Do Cards not pick a QB 1st round if....

[kerouac9]

while I'd love to see Palmer play the way he has the last three weeks, I think it will be a challenge to do so. we gotta remember that in the last three weeks we've played pretty much the three worst teams in the league, 2 of the 3 with awful defenses and the other which has a nice ranking, but has been in an 8 game tailspin.

Niners, Seahawks, Colts, Eagles...all winning teams with decent to very good defenses. My guess is he falls back to the pack. But maybe he really does have control of this offense finally. the proof will be in the pudding.

that said, if there is a QBOF there that we really like and pass on him, I'll be pretty upset. Gotta start looking to the future with this club and hopefully make moves in FA where you don't force yourself to take a LT again at the expense of a better player.

I guess, but if we're drafting 18-25, the QBoF that will be available is likely going to look more like Blaine Gabbert or Christian Ponder than Andrew Luck or RG3.

I generally don't have a lot of faith in mid-round QBs. They rarely turn into franchise guys. But in this case (and I admittedly have not looked at any college QBs outside of Aaron Murray), I wouldn't mind drafting someone toolsy in the 2nd or 3rd round and develop him for a year and pay Carson Palmer the $8M he's scheduled to make in 2014.

Ugh. $8M?! That's too much.

Would you rather have Carson Palmer for $8M salary and a $10M cap number, or Shaun Hill for $6M?

Did you know that Jimmy Clausen still has a job in the NFL for some reason?

 

[football karma]

I guess, but if we're drafting 18-25, the QBoF that will be available is likely going to look more like Blaine Gabbert or Christian Ponder than Andrew Luck or RG3.

this is the crux of the matter

if the Cards draft in the 16-ish range or later --- any QB available at that point in the draft will have a serious question mark on them -- be it arm strength, size, or ability to make good decisions.

Making things interesting: At the spot in the draft -- there are going to be some pretty quality tackles available. Its a deep draft (seemingly) for that position. Also -- if you want a TE that has pro bowl potential, its seems like its a pretty good year for TEs as well.

 

[kerouac9]

this is the crux of the matter

if the Cards draft in the 16-ish range or later --- any QB available at that point in the draft will have a serious question mark on them -- be it arm strength, size, or ability to make good decisions.

Making things interesting: At the spot in the draft -- there are going to be some pretty quality tackles available. Its a deep draft (seemingly) for that position. Also -- if you want a TE that has pro bowl potential, its seems like its a pretty good year for TEs as well.

Yeah... I was looking at the early Huddle Report value board, and they currently have Lewan, Matthews, and the Alabama tackle as Top 10 picks. One of the may fall into the early teens, but I'd be surprised if even one of them fall to the Cards.

Tennessee OT Antonio Richardson could be available if he comes out.

At the Quarterback position, THR has Carr and Mettenberger available.

Outside of those guys, I'm earmarking North Carolina TE Eric Ebron, Clemson DE/OLB Vic Beasley, and Minnesota DE RaShede Hageman as potential prospects for further research.

We should keep in the backs of our minds that this team could go into the 2014 draft with holes where Carson Palmer, Darnell Dockett, Daryn Colledge, and (to a much lesser extent) Andre Roberts currently sit.

 

[football karma]

for OTs -- Matthews, Lewan, Cyrus Kouandjio are the guys everyone talks about

but there are guys like Richardson as well as James Hurst, North Carolina -- "undersized" at 6-5, 305 lbs, but a super technically sound guy, or -- Seantrell Henderson of Miami -- a physical specimen at 6-7, 350 but raw; there is the kid from Florida State, Ogbuehi at Tex, A&M, and maybe three other guys

as for Tight Ends -- i really like Ebron -- a down the field TE who is also a credible blocker. Austin Sefarian-Jenkins of Washington -- physical specimen. Jace Amaro of Texas Tech --

all those players in are in that pick 16-48 range

 

[Jetstream Green]

I would love a pass rushing demon. then this defense would be insane

 

[Cardiac]

I would love a pass rushing demon. then this defense would be insane

To start the season I felt this was our biggest need with the caveat we still need to draft our QBOTF whenever possible.

Now I've moved pass rusher to 3rd on the needs list.

Yes a pass rushing demon would make this defense insane.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Would you rather have Carson Palmer for $8M salary and a $10M cap number, or Shaun Hill for $6M?

Are you joking? Shaun Hill makes $6M?

I'd pay Palmer 12mill before I'd pay Hill 6mill.

 

[kerouac9]

Are you joking? Shaun Hill makes $6M?

I'd pay Palmer 12mill before I'd pay Hill 6mill.

You're going to have to pay your starting quarterback something if he's a veteran you're trying to bring in. You can pay your starting NFL quarterback $3M a season, but you're going to end up with Drew Stanton.

But you wouldn't pay anything for Alex Smith, either. Go figure on your QB evaluations.

Shaun Hill is currently in the last year of a two-year contract (extension?) that pays him $2.4M with a $3.25M cap hold.

I wouldn't guarantee him the money, but I think you could pry him out with a starting job, $4M base, and incentives to get up to $6M. It's essentially the deal that we gave Derek Anderson.

 

[Duckjake]

You're going to have to pay your starting quarterback something if he's a veteran you're trying to bring in. You can pay your starting NFL quarterback $3M a season, but you're going to end up with Drew Stanton.

But you wouldn't pay anything for Alex Smith, either. Go figure on your QB evaluations.

Shaun Hill is currently in the last year of a two-year contract (extension?) that pays him $2.4M with a $3.25M cap hold.

I wouldn't guarantee him the money, but I think you could pry him out with a starting job, $4M base, and incentives to get up to $6M. It's essentially the deal that we gave Derek Anderson.

We need to get lucky like the Bengals, Seahawks and 49ers.

Dalton $1.4 million 2013 cap
Wilson $681,000 cap
Kaepernick $1.3 million cap

 

[kerouac9]

We need to get lucky like the Bengals, Seahawks and 49ers.

Dalton $1.4 million 2013 cap
Wilson $681,000 cap
Kaepernick $1.3 million cap

Well, yeah. If you draft someone, you get them for nearly nothing (I believe the measure is 0.25 Stewart Bradleys) for the first four years.

CAM NEWTON only has a $3.6M cap hold this year. (That's 0.75 Stewart Bradleys).

 

[Duckjake]

Well, yeah. If you draft someone, you get them for nearly nothing (I believe the measure is 0.25 Stewart Bradleys) for the first four years.

CAM NEWTON only has a $3.6M cap hold this year. (That's 0.75 Stewart Bradleys).

And players you get in the 2nd and 3rd round cost even less money. Even if they are QBs.

Stewart Bradley's. The new cap currency. I like it.

 

[DoTheDew]

Lots of teams with really bad QB situations who aren't going to get to the 6 wins we already have. Someone is going to reach for the 3rd and maybe 4th best QB before we are even on the clock.

We'll take the best OT/OLB/S/TE available and take a flyer on a mid round QB IMO.

 

[Shaggy]

Well to me, the Colts game will be the deciding factor on who well Palmer has improved. Was he good because of the bottom of the barrel teams they played, or has he meshed with the offense finally? If he does well this Sunday, the QBOF will not on the top of the list for BASK. The Colts game is the make or break game for Palmer. I hope he does really well. I always have liked Palmer and would love to see him a Cards for a few more years.

I totally agree on the bettering of the OL. We need that to be solid and any QB behind a solid line will be a top QB.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

You're going to have to pay your starting quarterback something if he's a veteran you're trying to bring in. You can pay your starting NFL quarterback $3M a season, but you're going to end up with Drew Stanton.

But you wouldn't pay anything for Alex Smith, either. Go figure on your QB evaluations.

Shaun Hill is currently in the last year of a two-year contract (extension?) that pays him $2.4M with a $3.25M cap hold.

I wouldn't guarantee him the money, but I think you could pry him out with a starting job, $4M base, and incentives to get up to $6M. It's essentially the deal that we gave Derek Anderson.

I'm just saying I'd keep Palmer over brining in someone like Hill and draft a guy to develop for a year.

And, yes, Alex Smith still does nothing to impress me. But that's because I can't stand dink and dunk QB's that can't push the ball downfield.

Of course, If I had my choice, the 2 QB's whose teams have the best records, Smith and Wilson, would be nowhere near the top of my list.

 

[BullheadCardFan]

Well, yeah. If you draft someone, you get them for nearly nothing (I believe the measure is 0.25 Stewart Bradleys) for the first four years.

Lol

 

[Totally_Red]

I guess, but if we're drafting 18-25, the QBoF that will be available is likely going to look more like Blaine Gabbert or Christian Ponder than Andrew Luck or RG3.

I generally don't have a lot of faith in mid-round QBs. They rarely turn into franchise guys. But in this case (and I admittedly have not looked at any college QBs outside of Aaron Murray), I wouldn't mind drafting someone toolsy in the 2nd or 3rd round and develop him for a year and pay Carson Palmer the $8M he's scheduled to make in 2014.

Ugh. $8M?! That's too much.

Would you rather have Carson Palmer for $8M salary and a $10M cap number, or Shaun Hill for $6M?

Did you know that Jimmy Clausen still has a job in the NFL for some reason?

I tend to agree with that. You might luck into an Aaron Rodgers, but only if a bunch of teams aren't drafting quarterbacks ahead of you that year. I expect 3-4 to go off the board before the Cardinals make their first round pick.

 

[Duckjake]

Well to me, the Colts game will be the deciding factor on who well Palmer has improved. Was he good because of the bottom of the barrel teams they played, or has he meshed with the offense finally? If he does well this Sunday, the QBOF will not on the top of the list for BASK. The Colts game is the make or break game for Palmer. I hope he does really well. I always have liked Palmer and would love to see him a Cards for a few more years.

I totally agree on the bettering of the OL. We need that to be solid and any QB behind a solid line will be a top QB.

One thing to keep in mind is that Palmer did fairly well against Houston which has the #1 ranked pass defense in the NFL.

Should be a great game to watch Sunday.

 

[kerouac9]

I'm just saying I'd keep Palmer over brining in someone like Hill and draft a guy to develop for a year.

And, yes, Alex Smith still does nothing to impress me. But that's because I can't stand dink and dunk QB's that can't push the ball downfield.

Of course, If I had my choice, the 2 QB's whose teams have the best records, Smith and Wilson, would be nowhere near the top of my list.

Here's an honest question: outside of name recognition, why would you believe that Palmer is a more legitimate quarterback right now than Shaun Hill, much less one who's worth two to three times in salary cap space?

You're right in that, if we're picking football cards or something, I'd rather have Palmer than Hill. But based on recent performances, I'm not sure there's $5M space between their values.

One thing to keep in mind is that Palmer did fairly well against Houston which has the #1 ranked pass defense in the NFL.

Should be a great game to watch Sunday.

Maybe, but Houston lost its top corner in the first quarter of the game, and has the 25th-ranked pass defense according to Football Outsiders' advanced metrics.

 

[Duckjake]

Here's an honest question: outside of name recognition, why would you believe that Palmer is a more legitimate quarterback right now than Shaun Hill, much less one who's worth two to three times in salary cap space?

You're right in that, if we're picking football cards or something, I'd rather have Palmer than Hill. But based on recent performances, I'm not sure there's $5M space between their values.



Maybe, but Houston lost its top corner in the first quarter of the game, and has the 25th-ranked pass defense according to Football Outsiders' advanced metrics.

That is a huge swing and makes me wonder what their advanced metrics are especially since Houston is 8th in Net Yards per attempt. Also if Houston losing their top Corner affected the game why wasn't it Fitzgerald who went off for 190 yards. Or was it moving the #2 to cover Fitz leaving #'s 3 and 4 to cover Floyd?

Plus Palmer threw for 92 yards and a TD in the first 16 minutes of the game.

At any rate Houston is hard to figure out. #1 overall defense in yards,top 10 in third down % but 28th in points. I wonder what the opponents average scoring drive is.

 

[Cardiac]

That is a huge swing and makes me wonder what their advanced metrics are especially since Houston is 8th in Net Yards per attempt. Also if Houston losing their top Corner affected the game why wasn't it Fitzgerald who went off for 190 yards. Or was it moving the #2 to cover Fitz leaving #'s 3 and 4 to cover Floyd?

Plus Palmer threw for 92 yards and a TD in the first 16 minutes of the game.

At any rate Houston is hard to figure out. #1 overall defense in yards,top 10 in third down % but 28th in points. I wonder what the opponents average scoring drive is.

You also have to factor in all the pick 6's Schaub was throwing and any ST's points. Unfair that the D has to put those point into their points allowed column. Not even on the field and they get tagged with those points.

Does anyone have a site that factors in TO's in points allowed.

 

[john h]

Do you think Cards skip on picking a QB with their first pick if Palmer continues to play better the rest of the year? I have a feeling they will not pick a first round QB if he continues to play well and gets us to the playoffs. I really hope I am wrong, but Arians does make some crazy decisions.

It will likely come down to who is available. You would not pick a QB if the best player was a LT. If Palmer got injured you might go the QB route? There are so many variable here it is really hard at this early date to have a good idea of who the Cards might pick or even the position. We are sort of back to need or BPA?

 

[Denny Green Fan]

Lots of teams with really bad QB situations who aren't going to get to the 6 wins we already have. Someone is going to reach for the 3rd and maybe 4th best QB before we are even on the clock.

We'll take the best OT/OLB/S/TE available and take a flyer on a mid round QB IMO.

I was hoping the other Texas A&M tackle would come out but he told the

media he wants to stay. Cedric Ogebuchi

Cameron Erving
Michael Sam
Stephen Morris

 

[WildBB]

I see Roethlisberger coming over after this season. It would probably take at least a 2nd but mtl a 1st somewhere in the 20's to make it happen.

Arians reunites with his former #1.

 

[crisper57]

If Carr is the best QB left on the board, do you take him? Is he the guy you want to build the franchise around?

 

[GatorAZ]

If Carr is the best QB left on the board, do you take him? Is he the guy you want to build the franchise around?

Yes because he has what you can't teach (arm-talent) and his flaws can be worked on (footwork). If had Mettenberger's weapons he'd be a lock in the top-10...