Doug Haller, 3rd edition mock

[Mainstreet]

Doug Haller put out his 3rd edition mock draft today. He has the first three teams going with PGs and Josh Jackson falling to the Suns.

The first five picks in his mock goes this way respectively: Fultz, Ball, Fox, Jackson and Tatum.

I think it will be hard for any team to pass on Fox as well.

1. Boston Celtics
Markelle Fultz, PG, 6-4, 195 pounds, 18 years old, Washington

For the most part, this seems like the draft's only sure thing. The Celtics need more scoring and Fultz is a score-first point guard. Will it cause a problem with Isaiah Thomas? Perhaps. But that's not a bad problem to have.

2. Los Angeles Lakers
Lonzo Ball, PG, 6-6, 190, 19, UCLA

According to reports, Ball has informed the Celtics he will not work out for them. This will get interesting if Magic Johnson falls in love with De'Aaron Fox or Kansas forward Josh Jackson, but at this point that's hard to imagine. If the Lakers pass on the pass-first Ball and the point guard goes on to become a star, Magic will hear about it for the rest of his days. Mostly from LaVar.

3. Philadelphia 76ers
De’Aaron Fox, PG 6-4, 171, 19, Kentucky

This is where it gets interesting. Fox is an athletic, defensive-minded point guard who already has impressed teams with his presence and speed. He may be the draft's best prospect behind Fultz, which makes it hard to see him dropping past No. 3 -- no matter which team holds the pick.

4. Phoenix Suns
Josh Jackson, SF, 6-8, 203, 20, Kansas

Given his length and defensive ability, Jackson makes the most immediate sense for the Suns. If all of the above side with point guards, the Suns will get the draft's best two-way player, someone who can start from Day 1.

5. Sacramento Kings
Jayson Tatum, SF, 6-8, 204, 19, Duke

Tatum is as polished offensively as anyone in the draft. A skilled scorer, he’s mature for his age and versatile in the mid-range. He also rebounds well for his position. After missing eight games with an ankle injury to start last season, Tatum lived up to high expectations, averaging 16.8 points, 7.3 rebounds and 2.1 assists. A potential problem is his defense.

http://www.azcentral.com/story/spor...k-draft-doug-hallers-third-edition/345132001/

 

[3rdside]

Josh Jackson is not long


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[Mainstreet]

All of these players have flaws the more we break them down. My head is beginning to swim.

I'm still like Fox as BPA but I am warming up to Tatum. Jackson has a lot more flaws to his game.

 

[Finito]

Jackson also has more upside that Tatum.

 

[Bodha]

The Ball situation interests me.

Do we even know if the Lakers like him? This entire draft process, its been as if the Ball family decided he will play for the Lakers....

Well...how do the Lakers feel?

 

[slinslin]

Jackson also has more upside that Tatum.

No he does not and is a full year older.

People that act like Jackson is a no-brainer pick at 4 don't know what they are talking about.

 

[AzStevenCal]

No he does not and is a full year older.

People that act like Jackson is a no-brainer pick at 4 don't know what they are talking about.

He has 2 J's in his name, none in his game. I pass.

 

[Mainstreet]

No he does not and is a full year older.

People that act like Jackson is a no-brainer pick at 4 don't know what they are talking about.

I went back to review Jackson's scouting reports on DraftExpress today. He has a number of weaknesses that I previously previously skimmed over. I'm still liking Fox though.

 

[slinslin]

Jacksons defense is not even that good, there is a guy on twitter that has been making an example out of Jacksons defensive mistakes and lack of awareness.

The best two players on the board after Fultz are Tatum and Smith.


I like Fox but no way I take him 4th. Smith is superior in every aspect besides defense where I dont expect much from either PG. A lot of what is said about Fox defense was also said about DPOY Tyler Ulis. Fox weighs 169lbs and PG defense has the leadt effect on defense because even the good ones can't stop the top PGs anyway.

Unfortunately the Sixers per rumors also have Tatum and Smith on top of their board.

Tatum shooting drill

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Shooter projections by Andrew Jackson

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Tatum and Smith projecting a lot better than Jackson and Fox. Higher percentages and twice the 3pt volume. One of the Suns biggest weaknesses is 3pt shooting.

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Look at Jackson, he is on the brink of under 30% from most areas. If not for a late season hot streak this would look worse.

Projects rated by basketballanalytics model CPR

2017
Notable Rankings

1. Malik Monk, Score 18

2. Jayson Tatum, Score 15

3. Markelle Fultz, Lonzo Ball, Caleb Swannigan, Score 14

7. Dennis Smith, Score 11

9. Josh Jackson, Score 10

11. Jonathan Isaac, Score 9

21. De'Aaron Fox, Lauri Markkanen, John Collins, Ivan Rabb, Jawun Evans, Score 7

28. Bam Adebayo, Sindarius Thornwell, Score 6

35. OG Anunoby, Jordan BellScore 5





Harry Giles and Ike Anigbogu finish tied for last with a score of 1.


All-Time Rankings
1. Kevin Durant, Score 84

2. Chris Paul, Score 30

3. Anthony Davis, Score 23

4. Steph Curry, Score 21.

5. Malik Monk, Score 18.

6. Hassan Whiteside, Score 17.

7. Kevin Love, Score 17.

8. Blake Griffin, Score 16.

9. Jayson Tatum, Jabari Parker, Joel Embiid, Score 15.

12. Fultz, Ball, Swannigan, Ingram, Russell, Towns, Wiggins, Smart, Noel

 

[Finito]

No he does not and is a full year older.

People that act like Jackson is a no-brainer pick at 4 don't know what they are talking about.

Soooo pretty much everyone?

 

[slinslin]

Soooo pretty much everyone?

No, I can assure you that not everyone thinks that Josh Jackson is a top 3 talent in this draft.

 

[Finito]

No, I can assure you that not everyone thinks that Josh Jackson is a top 3 talent in this draft.

Everyone on the planet pretty much agrees he's not falling past 4 except you.

It's cool I understand

 

[AzStevenCal]

Everyone on the planet pretty much agrees he's not falling past 4 except you.

It's cool I understand

Which planet?

If he shows up in workouts and impresses, maybe he goes top 4 but I doubt it. Every time I watch him play, I can't help but cringe. He's all flash on D, very little substance. We'd be much better off making a competitive 12 million per deal to bring back PJ.

IMO far too much credibility is being given to these early rankings and draft boards, the projected order will change considerably as they start interviewing and testing these guys. I don't see Jackson helping himself and I really doubt he's anywhere on our draft board.

 

[elindholm]

Was that 18 in a row? I lost count.

 

[slinslin]

Dennis Smith is easily the 2nd best player in this draft in my opinion.

The only question is he checks out medically. If not or if we simply don't want to draft a PG I have Tatum next.

Dennis Smith has everything you want from a PG prospect. He has elite athleticism, he has the best ball-handling ability in this draft, he is a decent shooter off the dribble and catch with easy NBA range. He gets to the rim, even on a NCSU team that had 2 big man that clogged the paint and provided no spacing. He has good passing instincts and vision and regularly found his teammates in traffic or for lobs.
Two triple doubles as a freshman PG, huge games against Duke, Virginia, Syracuse..


His defense is not great but it is not like Lonzo, Fultz etc are playing better defense at this stage. He has all the tools.

And as a nice plus TJ Warren already knows him.

 

[Finito]

Which planet?

If he shows up in workouts and impresses, maybe he goes top 4 but I doubt it. Every time I watch him play, I can't help but cringe. He's all flash on D, very little substance. We'd be much better off making a competitive 12 million per deal to bring back PJ.

IMO far too much credibility is being given to these early rankings and draft boards, the projected order will change considerably as they start interviewing and testing these guys. I don't see Jackson helping himself and I really doubt he's anywhere on our draft board.

Oh this planet

Which planet?

If he shows up in workouts and impresses, maybe he goes top 4 but I doubt it. Every time I watch him play, I can't help but cringe. He's all flash on D, very little substance. We'd be much better off making a competitive 12 million per deal to bring back PJ.

IMO far too much credibility is being given to these early rankings and draft boards, the projected order will change considerably as they start interviewing and testing these guys. I don't see Jackson helping himself and I really doubt he's anywhere on our draft board.

Oh this planet.

PJ Tucker are you serious. So you'd rather havePJ Tucker over Josh Jackson wow

 

[GatorAZ]

Was that 18 in a row? I lost count.

Tatum looks ike a great shooter when stationary and barely has to jump. Would also explain his elite FT shooting. His 3pt shooting was very poor outside of 1 month though.

 

[overseascardfan]

Dennis Smith is easily the 2nd best player in this draft in my opinion.

The only question is he checks out medically. If not or if we simply don't want to draft a PG I have Tatum next.

Dennis Smith has everything you want from a PG prospect. He has elite athleticism, he has the best ball-handling ability in this draft, he is a decent shooter off the dribble and catch with easy NBA range. He gets to the rim, even on a NCSU team that had 2 big man that clogged the paint and provided no spacing. He has good passing instincts and vision and regularly found his teammates in traffic or for lobs.
Two triple doubles as a freshman PG, huge games against Duke, Virginia, Syracuse..


His defense is not great but it is not like Lonzo, Fultz etc are playing better defense at this stage. He has all the tools.

And as a nice plus TJ Warren already knows him.

I agree with you on Smith. I think if PHI goes PG, they take Smith as he is more of an offensive PG than Fox and PHI already has a PG who does everything but score in McConnell. If by some reason they don't take a PG, I think they take Tatum due to his all around offensive game. They already have Simmons who has no jump shot, I highly doubt they take another F with a questionable jump shot. Tatum & Simmons would be a nice F combo, but again I think PHI gets a PG either at #3 or trade up to #1. The only way PHI doesn't go PG is if Lowry does the unthinkable and goes home rather than to a title contender.

Another factor to play into the PHI pick, this year's draft is loaded with PG's but next year is a VERY WEAK PG draft class. So if they want a PG (PHI NEEDS a PG) then they might want to get one now.

 

[Chaplin]

I agree with you on Smith. I think if PHI goes PG, they take Smith as he is more of an offensive PG than Fox and PHI already has a PG who does everything but score in McConnell. If by some reason they don't take a PG, I think they take Tatum due to his all around offensive game. They already have Simmons who has no jump shot, I highly doubt they take another F with a questionable jump shot. Tatum & Simmons would be a nice F combo, but again I think PHI gets a PG either at #3 or trade up to #1. The only way PHI doesn't go PG is if Lowry does the unthinkable and goes home rather than to a title contender.

Another factor to play into the PHI pick, this year's draft is loaded with PG's but next year is a VERY WEAK PG draft class. So if they want a PG (PHI NEEDS a PG) then they might want to get one now.

There's a lot of questions--don't discount the possibility that if the Lakers do indeed take Ball, they could work something out with Philly to send them Russell. Then Philly wouldn't need to pick Fox/Smith.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Dennis Smith is easily the 2nd best player in this draft in my opinion.

The only question is he checks out medically. If not or if we simply don't want to draft a PG I have Tatum next.

Dennis Smith has everything you want from a PG prospect. He has elite athleticism, he has the best ball-handling ability in this draft, he is a decent shooter off the dribble and catch with easy NBA range. He gets to the rim, even on a NCSU team that had 2 big man that clogged the paint and provided no spacing. He has good passing instincts and vision and regularly found his teammates in traffic or for lobs.
Two triple doubles as a freshman PG, huge games against Duke, Virginia, Syracuse..


His defense is not great but it is not like Lonzo, Fultz etc are playing better defense at this stage. He has all the tools.

And as a nice plus TJ Warren already knows him.

OK. Based upon your enthusiasm for him, I have been looking more closely at Dennis Smith. Amazingly, in so many ways he reminds me of Eric Bledsoe. To me, he is incredibly like Bledsoe in his:

1. Offensive mind set. Score first pg's.
2. Distribution abilities (both average)
3. Outside shooting. Smith's college numbers are better than Eric's pro numbers, but the NBA three is longer. Smith's release is a fraction late, which gives him a little hitch, which I think will be a problem in the NBA. You over rate Smith's shooting IMO.
4. Injury history. This is not a good thing.
5. Defense. Both have defensive potential.
6. Athletes. Both are incredible athletes when healthy.

Eric is longer but Smith has a higher vert.
Bledsoe--6-1.5, 6-7.5 wingspan, 8-2 standing reach
Smith--6-2, 6-3 wingspan, 8-1 standing reach

 

[slinslin]

Dennis Smith is not "average at distributing".

Bledsoe and Smith are nothing alike. Ball-handling is the worst part of Eric Bledsoe's game and it is one of the strongest part of Dennis Smith. Dennis Smith can comfortably pull up from far behind the college 3pt line, way more natural shooter than Eric Bledsoe.

The measurements you are quoting for Smith are way outdated from 2014... Smith was barely 16 then..

Dennis Smith is comparable to a young Stephon Marbury and that was an amazing prospect.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Dennis Smith is not "average at distributing".

Bledsoe and Smith are nothing alike. Ball-handling is the worst part of Eric Bledsoe's game and it is one of the strongest part of Dennis Smith. Dennis Smith can comfortably pull up from far behind the college 3pt line, way more natural shooter than Eric Bledsoe.

The measurements you are quoting for Smith are way outdated from 2014... Smith was barely 16 then..

Dennis Smith is comparable to a young Stephon Marbury and that was an amazing prospect.

I tried to find the most recent measurements. They came from here.
https://wesbrownscouting.squarespace.com/dennissmithjr/

If you have better ones, I am interested in seeing them. Not challenging you. I want to be accurate.

I just disagree with your assessment of his shooting. His form has a hesitation.

Do you take issue with the "weaknesses" video on DX?

 

[BleedRed]

Marbury is a great comparison for Smith. I also see a lot of Steve Francis. Would be more then happy with Smith at #4 and curious what the market is for Bledsoe if he was taken.

 

[Chaplin]

Marbury is a great comparison for Smith. I also see a lot of Steve Francis. Would be more then happy with Smith at #4 and curious what the market is for Bledsoe if he was taken.

That is a good question. If the Suns find that the market is soft for Bledsoe, would that basically force them to NOT draft a PG like Smith or Fox? Just another factor to consider with who they are drafting at #4.

 

[BleedRed]

If we did take Smith at 4 and we're able to get back in the lottery with a trade for Bledsoe, I would be doing back flips for Bam Adebayo. I think he could add a physical presence in the paint that would be huge for us.