Enough is freaking enough!!!

[Jetstream Green]

There is NO EXCUSE with the talent we have on defense, i.e Fisher, Thompson, Wilson and Bryant ect... that we can get atleast two sacks a game. I know we think the talent is subpar but could it be that Joe Green just really isn't much of a line coach though he was a amazing player in his own right?

 

[BW52]

Bingo.I don`t recall ever reading or hearing anyone ever say Joe greene made any of his players better.

 

[AZCB34]

Originally posted by Jetstream Green
There is NO EXCUSE with the talent we have on defense, i.e Fisher, Thompson, Wilson and Bryant ect... that we can get atleast two sacks a game. I know we think the talent is subpar but could it be that Joe Green just really isn't much of a line coach though he was a amazing player in his own right?

Supposedly Greene is responsible for DTs only. Bell and Bryant, according to reports were having very good camps. So I assume that some coaching occurred. Unfortunately, Greene has little control over the other players you mention and really probably only has real control over Davis and Tanner from there.

So I think we may be laying too much blame on him.

 

[Russ Smith]

Originally posted by Jetstream Green
There is NO EXCUSE with the talent we have on defense, i.e Fisher, Thompson, Wilson and Bryant ect... that we can get atleast two sacks a game. I know we think the talent is subpar but could it be that Joe Green just really isn't much of a line coach though he was a amazing player in his own right?

again, Joey Harrington was the TOUGHEST QB in the NFL to sack last year. Anybody who is surprised we didn't get a bunch of sacks shouldn't be. Now 0 sacks sucks, and he did have too much time to throw, but I do think to be fair we need to at least wait until Bell is back before we declare this DL totally dead.


We need more on the DL, we all know it, but I do expect this DL to rush the passer better than the last few years DL's did.

I agree not a Mean Joe fan either I think he was a much better player than a coach.

 

[BW52]

Re: Re: Enough is freaking enough!!!

Originally posted by AZCB34
Supposedly Greene is responsible for DTs only. Bell and Bryant, according to reports were having very good camps. So I assume that some coaching occurred. Unfortunately, Greene has little control over the other players you mention and really probably only has real control over Davis and Tanner from there.

So I think we may be laying too much blame on him.

Wasn`t Greene the DL coach until this year.Now he is the DT coach.What i am saying is that i have heard words of praise for Greene from any sector.If Bryant and Tanner and Bell and Davis develop in playmakers it sure would go a long way towards changing people ideas on Greene.

 

[BW52]

Meant to say i have NEVER heard nor seen words of praise for Greene.

 

[AZCB34]

Re: Re: Re: Enough is freaking enough!!!

Originally posted by BW52
Wasn`t Greene the DL coach until this year.Now he is the DT coach.What i am saying is that i have heard words of praise for Greene from any sector.If Bryant and Tanner and Bell and Davis develop in playmakers it sure would go a long way towards changing people ideas on Greene.

I agree. If the Cards get ganme time production out of these four, it may very well vindicate Greene. From what I have seen out of Bryant and Bell thus far, my opinion of Greene has gone up a bit and hope they keep playing better.

 

[maddogkf]

Originally posted by Jetstream Green
There is NO EXCUSE with the talent we have on defense, i.e Fisher, Thompson, Wilson and Bryant ect... that we can get atleast two sacks a game.

We Have A WINNER!

 

[Wild Card]

Joe Greene holds at least one distinction. He was the last DL coach employed by two legendary head coaches, Chuck Noll in Pittsburgh and Don Shula in Miami.

Noll gave his ex-Pro Bowler his first NFL coaching job, from 1987-91. Those were generally mediocre seasons for the Steelers; in 1991, Noll's last season, they went 7-9, with a defense ranked 22nd out of 28 teams for both yards and points allowed.

Shula hired Greene in 1992, and Greene spent the next four years coaching the d-line of a mostly undistinguished Miami defense; they finished his (and Shula's) final season with the Fins, 1995, ranked 14th in yards allowed out of 30 teams.

Now, I don't want to say Joe Greene helped ease two Hall-of-Fame HCs into retirement, but the coincidence is sorta creepy.

WC

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Originally posted by Jetstream Green
There is NO EXCUSE with the talent we have on defense, i.e Fisher, Thompson, Wilson and Bryant ect... that we can get atleast two sacks a game. I know we think the talent is subpar but could it be that Joe Green just really isn't much of a line coach though he was a amazing player in his own right?

I hear you. But don't rip Joe Green. He is only teaching. If he was playing then our DL would have no problems what so ever cause he was/is a beast. MAYBE HE SHOULD be DE coach.

 

[Wild Card]

Re: Re: Re: Enough is freaking enough!!!

Originally posted by BW52
Wasn`t Greene the DL coach until this year.Now he is the DT coach.What i am saying is that i have heard words of praise for Greene from any sector.If Bryant and Tanner and Bell and Davis develop in playmakers it sure would go a long way towards changing people ideas on Greene.

BW52:

What is this reverse career path that Joe Greene is following? After three, at best, lateral moves as DL coach--and I think I'm being generous, characterizing Noll's Steelers to Shula's Dolphins to Vince Tobin's Cardinals as "lateral"--Greene is demoted to DT coach?

Seems to me, as a coach, Greene was a helluva lineman.

WC

 

[Northern Card]

Re: Re: Enough is freaking enough!!!

Originally posted by Russ Smith
again, Joey Harrington was the TOUGHEST QB in the NFL to sack last year. Anybody who is surprised we didn't get a bunch of sacks shouldn't be. Now 0 sacks sucks, and he did have too much time to throw, but I do think to be fair we need to at least wait until Bell is back before we declare this DL totally dead.


We need more on the DL, we all know it, but I do expect this DL to rush the passer better than the last few years DL's did.

I agree not a Mean Joe fan either I think he was a much better player than a coach.

In passing, so to speak... most of Harrington's passes were of a three and five step drop. Pretty difficult to sack a quarterback with a quick release, a decent line.. when he's doing that consistently. Rogers TD, over the middle, was a three-step drop and a beautiful layout by Rogers... and then all I read, following the game, is how our DBs were lousy in coverage. Wouldn't be a bad idea, for some on this board, to tape games, review a day or so later, before spewing based simply on memory.

 

[BW52]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Enough is freaking enough!!!

Originally posted by Wild Card
BW52:

What is this reverse career path that Joe Greene is following? After three, at best, lateral moves as DL coach--and I think I'm being generous, characterizing Noll's Steelers to Shula's Dolphins to Vince Tobin's Cardinals as "lateral"--Greene is demoted to DT coach?

Seems to me, as a coach, Greene was a helluva lineman.

WC

I guess you didn`t see my followup post where i stated that "i meant to say i NEVER heard or read praise for Greene.

 

[BuckeyeCardinal]

What Bothers Me

Bryant has the size/speed ratio to be a successful NFL lineman.....in other words he has enough athleticism.

But I worry about his success when more than one person says that he is SOFT.

S-O-F-T in the NFL means he may be a B-U-S-T.

 

[Northern Card]

Re: What Bothers Me

Originally posted by BuckeyeCardinal


But I worry about his success when more than one person says that he is SOFT.

WHOM?

 

[D-Dogg]

I still don't see the knock on W Bryant....he had a decent game getting inside pressure, and had near sacks..I think he popped harrington once. That O Line there doesn't give up sacks though...very few.

I think you'll see more pressure on Hasslebeck this weekend. Too bad I can't be at the game...my friend and I are trading our season tix this week and next...he's taking his new gf and I'm taking my wife to the Packer game. I hate missing the opener.

 

[red desert]

Welcome D-Dogg.

 

[PJ1]

The talent you mention has never proven anything in the pass rush area. Pace and Bryant need to develop. Fisher and Thompson aren't the answer and won't be effective until we get the D line straightened out.

 

[JeffGollin]

Crucial Question -

If the Cardinals decided to really go out and kick butt on a given Sunday, do they (right now!) have the personnel to do so?

Discuss.