Could the Phoenix Suns, city build a new arena at Phoenix Convention Center site?

[NJCardFan]

Pro sports is going to learn that all fans have a limit. It's crazy to think a suns game for a family of 4 costs $500.


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The actual fan has been getting priced out of the building a long time ago. At the old Vet in Philly, you could get a child's general admission ticket for 50 cents and an adult ticket was $2. The best ticket in the house was $12. Now a standing room only ticket is $20 and the most expensive tickets, if you can get them, are well over $100...for baseball. When I was offered Eagles season tickets last year they were $75 per ticket for the nose bleed section and that doesn't include the $30 for parking.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Just like Americans. Tear something down after 25 years. That building is just getting broken in. To building something new, especially if it requires tax dollars, would be a tremendous waste.

Now if there were some kind of fundamental flaw in the building, maybe an argument could be made. But there is no such flaw.

 

[Covert Rain]

The actual fan has been getting priced out of the building a long time ago. At the old Vet in Philly, you could get a child's general admission ticket for 50 cents and an adult ticket was $2. The best ticket in the house was $12. Now a standing room only ticket is $20 and the most expensive tickets, if you can get them, are well over $100...for baseball. When I was offered Eagles season tickets last year they were $75 per ticket for the nose bleed section and that doesn't include the $30 for parking.

The Phoenix Suns back in the day used to offer free tickets through Circle K when they were at the VMC every single season. My friends and I used to run down their and pick them up whenever they did it. There would be just a stack of tickets sitting next to the cash register. The cashier would yell at us kids if we took too many. However, they did it all the time.

 

[slinslin]

Also if they start talking now then it probably is done maybe in 10-15 years at which point their arena is already 35-40 years old.

 

[CardsFan88]

It's pretty crazy. Stadiums and arenas used to last 50-80 years. One of the selling points used to be, it'll be our stadium for a long time similar to that.

Isn't it funny that when you start using public dollars for stadiums, suddenly their lifespan is alot shorter?? I wonder why that could be. Hint: It's not their money.

There will always be jones's to keep up with. If everyone updates their stadium ever 25 years, then it'll be pushed to 20, and 15. It's like...the stadium is good, but we need public dollars to maintain fat margins like other teams. It's not a good blueprint for anything.

Besides, isn't part of the problem the fact that ticket prices, parking, concessions and all of that is priced TOO HIGH? Do we think prices are going to go UP or DOWN with a new stadium. Seems like we'll just be pricing things more out of reach, and attendance will slip unless, as Phx fans go, we are perpetually good.

Think about how the whole terminology was being cast. 'One of the oldest' arenas. So. There will ALWAYS be an oldest. That simply is not a valid reason to build a new arena. If every team built a stadium in the next three years...one would still have to be 'the oldest'. Catch my drift? 23 years old is NOT old.

Think about it. Say you were a person who bought a brand new house in Gilbert or Scottsdale around 1992, and you have 7 years left on the mortgage. Now start talking with your neighbors about wanting to demolish and put up a new one, because it's old. Does that sound crazy? Well, exactly.

What makes it worse? The fact they've 'remodeled' that house they want to tear down a couple of times so far in only ~23 years.

IF we decide we should build another stadium, it shouldn't be for quite a while. Talking now is fine, but that arena should last at least another 20 years.

Then the Diamondbacks will want one because of that design flaw of the upper deck clips.

Part of the problem with the world is we look too much at equations that don't matter, and forget everything that does.

 

[Covert Rain]

It's a catch 22. If a city passes an ordinance that says no public dollars can be used, it might have the effect of owners staying in stadiums longer. Then again, the team can just up and move which seem the most likely course of action nowadays.

Bottom line is if a city wants a sports team, you have to be prepared to publicly fund at least part of it. It's the way sports teams work now.

 

[Son of RedRage]

Is it weird that I miss the old name of the 'American West Arena'?

 

[Covert Rain]

Is it weird that I miss the old name of the 'American West Arena'?

No. Loved the name of that Arena. I have no idea either. Maybe it's just because of the success we had under that name.

 

[HooverDam]

I'm glad that even this small, self selected sample of Suns fans seems to generally agree that the Suns don't need a new arena. Sarver may just be putting the idea out their to judge public reaction. Hopefully he realizes there's no popular support for replacing a perfectly fine, under 30 year old arena.

No. Loved the name of that Arena. I have no idea either. Maybe it's just because of the success we had under that name.

I think it's also because it didn't sound so corporate. It was America West Arena, not "America West AIRLINES Arena". "US Airways Center" always sounded awful.

Corporate names like Wrigley Field, Chase Field, Busch Stadium, etc that don't have the word 'bank' or 'airline' or whatever in them sound much more tolerable.

 

[chickenhead]

I think any notion about the Suns needing a new arena to "stay competitive" would just be code for wanting the franchise value to stay competitive. A new funded building is a free asset for owners. Amenities and facilities to lure players can be upgraded without a new arena. The fan experience can be upgraded without a new arena. The location is already perfect. The arena still looks nice, and there was no shift in arena design that makes it seem dated (like SkyDome in baseball, for example). A deep playoff run will bring back a lot of good memories in that building...

 

[JCSunsfan]

I think any notion about the Suns needing a new arena to "stay competitive" would just be code for wanting the franchise value to stay competitive. A new funded building is a free asset for owners. Amenities and facilities to lure players can be upgraded without a new arena. The fan experience can be upgraded without a new arena. The location is already perfect. The arena still looks nice, and there was no shift in arena design that makes it seem dated (like SkyDome in baseball, for example). A deep playoff run will bring back a lot of good memories in that building...

You nailed it. Get a new building with a new lease and you have increased the value of the team. Its money in Sarver's pocket for when he sells.

Maybe that should be the deal. We will build him a new building if he commits to sell.

 

[SunsTzu]

I'd rather see Chase Field get scrapped. That place is more of an eyesore and I never liked the pool gimmick.

 

[BC867]

I'd rather see Chase Field get scrapped. That place is more of an eyesore and I never liked the pool gimmick.

Please explain why.

Is it any more of an eyesore than any other downtown Major League stadium? San Diego? Denver?

Is it any more of an eyesore than the spaceship on the westside 101?

And why do you not like the pool? We are in the desert and it gives the stadium an identity as such.

I enjoy Chase Field.

Dodger Stadium, which is in a more moderate climate, gets to over 100° on the field and lower seating during the summer. Ugh!

 

[chickenhead]

I agree with SunTzu, actually. The exterior of Chase is pretty ugly, as are the adjacent parking garages (which also ruined the view of the mountains from the stadium). Significantly uglier than Coors.

 

[Phrazbit]

For a large domed stadium Chase Field looks pretty good. I think the pool is silly but hardly a reason to blow up the joint.

 

[mojorizen7]

Please explain why.

Is it any more of an eyesore than any other downtown Major League stadium? San Diego? Denver?

Is it any more of an eyesore than the spaceship on the westside 101?

And why do you not like the pool? We are in the desert and it gives the stadium an identity as such.

I enjoy Chase Field.

Dodger Stadium, which is in a more moderate climate, gets to over 100° on the field and lower seating during the summer. Ugh!

I've got to agree with you here BC, the UofP is fugly looking on the outside. Can't believe they couldn't come up with something better than a giant warped looking sardine can. Outstanding venue once you get inside though, obviously. REAL nice.

I've only been to a handful of Diamondbacks games, but i thought it looked alright on the exterior. They should have named it the (D)Backyard though.

The Suns building looks nice. Always liked it. Classy but with some personality.

 

[HooverDam]

Unfortunatley, Chase Field has major design flaws. It'll be tricky to replace that building anytime though since its so much younger, and because by the nature of baseball stadiums, is much larger.

Chase Field is WAY too large capacity wise. It needs to be closer to 38K, not 49K. The way the roof was designed doesn't let enough light into the field, resulting in a poor, patchy playing condition from mid-season on. The Garage Mahal across the street is almost always empty and is a hugely inefficient use of downtown real estate. And from an aesthetic point of view, it'd be nice of the stadium opened up more to views of downtown and the mountains. It's also a shame that grass berms weren't included as inexpensive outfield seating, to keep the Spring Training feeling going year round.

 

[Dback Jon]

Unfortunatley, Chase Field has major design flaws. It'll be tricky to replace that building anytime though since its so much younger, and because by the nature of baseball stadiums, is much larger.

Chase Field is WAY too large capacity wise. It needs to be closer to 38K, not 49K. The way the roof was designed doesn't let enough light into the field, resulting in a poor, patchy playing condition from mid-season on. The Garage Mahal across the street is almost always empty and is a hugely inefficient use of downtown real estate. And from an aesthetic point of view, it'd be nice of the stadium opened up more to views of downtown and the mountains. It's also a shame that grass berms weren't included as inexpensive outfield seating, to keep the Spring Training feeling going year round.

I like Chase Field. It may be a bit too big, but that doesn't bother me.

I never have gotten the obsession with "views" at a stadium - I am there to watch the game, not look at a view I can see better elsewhere.


I do agree about the garage - it is UGLY, and needs something else there, like a residential tower.

 

[Phrazbit]

I think they did about as good as could be expected with the view. It has to be a retractable roof, so its hard to make it very open to outside scenery.

And the line of site views are phenomenal. There is not a bad seat in the stadium, despite its size... which probably should have been smaller. 50k is simply too big for anywhere but New York. We have the 5th largest capacity in the league.

 

[Covert Rain]

I think they did about as good as could be expected with the view. It has to be a retractable roof, so its hard to make it very open to outside scenery.

And the line of site views are phenomenal. There is not a bad seat in the stadium, despite its size... which probably should have been smaller. 50k is simply too big for anywhere but New York. We have the 5th largest capacity in the league.

I am sure the prevailing thought was once we won the world serious we would be regular contenders. If that was the case they would have no issues with filling to capacity.

 

[Phrazbit]

I am sure the prevailing thought was once we won the world serious we would be regular contenders. If that was the case they would have no issues with filling to capacity.

I dunno, its a long season. The Dodgers, Yankees, Rangers don't fill their 50k stadiums on a nightly basis. Atlanta was a contender for nearly 20 years and played to similar crowds as Arizona.

I think its just too big for a team that plays 81 home games. I like the stadium though.

 

[Covert Rain]

I dunno, its a long season. The Dodgers, Yankees, Rangers don't fill their 50k stadiums on a nightly basis. Atlanta was a contender for nearly 20 years and played to similar crowds as Arizona.

I think its just too big for a team that plays 81 home games. I like the stadium though.

I don't think they care if the stadium is full each night. They care if the stadium is sold out. Heck, even when the Suns and Cards have played well I can name times I have been to games with tons of empty seats.

 

[chickenhead]

They might not build to that capacity if they were doing so today. When BOB/Chase was designed and built the sport was in the midst of a resurgence and less than a decade removed from league attendance records being broken in Denver and Toronto (with both averaging close to 50k/game for a while, among other cities). I assume the cost of 10,000 more in capacity seemed fairly negligible against the lost revenue of not having it in those early years--especially if they planned on building immediately through free agency.

Attendance lately has been in the mid-20s, which actually isn't abysmally below the league average of 30k in the last few years. But the thing is that 30k is a historically good league-wide average. The next time a team builds a stadium, they may plan for the 35-40k range and an "experience" to compete with home viewership (or rather, complement it, given the TV deals). One way to increase capacity for playoff and weekend games would be standing-room areas--something really lacking at Chase now. I'll never understand why they have an army of ushers shooing fans away from all railings at all times. Obviously they need to keep fire lanes and accessible seating clear, but carving out a standing area similar to other stadiums like SafeCo would be great.

Rogers Centre (SkyDome) faces a lot of the same issues as Chase, and the single best thing they've done in recent years was rip out the restaurant in center field and replace it with a few levels of standing room.

 

[sunsfan88]

Is Robert Sarver looking at Talking Stick Resort in Scottsdale as the next home for the Suns? Sarver has been on record saying that the current downtown Phoenix arena footprint is too small in terms of square footage and would be a poor investment to re-model. A well-connected source told me this past week that they have seen plans for a basketball facility on Talking Stick soil.

The Salt River Pima-Maricopa Indian Community and the Suns announced last December that US Airways Center, the home of the Suns, Phoenix Mercury and Arizona Rattlers, as well as one of the Valley’s premier concert venues would take on the name Talking Stick Resort Arena. The naming rights deal is a multi-year agreement. Is there more coming on this relationship?
Talking Stick Resort is off the 101 and Indian Bend, east of the Diamondbacks spring training facility.

If this move were to happen, could a domino effect take place? Would Arizona State consider the downtown arena as a possible destination for its hockey program? When I presented this scenario to Arizona State AD Ray Anderson on a recent show, he admitted that with the downtown ASU campus, he would consider all options. ASU hockey is not going to be some small time deal, they have BIG money backing that program and want to make a splash.
Would the struggling Arizona Coyotes try to find a way to play some of their weeknight games against non-marquee opponents in downtown Phoenix in partnership with ASU on the building? The big draws like Chicago and Detroit would still be played in Glendale on weekends. Sounds far-fetched on the surface, but others have told me to be more open-minded on the possibility.

Since Sarver has already stated that the Suns current location doesn’t make sense for a remodel, would he consider partnering with other franchises looking to build an arena? United SC Owner Kyle Eng has a deadline to get a facility built-in order to continue his pursuit of a Major League Soccer franchise. Phoenix is the only market in the top 11 in the country without a MLS team and the league is watching Eng very carefully. Sarver pursued owning a Scottish soccer franchise in 2014.

The bottom line on all of this is…well…the bottom line. Sarver is not going to cut a bad deal just to keep the team in Phoenix. With the globalization of the NBA and cities like Seattle sitting out there, it’s important for our leaders to pay attention to Sarver saying he wants a new facility and to look at all options. I am sure he is doing the same…

http://www.sports360az.com/2015/05/is-talking-stick-more-than-just-a-name-to-suns/

Scottsdale Suns just doesn't sound right imo.

 

[Phrazbit]

... they wouldn't change their name.