Defense? Don’t make me laugh.

[BritCard]

Okay, so you're saying that said coach also gets through to him and gets him to watch film? I can buy that. I can't buy that he's going to humble himself to get an offseason QB coach, or that he's going to actually listen to a QB coach or OC. Why would he start now? On the list of star QBs down the years, you don't find many who started out woefully and inexcusably immature that suddenly turn it around. Ben Roethlissomething, yes, because his team was so good he went and won a SB early. Who else? Who else is THIS arrogant and suddenly humbles himself enough to live up to his potential? It's just so damn depressing to think about.

This shouldn't be a surprise. But a lot of QB's that were 5 star recruits and top 5 picks are arrogant and immature. It's kinda built in to the whole persona.

Guys like Mahomes and Allen were never those star guys and had to work harder for it. But the one's that were always great? Arrogance is built in. Hard not to live that life and think your **** don't stink.

 

[BritCard]

Kevin Murray is Kyler Murray’s dad and a big QB coach at Texas’ Air 14 academy. If you were Kyler, why would you go anywhere else?

Air 14 is Kevin Murray's own business. He's not a big coach. He's the only coach. And it's for high school kids.

I'm not even sure it's still active.

 

[Russ Smith]

Sure, but that doesn't excuse KM. He has to learn, and fast, that he isn't all that and a bag of chips; he has to WORK to become that. And, as Cheese said, not just physical work. Because the kid does work; he's not lazy, per se, though I sometimes simplify it to that. It's more arrogance, that he doesn't have to put the mental work in. He doesn't get years and decades to get better at that attitude. He basically gets an offseason now. He's pretty much out of time and can't put in performances like that in clutch games any longer.

It's not excusing him it's explaining that everyone develops at a different pace. Go back to Allen's rookie year people all over Twitter were joking about him. This is why people still say black QB's have a bias, how does Josh Allen get drafted that high he can't hit the side of a barn. Now he's arguably as good as any QB in the NFL. But he HAD to get a QB coach he was absolutely terrible as a rookie. The problem with Kyler is he was very raw, very inexperienced and yet he was still very good as a rookie it's harder to convince a kid what he needs to do when he's that good right away essentially just winging it. He got better each year but to get to the next level he clearly needs to do more.

All I'm saying is it was a lot easier to convince Josh Allen that after his rookie year than it was Kyler Murray, Murray was significantly better at the same stage with less experience and a rookie HC.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

No QB that gets 11 wins in the NFL is a bust.

What he is is well below the level he is capable of achieving due to lack of effort. He would be starting QB for 20 teams in the league. That's not a bust.

Kyler went 9-5 this year. So he didn’t get 11 wins.

 

[BritCard]

Not enough Brit. Go a out and sign two o-linemen. Harry mentioned Ben Jones who is a very good center AND guard. Add a guy like Mike Glowinski and we would have the best o- line we’ve had in many years and there’s your depth. No more bandaids .
From everything I’ve read Kirk is expected to make 10-12m. No way and I’m tired of hearing about Kylee’s feelings. A guy like Cedric Wilson is taller , just as fast and will sign for less than Kirk. Then we have to add a physical wide receiver. Maybe a one year prove it deal like DJ Chark. Both of these guys will add much needed speed to this offended and actually make Hopkins even better. I hope Green has already left Arizona. Moores roll can and should be expanded and an added bonus.

TE, We all love Max. But can we really depend on him to be 100% ready to he was in 1 year. I think a guy like Mo Alie Cox Would be awesome even if Max returns. There’s your depth again. Any other te’s on this team should be bagging groceries by now.

RB. Conner is our thug. Our beat them up later in the game guy. I think everyone wants him back. With that we need to add speed. Everything else is a question mark. It appears Edmonds might not be back. Can Eno step up? Can Ward contribute? If not we have to either draft a guy or find one in free agency.

We heard this last year…”All In”, but we really weren’t. We are SLOW on offense. That has to drastically change.

Depth and speed should be top priority for this offense. Then we can put it all on Kingsbury and Murray. If we don’t see a drastic improvement from this offense there will be a head coach in 2023 that will have a decent roster with depth.

Yeah but I'm being realistic. We have less than $9m in cap space AFTER losing

Chandler
Edmonds
Conner
Kirk
Ertz
Green
Peters
Alford
Garcia
Maxx
Brewer
McCoy
Gardeck

All these have started or played significant snaps this season. Some fans seem blind to how many starters we are going to lose. This team is almost certainly going to be worse next year in both starters and depth.

We went into last offseason with similar space but all we lost was Fitz, Dre and Sweezy. That was it.

There are not many obvious moves where we have an obvious replacement. Hicks is one. We can get $6.5m back if we trade him, but considering our LB depth they may not think it's worth it.

We barely get half Kennards money back and we are already losing CJ and Gardeck. Pugh would cost more to replace than would save. We could get $2.3m back from Justin Murray. $1m or so from Isabella and then it's chicken feed.

The only players we can restructure that have big multi year deals are Hump and Nuk. Maybe can get $10-$15m back there.

But it's going to be messy. Incredibly tough just to resign the players we want to keep. I don't see any chance of major wholesale restructures.

Just to resign the top 5 players on that list is probably $50m.

 

[cardpa]

Not so fast. Josh Allen's 1st 2 years weren't good at all...In fact they may have been sub par to Trubisky. He finally broke out in year 3 and got even better in year 4. There is hope for KM, yet.

This is true however in year three he blossomed. It's a well documented fact that Allen put in a lot of work to get better. It's also been documented that Allen himself has said he wants to become one of the all time best at his position and he knew he needed to do a lot of things to get better. Our guy on the other hand claims he can just go out there and see things kind of like looking into a magic ball.

 

[kerouac9]

Air 14 is Kevin Murray's own business. He's not a big coach. He's the only coach. And it's for high school kids.

I'm not even sure it's still active.

Every QB academy is for high school kids -- that's the market. You tutor one or two pro QBs as a loss lead to recruit dozens and dozens of high school QBs for hundreds of dollars a month.

There’s value in getting different perspectives. Like golfers getting different swing coaches and different caddies.

I agree, but Kyler has to believe that and go out looking.

 

[slanidrac16]

Yeah but I'm being realistic. We have less than $9m in cap space AFTER losing

Chandler
Edmonds
Conner
Kirk
Ertz
Green
Peters
Alford
Garcia
Maxx
Brewer
McCoy
Gardeck

All these have started or played significant snaps this season. Some fans seem blind to how many starters we are going to lose. This team is almost certainly going to be worse next year in both starters and depth.

We went into last offseason with similar space but all we lost was Fitz, Dre and Sweezy. That was it.

There are not many obvious moves where we have an obvious replacement. Hicks is one. We can get $6.5m back if we trade him, but considering our LB depth they may not think it's worth it.

We barely get half Kennards money back and we are already losing CJ and Gardeck. Pugh would cost more to replace than would save. We could get $2.3m back from Justin Murray. $1m or so from Isabella and then it's chicken feed.

The only players we can restructure that have big multi year deals are Hump and Nuk. Maybe can get $10-$15m back there.

But it's going to be messy. Incredibly tough just to resign the players we want to keep. I don't see any chance of major wholesale restructures.

Just to resign the top 5 players on that list is probably $50m.

It won’t be easy and it’s going to take some ingenuity to get anything done. But Keim has put us and himself in this bind. We have two years of Kyler’s rookie contract, some would say one year. Keim is going to have to sell his soul to the devil to get this done because anything backwards will surely force changes including him.

If this offense limps into next year without a major upgrade on the o-line and drastically improve the speed on this team we will see mediocrity and not an offense that can carry this defense.

We obviously can’t do a drastic upgrade on both sides of the ball. It makes more sense to fix the offense with Kyler being the key ingredient.

 

[Chopper0080]

I mean, that is partly it. Kyler needs to step it the hell up big time, but don’t disrespect arguably the most dominant WR/TE duo in the league in Tyreek/Kelce. Then you have a top 3-5 WR in Diggs on the other side.
Those QBs are that damn good, but you’re better than this, Chop.

Hopkins Hill and Diggs cancel each other out IMO. Kelce is obviously the next beat player by a large margin but the rest or interchangeable. I would also argue that our RBs are head and shoulders better than either Buffalo or KC.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Josh is 6'5, plays with heart, is a leader and loves football. Kyler is 5'10, plays video games and seems to care less about being a leader or the game of football. These two have very different trajectories at this point in their careers. Any hope I had left in Kyler is gone at this point.

 

[Cheesebeef]

No one is arguing that Allen is a great QB. But, in addition to working his craft, the Bills also put multiple weapons around him & fixed their OL each and every year. They also have a great D that tilts the field position in their offense's favor throughout the season. Minus Hop, the Cardinals had one of the slowest & least dependable WR group in the entire NFC. What makes you think that Murray doesn't work hard to improve? It's a crock of crap to say otherwise.

Murray’s own words. It’s a crock of crap to say otherwise when he literally says that he doesn’t watch a lot of film and just has the “cognitive ability to see everything on the field.”

 

[DVontel]

Hopkins Hill and Diggs cancel each other out IMO. Kelce is obviously the next beat player by a large margin but the rest or interchangeable. I would also argue that our RBs are head and shoulders better than either Buffalo or KC.

Hopkins, Hill, & Diggs does not cancel each other out. Hill has been above them two for years now. There’s an argument with Buffalo, but KC’s easily supersedes ours. I do like Buffalo’s style though. Quick & shifty WRs.

 

[PACardsFan]

Murray’s own words. It’s a crock of crap to say otherwise when he literally says that he doesn’t watch a lot of film and just has the “cognitive ability to see everything on the field.”

Murray isn’t good with media interviews & needs to improve in how he communicates with them. He’s been watching KK too much in that respect.

 

[Jetstream Green]

Kevin Murray is Kyler Murray’s dad and a big QB coach at Texas’ Air 14 academy. If you were Kyler, why would you go anywhere else?

Because maybe what his dad is teaching does not cut it at the pros

 

[Jetstream Green]

Every QB academy is for high school kids -- that's the market. You tutor one or two pro QBs as a loss lead to recruit dozens and dozens of high school QBs for hundreds of dollars a month.



I agree, but Kyler has to believe that and go out looking.

I agree with the last part about him having to want it or he will not put any time in and it will be wasted but still this organization has to put it in front of him... as far as academies, I do not want that but a QB guru in his ears nonstop whether he likes it or not till he shows he no longer needs outside influence

 

[Stout]

No QB that gets 11 wins in the NFL is a bust.

What he is is well below the level he is capable of achieving due to lack of effort. He would be starting QB for 20 teams in the league. That's not a bust.

He didn't get 11 wins.

 

[Stout]

This shouldn't be a surprise. But a lot of QB's that were 5 star recruits and top 5 picks are arrogant and immature. It's kinda built in to the whole persona.

Guys like Mahomes and Allen were never those star guys and had to work harder for it. But the one's that were always great? Arrogance is built in. Hard not to live that life and think your **** don't stink.

Tell that to the other greats that were drafted high. This excuse doesn't hold water.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Hopkins, Hill, & Diggs does not cancel each other out. Hill has been above them two for years now. There’s an argument with Buffalo, but KC’s easily supersedes ours. I do like Buffalo’s style though. Quick & shifty WRs.

I’m pretty sure that’s what the cards thought they were getting with kirk and Moore.

 

[Chopper0080]

Hopkins, Hill, & Diggs does not cancel each other out. Hill has been above them two for years now. There’s an argument with Buffalo, but KC’s easily supersedes ours. I do like Buffalo’s style though. Quick & shifty WRs.

We can disagree with Hill, Diggs and Hopkins I guess. While stylistically different, I would put Hopkins against either of those players.

I do agree that I would take KCs overall offensive personnel over ours easily. Their line and Kelce are clear advantages.

 

[Chopper0080]

Murray isn’t good with media interviews & needs to improve in how he communicates with them. He’s been watching KK too much in that respect.

You speak of Kyler like he is a High School QB. I have never heard of anyone having to coach up other top young QBs in this respect. These guys are groomed from a very young age how to act and speak as a big time QB. Kyler either doesn't care or doesn't recognize it is a deficiency which would fit some of his other issues as well.

 

[DVontel]

I’m pretty sure that’s what the cards thought they were getting with kirk and Moore.

It’s still there with Moore. I still like his potential a lot. Kirk has always been more linear than shifty.

 

[Chopper0080]

I’m pretty sure that’s what the cards thought they were getting with kirk and Moore.

and some of that is Kyler missing open receivers down the field in key moments while those other QBs hit them. Kyler's peers seem to be able to take advantage of those opportunities while Kyler has not...at least in big moments and in big games. Again, not saying he can't, but that he has not shown it to date.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

We can disagree with Hill, Diggs and Hopkins I guess. While stylistically different, I would put Hopkins against either of those players.

I do agree that I would take KCs overall offensive personnel over ours easily. Their line and Kelce are clear advantages.

I think hill is above the other two. His speed is something that no one else on the field can match. The other two guys can’t take that late catch in the game to the house the way he did.

 

[PlayerHater]

I know the truth is hard to swallow for the Kyler apologists. But don't worry, that number 1 jersey you wear to bed will still be semi trendy for at least one more season.

 

[SoonerLou]

and some of that is Kyler missing open receivers down the field in key moments while those other QBs hit them. Kyler's peers seem to be able to take advantage of those opportunities while Kyler has not...at least in big moments and in big games. Again, not saying he can't, but that he has not shown it to date.

Do you mean miss in not see him or miss in not connect with him?

Kyler was the #1 deep passer in the league. When did he his miss Kirk?

I know the Lions game. He missed him in the Cowboys game, but picked up the 1st down on the next play.

If you're talking playoffs it looked like Kirk pulled up.

Kyler has his issues, but I dont know if thats it.