Federal documents detail sweeping potential NCAA violations involving high-profile players, schools

[DWKB]

Let me just point out that in order for Russ to be right that Self knew about these payments from Adidas, he would have planned to play Preston this season even though he was ineligible until a single car accident happened that KU self investigated and voluntarily reported to the NCAA while cautiously sitting Preston out the whole time.

Once Preston declared himself professional, Self then chose to play another ineligible kid who was able to come in because Preston declared and play him in meaningful games.

The juxtaposition of caution and brazen one would have to have is not logical or rational. Russ starts with a biased conclusion and works backwards. It doesn't add up.

The report also states that (supposedly) DeSousa was committed to Maryland because Under Armour paid his guardian to do so, but DeSousa wanted to come to KU and the guardian had Adidas pay off the payment from Under Armour in order to make this happen. While there is obvious problems with Adidas doing this, it in no way signals that KU/Adidas has to purchase DeSousa's desire to come play basketball at KU. In fact the payment was only to get out of a previous "contract". This is per the report.

Nobody in the media is talking about UA or Maryland from this report because why?

 

[DWKB]

Worth a read if you care about this subject. Some highlights:

Q: Do you see it as a possibility that Bill Self could not have known about the shoe companies trying to steer them (the two players cited in indictment against Adidas reps) to KU?

JAY BILAS: Well first I don’t know that that (steering players) happened, but if you assume that it did, I can absolutely believe that coaches were not involved in those type of things. At Miami it’s the same type of deal. Heck the government has already dropped one guy out that claimed to be passing money onto a kid that kept the money for himself. So who knows what is being said. You don’t know. I think like anything else, it needs to be proven. … To my understanding there is no allegation that anyone at Kansas had any knowledge.

[...]

Q: (following up on previous question)

JAY BILAS: … I read (one) article the other day, the one that was using unnamed sources on people like balking at Kansas using the term ‘victim.’ That’s not Kansas’ term. That’s what the government claims. That’s what the the government says. They (KU officials) didn’t pull that out of thin air. The United States government says they are a victim, That is their theory. I don’t understand why people won’t go on the record. What’s so horrible about it? If you’ve got the opinion that Kansas, they’re not victims, then why wouldn’t you stand behind that? I didn’t understand that one. To me that’s like an issue of petty jealousy. It’s like claiming UCLA wouldn’t have won all those championships if not for Sam Gilbert. The hell they wouldn’t have. They would have won them anyway.

Q: Do you want to say anything about Bill (Self) about or his integrity or …?

JAY BILAS: Yeah, I would. I’ve known Bill Self for geez, for almost 20 years now. And I know him to be of the highest integrity. So I don’t believe that he would actively participate in the violation of NCAA rules any more than I would believe Coach K or John Beilein would do that.

I don’t believe that. I believe I understand how the business works. I played. I am not naive. I know that hardly anybody was eligible when I played and hardly anybody is eligible now.


http://kuhoops.com/ku-basketball-news/209167479/

 

[Russ Smith]

Let me just point out that in order for Russ to be right that Self knew about these payments from Adidas, he would have planned to play Preston this season even though he was ineligible until a single car accident happened that KU self investigated and voluntarily reported to the NCAA while cautiously sitting Preston out the whole time.

Once Preston declared himself professional, Self then chose to play another ineligible kid who was able to come in because Preston declared and play him in meaningful games.

The juxtaposition of caution and brazen one would have to have is not logical or rational. Russ starts with a biased conclusion and works backwards. It doesn't add up.

The report also states that (supposedly) DeSousa was committed to Maryland because Under Armour paid his guardian to do so, but DeSousa wanted to come to KU and the guardian had Adidas pay off the payment from Under Armour in order to make this happen. While there is obvious problems with Adidas doing this, it in no way signals that KU/Adidas has to purchase DeSousa's desire to come play basketball at KU. In fact the payment was only to get out of a previous "contract". This is per the report.

Nobody in the media is talking about UA or Maryland from this report because why?

Because they didn't directly name maryland although we know it's them.

I don't think Preston and DeSousa are really similar though. Preston was a top 20 type player who would have likely started at most places right away, maybe not KU, Self seems to make freshmen earn it a bit more. DeSousa is an athletic kid but not polished, I don't think it was surprising he didn't play all that much.

I think a kid on Preston's level virtually everyone assumes the kid is getting something. All of these kids get something but at his level, I think it would be naive to say he didn't get some money. With DeSousa that may not be the case he wasn't an instant impact guy.

I know the story out there about him is that his commitment to KU was a big surprise but i didn't follow that recruitment so I really don't know if that's the case.

Both kids committed before the FBi story broke so the notion that this was done knowing about the FBI is not there. I agree that Self playing DeSousa if he knew he'd been paid was risky, and in his case I think he probably didn't know DeSousa had been paid. As you said he was really apparently paid by UA to go to Maryland. Then he wanted to go to KU, so they in effect bought out that deal. It depends what version you believe but the claim out there is that whoever got the money told Adidas we don't have it any more, we can't just give it back to UA, so Adidas paid it off. So if they paid 20K to buy him out, the implication is the family got 20K from UA, kept it, and then Adidas paid 20K in their name to get him out. So I would argue they got 20 K but got the BENEFIT of 40K ALso the way the story was written implies that DeSousa knew about it, so I expect the NCAA to suspend him, not clear for how long.

As to am I starting with the assumption of guilt absolutely, I've been saying this since the FBI story broke, most of these kids are getting money, to them, to their family etc. I have known this for yeras. We had scout guys on BRO 3 years ago telling us how the current setup worked and was designed to give coaches plausible deniability, what the FBI story exposed was almost exactly what they said. The difference was, there were actual coaches, assistants plus Pitino, named in the charges. That was something that surprised even the "experts."

Anybody that followed Preston's HS career closely would not have been surprised that he had eligibility issues, both academic and otherwise. So in his case I have a hard time believing Self didn't know going in there was a risk. i suspect after the FBI story broke, KU did what all schools did, who on our roster is at risk here, and chose to suspend him. I think that was the right move but I still am very skeptical they had no clue he'd been paid.

 

[Russ Smith]

Worth a read if you care about this subject. Some highlights:

Q: Do you see it as a possibility that Bill Self could not have known about the shoe companies trying to steer them (the two players cited in indictment against Adidas reps) to KU?

JAY BILAS: Well first I don’t know that that (steering players) happened, but if you assume that it did, I can absolutely believe that coaches were not involved in those type of things. At Miami it’s the same type of deal. Heck the government has already dropped one guy out that claimed to be passing money onto a kid that kept the money for himself. So who knows what is being said. You don’t know. I think like anything else, it needs to be proven. … To my understanding there is no allegation that anyone at Kansas had any knowledge.

[...]

Q: (following up on previous question)

JAY BILAS: … I read (one) article the other day, the one that was using unnamed sources on people like balking at Kansas using the term ‘victim.’ That’s not Kansas’ term. That’s what the government claims. That’s what the the government says. They (KU officials) didn’t pull that out of thin air. The United States government says they are a victim, That is their theory. I don’t understand why people won’t go on the record. What’s so horrible about it? If you’ve got the opinion that Kansas, they’re not victims, then why wouldn’t you stand behind that? I didn’t understand that one. To me that’s like an issue of petty jealousy. It’s like claiming UCLA wouldn’t have won all those championships if not for Sam Gilbert. The hell they wouldn’t have. They would have won them anyway.

Q: Do you want to say anything about Bill (Self) about or his integrity or …?

JAY BILAS: Yeah, I would. I’ve known Bill Self for geez, for almost 20 years now. And I know him to be of the highest integrity. So I don’t believe that he would actively participate in the violation of NCAA rules any more than I would believe Coach K or John Beilein would do that.

I don’t believe that. I believe I understand how the business works. I played. I am not naive. I know that hardly anybody was eligible when I played and hardly anybody is eligible now.


http://kuhoops.com/ku-basketball-news/209167479/

He completely contradicted himself at the end by admitting he knows hardly anybody is eligible and earlier having said people like Self, CoachK and Beilein participate in the violation of NCAA rules. If Jay Bilas knows most kids aren't eligible, clearly the coaches do too and yet they're playing them.

Unless he seriously wants me to bellieve that Duke, Kansas and Michigan are comparable. They're not, Duke is losing their entire starting 5, 4 of them were one and dones. One of them, Bagley has this huge story out there now about how his father went from BK and losing a home to foreclosure, to living in a million dollar gated development in SO Cal where his only source of income was Nike. There's no way Coach K didn't know that because it was well known. I've been saying all along I never got excited about the claims UCLA led for Bagley becaues I didn't think he'd qualify.

Kansas recruits at a notch below Duke, but they're getting elite kids. Michigan just doesn't recruit at that level. If you told me one of those 3 teams had ineligible plaeyrs I'd immediately guess Duke, I still think the EYBL stuff will ultimately reveal they had kids getting steered to Duke. The last of the 3 I would suspect is Michigan.

The victim stuff as a lawyer Bilas is being disingenuous. That term is used for a reason, the FBI is bringing federal charges and one of the requirements of doing it is there has to be a "victim". In order to do this, they determined the schools were victims playing guys who were actually ineligible defrauded the schools. I think the tone at the initial press conference was pretty clear, we have your playbook meant we know what the deal here is.

 

[Ronin]

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[Russ Smith]

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

I don't have any issue with that, did anybody expect there was going to be actual evidence given to KU in that October review that they'd be required to document? That was just after the story broke, nobody had access to any information the FBI has, the kids and their parents aren't going to volunteer if they got paid so expecting Kansas to file a written report seems a bit silly.

 

[Russ Smith]

On the Billy Preston thing.Ironically the kid I was hoping UCLA would get instead of Preston was Cody Riley. UCLA did get him, and he was one of the 3 kids who got caught shoplifting in China and missed his whole freshman year.

He also apparently has decided to test the waters and declared for the draft, without an agent. So 20 years old, never played above HS, 6'7" kid who's basically a 5, suspended a year for shoplifting and he decided to test the waters.

There are rumors he's not intending to come back to UCLA although nobody really knows.

So maybe Preston wasn't any worse.

 

[Russ Smith]

I sure hope the NCAA doesn't go after Langford's dad here. Well if they do, they sure as hell better do it concurrently with going after Marvin Bagley's dad and Nike for doing the same thing, for more money, and longer period of time, so Nike could get Bagley to Duke.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/spor...ory.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.ccfd67696d7f

 

[Russ Smith]

FWIW Munish Sood the financial advisor in the case has plead guilty. He apparently cooperated with authorities so they waited until recently to charge him and he's not indicted he took a plea for lesser charges presumably because he gave them information.

 

[Russ Smith]

THe Gatto trial has started, Adidas guy who got caught up in all this because the FBI said they had him on tape in the Bowen allegations.

Among tweets made today by Dan Wetzel, the attorney for Gatto said Oregon offered an "astronomical amount of money for Bowen" and the 100k for him to Louisville was to "level the playing field". Not clear if that means Oregon offered more than 100K but Bowen took less, because if it was less than 100K they wouldn't call it astronomical?

Also alleges Under Armour paid DeSousa 20K to go to Maryland(we already knew that) and that Arizona offered Nassir Little 150K. Note, he said Arizona not Nike, my understanding from the FBI stuff was that the bidding war was between shoe companies not universities in the Little case but Wetzel said the attorney said Arizona.

And that Dennis Smith Jr got 40K while at NC State, we already knew that too from the Yahoo stuff.

 

[TJ]

Looking forward to the concrete evidence Gatto's attorney has on Arizona indicating that such an offer was made to Little. Right now, it sounds like third-party hearsay. Appears that the Gatto defense is to burn basketball to the ground.

 

[Russ Smith]

Looking forward to the concrete evidence Gatto's attorney has on Arizona indicating that such an offer was made to Little. Right now, it sounds like third-party hearsay. Appears that the Gatto defense is to burn basketball to the ground.

I thin it's obvious their intent is to show that everyone is corrupt, everyone knew what was going on including the schools, so there are no victims. If there are no victims, then you can't convict Gatto of a federal crime. He can't have defrauded schools by paying players so they were technically ineligible, if the schools already knew the kids were getting paid. That seems to be their angle, none of them are taking plea deals they're all going to argue that the schools knew, were involved in it, so there was no fraud, there is no victim, and thus no crime.

The FBI story stuff we've seen so far alleged that 2 3rd parties(shoe companies) were in a bidding war over Little, nowhere in it did it say Miami and Arizona were offering him money. Now the assumption is the offers were to steer so it then is up to the NCAA to decide if the schools are also to blame or not. Little was going to Arizona before this story broke, so the clear indication is if Augustine was seeking money to send his star AAU player to a school, that someone offered him 150K on behalf of Arizona. Gatto apparently offered him money to go to Miami but it seems pretty unlikely he can PROVE that was competing with another offer. It's not like they send these kids written offer letters we will give you 150K plus stock options to sign with us, that stuff is all going to be done under the table. Augustine pocketed the money he admitted it, so it will be interesting to see who he got it from, Adidas(Gatto) or Nike. Based on the belief the kid was going to Arizona, you would assume he got paid by Nike, but we've never actually seen that stated as fact.

Both Zion Williamson and Taeshon Cherry are named as people of interest, as is Ayton. My first pass would be Ayton is on there because of Kansas not Arizona, his most obvious connection to Gatto and Adidas would be that for a long time everyone thought KU was the only school recruiting him. That doesn't mean Adidas offered to pay him on behalf of Kansas but it's the most likely reason IMO that he's on the list. Kansas recruited Zion too so maybe that's his connection to gatto? I don't think they recruited Cherry, and he was going to USC(Nike) until this all happened but presumably at some point Gatto and Adidas were competing for him and that's why he's on the list. Or he could just be on the list as a here is another kid who was getting paid see how widespread it is, with no connection at all to Gatto, and that could be the case for Ayton and Zion too, here are 2 more high profile kids who were going to get paid everyone does it not just Adidas.

FWIW the lawyer said they did have proof but he didn't say for which claims. Based on the opening statement one would assume they have proof Oregon offered Bowen's dad cash because they opened with that bombshell.

 

[Russ Smith]

Gassnola testified today that Gatto told him Bill Self personally called Gatto and thanked him when Silivo DeSousa committed to Kansas. And yet they are all still insisting Kansas and Self knew nothing about Adidas and paying kids. So what exactly was Self saying thank you for, what exactly did he think Gatto did that helped him get DeSousa? I assume that's what's going to be brought up today what exactly was he thanking you for.

 

[Russ Smith]

Self on tape saying that he's happy with the deal with Adidas, and essentially saying they do for Kansas what Nike does for Duke and UNC, and then Gassnola adds "and Kentucky too."

And yet there's Coach K saying he knows nothing about cheating, thinks college hoops is largely clean, the amount of cheating is minute.

I think he forgot Marvin Bagley played for him last year.

 

[Russ Smith]

Not a Dan Wetzel fan but he wrote a good article ripping into Coach K for "whistling by the graveyard" instead of telling the truth about college hoops. even mentioned Bagley and Zion.

https://sports.yahoo.com/coach-k-sh...-thinks-hoops-corruption-trial-052601836.html

 

[Russ Smith]

https://www.cbssports.com/college-b...ek-for-programs-involved-in-corruption-trial/

There's a link to a 60 plus minute podcast with Gary Parrish and Matt Norlander of CBS discussing the whole case. Some funny stuff and some stuff that's not really been made public.

Parrish goes into detail about how he's known Gassnola for 15 years and how when he was covering Memphis for the local news(think John Calipari), Gassnola was "around the program all the time". Gassnola was the guy who got them Antonio Anderson and that helped them with the key guys around Derrick Rose on that team that nearly won it all. He thinks Gassnola and Derek Kellogg(a Memphis assistant) were HS teammates and that was the angle. He said knowing what I knew then it doesn't surprise me at all Gassnola is in the situation he's in now, it was apparent then what his role was for Memphis(Calipari) and what he saw his career path as, exactly how it ended up.

It also explains something that I've wondered about for awhile, the timing of WHEN the FBI story broke. I assumed they felt it was the right time, there was speculation they did it to give the NCAA time to suspend kids before last year, which obviously wasn't the case. In the end the reason makes perfect sense, that is that Merl Code was very openly saying on taped calls that he was concerned about this new player in the Dawkins and Sood stuff, and the new player was in fact an FBI undercover agent they knew as "Jeff." Code was even talking with Dawkins and Gatto and Gassnola in separate calls saying I'm researching the guy online, I don't find anything, we need to protect ourselves. There were even discussions about calling private detectives, or does someone really have connections to the government that could help us find out who this guy is? So the entire reason they went public was not they felt they were at a logical conclusion, but they were concerned some of the key players in the scheme were suspicious of the undercover agent, and it was just a matter of time before they might have figured it out. Gassnola even transferred some of his ill gotten cash to his longtime gf in advance, when asked why under oath, he said because I figured it was just a matter of time before you guys knocked on my door. That is Gassnola was suspicious, Code was suspicious and it was apparently in their opinion because Dawkins and some of the guys he was dealing with, were just too brazen about the cheating and were going to get caught.

 

[Russ Smith]

If yuo listened to the CBS podcast they were guessing IF there's a tape with Miller and Dawkins discussing paying Ayton, it will come out today since Dawkins is in this trial. Both sides closed arguments today and nobody played such a tape. Their argument was it's not as relevant in the Book Richardson assistant coaches trial, the only way it's relevant is really if the DEFENSE wants to use it to defend Book, see even the head coach was involved my client is being thrown under the bus,

But it's much more relevant for the defense in the Dawkins, Gatto and Code trial, see even a head coach was involved, the schools know, there are no victims here. So there was no such tape reveal today.

Of course prior to that discussion they were talking about how Kansas and Arizona fans are the only people in the world paying attention to this trial that think their school is being exonerated not exposed. They did say look if you're a fan of a top 30 program don't gloat, your team is doing it too.

 

[Russ Smith]

In statements not allowed to be entered into testimony due to lack of relevance to the case, there's a discussion between Kurtis Townsend of Kansas, and Merl Code where they talk about how Zion Williamson wants a job and housing for his family, and money, and Townsend said if that's what it tkaes to get him here for 10 monhs, we'll do it. And yet we're supposed to believe he went to Duke for free?

 

[Dback Jon]

In statements not allowed to be entered into testimony due to lack of relevance to the case, there's a discussion between Kurtis Townsend of Kansas, and Merl Code where they talk about how Zion Williamson wants a job and housing for his family, and money, and Townsend said if that's what it tkaes to get him here for 10 monhs, we'll do it. And yet we're supposed to believe he went to Duke for free?

No doubt. If one big program goes down, they all need to go down.

 

[Russ Smith]

No doubt. If one big program goes down, they all need to go down.

The one thing that IMO works in Duke's favor here, beyond that Nike is not on trial Adidas is, is that his final 5 was Kansas and 4 Nike teams, DUke, UNC, Arizona and Kentucky. So you can make the argument that Nike agreed to pay whatever Adidas was going to pay(Money, job etc) but they let him pick which of 4 Nike schools he was going to. then if you're Coach K you can say see, we did nothing wrong, he picked Duke over 3 other schools that were all Nike, plus over Kansas. And of course there's no evidence money changed hands.

But it again brings up the point either this entire case is about Dawkins and others bragging about money that never actually happened, or there are a bunch of kids out there who are being offered tons of money and are instead choosing to attend other schools for free, and yet these shoe companies and agents keep offering them money. You'd think they'd eventually learn the kids don't want the money.

And yes that's sarcasm.

 

[Southpaw]

Please take down Duke.

 

[Russ Smith]

As expected Kansas suspends Silvio DeSousa pending review of his eligibility. I would assume Maryland will suspend Bruno Fernando too but since his name didn't actually come up in the trial maybe not.

CBS speculating Kansas will eventually have to vacate their FF appearance for playing DeSousa last year.

 

[GatorAZ]

As expected Kansas suspends Silvio DeSousa pending review of his eligibility. I would assume Maryland will suspend Bruno Fernando too but since his name didn't actually come up in the trial maybe not.

CBS speculating Kansas will eventually have to vacate their FF appearance for playing DeSousa last year.

Kansas has been cautious with Preston and DeSousa which is probably the smart move.

Most people are speculating the jury’s decision will come tomorrow or Friday. Federal crimes were committed yet they’re taking days to deliberate which is likely positive for the defense.

 

[Russ Smith]

Kansas has been cautious with Preston and DeSousa which is probably the smart move.

Most people are speculating the jury’s decision will come tomorrow or Friday. Federal crimes were committed yet they’re taking days to deliberate which is likely positive for the defense.

Verdict just out, guilty on all counts, the jury found the schools were the victims and federal crimes were committed.

I would assume this means some of the assistant coaches who entered not guilty pleas earlier are going to now ask to change their plea and cut a deal. My assumption is based on the idea they didn't believe it was going to be proven a crime was committed so they went NG on that assumption. Now that they know a crime has been found to be committed, they're going to do some CYA.

 

[Russ Smith]

Forgot to add wasn't heavily reported but both sides agreed to redacting Miami from the allegations. That seems to mean they're conceding they have no evidence Larranaga knew of any bidding on Nassir Little because they believe the only bidding for Little was between Dawkins and Augustine the AAU coach trying to get someone to bid money for him. You can take that 2 ways, there was no bidding war so Arizona is clean on that one, or Miami has been cleared but the other school mentioned in the original allegations, believed to be Arizona, was NOT cleared largely because it wasn't considered central to the case on trial. If there was no offer from Miami, then Adidas, Gatto, Code etc weren't guilty in that particular case so they didn't need to pursue it anymore because they and Dawkins were the ones on trial.