Dragic

[Covert Rain]

Arguing about whether per-36 or per-48 stats are more useful is the same as asking, "Why does this shirt say 20% off when it's not $100?" It makes absolutely no difference what basis you use as long as you are consistent when comparing one player to another.

Good point. However, since nobody on the planet calculates per 36 and Per 48 stats are available, you will get a much better comparison of players to other players. You can't calculate Dragic at a Per 36 and compare him to other players and say "impressive". It's just plain stupid. Per 48 stats are available for every player and it levels the playing field because everybody is being calculated the same (figuring per minute production then saying for every 48.....). The point was that people were using 36 "because no player plays 48" was said. That's not the reason 48 minutes is used. 48 does not mean Per game. It means for every 48 minutes. There is some confusion. Since 48 minutes is the length of a game, that's why people equate it to a game average.

PS. Dragic averages a little over 12.5 MPG. Any game good or bad with that small of sampling per game is going to skew any stat at this point.

 

[Cheesewater]

Good point. However, since nobody on the planet calculates per 36 and Per 48 stats are available, you will get a much better comparison of players to other players. You can't calculate Dragic at a Per 36 and compare him to other players and say "impressive". It's just plain stupid.

You can if you are comparing his stats to the other players' per 36 minutes stats.

Per 48 stats are available for every player and it levels the playing field because everybody is being calculated the same. Unless your going to go look at every players minutes and find out about how many minutes per game they play, your making Per 48 which is already hard to quantify and making the numbers look even more unrealistic.

Per 36 minutes stats are available for every player as well, at basketball-reference.com, where the OP got his numbers, and where I did my comparison. In fact, that resource is much better than 82games.com in my opinion. The two sites link to each other BTW.

 

[Covert Rain]

You can if you are comparing his stats to the other players' per 36 minutes stats.



Per 36 minutes stats are available for every player as well, at basketball-reference.com, where the OP got his numbers, and where I did my comparison. In fact, that resource is much better than 82games.com in my opinion. The two sites link to each other BTW.

It's not better because 82games gives you Per 48 by position. Basketball-reference clumps everything together including times when Dragic is on the floor playing 2 guard (or in some cases SF) when playing 3 guards on the floor. 82games breaks it out by position. In fact, that site is pullling their data from 82games.com. That could impact him either positively or negatively depending on the stat.

Since, Dragic is our future PG, I don't care what he does at other positions on the floor. What would be interesting is if they did their Per 36 based on Dragics time at PG only. Either way his defensive numbers look poor. Using PER alone is just plain bad anyway. There have been several threads explaining why just using PER is a bad idea. When you look at overall FG%, what you see on the court etc.....

I just don't see how anybody could be satisfied with him. Although between him and Lopez, Dragic is the most likely to make it IMO. I still maintain (at this moment), Dragic is a project and Lopez is a bust.

 

[arwillan]

It's not better because 82games gives you Per 48 by position. Basketball-reference clumps everything together including times when Dragic is on the floor playing 2 guard (or in some cases SF) when playing 3 guards on the floor. 82games breaks it out by position. In fact, that site is pullling their data from 82games.com. That could impact him either positively or negatively depending on the stat.

Since, Dragic is our future PG, I don't care what he does at other positions on the floor. What would be interesting is if they did their Per 36 based on Dragics time at PG only. Either way his defensive numbers look poor. Using PER alone is just plain bad anyway. There have been several threads explaining why just using PER is a bad idea. When you look at overall FG%, what you see on the court etc.....

I just don't see how anybody could be satisfied with him. Although between him and Lopez, Dragic is the most likely to make it IMO. I still maintain (at this moment), Dragic is a project and Lopez is a bust.

What a bold stance.

 

[nashman]

To be fair Dragic plays good aggressive defense he is just a rookie so gets a lot of BS calls against him that would not go against say CP3 or DW. As his name gets more well known maybe he gets a few more non calls I have seen quite a few terrible calls against him so far as he is gaurding well known players.

 

[Covert Rain]

What a bold stance.

Wow..way to add something to the discussion.

PS. For you info, I said they both would be busts at the start of the season.

 

[arwillan]

Wow..way to add something to the discussion.

PS. For you info, I said they both would be busts at the start of the season.

Then why did you say that you still "maintain" that Dragic is a project and Lopez is a bust, if you thought before they were both busts? Apparently you have changed your mind since the start of the season.

I sarcastically labeled your stance as bold because what you said is what nearly everyone already thinks. We know Dragic has potential, and we know Lopez sucks. If anything, you ought to thank yourself for adding something to the discussion.

 

[slinslin]

On the other hand there is some counter evidence to that as I just confused 'slin' with whoever it was pimping Diener in here a couple of years back.

It was graham.

 

[linhsiaohung]

I just love this new kid.
Compare to Robin, I think he does put some real effort in the game.
He just needs some time to fit in the NBA system.

 

[Errntknght]

It was graham.

Okay, okay, now I really apologize!

 

[elindholm]

It was graham.

You mean ydnaydna?

 

[slinslin]

If that is his new nick?

 

[Errntknght]

You mean ydnaydna?

Who else?

 

[Covert Rain]

Then why did you say that you still "maintain" that Dragic is a project and Lopez is a bust, if you thought before they were both busts? Apparently you have changed your mind since the start of the season. .

I did predict they both would be busts. However, I also said that if one of them had a chance (being a project player) it was Dragic. I never thought of Lopez as anything but a scrub.

I blasted Kerr for saying both these guys could come in and be regular contributers after the draf. Kerr had also basically pencilled Dragic in from the get go as Nash's backup. I said back then that if this team had to put that much faith and reliance on a couple unproven rookies this team would be in trouble.

 

[binkar]

I did predict they both would be busts. However, I also said that if one of them had a chance (being a project player) it was Dragic. I never thought of Lopez as anything but a scrub.

I blasted Kerr for saying both these guys could come in and be regular contributers after the draf. Kerr had also basically pencilled Dragic in from the get go as Nash's backup. I said back then that if this team had to put that much faith and reliance on a couple unproven rookies this team would be in trouble.

That was a huge "rookie GM" mistake by Kerr IMO. He placed such high expectations on Lopez and Dragic being regulars in the rotation from the start of the season and it was a big disservice to himself and the players. The reason I say that is this:

We as the fans were trained/told that these guys were going to play big minutes right away and when they didn't or there minutes were cut what is it that we all automatically think? That they aren't as good of players as we thought they were so we made a mistake in drafting them.

If Kerr would have come out from the beginning and said "Hey these are 2 young kids that have a lot of ability and will have a great opportunity to learn behind some of the best players to play their positions, but don't expect too much of them right away."

Instead, Porter kind of had to force the issue and play them some minutes until he realized they weren't ready to compete at this level yet, and then cut their minutes completely. It hurt their confidence and the fans confidence in them as well.

IMO we all would have been a bit more patient with their development if Kerr wouldn't have placed the expectations on them so high, so soon.