Getting Ready for Next Year

[George O'Brien]

As it currently stands, the Suns are a long shot to make the playoffs. The problem is that the West began the season as the stronger conference and several lottery teams are ploying well above expectations.

At some point in the next month or so, it will be clear whether the Suns have a legitimate shot. If they don't, then they should think about next year. This has several implications:

1. Forget about playing Googs. He is not coming back, so give the minutes to other players who need more experience.

2. Play the younger players a lot. Make White play as long as he can until he fouls out. Give Barbosa and jacobsen and Zarko 30 minutes a game. Put Trybanski in. Find out if these guys can play.

3. Install a structured offense and bench anybody who doesn't do what they are supposed to.

4. Pull any player who is not playing flat out all the time.


More than anything else, the Suns need to know what king of people are need through the draft and/or free agency. Some people think they need a great shooter. Some think they need a shot blocker. We will never know if Casey could be the shooter they need iif he stays on the bench.

Any thoughts?

 

[Billythekid]

I respect you thoughts... but my thoughts are not what your thoughts are

Still a looooooooong way to go.

GO SUNS!

 

[elindholm]

Why shouldn't they do most of those things if they are still playoff contenders? It seems like, with a few exceptions, those are pretty obviously good things to do either way.

 

[Dr. Dumas]

Originally posted by George O'Brien

More than anything else, the Suns need to know what king of people are need through the draft and/or free agency. Some people think they need a great shooter. Some think they need a shot blocker. We will never know if Casey could be the shooter they need iif he stays on the bench.


This will never happen, because the Suns always draft the best possible player in their eyes based on talent not need.

 

[BC867]

Re: Re: Getting Ready for Next Year

Originally posted by Dr. Dumas
... the Suns always draft the best possible player in their eyes based on talent not need.

How true. It ties in with the Suns playing the 5 best guys (regardless of position), with the game on the line, rather than the best at each position.

 

[George O'Brien]

When looking at the Suns, I feel their number one need is a center who can defend without double teams and block shots.

It will not be easy to find someone who can do this through the draft and a mid-range cap exception may not be enough. (One possiblity is Jeff Foster of the Pacers who is currently making $3.9 million. He is better than what the Suns have, but probably not a championship level center)

The draft is loaded with "project" big men, but no Tim Duncans or even Yao Mings.

The top pick is likely to be Okafor (U. of Conn), but he is only 6'9" and more likely a PF in the NBA. The tall guys all have serious negitive factors:

Dwight Howard 6'11" but only 220 pounds and is till in HS

Kosta Perovic 7'2" and 240 from Serbia. He is pretty light for that height and has minimal offensive skills.

Pavel Podkolzin 7'5" and 305 from Russia, playing in Italy. He is not getting a lot of playing time and is very raw.

Tiago Splitter 6'10" and 225 from Brazil playing in Spain. He is very light for PF and avoids contact.

Paul Davis 6'11" 240 Michigan State is not considered to be very strong defensively.

Predrag Samardziski 6'11" 245 Serbia is not very experienced.

David Harrison 7'0" 250 Colorado is not very experienced and is considered to be very immature.

 

[Jerbob]

Don't forget another Brazilian, Rafael Araujo from BYU.

He's 6'11" and 265. While not the greatest shotblocker in the world, he has scored 83 points in his last 3 games including 32 points and 17 rebounds against #25 Oklahoma state.

 

[George O'Brien]

Draft

There are not many draft sites up yet for 2004. The only one I found that ranked Rafael Araujo was http://probasketball.about.com/library/weekly/bl_mockdraft_a.htm who have him as a second rounder. With numbers like that, his stock is likely to rise.

 

[SweetD]

This is one of the better sites I have seen.
http://nbadraft.net/index.asp

 

[George O'Brien]

NBA Draft Net has Rafael Araujo ranked 46th.

These early rankings are notably inaccurate. They rarely agree until the final three or four weeks, but the profiles are always interesting.

NBA Draft Net has Pavel Podkolzine ranked second. This seems high, but he is definitely a Mark Eaton type player:

Pavel Podkolzine
Birthdate: 1/15/85
NBA Position: Center
Ht: 7-5
Wt: 303
Int Team: Metis Varese
Hometown: Novosibirsk, Russia

European Perspective:

A player who developed his agility in Italy to the point where early this year he was considered a future top 5 pick but not for a few seasons. The process has been sped up it appears... Enormous. with the classic physical structure of the long Russians... Definitely has good coordination and the good movements... Offensively he plays very timidly. With the ball he doesn't take any initiative... Does not seem to have great touch and has a long ways to go figuring out post moves ... Imposing presence, he's dangerous to take the basketball at.... Defensively does not have a good feeling for the game or sense of the position... Very raw. But he demonstrates good reactions to the game at a young age.

Would someone like that be worth waiting three years for him to learn the game?

 

[newfan101]

Re: Re: Re: Getting Ready for Next Year

Originally posted by BC867
How true. It ties in with the Suns playing the 5 best guys (regardless of position), with the game on the line, rather than the best at each position.

You appear to have tunnel vision with regards to players position and physical diminsions. With you, all 5 positions must be represented at all times, with players who fit the textbook role of their position, and with height and weight at or above the league average. You don't seem to care what an individual player brings to the table, or if he can even play for that matter, as long as he fits the physical description and role of the position labeled to him.

--- move Shawn Marion to shooting guard, because he's athletic and 6'7", making him taller than other shooting guards.

---- play J. White more, because he weighs 290 pounds.

---- Stephon scores too much, because point guards shouldn't score.

ect ...ect... ect... ect.....

I couldn't care less what positions are represented on the floor. I think you need 2 players with an inside presence defensively, (one with a low post game and one who can hit a mid-range jumper), 2 shooters, and a player who can create his own shot off the dribble. You need a superstar and a complimentary star, with the superstar, unless named Jordan, being the big, low post player. That's how you build a contender. I think if you have those ingredients, it doesn't matter what position is doing what, and it doesn't matter if one of the pieces is not the standard height and weight.

The Lakers didn't win 3 championships because they had a 7 foot, 350 pound center playing a lot of minutes. They won because their 7 foot, 350 pound center was the best and most dominating player in the league. Their point guard didn't create the offense, Kobe did. They surrounded those two with 3 shooters (a point guard and two small forwards). Horry wasn't a pure power forward, Fox was undersized, and Fisher wasn't a pure passing point guard. But they all could shoot from the outside and fill the other roles needed. It was their game that made them great complimentary players, not their size and position.

The Suns will ultimately become a contender only if Amare can develop into a superstar big man to play with Marbury. If he doesn't, everything else is moot. If he does, the critical factor in building players around them will be their complimentary skills, not their height, weight and position.

 

[Errntknght]

There's something to what you're saying Newfan, but the Lakers play a triangle offense that doesn't have the same requirements as traditional NBA offenses. Phil Jackson, for example, has never liked true point guards for his team - though GP may cause him to rethink that a bit. He's been searching for a PF along the lines of a classic one ever since he came to LA. It's to his credit that he made do without but I'm sure he's just tickled to have very traditional Karl covering Shaq's back.

You can't blame guys too much for wanting FJ to make changes in what he'd doing with this team - we see all this talent essentially going to waste. I don't personally agree with BC's ideas but they're not ridiculous. Shawn at the 2 and Zarko at 3 might work out very well with Z being a 'point forward'. We do need some extra play making skills on the floor because Marbs is more like a 1.5 than a 1.

Personally, I'd keep Marion as a 3 and make him a baseline player, sort of in the style of Ceballos. Zarko backing him and Amare but against a zone I'd bring Z in at center. (Or shift Amare to center, if that sounds more palatable.) I also think I'd pressure the opponents in the backcourt whenever they started playing a zone... pushing the tempo up and getting our guys thinking in terms of beating the zone down floor.

 

[George O'Brien]

I basically agree with Errntknght. I just don't see Shawn being more effective at #2. If anything, he is more effective at #4. Unfortunately, he doesn't like it there because he gets beat up.

Maybe Zarko should start and Marion come in off the bench. Zark may be the best outside shooter the Suns have. Unless Casey becomes starter material, the Suns are left with a starting lineup of streaky shooters.

 

[slinslin]

Actually I wouldn't mind a SG or SF.

Maybe someone like Andre Iguodala..

 

[frdbtr]

Originally posted by Jerbob
Don't forget another Brazilian, Rafael Araujo from BYU.

He's 6'11" and 265. While not the greatest shotblocker in the world, he has scored 83 points in his last 3 games including 32 points and 17 rebounds against #25 Oklahoma state.

I live in Salt Lake and have Seen Araujo play a lot. BYU is listing him at 6'11" and 285 this year. If he keeps playing the way he is currently playing he will be a first round pick guaranteed. He just wasn't on anyones Radar. Went to a big man camp last summer and was soon after rated by ESPN as the best sleeper big man in College basketball. The problem with Araujo is he isn't from europe and went through the college system instead of playing on his national team. This guy is a beast though. Beats Double and triple teams all game long. Only problem is he gets into foul trouble sometimes.

 

[frdbtr]

Originally posted by frdbtr
I live in Salt Lake and have Seen Araujo play a lot. BYU is listing him at 6'11" and 285 this year. If he keeps playing the way he is currently playing he will be a first round pick guaranteed. He just wasn't on anyones Radar. Went to a big man camp last summer and was soon after rated by ESPN as the best sleeper big man in College basketball. The problem with Araujo is he isn't from europe and went through the college system instead of playing on his national team. This guy is a beast though. Beats Double and triple teams all game long. Only problem is he gets into foul trouble sometimes.

 

[frdbtr]

Sorry about the dupe post guys, I meant to edit my post and hit the Quote button instead.