Getting an offensive lineman at #8

[DVontel]

It would be #notsmart to draft for need and pass on the best player. Adrian Peterson will be in the Hall of Fame...we got Levi Brown.

Um, okay?

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Dude, it's Lamb.

I have no idea why people think a WR is going to have impact from the get go as the #4 wideout, and protecting our QB or improving our defense is just an afterthought, short term or long.

Lamb is the kind of pick you make if you're all-set across the roster and just need one more guy to get you over the top. He is not going to make up for any of the major deficiencies we have elsewhere.

That's even assuming Lamb is even a good NFL WR. The WRs taken in the first round in the past five years haven't really been impactful.

I was gonna say the same thing, "who is Lamp" lol. You make good points Solar, the QB does need time to throw, the DL can always use upgrades but we have our starters on both lines right now imo. Again, I'm not advocating taking Lamb but if the ones we want aren't there at #8..............? Trading down no more than 3-4 spots, gaining picks, then taking BPA makes more sense to me, even if that player is Lamb? You said "if your roster is complete, then take a guy like Lamb to get you over the top"? Yes, our roster isn't complete but if that one player can help get you over the top, why not take him right now? Why wait? If Lamb is as good as most scouts say he is, then he can make our offense more dangerous for sure. OT's come around every yr, just like any position in the draft. There may not be as many as this yr during most drafts but there's always FA. No guarantees the OT's in this draft will pan out, just the same as the WR's or any position any yr. I'm all for making this team better, just the same as you brother, we're die hard Cardinal fans so whoever we pick, as long as they can make us better.........?

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Lamb would be on the depth chart below Hopkins and Fitz without exception. There's no way we're sticking some rookie above the franchise's #1 legend and probably our most exciting acquisition ever.

As far as beating out Kirk? I know for some reason he's suddenly on the trash heap, but he's got two years of NFL experience, a full year in Kingsbury's system, and it's not like he's some slow journeyman who is just barely hanging on, he's a 2nd round pick from two years ago with an unfortunate injury here or there.

If you think he's bad, again, this comes down to expecting fantasy football numbers instead of looking at what we really have.


No, because we have a top three WR already here, along with plenty of complementary pieces.

The "Air Raid" really needs 7 WR's if 10 personnel is to be used more often than not. Hopkins, Fitz, Kirk & Lamb makes 4, Johnson, Isabella & Butler makes 7. Sherfield is more ST's but can be used when needed.

 

[DVontel]

Some of you guys are acting like Kliff is going to run a Mike Leach-esque Air-Raid.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Some of you guys are acting like Kliff is going to run a Mike Leach-esque Air-Raid.

Lord I hope not. I want balance. I loved the two TE sets. Loved the 11 & 12 personnel. KK is obviously an "Air Raid" coach, having 4 top notch WR's at his disposal to use is essential if this offense is gonna work like he wants it to. I'm not saying be like Mike Leach, he never runs the ball & that would never work in the NFL. He needs balance with the players to use 10 personnel giving DC's something else to worry about.

 

[DVontel]

Lord I hope not. I want balance. I loved the two TE sets. Loved the 11 & 12 personnel. KK is obviously an "Air Raid" coach, having 4 top notch WR's at his disposal to use is essential if this offense is gonna work like he wants it to. I'm not saying be like Mike Leach, he never runs the ball & that would never work in the NFL. He needs balance with the players to use 10 personnel giving DC's something else to worry about.

Kliff is way too smart to go out there with 10 personnel so much like he did the first couple games of the season. He is creative & know you can get a lot more creative with 11/12 personnel opposed to 10.

 

[AZCrazy]

We were a disaster last year until we went away from the 4 wide sets. No tight ends and a weak O Line gets your quarterback creamed.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

We were a disaster last year until we went away from the 4 wide sets. No tight ends and a weak O Line gets your quarterback creamed.

Everything is related though. You can go 4 wide if you have either an OLine that can hold up long enough or receivers that can get open fast enough. The issue for us is that we didn’t really have either of those things last year.

 

[Solar7]

I was gonna say the same thing, "who is Lamp" lol. You make good points Solar, the QB does need time to throw, the DL can always use upgrades but we have our starters on both lines right now imo. Again, I'm not advocating taking Lamb but if the ones we want aren't there at #8..............? Trading down no more than 3-4 spots, gaining picks, then taking BPA makes more sense to me, even if that player is Lamb? You said "if your roster is complete, then take a guy like Lamb to get you over the top"? Yes, our roster isn't complete but if that one player can help get you over the top, why not take him right now? Why wait? If Lamb is as good as most scouts say he is, then he can make our offense more dangerous for sure. OT's come around every yr, just like any position in the draft. There may not be as many as this yr during most drafts but there's always FA. No guarantees the OT's in this draft will pan out, just the same as the WR's or any position any yr. I'm all for making this team better, just the same as you brother, we're die hard Cardinal fans so whoever we pick, as long as they can make us better.........?

Right on man. Of course we both want the team to get better. I just think it gets better protecting Murray rather than having him throw off of his back foot to guys in desperation.

You say OTs come around every year... I don't see that in the modern NFL. I think receivers come around every year. Michael Thomas is one of the best in the league, and he's a recent second round pick.

Some of you guys are acting like Kliff is going to run a Mike Leach-esque Air-Raid.

Once again, we agree. It's not college, and Kliff is willing to adapt. I think he's smart enough to know he can't run 10 personnel at all times, which makes our 4th WR less valuable.

Hell, I'd argue from watching Kliff's playcalling and such, he prefers versatility over all. Lamb's a very enticing player, just not the right fit in a world where we have a great WR corps.

 

[CardinalCovfefe]

I was gonna say the same thing, "who is Lamp" lol. You make good points Solar, the QB does need time to throw, the DL can always use upgrades but we have our starters on both lines right now imo. Again, I'm not advocating taking Lamb but if the ones we want aren't there at #8..............? Trading down no more than 3-4 spots, gaining picks, then taking BPA makes more sense to me, even if that player is Lamb? You said "if your roster is complete, then take a guy like Lamb to get you over the top"? Yes, our roster isn't complete but if that one player can help get you over the top, why not take him right now? Why wait? If Lamb is as good as most scouts say he is, then he can make our offense more dangerous for sure. OT's come around every yr, just like any position in the draft. There may not be as many as this yr during most drafts but there's always FA. No guarantees the OT's in this draft will pan out, just the same as the WR's or any position any yr. I'm all for making this team better, just the same as you brother, we're die hard Cardinal fans so whoever we pick, as long as they can make us better.........?

Who's the starting D line? I mean, I know Corey and Phillips, but who's the other guy? Zach Allen? I just think D Brown, Peters and Phillips would be an incredible 3 man front. Chandler and Kennard would freak out if we picked up Brown. Zach could spell the big guys with a little help from Dogbe maybe. But with Brown, somebody in the front 3 best be double teamed every down.

 

[CardinalCovfefe]

I was gonna say the same thing, "who is Lamp" lol. You make good points Solar, the QB does need time to throw, the DL can always use upgrades but we have our starters on both lines right now imo. Again, I'm not advocating taking Lamb but if the ones we want aren't there at #8..............? Trading down no more than 3-4 spots, gaining picks, then taking BPA makes more sense to me, even if that player is Lamb? You said "if your roster is complete, then take a guy like Lamb to get you over the top"? Yes, our roster isn't complete but if that one player can help get you over the top, why not take him right now? Why wait? If Lamb is as good as most scouts say he is, then he can make our offense more dangerous for sure. OT's come around every yr, just like any position in the draft. There may not be as many as this yr during most drafts but there's always FA. No guarantees the OT's in this draft will pan out, just the same as the WR's or any position any yr. I'm all for making this team better, just the same as you brother, we're die hard Cardinal fans so whoever we pick, as long as they can make us better.........?

Who's the starting D line? I mean, I know Corey and Phillips, but who's the other guy? Zach Allen? I just think D Brown, Peters and Phillips would be an incredible 3 man front. Chandler and Kennard would freak out if we picked up Brown. Zach could spell the big guys with a little help from Dogbe maybe. But with Brown, somebody in the front 3 best be double teamed every down.

 

[Solar7]

Who's the starting D line? I mean, I know Corey and Phillips, but who's the other guy? Zach Allen? I just think D Brown, Peters and Phillips would be an incredible 3 man front. Chandler and Kennard would freak out if we picked up Brown. Zach could spell the big guys with a little help from Dogbe maybe. But with Brown, somebody in the front 3 best be double teamed every down.

Amen to that. Our LB corps has a lot of athleticism now. Put more beef in there and let Allen rotate in during more pass-heavy downs? That sounds exciting. Especially against our run-heavy division.

Not to mention, for all of the people worried about replacing Fitz in a year, how about replacing Corey Peters? Brown could dominate at NT.

 

[Lagerfilled]

Amen to that. Our LB corps has a lot of athleticism now. Put more beef in there and let Allen rotate in during more pass-heavy downs? That sounds exciting. Especially against our run-heavy division.

Not to mention, for all of the people worried about replacing Fitz in a year, how about replacing Corey Peters? Brown could dominate at NT.

Finally something I can agree with!

 

[SoonerLou]

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[CardinalCovfefe]

Amen to that. Our LB corps has a lot of athleticism now. Put more beef in there and let Allen rotate in during more pass-heavy downs? That sounds exciting. Especially against our run-heavy division.

Not to mention, for all of the people worried about replacing Fitz in a year, how about replacing Corey Peters? Brown could dominate at NT.

Man, I worry about our CB's falling off a cliff. PP about to turn 30 and already been busted for boosting. Alford's 31 coming off injury?
Not exactly comforting....

 

[daves]

No tight ends and a weak O Line gets your quarterback creamed.

So supposing the Cards take Simmons at 8....

Is there a promising TE who's likely to be available at the top of the 3rd round who could satisfy both those looking to improve the OL and those looking to upgive Kingsbury and Murray more options in the receiving corps? I don't recall seeing a single mock that has the Cardinals taking a 2nd day TE. And while Williams and Arnold made a few nice plays last season, they're more complimentary pieces than stars.

...dave

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Who's the starting D line? I mean, I know Corey and Phillips, but who's the other guy? Zach Allen? I just think D Brown, Peters and Phillips would be an incredible 3 man front. Chandler and Kennard would freak out if we picked up Brown. Zach could spell the big guys with a little help from Dogbe maybe. But with Brown, somebody in the front 3 best be double teamed every down.

Probably Bullard or Allen on the left side, Peters will slide over on the right & Phillips will man the middle. I would have no problem drafting Brown. I just want what's best for the team. Whichever player has the most value from the start. We all have our own opinions. I can't wait for this draft.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Right on man. Of course we both want the team to get better. I just think it gets better protecting Murray rather than having him throw off of his back foot to guys in desperation.

You say OTs come around every year... I don't see that in the modern NFL. I think receivers come around every year. Michael Thomas is one of the best in the league, and he's a recent second round pick.


Once again, we agree. It's not college, and Kliff is willing to adapt. I think he's smart enough to know he can't run 10 personnel at all times, which makes our 4th WR less valuable.

Hell, I'd argue from watching Kliff's playcalling and such, he prefers versatility over all. Lamb's a very enticing player, just not the right fit in a world where we have a great WR corps.

Someone posted a percentage chart on here with the personnel sets used in 2019. I think it was 39% 11 personnel & 31% 10 personnel. I'm in the belief those two would've been flip flopped if we had WR's in 2019 that could get seperation? I may be wrong? Just an opinion. Do you think KK started using less 10 personnel because of the WR situation in 2019? I know I do. Like I've said on this thread, I love the balance with 11 & 12 personnel. I hope he keeps adapting week to week. Just having 4 awesome WR's would be harder to defend knowing it's available coupled with all the different plays from 11 & 12. Love how he got as creative as possible with what we had in 2019. The potential of this offense has me excited. The defense held us back in 2019, using backups in too many key spots. The defensive FA signings should make the defense a whole lot better in 2020.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Amen to that. Our LB corps has a lot of athleticism now. Put more beef in there and let Allen rotate in during more pass-heavy downs? That sounds exciting. Especially against our run-heavy division.

Not to mention, for all of the people worried about replacing Fitz in a year, how about replacing Corey Peters? Brown could dominate at NT.

For months now I've been wanting to draft Derrick Brown, just figured after signing Jordan Phillips that wouldn't be a possibility? You're absolutely right, Corey Peters is getting up there in age. Love the dude, he's from right here in Louisville, KY. Went to Louisville Central H.S & played at the University of Kentucky. He's still strong as hell but we all get old at some point. I guess it will all depend on player availability in this draft & who has the most say lol? KK or SK? Will SK listen to others or do his own thing is the burning question?

 

[Solar7]

Someone posted a percentage chart on here with the personnel sets used in 2019. I think it was 39% 11 personnel & 31% 10 personnel. I'm in the belief those two would've been flip flopped if we had WR's in 2019 that could get seperation? I may be wrong? Just an opinion. Do you think KK started using less 10 personnel because of the WR situation in 2019? I know I do. Like I've said on this thread, I love the balance with 11 & 12 personnel. I hope he keeps adapting week to week. Just having 4 awesome WR's would be harder to defend knowing it's available coupled with all the different plays from 11 & 12. Love how he got as creative as possible with what we had in 2019. The potential of this offense has me excited. The defense held us back in 2019, using backups in too many key spots. The defensive FA signings should make the defense a whole lot better in 2020.

I think he changed the personnel groupings because no one could block for Kyler or the RBs. Go four or five wide and all the defense has to do is just tee off on the QB.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

I think he changed the personnel groupings because no one could block for Kyler or the RBs. Go four or five wide and all the defense has to do is just tee off on the QB.

That is very true but someone will be open if they tee off. Kyler being able to run will cause some pressure to hold back somewhat. This draft is gonna be interesting, I'm ready brother.

 

[TheCardFan]

http://bottom-of-the-barrel.blogspot.com/2015/12/grading-mel-kipers-2007-nfl-draft-grades.html


Once Joe Thomas was gone, the Cardinals had to make a decision whether to take Adrian Peterson or Levi Brown.

Should I eat pizza or dog poo? Pizza has few nutrients in it and I already had pizza this week, so maybe I'll go with the dog poo because it has to have nutrients and I haven't had dog poo lately.

Peterson would have been a luxury pick, which they couldn't afford to do, and Brown fills a hole.

Because when you have J.J. Arrington and Edgerrin James, there's no need for a running back. The Cardinals did just sign James, but still, an offense with Kurt Warner, Adrian Peterson, Anquan Boldin, Larry Fitzgerald, and Steve Breaston. That's a pretty good offense.

There were quite a few teams that didn't think there was a lot that separated Brown from Thomas. Brown has a nasty streak and can play either tackle position.

But he can he play either tackle as well as Adrian Peterson can play running back? Brown was decent, but man, passing up Peterson...

Tight end Ben Patrick is a potential steal in the seventh round. He needs to work on his concentration and catching the ball, but Patrick could have gone in the third round and no one would have argued.

Other than getting distracted while he's on the field and not being able to catch the ball, Ben Patrick would make an excellent tight end.

This is just the beginning of a lot of "B's" and "C's." What an embarrassment.

 

[cardsunsfan]

http://bottom-of-the-barrel.blogspot.com/2015/12/grading-mel-kipers-2007-nfl-draft-grades.html


Once Joe Thomas was gone, the Cardinals had to make a decision whether to take Adrian Peterson or Levi Brown.

Should I eat pizza or dog ****? Pizza has few nutrients in it and I already had pizza this week, so maybe I'll go with the dog **** because it has to have nutrients and I haven't had dog **** lately.

Peterson would have been a luxury pick, which they couldn't afford to do, and Brown fills a hole.

Because when you have J.J. Arrington and Edgerrin James, there's no need for a running back. The Cardinals did just sign James, but still, an offense with Kurt Warner, Adrian Peterson, Anquan Boldin, Larry Fitzgerald, and Steve Breaston. That's a pretty good offense.

There were quite a few teams that didn't think there was a lot that separated Brown from Thomas. Brown has a nasty streak and can play either tackle position.

But he can he play either tackle as well as Adrian Peterson can play running back? Brown was decent, but man, passing up Peterson...

Tight end Ben Patrick is a potential steal in the seventh round. He needs to work on his concentration and catching the ball, but Patrick could have gone in the third round and no one would have argued.

Other than getting distracted while he's on the field and not being able to catch the ball, Ben Patrick would make an excellent tight end.

This is just the beginning of a lot of "B's" and "C's." What an embarrassment.

Yes the draft guys never seem to want to go back.. and look at what they say. The can't miss prospects that are uniformly well liked across the board do pan out. Was Peterson coming off his injury though? I think that was the only major knock against him..

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

Someone posted a percentage chart on here with the personnel sets used in 2019. I think it was 39% 11 personnel & 31% 10 personnel. I'm in the belief those two would've been flip flopped if we had WR's in 2019 that could get seperation? I may be wrong? Just an opinion. Do you think KK started using less 10 personnel because of the WR situation in 2019? I know I do. Like I've said on this thread, I love the balance with 11 & 12 personnel. I hope he keeps adapting week to week. Just having 4 awesome WR's would be harder to defend knowing it's available coupled with all the different plays from 11 & 12. Love how he got as creative as possible with what we had in 2019. The potential of this offense has me excited. The defense held us back in 2019, using backups in too many key spots. The defensive FA signings should make the defense a whole lot better in 2020.

They moved away from 10 personnel because of the WR situation and the O-Line situation. The line wasn't good enough to hold off the rush long enough for the mediocre receivers to get separation. Improve either or both of those groups and 10 personnel should work quite a bit better.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

They moved away from 10 personnel because of the WR situation and the O-Line situation. The line wasn't good enough to hold off the rush long enough for the mediocre receivers to get separation. Improve either or both of those groups and 10 personnel should work quite a bit better.

I honestly think our OL wouldn't have given up all the sacks had Gilbert stayed healthy. Sweezy played better than given credit for. What do you think, OL or WR at #8? Murray played well in about 8-9 of the games he played, he did give up some sacks but given the tough spot he was put in, I thought he held up as well as possible. If we don't take an OT at #8, Gilbert & Murray better hold up in 2020 lol.