Cintron

[mark1]

That's what I thought. 25 for the Cal league is old. They might move him to El Paso this year.
He'll probably come back down to earth in double A.

What do you make of Goslings poor performance at Tucson? I would have thought he might have a learning curve switching leagues, but he's been miserable so far.

 

[Matrix31]

Gosling is kind of weird. A week ago or so Tommy Jones was talking about a few guys in the minors who had the talent but the maturity and attitude werent there. I think two of these guys are Luis Terrero and Gosling in Tucson. Gosling's WHIP is horrible this year, everything is bad compared to last year in AA. I think both Terrero and Gosling may have been expecting to be with the big club this year and werent given the chance and may have had a mental let down. This isnt a good thing, but it also makes you think that when and if they make the big club they will have better numbers then when they were in the minors because they will actually be focused. This is justa theory, and a rosy one at that, but Gosling is much better then he has pitched, and despite decent numbers in AAA Terrero is a better player then he has shown also.

 

[deweyniner]

Everybody knows, except Brenly, that Alex is better than Womack. Heck, most folks think Kata and Olson are better than Womack, and EVERYBODY knows CC and Spivey are already.

Thing is, Brenly doesn't play up-and-comers, even if they are head and shoulders above who we already have. Cintron/Womack, Overbay/Grace, any pitcher/Dessens/Myers/Oropesa, and we went and made stupid signings like Sanders and Grace. What Yount should do to Brenly.

 

[mark1]

Since May the 13th, Alex has gone 33 for 94, which is a .351 average. Maybe he'll get to his Tucson average of .393 before the year is out

 

[schillingfan]

Originally posted by deweyniner
Thing is, Brenly doesn't play up-and-comers, even if they are head and shoulders above who we already have. Cintron/Womack, Overbay/Grace, any pitcher/Dessens/Myers/Oropesa, and we went and made stupid signings like Sanders and Grace.

That's not true. I admit Brenly had an attachment to Matt Williams, but for the most part Brenly has no problems playing youngsters and is not averse to playing the hot hand. He benched Jay Bell in 2001 for over a month in favor of Junior Spivey.

Brenly continually has gone with young players. Look at Bret Prinz in 2001. And he had no problem plugging Valverde in at closer when Mantei went down. Whenever he gets a young pitcher up from Tucson he throws them right in the mix. When he got Hammock up he used him immediately.

And I have no clue what you mean about signing Grace and Sanders. Both had excellent years in 2001 for the D-Backs and IMHO played a huge part in winning the championship.

 

[deweyniner]

Sanders had a somewhat decent year, but was outplayed by Danny B, yet Brenly didn't bench King K until the Series. And Durazo ALWAYS outplayed Grace, the numbers bear that out. Grace had a not so good year. Bell hadn't played well for over a year when Brenly FINALLY inserted Spivey in the line-up. Grace hasn't hit well since Chicago. Womack still gets the majority of playing time, when AC, Spivey, Baerga, Tracy, Kata, Olson and CC are all better offensive players, by far than Womack is. What Yount should do to Brenly

 

[schillingfan]

dewerniner, you really don't know what you are talking about. Jay Bell sported a BA of near .300 well into May and even when it dropped some he still had an OBP .100 points higher. If you check the ESPN splits, he batted .351 in April of 2001 with an OPS of 1.051. May was not good going .227 and .630 OPS, but he rebounded in June to post a .295 and a .947 OPS.

He really started slumping in July, but Spivey didn't get hot until the end of July and that's when BB played him regularly over Bell. Durazo was great until he got slammed into at home plate in by Schumpert and after he was concussed he was
terrible until near end of the year when he finally recovered. And Grace played well in 2001 with a .298 BA and a .386 OBP, though his power wasn't down.

And as to Reggie Sanders - Reggie had a .263 average with a .886 OPS, which is more than acceptable. He had a 1.263 OPS in October (the extra week) a .866 OPS in September and a 1.088 OPS in August. He was terrible in July. Danny Bautista had a higher BA than Reggie, .302 but he hit for far less power so his OPS was only .783. He also had an excellent end of the season with an OPS of 1.308 in October and .963 in September. He was also horrible in July.

If you want to dislike BB, go ahead, but do it on a factual basis.

 

[Smolder]

Originally posted by schillingfan
dewerniner, you really don't know what you are talking about. Jay Bell sported a BA of near .300 well into May and even when it dropped some he still had an OBP .100 points higher. If you check the ESPN splits, he batted .351 in April of 2001 with an OPS of 1.051. May was not good going .227 and .630 OPS, but he rebounded in June to post a .295 and a .947 OPS.

He really started slumping in July, but Spivey didn't get hot until the end of July and that's when BB played him regularly over Bell. Durazo was great until he got slammed into at home plate in by Schumpert and after he was concussed he was
terrible until near end of the year when he finally recovered. And Grace played well in 2001 with a .298 BA and a .386 OBP, though his power wasn't down.

And as to Reggie Sanders - Reggie had a .263 average with a .886 OPS, which is more than acceptable. He had a 1.263 OPS in October (the extra week) a .866 OPS in September and a 1.088 OPS in August. He was terrible in July. Danny Bautista had a higher BA than Reggie, .302 but he hit for far less power so his OPS was only .783. He also had an excellent end of the season with an OPS of 1.308 in October and .963 in September. He was also horrible in July.

If you want to dislike BB, go ahead, but do it on a factual basis.

geezes, don't you just love schillingfan's comments? she should write for espn or something. better yet, she should take the place of those barbaric east coast bias guys.

 

[AZZenny]

better yet, she should take the place of those barbaric east coast bias guys.

Never happen - she typically gets her facts straight; they wouldn't know what to do with her.

 

[moviegeekjn]

Exactly.... how would she fill out the application form? They have a blank for a small essay:

East coast bias credentials (Provide Sample):

 

[schillingfan]

Hey, while I'm an east coaster I am biased in favor of the D-Backs.

I didn't mean to be harsh, just geez, I loved that 2001 team. Grace was very good all year, and Jay Bell really held the team together in April. Even when he wasn't hitting well, he was being patient and walking a lot to get on base.

I happen to definitely be in the pro-Brenly camp, and what I really like about him as a manager is the confidence that he shows in young players. Compare him to Dusty Baker or my own Larry Bowa who just bury kids on the bench and in the pen. I will admit that he played Matt Williams too much though.

Speaking of Matty - I guess RLakin doesn't have anything to say on the board now that he doesn't have Matty to kick around any more.

 

[Matrix31]

Ok, i might be wrong. Cintron still has some growing to do, but i do see how he could be an everyday player. Nothing spectacular but just solid all around. He also looks like a guy who could become 20-30 HR guy if he puts on some weight, right now hes wiry strong and with a little muscle could definately hit for more power. He is patient at the plate, doesnt take a lot of walks, but works the count and makes contact, doesnt strike out a lot. HIs defense is good at 2nd, SS and 3rd also.

 

[Stan C]

I think the power may be there, but I'd just assume he not change anything and keep his average about .320. We get a bunch of ball swatters going, and we will score just as many runs as the power clubs. As you know matrix, sometimes when kids start hitting for just power, they start losing their good swing, and go into a slump. And some times veterans do it, ask Steve Finley.

 

[Matrix31]

actually that has been one of the knocks on Cintron coming up through the minors. After he would hit a homerun he would fall in love with the power swing and go into a little slump. Ive been watching his at bats after he hits homeruns and havent seen that yet, so maybe he has matured. This was the biggest homerun of his brief career so lets see how it affects his swing this time.

 

[mark1]

Matrix

I'm glad to see you jumping on the Cintron bandwagon. I hope he doesn't fall in love with the home run either. Cintron is best when he is hitting the ball up the middle. You're right about him having to grow more. But as he matures he should fill into his 6'2 frame and generate more power. He has improved every year, and I don't think he has reached his ceiling yet. This kid can flat hit. I also think he needs to improve his defense which I consider about average at this point. I think Carlos Baerga has helped him alot with his confidence this year. Some of the other players like Gonzo call Alex, Carlos's son.

 

[mark1]

BTW...What kind of steroids are they feeding Carlos Guillen this year?

 

[Smolder]

Originally posted by schillingfan
Hey, while I'm an east coaster I am biased in favor of the D-Backs.

I didn't mean to be harsh, just geez, I loved that 2001 team. Grace was very good all year, and Jay Bell really held the team together in April. Even when he wasn't hitting well, he was being patient and walking a lot to get on base.

I happen to definitely be in the pro-Brenly camp, and what I really like about him as a manager is the confidence that he shows in young players. Compare him to Dusty Baker or my own Larry Bowa who just bury kids on the bench and in the pen. I will admit that he played Matt Williams too much though.

Speaking of Matty - I guess RLakin doesn't have anything to say on the board now that he doesn't have Matty to kick around any more.

rotfl! that's the point. seriously, why don't you apply or something. i really hate those yankee fans over at espn. would be great if we had more people like you, instead.

 

[az240zz]

Originally posted by mark1
BTW...What kind of steroids are they feeding Carlos Guillen this year?

I don't think its steroids I just htink that he has finally gotten over his injuries. Also he isn't under the Brenly system of never playing every day unless your Gonzo.

Az240z

 

[mark1]

Carlos would sure look good in right field right now.

 

[green machine]

You guys do know that Carlos Guillen is the SS for the Mariners, the RF for the Reds is Jose Guillen.

adam

 

[mark1]

Originally posted by green machine
You guys do know that Carlos Guillen is the SS for the Mariners, the RF for the Reds is Jose Guillen.

adam

OOPS.

 

[BC867]

I didn't realize there was so much discussion about Lyle Overbay here at the ASFN.

I recently posted on another site that . . . althought Lyle Overbay could develop into another Mark Grace (and that's not bad) . . .

If it's a choice of Overbay and Hillenbrand on the corners (and Cintron on the bench) . . . or Cintron and Hillenbrand on the corners . . . until Cintron takes over SS next year . . .

I'd send Overbay down to Tucson until the rosters expand in two months.

Lyle is 6th on the team in RBI's and HR's and 8th in runs scored. On a team with limited power, you need more punch at 1B.

Not one person agreed with sending Overbay down at this time.

Nothing should stand in the way of Alex Cintron playing every day this year, right through the last game of the World Series.

 

[green machine]

Originally posted by BC867
I didn't realize there was so much discussion about Lyle Overbay here at the ASFN.

I recently posted on another site that . . . althought Lyle Overbay could develop into another Mark Grace (and that's not bad) . . .

If it's a choice of Overbay and Hillenbrand on the corners (and Cintron on the bench) . . . or Cintron and Hillenbrand on the corners . . . until Cintron takes over SS next year . . .

I'd send Overbay down to Tucson until the rosters expand in two months.

Lyle is 6th on the team in RBI's and HR's and 8th in runs scored. On a team with limited power, you need more punch at 1B.

Not one person agreed with sending Overbay down at this time.

Nothing should stand in the way of Alex Cintron playing every day this year, right through the last game of the World Series.

I was against it on the other site and I'l voice the same opinion here. Womack stands in the way of Cintron playing every day. Would you rather have a lineup of Hilly/Cintron/Spivey/Overbay or a lineup of Cintron/Womack/Spivey/Hilly? Who's the weak link in this? You cannot send Overbay down because the guy can hit. Womack is the one who deserves to go, not the young guys.

adam

 

[schillingfan]

Funny how often these things have their own way of working out, rendering a decision unnecessary at this time.

 

[Lefty]

Let's hope the best for Tony. I think Brenly was going to play Alex every day even when everyone came back.