Fleming Video

[Shane]

http://www.azcardinals.com/videos-p...-Journey/bba7be92-4b47-4f4c-9610-c5a496ca2453

Good video. He's definitely got those really fluid hips and good footwork you like to see in a CB.

 

[jw7]

Umm, did you paste the wrong link? That is a Massie clip?

 

[Catfish]

Shane-----from what I read about him, he is a cover corner who can tackle, BUT can be played as a safety too, (and has the free-flowing hips that let him turn and cover deep).
He should be exactly the kind of player Horton can plug-in all over the secondary. He also has some length and some strength. Outstanding standing high jump.

 

[Shane]

Umm, did you paste the wrong link? That is a Massie clip?

oops fixed

 

[Dayman]

Some quotes from Horton about Fleming and Bethel:

http://www.azcentral.com/sports/car...13arizona-cardinals-rookie-minicamp-ends.html

"It looks like one is from a big school and one is from a small school, it really does," Horton said. "One is well coached, well-versed, understands schemes and what he's doing and how to play football.

"Justin looks like he's a raw kid from a small school who has a bunch of athletic talent. We have to harness that talent and put it into the right direction. You could see the kid get overwhelmed but you want him to be a sponge and soak stuff up."

"I expected Jamell to be polished and 'no big deal, just another practice.' And probably thought Justin's head would be swimming a bit, playing free safety, corner, a few positions that are totally different for him. The talent is there, you can see it."

"I don't remember (Fleming) making a mental mistake, which was great," he said. "We're going to start throwing more things at him, but he has the demeanor of an NFL guy. He reminds me of Patrick. He came in and said: 'O.K., this is what I am. I'm a pro football player.'"

 

[BullheadCardFan]

"I don't remember (Fleming) making a mental mistake, which was great," he said. "We're going to start throwing more things at him, but he has the demeanor of an NFL guy. He reminds me of Patrick. He came in and said: 'O.K., this is what I am. I'm a pro football player.'"

I know it's early but I like hearing this about Fleming. Like to see him battle for a starting spot at CB.

 

[WildBB]

I know it's early but I like hearing this about Fleming. Like to see him battle for a starting spot at CB.

Got to keep it in context, being a rook. Even PP had his ups and downs as the #5 in the draft playing corner. It's the toughest position ouside of QB to play possibly. But he should bring a little something into the mix soon in his 1st year.

 

[Darkside]

Quotes like that from Horton get me pumped.

 

[Chopper0080]

I know it's early but I like hearing this about Fleming. Like to see him battle for a starting spot at CB.

He has a ways to go with Toler, Jefferson, and Gay on the roster, but time is on his side. It will be interesting to see what happens if Toler comes back strong from his injury as Gay has experience in the scheme, and Flemming might be the most talented of the 3.

 

[RonF]

strong bench: championship

 

[JeffGollin]

Shane-----from what I read about him, he is a cover corner who can tackle....

Cat - I've read mixed reviews about his physicality

PF Draft Guide - "...Physicality is a problem as he'll be pushed around by big receivers and doesn't help in run support. But if a coach can light a fire under him, he has No. 2 potential. "

NFL Draft Scout.com - ...He's not a tenacious tackler and plays the position with a wide receiver's mentality similar to Asante Samuel...

That doesn't make you wrong (& certainly Horton is not known for putting his seal of approval on guys who can't or won't hit) but I'd want to see Flemming blow up a couple of receivers and ballcarriers before drawing any final conclusions.

 

[Mainstreet]

Umm, did you paste the wrong link? That is a Massie clip?

I was impressed how quick Massie was and how he got deep with the receivers at over 300 lbs.

On a serious note Fleming seems to have amazing skills. Getting him in the third round is a pleasant surprise.

 

[Catfish]

Cat - I've read mixed reviews about his physicality

PF Draft Guide - "...Physicality is a problem as he'll be pushed around by big receivers and doesn't help in run support. But if a coach can light a fire under him, he has No. 2 potential. "

NFL Draft Scout.com - ...He's not a tenacious tackler and plays the position with a wide receiver's mentality similar to Asante Samuel...

That doesn't make you wrong (& certainly Horton is not known for putting his seal of approval on guys who can't or won't hit) but I'd want to see Flemming blow up a couple of receivers and ballcarriers before drawing any final conclusions.

I'm glad you brought this up. I didn't do a lot of looking on Flemming, and did not see this information. Lets hope he ends up being a really solid pick-up for us, and that we get real good, real deep. No matter what, he appears to fit Horton's versatility pattern.

 

[Mitch]

I'm glad you brought this up. I didn't do a lot of looking on Flemming, and did not see this information. Lets hope he ends up being a really solid pick-up for us, and that we get real good, real deep. No matter what, he appears to fit Horton's versatility pattern.

Hey, Fish, I did considerable film watching of Jamell Fleming and I do not see what the issue is with his tackling---this kid is aggressive in everything he does and I saw him repeatedly force the run with good results. He's kind of like Michael Adams in that respect and this is a very good compliment---he undercuts RBs at their shins and he wraps up. He is not an imposing physical specimen, but he plays with a flair and a tenacity---and that's what we want.

 

[JeffGollin]

Hey, Fish, I did considerable film watching of Jamell Fleming and I do not see what the issue is with his tackling---this kid is aggressive in everything he does and I saw him repeatedly force the run with good results. He's kind of like Michael Adams in that respect and this is a very good compliment---he undercuts RBs at their shins and he wraps up. He is not an imposing physical specimen, but he plays with a flair and a tenacity---and that's what we want.

If he can get the job done...you cannot have too many good QB's. But the one thing I'll be watching for as preseason progresses is evidence that Jammel can be trusted as a tackler.

(It's always dangerous believing everything a draft guide says, but "a red flag is a red flag" and merits checking out).

 

[52brandon]

I could see Fleming being a starter by mid-season. Bethel will likely be a Horton project at Safety. But I think he will do a much better job developing guys than our previous DCs. Maybe can even salvage Johnson to have his pair of future Safeties already on the roster...




...hey, a guy can hope

 

[Jetstream Green]

Johnson was nothing spectacular last year but towards the end he was solid. One did not hear his name called often and for a safety, that is a good thing

 

[desertdawg]

Hey, Fish, I did considerable film watching of Jamell Fleming and I do not see what the issue is with his tackling---this kid is aggressive in everything he does and I saw him repeatedly force the run with good results. He's kind of like Michael Adams in that respect and this is a very good compliment---he undercuts RBs at their shins and he wraps up. He is not an imposing physical specimen, but he plays with a flair and a tenacity---and that's what we want.

Yes sir he can stick'em, and if he wants playing time as a youngin in Horton's casa....

 

[Goldfield]

This is why BPA is the way to draft. I didnt expect to draft a DB, and we drafted two.

With Peterson, Gay, Toler, Flemming, and the kid that started a few games last year. We have some solid depth and competition.

I think Toler is going to become a safety for us in a year or two if he gets beat out at CB.

 

[kerouac9]

He has a ways to go with Toler, Jefferson, and Gay on the roster, but time is on his side. It will be interesting to see what happens if Toler comes back strong from his injury as Gay has experience in the scheme, and Flemming might be the most talented of the 3.

Can we stop pretending that A.J. Jefferson is a legitimate NFL player yet? Do we really have to wait until he doesn't make the 53-man roster? The dude is hot garbage. If Toler comes back anything close to 90%, Jefferson isn't going to make the roster, because he can't play the slot position.

 

[D-Dogg]

Jefferson is not hot garbage...just not a #2 corner. He has ability, he can play nickel and can be used in dime packages or as depth for #2. He's not as bad as you make him out...he's not "good" either. He's decent.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Can we stop pretending that A.J. Jefferson is a legitimate NFL player yet? Do we really have to wait until he doesn't make the 53-man roster? The dude is hot garbage. If Toler comes back anything close to 90%, Jefferson isn't going to make the roster, because he can't play the slot position.

I agree.

I have him as our 5th CB if the is lucky, but he will have to fight for a roster spot this year.

He is not going to beat out, IMHO

Peterson
Toler
Gay
Flemming

 

[JeffGollin]

Donald wrote: Jefferson is not hot garbage.
+1.

There's a difference between a CB who lacks the raw talent, brains and attitude and a guy with huge athletic talent, good attitude and (I'm presuming) brains - who was thrown into a starting role before he was ready & did a decent job considering the circumstances & who, with good coaching, could turn out to be something special.

But time's running out, the future is now and this figures to be a make or break year for AJ. (I'd hate for this to turn out to be one of those deals where we develop a good CB only to have some other team reap the benefits).

 

[kerouac9]

Jefferson is not hot garbage...just not a #2 corner. He has ability, he can play nickel and can be used in dime packages or as depth for #2. He's not as bad as you make him out...he's not "good" either. He's decent.

He's too big and stiff to play in the slot. The most you can do with him is what Horton ended up doing--putting him in on the outside as third cornerback and moving your actual starter--Richard Marshall--into the slot or 3rd safety position to try and minimize the damage.

But teams picked on Jefferson pretty relentlessly when Peterson was showing that he was having an "on" game, and he never did anything to make them stop.

No ability, no instincts, no game-making skills. He's the Fred Wakefield of the defensive secondary. This team is better when guys like A.J. Jefferson are no longer on it.

 

[Duckjake]

He's too big and stiff to play in the slot. The most you can do with him is what Horton ended up doing--putting him in on the outside as third cornerback and moving your actual starter--Richard Marshall--into the slot or 3rd safety position to try and minimize the damage.

But teams picked on Jefferson pretty relentlessly when Peterson was showing that he was having an "on" game, and he never did anything to make them stop.

No ability, no instincts, no game-making skills. He's the Fred Wakefield of the defensive secondary. This team is better when guys like A.J. Jefferson are no longer on it.

And that's reason for optimism. Peterson, Gay, Fleming, Toler, Adams, Butler and Korey Lindsey. So A.J. Jefferson is the #8 CB right now.