Georgia OLB Azeez Ojulari - Reddick replacement in Rd 1

[Solar7]

Who knows?

If Horn, Surtain, & the WRs are all gone, I could see it happening if Farley’s & Newsome’s durabilty issues scare us off completely.

Upgrading the OL will make Chase & the other RBs’ jobs easier.

If they have talent. I think Chase is pretty pedestrian and can't handle it when gameplanned for. I don't think any degree of improved blocking is going to make him a star. I have no reason to think Eno Benjamin or Jonathan Ward belong on an NFL roster.

 

[juza76]

Who knows?

If Horn, Surtain, & the WRs are all gone, I could see it happening if Farley’s & Newsome’s durabilty issues scare us off completely.

Upgrading the OL will make Chase & the other RBs’ jobs easier.

I watched some tapes of tevon Jenkins, adequate feet and heavy hands, would bring some nastiness
like u said, if the top 2 CB's are gone and even WR's left aren't worth the 16 pick, we can trade back few spots and have a chance to get tevon Jenkins or vera tucker, which would make our line very good and with a bright future ahead
I know we have some spots to fill with more urgency, but we have our qb of the future already and make him comfortable is the best way to put this team in a good position to succeed
If we get a guy like Nelson and pairing him with Butler Make us enough covered for the season

 

[DVontel]

If they have talent. I think Chase is pretty pedestrian and can't handle it when gameplanned for. I don't think any degree of improved blocking is going to make him a star. I have no reason to think Eno Benjamin or Jonathan Ward belong on an NFL roster.

He doesn’t need to be a star. He’s a good player that will benefit more with better blocking ahead of him.

Ward scored on his first ever carry in the NFL. You nor I don’t know if he belongs or not.

Your RB doesn’t need to be a star. That’s what you’re not getting. It’s not 1995 anymore.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

He doesn’t need to be a star. He’s a good player that will benefit more with better blocking ahead of him.

Ward scored on his first ever carry in the NFL. You nor I don’t know if he belongs or not.

Your RB doesn’t need to be a star. That’s what you’re not getting. It’s not 1995 anymore.

True, but it certainly helps if he is. And it certainly isn’t good when your team has the second worst running back production (I believe solar posted that). The Hudson upgrade is nice but the rest of the line that produced that second worst production is either the same (Dj, Pugh and beachum) or worse (as of now starting someone who couldn’t beat out sweezy last season).

 

[Solar7]

I watched some tapes of tevon Jenkins, adequate feet and heavy hands, would bring some nastiness
like u said, if the top 2 CB's are gone and even WR's left aren't worth the 16 pick, we can trade back few spots and have a chance to get tevon Jenkins or vera tucker, which would make our line very good and with a bright future ahead
I know we have some spots to fill with more urgency, but we have our qb of the future already and make him comfortable is the best way to put this team in a good position to succeed
If we get a guy like Nelson and pairing him with Butler Make us enough covered for the season

Why is our QB more comfortable if we add another top wideout than a top RB? That situation still puts all of the pressure on Kyler to succeed. If he's just plainly having an off game, this team loses. Add in a good running back who can take some of the workload, and we have a chance in games where Kyler isn't at 100%. A WR doesn't do that.

He doesn’t need to be a star. He’s a good player that will benefit more with better blocking ahead of him.

Ward scored on his first ever carry in the NFL. You nor I don’t know if he belongs or not.

Your RB doesn’t need to be a star. That’s what you’re not getting. It’s not 1995 anymore.

He needs to be better than average. Edmonds is average. The guys behind him are complete unknowns but should be considered bad until proven good instead of good until proven bad given that they were a 7th round pick and undrafted. Plenty of guys have caught a TD pass in this league and never played another down.

You and others are way overrating Edmonds. As a starter, he has been absolutely abysmal. We have four games of evidence in this offense, and to Ouchie's point, the line hasn't changed all that much for the better. The right side is a mystery, and while Hudson is very good, I don't think he's good enough to solely make a middling running back a good running back.

I'm not asking for a star, I'm asking for adequate production. And I'm asking to hedge our bets a little bit, since Edmonds has already missed 5 career games due to hamstring injuries, which he also had at Fordham.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Depends on where they are in the draft. The best teams don’t have many holes to fill so they can be more strategic, it’s one of the reasons the pats trade down so often. At the top of the draft picking for need is idiotic.

No. Teams still draft needs, or needs upcoming. A good example of the Cards doing this was drafting Calais Campbell. He wasn't a need at the time, but the Cardinals KNEW they were moving on from a DL so they drafted him for the near future.

Teams prioritize their needs and scheme fit INTO their board from the start, so it's completely baked into their draft board when they make selections.

So no, teams don't follow the Mel Kiper school of fantasy drafting.

 

[juza76]

No. Teams still draft needs, or needs upcoming. A good example of the Cards doing this was drafting Calais Campbell. He wasn't a need at the time, but the Cardinals KNEW they were moving on from a DL so they drafted him for the near future.

Teams prioritize their needs and scheme fit INTO their board from the start, so it's completely baked into their draft board when they make selections.

So no, teams don't follow the Mel Kiper school of fantasy drafting.

Was a need for the following year cause Antonio Smith was a free agent

Thats why pass rusher is an option in the second round i guess
There is a reason Keim went to Miami pro day and watch Rousseau and Philipps, don't say they are the right guy but the position is considered pretty important

 

[splitsecond]

Look I'm very new to draft analysis in general. I'm probably missing the plot, but I'll walk you through my thought process for being okay with a round 1 running back.

I want us to make a run while Kyler has his rookie contract so I'm looking for immediate return from the first round pick. Cornerbacks tend to struggle their first year no matter where they are taken and the #3 overall pick last year, Okudah, being arguably the worst CB in the league last year has my recency bias acting up. Running backs however, usually hit the ground running and are able to be effective starters their first year. I also think RB is a major hole in our roster that held us back a lot last year. We need one, why not get a really good one?

That brings me to the #1 running back prospect. In my mind Najee Harris is a complete player. Great at short yardage between the tackles, fast in space and a good pass catcher to boot. The Cardinals are in desperate need of a back that is good in short yardage situations. Teams stopped Kyler from running halfway through last year and all a sudden 3rd and 1 became impossible to convert. The whole offense crumbled. Harris plugs that massive hole in our offense and makes it so Kyler's run game won't be contained as easily. I think any team would be happy to have Harris on their roster. I don't think his skillset is matched by other backs in this draft. I'm not concerned that its bad value to take him in the first, since I don't take its possible to get a similar player in the second. (That last sentence is where I worry my logic might be faulty, but I do worry there will be a run on the top RBs at the start of round 2)

Of course CB is still very important and another huge position of need. I won't be disappointed if we take Horn or Farley. Honestly I'm fine with a running back being taken in round 2 instead. I just view the running game as so important that I am willing to use a first rounder. Overall I think rounds 1&2 should be spent on CB and RB and I don't care which order. If we had more picks I'd be okay with a RB in the 3rd, but I really don't want us plugging such a major need in the 5th.

call me crazy but I truly believe we can get both Harris and Farley. This draft is weird as one of them will fall enough that we can either get them with our second or move up in the second to get them.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

No. Teams still draft needs, or needs upcoming. A good example of the Cards doing this was drafting Calais Campbell. He wasn't a need at the time, but the Cardinals KNEW they were moving on from a DL so they drafted him for the near future.

Teams prioritize their needs and scheme fit INTO their board from the start, so it's completely baked into their draft board when they make selections.

So no, teams don't follow the Mel Kiper school of fantasy drafting.

Uh Calais is a great example of the opposite of what you’re talking about. He was a BPA opportunity draft. Were the cards going to need a dlinemen in the future? Yes. But every team likely can say that about almost every position. Did they have more immediate needs when they drafted him? Yes, but they didn’t draft for NEED, they drafted BPA.

The truth is that teams draft for a combination of need and BPA to argue fully one side or the other is stupid.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

The reality is every team can draft almost anyone and have it be “for need” if you’re including future free agency bc almost no position on any team (other than maybe QB, K, and P) has a full stable of any position locked down for three plus years.

 

[DVontel]

True, but it certainly helps if he is. And it certainly isn’t good when your team has the second worst running back production (I believe solar posted that). The Hudson upgrade is nice but the rest of the line that produced that second worst production is either the same (Dj, Pugh and beachum) or worse (as of now starting someone who couldn’t beat out sweezy last season).

It does help, but it doesn’t & should not come with the expense of a 1st round pick.


Think of it like this, would you really be okay if our 1st rounder had 2, maybe 3 prime years of play before it comes crashing down? Now, imagine it doesn’t even cap off with a SB.

 

[juza76]

It does help, but it doesn’t & should not come with the expense of a 1st round pick.


Think of it like this, would you really be okay if our 1st rounder had 2, maybe 3 prime years of play before it comes crashing down? Now, imagine it doesn’t even cap off with a SB.

Can u mention rb's drafted in the top 15 in the last 25 years that won a superbowl with their first team

 

[Chopper0080]

I love the arguments for drafting a RB in round 1 when the 2020 expanded playoffs had one team with it's starting RB as a 1st rounder.

Cleveland - Nick Chubb - Rnd 2
Pittsburgh - James Conner - Rnd 3
Indianapolis - Jonathan Taylor - Rnd 2
Buffalo - Devin Singletary - Rnd 3
Baltimore - JK Dobbins - Rnd 2
Tennessee - Derrick Henry - Rnd 2
Kansas City - CEH - Rnd 1

LA Rams - Cam Akers - Rnd 2
Seattle - Chris Carson - Rnd 7
Chicago - David Montgomery - Rnd 3
New Orleans - Alvin Kamara - Rnd 3
Tampa Bay - Ronald Jones - Rnd 2
Washington - Antonio Gibson - Rnd 3
Green Bay - Aaron Jones - Rnd 5

EDIT - If you wanted to use this as the argument to take a RB in rounds 2 or 3, I feel like you have a case.

 

[DVontel]

Can u mention rb's drafted in the top 15 in the last 25 years that won a superbowl with their first team

I’m actually curious on how many drafted in the top 32 period.

 

[Solar7]

I love the arguments for drafting a RB in round 1 when the 2020 expanded playoffs had one team with it's starting RB as a 1st rounder.

Cleveland - Nick Chubb - Rnd 2
Pittsburgh - James Conner - Rnd 3
Indianapolis - Jonathan Taylor - Rnd 2
Buffalo - Devin Singletary - Rnd 3
Baltimore - JK Dobbins - Rnd 2
Tennessee - Derrick Henry - Rnd 2
Kansas City - CEH - Rnd 1

LA Rams - Cam Akers - Rnd 2
Seattle - Chris Carson - Rnd 7
Chicago - David Montgomery - Rnd 3
New Orleans - Alvin Kamara - Rnd 3
Tampa Bay - Ronald Jones - Rnd 2
Washington - Antonio Gibson - Rnd 3
Green Bay - Aaron Jones - Rnd 5

EDIT - If you wanted to use this as the argument to take a RB in rounds 2 or 3, I feel like you have a case.

The only reason I'm arguing for an RB in the first is because we won't have a shot at the top 3 RBs in the second and don't have a third. I'm all for trading back to acquire a 3rd and drafting an RB there. It's simply a matter of the spot we're in, not philosophical support of needing a 1st round RB all the time.

 

[Stout]

The only reason I'm arguing for an RB in the first is because we won't have a shot at the top 3 RBs in the second and don't have a third. I'm all for trading back to acquire a 3rd and drafting an RB there. It's simply a matter of the spot we're in, not philosophical support of needing a 1st round RB all the time.

Yep, we're in a tough, tough spot at the position. Pretty inarguable that we need a starting RB, or at the least a RB that can platoon as a starter. If you're riding with what we have, you're not expecting to make the playoffs. So, we need a RB in the draft at this point. And we don't have the draft capital to really get one. Keim's dug us another hole...again.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I’m not so sure people are advocating a 1st round RB or trying to justify Keim picking one.

I’d be for Kylin Hill or Trey Sermon in the later rounds and go something like Farley and a Wr in the first 2 rounds.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

It does help, but it doesn’t & should not come with the expense of a 1st round pick.


Think of it like this, would you really be okay if our 1st rounder had 2, maybe 3 prime years of play before it comes crashing down? Now, imagine it doesn’t even cap off with a SB.

Your comment about being beaten down by keim echoes in my mind. 2-3 prime years for our first rounder sounds pretty good to this guy . . .

 

[SECTION 11]

I’m not so sure people are advocating a 1st round RB or trying to justify Keim picking one.

I’d be for Kylin Hill or Trey Sermon in the later rounds and go something like Farley and a Wr in the first 2 rounds.

I totally am.

 

[Solar7]

I'm advocating RB just slightly above CB barring some kind of wild drop from a clear cut amazing player. Seems like the best spot to get a difference maker, and yes, even if that means fewer years than another pick.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I love the arguments for drafting a RB in round 1 when the 2020 expanded playoffs had one team with it's starting RB as a 1st rounder.

Cleveland - Nick Chubb - Rnd 2
Pittsburgh - James Conner - Rnd 3
Indianapolis - Jonathan Taylor - Rnd 2
Buffalo - Devin Singletary - Rnd 3
Baltimore - JK Dobbins - Rnd 2
Tennessee - Derrick Henry - Rnd 2
Kansas City - CEH - Rnd 1

LA Rams - Cam Akers - Rnd 2
Seattle - Chris Carson - Rnd 7
Chicago - David Montgomery - Rnd 3
New Orleans - Alvin Kamara - Rnd 3
Tampa Bay - Ronald Jones - Rnd 2
Washington - Antonio Gibson - Rnd 3
Green Bay - Aaron Jones - Rnd 5

EDIT - If you wanted to use this as the argument to take a RB in rounds 2 or 3, I feel like you have a case.

It certainly dispelled the myth that rounds 5-7 are the prime spot to locate them.

also, I think there’s a bit of a data issue, for instance are many more second and third round selections because there’s a lot more taken in those rounds? I don’t know that it would change the outlook but the hit rate in each round may be more persuasive.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I’m not so sure people are advocating a 1st round RB or trying to justify Keim picking one.

I’d be for Kylin Hill or Trey Sermon in the later rounds and go something like Farley and a Wr in the first 2 rounds.

Sermon will likely go third or fourth round. We don’t have a pick in either round.

 

[Solar7]

It certainly dispelled the myth that rounds 5-7 are the prime spot to locate them.

also, I think there’s a bit of a data issue, for instance are many more second and third round selections because there’s a lot more taken in those rounds? I don’t know that it would change the outlook but the hit rate in each round may be more persuasive.

I'm not going to break out everything like in the deep dive with that post on the last page, but in the past 5 years...

Rounds 2-3: 18 players
Rounds 5-7: 56 players

(Rounds 2-4: 41 players)

So, it's not the amount of players.

Roughly counting out the amount of adequate players in the past 5 years (mainly going by guys with 100+ carries/rushes, amount of starts, or significant contribution on limited snaps, like Tarik Cohen), here's the breakout I ended up with from 2016-2020:

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[Krangodnzr]

Sermon will likely go third or fourth round. We don’t have a pick in either round.

I think the Cardinals have to either trade down and get more picks, or they may have to reach for a back in the 2nd round of the value isn't good.

 

[Chopper0080]

The only reason I'm arguing for an RB in the first is because we won't have a shot at the top 3 RBs in the second and don't have a third. I'm all for trading back to acquire a 3rd and drafting an RB there. It's simply a matter of the spot we're in, not philosophical support of needing a 1st round RB all the time.

Cleveland - Nick Chubb - 4th RB taken
Pittsburgh - James Conner - 8th RB taken
Indianapolis - Jonathan Taylor - 3rd RB taken
Buffalo - Devin Singletary - 5th RB taken
Baltimore - JK Dobbins - 5th RB taken
Tennessee - Derrick Henry - 2nd RB taken
Kansas City - CEH - 1st RB taken

LA Rams - Cam Akers - 4th Rb taken
Seattle - Chris Carson - Lots taken before him
Chicago - David Montgomery - 4th RB taken
New Orleans - Alvin Kamara - 5th RB taken
Tampa Bay - Ronald Jones - 5th RB taken
Washington - Antonio Gibson - 7th RB taken
Green Bay - Aaron Jones - 19th RB taken

Again...your not looking at the results. Only three of the RBs those teams drafted were in the top 3 RB s drafted in any given year.

Once again, the argument is to sit at our spot in round 2 and let the draft come to us if we are waiting for a RB. The argument is that RBs have shown to be able to contribute right away for teams with solid offensive lines. That the 4th or 5th RB in draft classes are still able to provide solid production. That our roster will have a role for that player immediately and also give our offense another needed weapon.