CP3 Rumored Trade

[AzStevenCal]

The Warren situation isn’t remotely similar. The Suns traded Warren for NOTHING. They literally did it to create space to maybe possibly sign someone.

If Oubre and Rubio are traded for Paul, they will have been traded for a HoF PG that finished 7th in MVP voting last year.

That's a nice fact, it pairs nicely with another fact. NBA organizations just can't wait to get that guy into their locker room as we will be his 4th different team in just 5 years.

 

[1Sun]

That's a nice fact, it pairs nicely with another fact. NBA organizations just can't wait to get that guy into their locker room as we will be his 4th different team in just 5 years.

To be fair, the first three teams were successful with him at the helm, and the circumstances of each move do not necessarily reflect poorly on Paul. Houston pried him away from the Clippers to make a run. He was then traded to go younger with a former MVP in Westbrook only for it to appear that Harden is more of a problem than Paul, as Houston regressed while OKC exceeded expectations. Now OKC is looking for salary relief and to rebuild.

 

[GatorAZ]

With Paul and Booker I think it comes down to not really needing Oubre’s scoring which is still his best skill. At that point you’re just taking shots from Ayton. With Rubio you’d still need a guy who can fill it up on the perimeter.

What did that tweet a couple days ago projecting FA salary have for Ibaka? Could we make the trade with OKC before the draft and have enough space given the #10 pick’s cap hold?

 

[AzStevenCal]

To be fair, the first three teams were successful with him at the helm, and the circumstances of each move do not necessarily reflect poorly on Paul. Houston pried him away from the Clippers to make a run. He was then traded to go younger with a former MVP in Westbrook only for it to appear that Harden is more of a problem than Paul, as Houston regressed while OKC exceeded expectations. Now OKC is looking for salary relief and to rebuild.

Yes they had good records, records we'd kill to have. But they were very talented teams, so talented that many expected them to compete for the championship if not win it all and year after year they disappointed.

But I don't argue that Paul has been a great player, he has. He is no longer quite that player but he's still a pretty good player, when he plays. And perhaps I'm misremembering, but I don't think Houston actually "pried" him away from LAC. As I recall, they bombed again, much of the blame fell on Chris, so he bolted. There were rumors about him disliking the way coach handled Austin but Paul said many times it had nothing to do with it, he just felt they'd gone as far together as they could.

As for the Westbrook/Paul trade, and I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong on this, but I don't think it really went down that way either. Westbrook, because of multiple injuries, was looking like a shell of his former self and he wanted out of OKC. Paul and Harden clashed, as usually happens between Paul and any star he's paired with, and he also wanted out. They were both making big bucks, there weren't a whole lot of options for either club. It turned out to be a steal for OKC.

 

[WhyAlwaysMe]

“still pretty good”

nobody can take you seriously if 7th in MVP voting equates to “still pretty good”. Unless you think Booker is worse than “pretty good”. Lmao

 

[AzStevenCal]

“still pretty good”

nobody can take you seriously if 7th in MVP voting equates to “still pretty good”. Unless you think Booker is worse than “pretty good”. Lmao

He used to be great. He's still pretty good. Not quite very good. He had a very good season under highly beneficial and highly unusual circumstances. He missed 69 games in the 3 seasons prior to that. If you choose to grade him solely on last season that's your choice but it's not mine.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

He used to be great. He's still pretty good. Not quite very good. He had a very good season under highly beneficial and highly unusual circumstances. He missed 69 games in the 3 seasons prior to that. If you choose to grade him solely on last season that's your choice but it's not mine.

Even I have to say that calling him pretty good in a season that he finished 7th in mvp voting is silly.

 

[Mainstreet]

I've already come to the conclusion the Chris Paul trade is a done deal.

It's Steve Nash redux.

Let's hope the Suns get similar success.

 

[WhyAlwaysMe]

I am not grading him “solely on last season”. He has a long track record of being an all star caliber player, and last season was no exception.

Paul’s detractors seem to be bizarrely assuming substantial decline when that is simply not in evidence.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Deals like this that linger don’t usually end up happening. I’ll be surprised if this one does.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Even I have to say that calling him pretty good in a season that he finished 7th in mvp voting is silly.

I didn't say that, or I didn't intend to say that. He had a very good season, he is still a pretty good player. However, he's shown signs of decline despite last years bounce back season. And even as a bounce back season, he was nowhere near the player he was in his prime. I know there are inconsistencies in this category but in his best season he had a PER of 30 but starting with the strike season his PER has dropped from 27 to last season's 21.7.

And personally, I think you guys are making a bit too much of his 7th place MVP finish. Giannis, the MVP, received 962 votes. Chris Paul got 26, it's not like he was knocking on the door and there were several others in his voting vicinity. For most years, you can see a strong similarity between MVP voting and PER. It may not be a popularity contest but IMO reputation definitely has an impact as it did for Chris last season. Regardless, full time players PER relates considerably to MVP voting most seasons. Here's last years PER numbers and last year's MVP voting:

Spoiler

Giannis =31.9, Harden 29.1, Doncic 27.6, Davis 27.4, Kawhi 26.9, Lillard 26.9, Towns 26.5, Embiid 25.8, Lebron 25.5, Hassan 25.0, Jokic 24.9, Trae 23.9, Butler 23.6 - also showing with a better PER are John Collins, Mitchell Robinson, Bradley Beal, Harrell, Christian Wood, Valanciunas, Drummond, Vucevic and Gobert before Paul's 21.7 comes up

Giannis 962, James 753, Harden 367, Doncic 200, Kawhi 168, Davis 82, Paul 26, Lillard 23, Jokic 18, Siakam 17, Butler 9

Notice they line up almost the same except for Paul.

Keep in mind, I only put this here to contest the steadfast assertion that his MVP ranking proves he was a great player last season. If you watched him play for OKC and that's your motivation for saying he had a great (or very good) season, then fine. But if you're just looking at MVP voting and presenting it as proof that he was the 7th best player in the league last season, well, I'm not with you.

 

[FJM23]

I've already come to the conclusion the Chris Paul trade is a done deal.

It's Steve Nash redux.

Let's hope the Suns get similar success.

Except Steve Nash was 30 when he was traded to the Suns. Paul is 35. Steve Nash’s age 35 season was his last with the Suns above .500.

 

[overseascardfan]

I voted no and this is why. Yes, he was a 2nd Team All NBA and was the engine for OKC's playoff run. So why is OKC wanting to trade him? Sam Presti is one of the best GM's (if not the best), he's selling high. The argument that OKC needs cap relief doesn't really fly when there are many big FA in this year's market for them to pursue so they could keep their same playoff roster, why trade away your best player who many are arguing he is on this thread? Presti has fleeced LAC & HOU in the Westbrook and George trades where he was at a disadvantage leverage wise as both players made it known they had no intention of staying in OKC. Presti got 7 future 1st round draft picks and 2 starters in the deals. He might be asking for more than Rubio, Oubre and the #10 which is why PHX may be hesitating and James Jones should be.

If I'm PHX I stick with Rubio who is the facilitator this team needs and look to take a PG at #10 and acquiring another pick in the teens to take Jalen Smith. I then look to sign Ibaka and maybe another low cost shooter like Alec Burks or Bryn Forbes.

 

[1Sun]

Deals like this that linger don’t usually end up happening. I’ll be surprised if this one does.

I'm pretty sure it doesn't at this point, which is fine...as long as we get our starting power forward, the #10 pick isn't wasted on someone like Bane or Terry, and Booker isn't frustrated.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

Except Steve Nash was 30 when he was traded to the Suns. Paul is 35. Steve Nash’s age 35 season was his last with the Suns above .500.

The suns not being above .500 in Nash’s last two seasons has a lot more to do with what was around him than Nash himself. If he had Ayton and Booker as teammates I would imagine they would have easily been over .500.

 

[Chaplin]

I voted no and this is why. Yes, he was a 2nd Team All NBA and was the engine for OKC's playoff run. So why is OKC wanting to trade him? Sam Presti is one of the best GM's (if not the best), he's selling high. The argument that OKC needs cap relief doesn't really fly when there are many big FA in this year's market for them to pursue so they could keep their same playoff roster, why trade away your best player who many are arguing he is on this thread? Presti has fleeced LAC & HOU in the Westbrook and George trades where he was at a disadvantage leverage wise as both players made it known they had no intention of staying in OKC. Presti got 7 future 1st round draft picks and 2 starters in the deals. He might be asking for more than Rubio, Oubre and the #10 which is why PHX may be hesitating and James Jones should be.

If I'm PHX I stick with Rubio who is the facilitator this team needs and look to take a PG at #10 and acquiring another pick in the teens to take Jalen Smith. I then look to sign Ibaka and maybe another low cost shooter like Alec Burks or Bryn Forbes.

Have to disagree here. I’m a little surprised that you think there are big FAs this year. This is actually a pretty poor year for big name FAs.

OKC isn’t going to be contending for a championship anytime soon, Paul or no Paul. They simply want to get out of his contract, which is understandable.

 

[1Sun]

I voted no and this is why. Yes, he was a 2nd Team All NBA and was the engine for OKC's playoff run. So why is OKC wanting to trade him? Sam Presti is one of the best GM's (if not the best), he's selling high. The argument that OKC needs cap relief doesn't really fly when there are many big FA in this year's market for them to pursue so they could keep their same playoff roster, why trade away your best player who many are arguing he is on this thread? Presti has fleeced LAC & HOU in the Westbrook and George trades where he was at a disadvantage leverage wise as both players made it known they had no intention of staying in OKC. Presti got 7 future 1st round draft picks and 2 starters in the deals. He might be asking for more than Rubio, Oubre and the #10 which is why PHX may be hesitating and James Jones should be.

If I'm PHX I stick with Rubio who is the facilitator this team needs and look to take a PG at #10 and acquiring another pick in the teens to take Jalen Smith. I then look to sign Ibaka and maybe another low cost shooter like Alec Burks or Bryn Forbes.

That plan would work for me, but what PG do you have in mind at #10?

 

[Mainstreet]

Except Steve Nash was 30 when he was traded to the Suns. Paul is 35. Steve Nash’s age 35 season was his last with the Suns above .500.

Let's hope it is not more like Steve Nash's time with the Lakers.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Deals like this that linger don’t usually end up happening. I’ll be surprised if this one does.

This is where I am at presently. Shocking, I know.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I voted no and this is why. Yes, he was a 2nd Team All NBA and was the engine for OKC's playoff run. So why is OKC wanting to trade him? Sam Presti is one of the best GM's (if not the best), he's selling high. The argument that OKC needs cap relief doesn't really fly when there are many big FA in this year's market for them to pursue so they could keep their same playoff roster, why trade away your best player who many are arguing he is on this thread? Presti has fleeced LAC & HOU in the Westbrook and George trades where he was at a disadvantage leverage wise as both players made it known they had no intention of staying in OKC. Presti got 7 future 1st round draft picks and 2 starters in the deals. He might be asking for more than Rubio, Oubre and the #10 which is why PHX may be hesitating and James Jones should be.

If I'm PHX I stick with Rubio who is the facilitator this team needs and look to take a PG at #10 and acquiring another pick in the teens to take Jalen Smith. I then look to sign Ibaka and maybe another low cost shooter like Alec Burks or Bryn Forbes.

The reason OKC sells now is obvious. This was a go-nowhere team. The playoffs were a surprise and there was little-to-no reason they could improve. They are a limbo team with a couple of nice young players and a plethora of draft picks. If you can’t push for contention and the top end talent is old, you do the smart thing and start rebuilding. If anything this OKC team is descending with nice pieces for the future.

conversely the suns are likely done with the initial stages of rebuild. They are ascending. They seek proven vets to push over the top to playoffs. From there they build off their young stars. The older vets roll off but the hope is that by that time the young stars have taken over and you’ve pre-filled the older vacancies.

 

[overseascardfan]

Have to disagree here. I’m a little surprised that you think there are big FAs this year. This is actually a pretty poor year for big name FAs.

OKC isn’t going to be contending for a championship anytime soon, Paul or no Paul. They simply want to get out of his contract, which is understandable.

Oops, meant to type "aren't" many FA's this year. Also, OKC made the playoffs which is better than the year PHX had and PHX will also not be contending for a championship anytime soon so no need to help Sam Presti and OKC out taking Paul's contract unless we're getting some of those 7 draft picks they got in the Westbrook / George deals.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Oops, meant to type "aren't" many FA's this year. Also, OKC made the playoffs which is better than the year PHX had and PHX will also not be contending for a championship anytime soon so no need to help Sam Presti and OKC out taking Paul's contract unless we're getting some of those 7 draft picks they got in the Westbrook / George deals.

Few, if any, teams go from missing playoffs to contending. That’s not the next step.

 

[overseascardfan]

That plan would work for me, but what PG do you have in mind at #10?

Right now NBA Draft Room has us taking Haliburton at #10, if he's there then fine if not you have to consider trading down from #10 and look at Terry or Lewis as they are the next best available PG's in draft. Terry is starting to grow on me because of his shooting and the fact that he can play off ball and the experience of running with the second unit off the bench until Rubio's deal expires would help him transition into the starting PG role. He just has to work on continuing to get stronger which he has already begun doing this offseason adding 20 pounds of muscle to his frame.

 

[Chaplin]

Oops, meant to type "aren't" many FA's this year. Also, OKC made the playoffs which is better than the year PHX had and PHX will also not be contending for a championship anytime soon so no need to help Sam Presti and OKC out taking Paul's contract unless we're getting some of those 7 draft picks they got in the Westbrook / George deals.

Our next step is to get to the playoffs and establishing a winning mindset. Paul helps to do that more than Oubre and Rubio. I can see why people don’t want to trade for him, but I can also see the positives in doing so.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Our next step is to get to the playoffs and establishing a winning mindset. Paul helps to do that more than Oubre and Rubio. I can see why people don’t want to trade for him, but I can also see the positives in doing so.

me too. What I don’t get is people either being over the moon or conversely pissed if this deal goes down. There’s pretty even positives and negatives and just a bevy of factors all around which makes them so.