Final Jeopardy

[Harry]

Who will the Cards take with the first pick? Well I’ve spent recent days reading everything I could find that KK said. I’ve skipped evaluations by others and just looked at his words. I think I’ve got a handle on him. Then I reviewed how the Cards handled the coaching change. Finally I looked at college coaches making the transition to NFL coach. Back to question one; the Cards will take Murray. This reminds me of the Chip Kelly error of believing my system is so good it can’t lose. Keep in mind KK’s system has been losing in college. Finally there’s the Solomon-like decision to cut the baby into two parts. KK will run the offense and Joesph the defense. Of course Solomon wasn’t serious but sadly the Cards are.

The first pick decision should be simple. Which player is most certain to make the team better? Teams that gamble with the first pick usually lose. Murray may be the best QB for KK’s offense, but will he do the most to improve the Cards? If KK was correct that Rosen could run this offense then let him run it. The cost of changing to Murray is an unnecessary burden to pay. How much difference could Murray possibly make with this offense still undergoing major personnel changes? Tons has been written about Rosen’s rapport with Kirk. We’ve seen new QBs always take time to understand when Fitz is “open.” Rosen has experienced the speed of an NFL defense. He made mistakes. Why make them all over again with Murray?

I’m not saying Murray can’t make it as an NFL QB. I’m saying the coach doesn’t call the first pick. Did Keim have Murray on top his board? Maybe. The Cards do seem to have an envy issue. They want a dynamic QB like Wilson. They want a dynamic coach like McVay. Plus, as the song says, they want it now. The more I look at this picture the less likely it seems to represent success. The number of college transitioning coaches who succeed is small. The successes who want to change to a revolutionary system is even smaller. The number of QB with one year of college starting who succeed in the NFL is small. The number of small QBs who succeed is small.

The current Cards defense looks promising but it lacks depth. If Jones get hurt, where’s the pass rush coming from? How much better could the rush be with 2 premier players instead of one? Defense isn’t as much fun as offense, but it’s the right call with the first pick. If this offense really plays as a system then surely more than one QB can run it.

 

[Garthshort]

Harry, most pundits say that a good QB is more valued than a good Edge rusher. Look at what happened to Arizona when they had a Derrick (??) Anderson clone at QB.

 

[cardsunsfan]

I really wish the NFL was more balanced and the QB wasn't so important.. I really do. Unfortunately I feel like the QB is more than 50% of the equation, maybe 2/3rds.. The best defensive player may be 10% if lucky? I think Patrick Peterson is one of the most important defensive players in the game today but how much did he help our win total? I think we could have easily lost a couple of those games we won with a Rosen bad throw or a dropped ball.. nothing Peterson would have done would have helped change that tide..

In todays game I just don't see any defensive player by themselves being a huge game changer. A lesser QB on the Seahawks last year I think would have won three games. I think you add or take off any defensive player you wanted to and maybe it would make a one game difference?

I think you can string a lot of good defensive players together to help your team but I don't think one 1st does it anymore.. Look at how many 1st we have gone through recently that have not panned out.

I almost feel like we should draft Murray and keep Rosen and let them fight it out in camp... I think second order of business is to get an Oline that doesn't get the QB killed then receivers that can actually catch the ball... Then defense.. I really like defense but the NFL rules are just leaning so much towards offense... The great thing about a good Oline is it can keep your QB alive.. no defensive position normally prevents another player from getting killed so I think it helps in multiple areas..

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Nick Bosa

 

[az jam]

I don't know if both Bidwill and Keim will let KK make the decision on drafting Murray. So far KK has let Keim really call all the shots. Keim brought in the coaching staff candidates and made the free agent signings. KK of course was involved but Keim has been the decision maker. I don't see KK as a very forceful voice at this time like BA was. IMO it really comes down to how both Bidwill and Keim view Rosen versus Murray. I'm hoping that they stay with Rosen and build around him which they have started in free agency and could continue in the draft. I'm on the Bosa at #1 train for the Cards.

 

[TheCardFan]

This reminds me of the Chip Kelly error of believing my system is so good it can’t lose. Keep in mind KK’s system has been losing in college. Finally there’s the Solomon-like decision to cut the baby into two parts. KK will run the offense and Joesph the defense. Of course Solomon wasn’t serious but sadly the Cards are.

Worked for McVay.

KK's offensive system hasn't been "losing", his defenses have. I would say its smart to surround him with great D coaches and upgraded talent. Just like the Rams.

 

[cardsunsfan]

I agree with that..damn you guys post fast and early too. I was going to delete my comment because I wanted to post it as a separate comment.. I think of the best defensive players in the game last year and I think in the end, they didn't make the difference to put them over the edge. Solid team defense and great QB play did that.. Who is the best defensive player in the game right now? How much of a difference did he make to his team? I can think of one guy in Chicago..but I think his team was ready to break out before he got there and was really only one piece to the puzzle.. the Raiders were still really bad with him.

 

[slanidrac16]

10 years ago I would have totally agreed with you Harry. I respect your opinion more than anybody else on the board. Maybe it’s the kool-aid in me but I’m going to humbly disagree with some of your post. McVay/Phillips and Nagy/Fangio seems to be the new wave. I see nothing wrong with that concept. I too think it’s Murray but I’m not going to blame KIngsbury if we do select him. That’s all on your GM AND owner. Anybody who doesn’t believe selecting Murray is just a football decision I think is delusional. PR and ticket sales come into play. It may not be the deciding factor, but it’s definitely in the mix. I believe trading down is the best thing to do but not any further than #4. I think Rosen could be twice as good with less ints. than last year in Kingsbury’s system. Add some real weapons around him (wr maybe two, an o- lineman maybe two and a good pass rushing 3/4 de ) and I think this team could compete. If we do draft Murray they had better surround him with super playmakers and not Hope Kevin White, chad Williams and Clay are the answer.

 

[PACardsFan]

Who will the Cards take with the first pick? Well I’ve spent recent days reading everything I could find that KK said. I’ve skipped evaluations by others and just looked at his words. I think I’ve got a handle on him. Then I reviewed how the Cards handled the coaching change. Finally I looked at college coaches making the transition to NFL coach. Back to question one; the Cards will take Murray. This reminds me of the Chip Kelly error of believing my system is so good it can’t lose. Keep in mind KK’s system has been losing in college. Finally there’s the Solomon-like decision to cut the baby into two parts. KK will run the offense and Joesph the defense. Of course Solomon wasn’t serious but sadly the Cards are.

The first pick decision should be simple. Which player is most certain to make the team better? Teams that gamble with the first pick usually lose. Murray may be the best QB for KK’s offense, but will he do the most to improve the Cards? If KK was correct that Rosen could run this offense then let him run it. The cost of changing to Murray is an unnecessary burden to pay. How much difference could Murray possibly make with this offense still undergoing major personnel changes? Tons has been written about Rosen’s rapport with Kirk. We’ve seen new QBs always take time to understand when Fitz is “open.” Rosen has experienced the speed of an NFL defense. He made mistakes. Why make them all over again with Murray?

I’m not saying Murray can’t make it as an NFL QB. I’m saying the coach doesn’t call the first pick. Did Keim have Murray on top his board? Maybe. The Cards do seem to have an envy issue. They want a dynamic QB like Wilson. They want a dynamic coach like McVay. Plus, as the song says, they want it now. The more I look at this picture the less likely it seems to represent success. The number of college transitioning coaches who succeed is small. The successes who want to change to a revolutionary system is even smaller. The number of QB with one year of college starting who succeed in the NFL is small. The number of small QBs who succeed is small.

The current Cards defense looks promising but it lacks depth. If Jones get hurt, where’s the pass rush coming from? How much better could the rush be with 2 premier players instead of one? Defense isn’t as much fun as offense, but it’s the right call with the first pick. If this offense really plays as a system then surely more than one QB can run it.

When you have the 1st overall pick, the question should NOT be which player is most certain to make the team better. We have to stop thinking like that. With the 1st overall pick, the Cardinals need to take the player that is most certain to make them GREAT! That has to be the mindset. It doesn't matter if it backfires, and everyone gets fired. The only player that can make us GREAT is Murray. Go get him!!!!

 

[RugbyMuffin]

When you have the 1st overall pick, the question should NOT be which player is most certain to make the team better. We have to stop thinking like that. With the 1st overall pick, the Cardinals need to take the player that is most certain to make them GREAT! That has to be the mindset. It doesn't matter if it backfires, and everyone gets fired. The only player that can make us GREAT is Murray. Go get him!!!!

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[cardpa]

Who will the Cards take with the first pick? Well I’ve spent recent days reading everything I could find that KK said. I’ve skipped evaluations by others and just looked at his words. I think I’ve got a handle on him. Then I reviewed how the Cards handled the coaching change. Finally I looked at college coaches making the transition to NFL coach. Back to question one; the Cards will take Murray. This reminds me of the Chip Kelly error of believing my system is so good it can’t lose. Keep in mind KK’s system has been losing in college. Finally there’s the Solomon-like decision to cut the baby into two parts. KK will run the offense and Joesph the defense. Of course Solomon wasn’t serious but sadly the Cards are.

The first pick decision should be simple. Which player is most certain to make the team better? Teams that gamble with the first pick usually lose. Murray may be the best QB for KK’s offense, but will he do the most to improve the Cards? If KK was correct that Rosen could run this offense then let him run it. The cost of changing to Murray is an unnecessary burden to pay. How much difference could Murray possibly make with this offense still undergoing major personnel changes? Tons has been written about Rosen’s rapport with Kirk. We’ve seen new QBs always take time to understand when Fitz is “open.” Rosen has experienced the speed of an NFL defense. He made mistakes. Why make them all over again with Murray?

I’m not saying Murray can’t make it as an NFL QB. I’m saying the coach doesn’t call the first pick. Did Keim have Murray on top his board? Maybe. The Cards do seem to have an envy issue. They want a dynamic QB like Wilson. They want a dynamic coach like McVay. Plus, as the song says, they want it now. The more I look at this picture the less likely it seems to represent success. The number of college transitioning coaches who succeed is small. The successes who want to change to a revolutionary system is even smaller. The number of QB with one year of college starting who succeed in the NFL is small. The number of small QBs who succeed is small.

The current Cards defense looks promising but it lacks depth. If Jones get hurt, where’s the pass rush coming from? How much better could the rush be with 2 premier players instead of one? Defense isn’t as much fun as offense, but it’s the right call with the first pick. If this offense really plays as a system then surely more than one QB can run it.

Harry, you summarized all the thoughts floating around in my head. I think this could end up exploding and not in a good way. KK's Big 12 record as a HC was 19-35, hardly anything to get excited about. I also get the impression that the team will in reality have two HCs, one on offense and one on defense. No one will be leading the train.

 

[cardpa]

Worked for McVay.

KK's offensive system hasn't been "losing", his defenses have. I would say its smart to surround him with great D coaches and upgraded talent. Just like the Rams.

As head coach he was responsible for the entire team not just the offense. This argument doesn't hold water. Is this what you want as a HC in the NFL? A guy who doesn't take on the responsibility for the entire team.

 

[AZCrazy]

Murray runs around real fast. Whoop de do. The team won't improve one iota if he is drafted #1 overall, and it's ceiling will drop.

He won't be better than Rosen, and can't lead us to the Super Bowl.

 

[PACardsFan]

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And your point is? Miller is outstanding, but once Manning retired, they haven't won crap. No one wins big in the NFL without a QB. And it's not obvious that we have one on our roster.

 

[dscher]

This is where I differ.. I think it would be a massive mistake to not let him get his players he thinks will best fit his style. At the sake of making excuses.. Texas tech is always gonna be behind the eight ball when it comes to talent. That can't be overlooked. Imo. Obviously very homerish statement, but it is what it is..

 

[dscher]

And your point is? Miller is outstanding, but once Manning retired, they haven't won crap. No one wins big in the NFL without a QB. And it's not obvious that we have one on our roster.

Agreed. I think the divisional playoff teams from last year proved that you need an explosive offense to get you into the playoffs.. the defense will be the difference maker when you get there. Imo.

 

[BW52]

When you have the 1st overall pick, the question should NOT be which player is most certain to make the team better. We have to stop thinking like that. With the 1st overall pick, the Cardinals need to take the player that is most certain to make them GREAT! That has to be the mindset. It doesn't matter if it backfires, and everyone gets fired. The only player that can make us GREAT is Murray. Go get him!!!!

pure hype and speculation.Most certain to make the team great?

 

[BW52]

And your point is? Miller is outstanding, but once Manning retired, they haven't won crap. No one wins big in the NFL without a QB. And it's not obvious that we have one on our roster.

 

[MadCardDisease]

Could this be Steve Keim's greatest performance of all time? Could he have all of the pundits fooled into believing that the Cardinals are taking Murray?

I sure hope so! And if that is the case then Keim deserves an Oscar!

 

[TheCardFan]

Could this be Steve Keim's greatest performance of all time? Could he have all of the pundits fooled into believing that the Cardinals are taking Murray?

I sure hope so! And if that is the case then Keim deserves an Oscar!

The biggest hint to that being true is when Keim said about Rosen "he is now" our current QB.

 

[Arz101]

Nick Bosa

YOU ARE WRONG!!!! it should read NICK FREAKING BOSA!

 

[Arz101]

Could this be Steve Keim's greatest performance of all time? Could he have all of the pundits fooled into believing that the Cardinals are taking Murray?

I sure hope so! And if that is the case then Keim deserves an Oscar!

Razzie award as NFL GM but an Oscar for non-football stuff. Sounds about right

 

[TJ]

Could this be Steve Keim's greatest performance of all time? Could he have all of the pundits fooled into believing that the Cardinals are taking Murray?

I sure hope so! And if that is the case then Keim deserves an Oscar!

If Keim successfully hoodwinks the entire media, that would be something special. Because as if today, nobody is buying it as a ruse.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

And your point is? Miller is outstanding, but once Manning retired, they haven't won crap.

....

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[RugbyMuffin]

No one wins big in the NFL without a QB. And it's not obvious that we have one on our roster.

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