Flexibility

[Harry]

Kyle Odegard has author a good reminder piece about one of the values of Rosen I and others mentioned on the site but may have moved from memory. Rosen was a huge value as he drifted downward in the draft. By having a quality, young QB at his price allows the Cards tremendous cap flexibility. The Cards have already used that to their advantage to fill out their current roster. Draft Murray, even if he succeeds, will hamstring this team for the near future. He would have to be an awesome QB to be worth that cost. Even if he is just sound, Rosen’s cost allows the Cards to build a competitive team unusually quickly.


https://www.azcardinals.com/news/cheap-quarterback-room-benefiting-cardinals-in-free-agency

 

[Krangodnzr]

Kyle Odegard has author a good reminder piece about one of the values of Rosen I and others mentioned on the site but may have moved from memory. Rosen was a huge value as he drifted downward in the draft. By having a quality, young QB at his price allows the Cards tremendous cap flexibility. The Cards have already used that to their advantage to fill out their current roster. Draft Murray, even if he succeeds, will hamstring this team for the near future. He would have to be an awesome QB to be worth that cost. Even if he is just sound, Rosen’s cost allows the Cards to build a competitive team unusually quickly.


https://www.azcardinals.com/news/cheap-quarterback-room-benefiting-cardinals-in-free-agency

Murray isnt going to cost THAT much more.

 

[Veer]

It's a good point, but Murray isn't gonna cost much more than Rosen. In case we draft Murray, Rosen will most likely be off our books by next season. This season I don't care about cap ramifications, because we have enough space to work with and all of the few building blocks we have are under contract for next season.

 

[slanidrac16]

Just when I think I’ve made up my mind I see something like this. When I see teams like the Chargers, Packers and Patriots inquiring about Rosen you have to pause for a minute. Now honestly part of the attraction for Rosen is those teams would be getting a potential heir apparent to their current aging qb’s Without taking a big risk. He would come cheap and could sit and learn behind a veteran qb. It’s s luxury Rosen should of had last year but didn’t. I’m hoping KK can convince us all that Rosen is a more than adequate qb to run this offense. That would allow us to trade down ( not below 4) and pick up a couple of extra picks where we could still get one of the top 3 prospects. How exciting would it be to have 27, 33 and 35. The possibilities would be endless.

 

[Chopper0080]

I come to the conclusion that if we drafted Murray, I wouldn't trade Rosen unless I was offered a 1st rounder for him. I would use the preseason to rebuild his value even if I wanted to move forward with Murray. Why waste the value that comes with two cheap QBs.

 

[JeffGollin]

As legend has it - During the famous Suggs for 2 Midrounders draft, an NFL insider was heard to say:

"The Cardinals will find a way to screw things up."

Well, now, a lot has happened since then to change that perception, but it does serve to warn us all:

Don't overthink things. In the end, we want to wind up with fabulous bang for our buck...or we should walk away from the deal and play it safe drafting a Bosa or QW with Rosen as our QB.

 

[MadCardDisease]

Kyle Odegard has author a good reminder piece about one of the values of Rosen I and others mentioned on the site but may have moved from memory. Rosen was a huge value as he drifted downward in the draft. By having a quality, young QB at his price allows the Cards tremendous cap flexibility. The Cards have already used that to their advantage to fill out their current roster. Draft Murray, even if he succeeds, will hamstring this team for the near future. He would have to be an awesome QB to be worth that cost. Even if he is just sound, Rosen’s cost allows the Cards to build a competitive team unusually quickly.


https://www.azcardinals.com/news/cheap-quarterback-room-benefiting-cardinals-in-free-agency

Harry, I guess I'm not following what you are saying here. How much would Murray cost if the Cardinals drafted him at #1?

I thought whoever the Cardinals drafted with the #1 pick would only cost around $6M the first year and add around $1M additional for each year that follows. I don't see how $6M or $7M for a rookie QB would hamstring the Cardinals in the Near term.

At that cost, keeping Rosen and Murray on the roster would still be a huge bargain at the QB position. The combined costs of their two contracts this year would be $10M cheaper than what they were paying Bradford last year alone.

With that said I would rather be paying Bosa the $6M this year over a midget QB.

 

[Jetstream Green]

Kyle Odegard has author a good reminder piece about one of the values of Rosen I and others mentioned on the site but may have moved from memory. Rosen was a huge value as he drifted downward in the draft. By having a quality, young QB at his price allows the Cards tremendous cap flexibility. The Cards have already used that to their advantage to fill out their current roster. Draft Murray, even if he succeeds, will hamstring this team for the near future. He would have to be an awesome QB to be worth that cost. Even if he is just sound, Rosen’s cost allows the Cards to build a competitive team unusually quickly.


https://www.azcardinals.com/news/cheap-quarterback-room-benefiting-cardinals-in-free-agency

That's also coming from the Cardinal's website... we're keeping Rosen

 

[kerouac9]

It’s
Not clear that the cards made any good moves with that leftover cap.

The Rams, Colts, Browns and Eagles made some MONEY moves in their second year with a rookie QB. We got a 38 year old defensive end.

Awesome.

Forgot that the Bears made great moves, too.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

This is actually the argument my buddy made for drafting Murray. You reset your rookie QB salary cap timeline while piling all your dead money from two years of dumb decisions into this year.

So you try to cover up your warts and be competitive this year and then blow up next year when the dead money is gone.

 

[Krangodnzr]

It’s
Not clear that the cards made any good moves with that leftover cap.

The Rams, Colts, Browns and Eagles made some MONEY moves in their second year with a rookie QB. We got a 38 year old defensive end.

Awesome.

Forgot that the Bears made great moves, too.

36 year old defensive end. One year fix. Great lockerroom leader and still productive.

You should know better than to bet against Keim in this situation, because he has been right about squeezing out one more year from an older premier pass rusher.

 

[kerouac9]

36 year old defensive end. One year fix. Great lockerroom leader and still productive.

You should know better than to bet against Keim in this situation, because he has been right about squeezing out one more year from an older premier pass rusher.

And that's fine, but it's not making the difference between 5-11 and 10-6. The Bears, Eagles, Colts, and Rams remade their roster and put the pieces around their young QB to be successful.

What has Keim done for Rosen? He's not acting like he's 20% of the way through the cost-controlled rebuild.

 

[cardncubfan]

And that's fine, but it's not making the difference between 5-11 and 10-6. The Bears, Eagles, Colts, and Rams remade their roster and put the pieces around their young QB to be successful.

What has Keim done for Rosen? He's not acting like he's 20% of the way through the cost-controlled rebuild.

Sign offensive linemen?

 

[ajcardfan]

Just when I think I’ve made up my mind I see something like this. When I see teams like the Chargers, Packers and Patriots inquiring about Rosen you have to pause for a minute. Now honestly part of the attraction for Rosen is those teams would be getting a potential heir apparent to their current aging qb’s Without taking a big risk. He would come cheap and could sit and learn behind a veteran qb. It’s s luxury Rosen should of had last year but didn’t. I’m hoping KK can convince us all that Rosen is a more than adequate qb to run this offense. That would allow us to trade down ( not below 4) and pick up a couple of extra picks where we could still get one of the top 3 prospects. How exciting would it be to have 27, 33 and 35. The possibilities would be endless.

I don't think it really matters if teams are interested in QBs. I mean, look at how long Josh Frigging McCown has played. Was it a disaster that we gave up on him, and he has played 15 more years? Being a serviceable QB is like being a left-handed pitcher in baseball. If you are just half ass good, you have jobs for a long time.

100% of NFL teams are looking for QBs, every year.

 

[Cheesebeef]

It’s
Not clear that the cards made any good moves with that leftover cap.

The Rams, Colts, Browns and Eagles made some MONEY moves in their second year with a rookie QB. We got a 38 year old defensive end.

Awesome.

Forgot that the Bears made great moves, too.

agreed.

 

[ajcardfan]

It’s
Not clear that the cards made any good moves with that leftover cap.

The Rams, Colts, Browns and Eagles made some MONEY moves in their second year with a rookie QB. We got a 38 year old defensive end.

Awesome.

Forgot that the Bears made great moves, too.

Come on, Suggs is not the only guy we have added. You are better than that type of argumentation style. Say we had the worst offseason ever. That's fine. But don't pull out some nonsequitor statement and act like you are looking at the whole. Legitimate debate, legitimate logic, matters.

Thank you all.

 

[kerouac9]

Come on, Suggs is not the only guy we have added. You are better than that type of argumentation style. Say we had the worst offseason ever. That's fine. But don't pull out some nonsequitor statement and act like you are looking at the whole. Legitimate debate, legitimate logic, matters.

Thank you all.

We added some backup-level linemen and an oft-injured inside linebacker. Do you want to look back at who the Rams added after Goff's first season?

Sammy Watkins
Robert Woods
Andrew Witworth
John Sullivan

Our offense was the worst in the league last year. Our defense was about league-average with some terrible coaching. Again, we dismantled the defense and haven't done anything about the offense.

 

[ajcardfan]

We added some backup-level linemen and an oft-injured inside linebacker. Do you want to look back at who the Rams added after Goff's first season?

Sammy Watkins
Robert Woods
Andrew Witworth
John Sullivan

Our offense was the worst in the league last year. Our defense was about league-average with some terrible coaching. Again, we dismantled the defense and haven't done anything about the offense.

This is better. I am not arguing in favor of the Cardinals. I don't pretend to have the knowledge to know how well all this works out.

But, "all we got is Suggs" is ... what? You tell me. It's not the truth.

 

[Garthshort]

Harry, I believe is talking about dead money.

 

[kerouac9]

This is better. I am not arguing in favor of the Cardinals. I don't pretend to have the knowledge to know how well all this works out.

But, "all we got is Suggs" is ... what? You tell me. It's not the truth.

I guess, but I suppose I mean that Suggs is the only meaningful addition. Everything else is no different than the shuffling that goes on every offseason.

 

[ajcardfan]

I guess, but I suppose I mean that Suggs is the only meaningful addition. Everything else is no different than the shuffling that goes on every offseason.

I think Hicks, Sweezy and Philon are all more important to the future of the team than Suggs. Suggs signed a one year deal. If he can do what Freeney did for a winning Cards team, then great. But, if we suck again, he retires and we are still on the hook for these other guys.

 

[kerouac9]

I think Hicks, Sweezy and Philon are all more important to the future of the team than Suggs. Suggs signed a one year deal. If he can do what Freeney did for a winning Cards team, then great. But, if we suck again, he retires and we are still on the hook for these other guys.

I guess. Philon is a two-year deal, as is Sweezy. Sweezy has never been more than an average lineman his entire career. There's always reasons the free agents are allowed to leave.

The Cards would create $1.5M in dead money but save $4m if they cut Sweezy after this year. Cards would create $2M in dead money but save $5m by cutting Philon. Odds are that one or both of them will be gone in about 360 days.

 

[football karma]

last year's no. 1 pick -- Baker Mayfield -- has a $7.4mm annual cap hit

Rosen's is $4mm. So a $3mm+ upcharge annually.

yes, if Rosen is traded, there is a $8mm charge, offset by ~$4mm in salary savings -- so a net charge to this years cap of $4mm.

this doesn't feel like you are giving up too much flexibility

 

[cardncubfan]

We added some backup-level linemen and an oft-injured inside linebacker. Do you want to look back at who the Rams added after Goff's first season?

Sammy Watkins
Robert Woods
Andrew Witworth
John Sullivan

Our offense was the worst in the league last year. Our defense was about league-average with some terrible coaching. Again, we dismantled the defense and haven't done anything about the offense.

Who was available this year that are comparable to these guys?

 

[juza76]

We added some backup-level linemen and an oft-injured inside linebacker. Do you want to look back at who the Rams added after Goff's first season?

Sammy Watkins
Robert Woods
Andrew Witworth
John Sullivan

Our offense was the worst in the league last year. Our defense was about league-average with some terrible coaching. Again, we dismantled the defense and haven't done anything about the offense.

Murray is the player that can change drastically our offense