Has Cam Johnson displaced Oubre?

[Mainstreet]

James Jones at age 23 (1.3 points and .3 rebounds). Cam Johnson at 23 (8.7 points and 3.3 rebounds).

http://bkref.com/tiny/ITUhA

 

[JerkFace]

Cam Johnson’s bubble stats:
13.3 points
5.9 rebounds
2.1 assists
62.5 TS%

Combine that with the fact then when he is on the floor his defender has to respect his shot so it opens everything up for everyone else.

 

[Hoop Head]

Cam Johnson’s bubble stats:
13.3 points
5.9 rebounds
2.1 assists
62.5 TS%

Combine that with the fact then when he is on the floor his defender has to respect his shot so it opens everything up for everyone else.

And in 4 years as a Sun, Channing Frye averaged
11.4 points
5.4 rebounds
1.3 assists
55.8 TS%

Frye shot 38.9 from 3 to Cam's 39.2% this season.

I'll stick with that comparison until Cam surpasses Channing but even if he doesn't I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing.

Unfortunately you can't really compare them at the same age because Frye was an interior "big" until he signed with the Suns in 2009-10, when he was 26 and in his 5th season. Stylistically he was really different before being a Sun. For example he only attempted a total of 70 3's in his first 4 years, where he played in 278 games. Then that first year in Phoenix he was given a green light and shot 392 3's at a 43.9% clip throughout 81. He attempted 4.8 a game, which is the same as Cam this season. Cam's percentage is lower at 39% but I believe he'll top 40% with time and reps.

Their per 36 numbers are similar in a number of categories also. I think the more Cam plays PF, the more his stats will mirror Frye's. Click here for more comparisons, I put the Per 36 below though...

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[Phrazbit]

James Jones at age 23 (1.3 points and .3 rebounds). Cam Johnson at 23 (8.7 points and 3.3 rebounds).

http://bkref.com/tiny/ITUhA

Umm... Uhh... something about Cam Johnson being a bad shooter because his super fast release is only there to cover for his "natural" slow release AND you need to ignore every game in which he shot well and he is totally incapable of defending outside of rotations and keeping his man in front of him.

 

[Dr. Jones]

I loved what I saw from Cam. LOVED IT.

Kelly can shoot but nothing like this assassin. He needs very little space to get it up too. I may have come full circle on Cam and Kelly in the same bubble. Amazing.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Cam reminds me of Jeff Hornacek in his court demeanor. He shoots like that is what he is supposed to do. When it goes in he acts like that is just what he expected. He goes about his defense in a very determined business-like fashion.

He has a great level of maturity--especially for a rookie regardless of his age.

 

[Yuma]

Cam is maturing rapidly as a player. We need Payne and the bulldog to come back for our second unit. Saric? Kominsky? Baynes? I think Baynes leaves for greener pastures. keep the squad together, or upgrade? Do we have the juice to upgrade?

 

[1Sun]

And in 4 years as a Sun, Channing Frye averaged
11.4 points
5.4 rebounds
1.3 assists
55.8 TS%

Frye shot 38.9 from 3 to Cam's 39.2% this season.

I'll stick with that comparison until Cam surpasses Channing but even if he doesn't I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing.

Unfortunately you can't really compare them at the same age because Frye was an interior "big" until he signed with the Suns in 2009-10, when he was 26 and in his 5th season. Stylistically he was really different before being a Sun. For example he only attempted a total of 70 3's in his first 4 years, where he played in 278 games. Then that first year in Phoenix he was given a green light and shot 392 3's at a 43.9% clip throughout 81. He attempted 4.8 a game, which is the same as Cam this season. Cam's percentage is lower at 39% but I believe he'll top 40% with time and reps.

Their per 36 numbers are similar in a number of categories also. I think the more Cam plays PF, the more his stats will mirror Frye's. Click here for more comparisons, I put the Per 36 below though...

You must be registered for see images attach

Frye was 3 inches taller, 40 pounds heavier and more athletic. Frye was a true stretch 5. Cam is a 3 masquerading as a 4 to make up for his lack of athleticism. The numbers might be comparable, but the positions and roles are not.

 

[Mainstreet]

@Hoop Head

I'm satisfied with the Frye comparison. Potentially Cam Johnson may become a better shooter.

 

[BC867]

Cam reminds me of Jeff Hornacek in his court demeanor. He shoots like that is what he is supposed to do. When it goes in he acts like that is just what he expected. He goes about his defense in a very determined business-like fashion.

He has a great level of maturity--especially for a rookie regardless of his age.

But, as much as we loved Horny, he was a smooth undersized 2-Guard
who could help his teams maintain good basketball, but not advance to
great basketball.

 

[Phrazbit]

Frye was 3 inches taller, 40 pounds heavier and more athletic. Frye was a true stretch 5. Cam is a 3 masquerading as a 4 to make up for his lack of athleticism. The numbers might be comparable, but the positions and roles are not.

Yeah, it is not a fair comparison because Cam is already a more impactful player. He can shoot from the outside, he can attack the rim, he can pass and he has shown himself to be capable of defending on the wing.

He also isn't afraid to shoot. Few things bothered me more than us running plays to create looks for Frye from 3, only for him to get a WIDE open look and then pass the ball to someone who is covered.

What I like the most about Cam is his confidence. He isn't scared.

 

[Phrazbit]

But, as much as we loved Horny, he was a smooth undersized 2-Guard
who could help his teams maintain good basketball, but not advance to
great basketball.

I am not sure what you're digging at here. If a player doesn't win a title then what is the point? Hornacek was an all-star, a capable player across all fronts, he played great unselfish basketball... was he Michael 'freaking' Jordan? No, but he was an absolute stud. Any team would LOVE to have that type of player.

 

[Hoop Head]

But, as much as we loved Horny, he was a smooth undersized 2-Guard
who could help his teams maintain good basketball, but not advance to
great basketball.

I am not sure what you're digging at here. If a player doesn't win a title then what is the point? Hornacek was an all-star, a capable player across all fronts, he played great unselfish basketball... was he Michael 'freaking' Jordan? No, but he was an absolute stud. Any team would LOVE to have that type of player.

And Michael Jordan is arguably the only reason Hornacek doesn't have an NBA Championship on his resume. Hornacek was part of some good Suns teams but he was a key piece of the Jazz in the 90's when they went to back to back NBA Finals against the Bulls. It's definitely fair to assume that if MJ didn't un-retire for his 2nd 3-Peat then the Jazz would have won a title during that stretch.

 

[Phrazbit]

And Michael Jordan is arguably the only reason Hornacek doesn't have an NBA Championship on his resume. Hornacek was part of some good Suns teams but he was a key piece of the Jazz in the 90's when they went to back to back NBA Finals against the Bulls. It's definitely fair to assume that if MJ didn't un-retire for his 2nd 3-Peat then the Jazz would have won a title during that stretch.

Exactly. If those exact same Bulls team had the static choice of having Hornacek vs having Paxson or Kerr or Armstrong, they'd take Hornacek in a heart beat... he was a better player. Did he ever win a title? No, but he every team he played on better, he played on teams that made deeps runs almost every year of his career and he did everything well. Which is more than you can say for about 95% of players in the league.

 

[GatorAZ]

And Michael Jordan is arguably the only reason Hornacek doesn't have an NBA Championship on his resume. Hornacek was part of some good Suns teams but he was a key piece of the Jazz in the 90's when they went to back to back NBA Finals against the Bulls. It's definitely fair to assume that if MJ didn't un-retire for his 2nd 3-Peat then the Jazz would have won a title during that stretch.

On a completely separate not it’s crazy Utah with a prime Stockton/Malone never made the Finals until 97’.

 

[WhyAlwaysMe]

On a completely separate not it’s crazy Utah with a prime Stockton/Malone never made the Finals until 97’.

88-89 was their first good year together. Stockton’s 4th year and Malone’s 3rd.

They went 51-31 and got swept (3-0) by a 43-39 Warriors (Mullin/Richmond). Interestingly, they were only 17th in ORTG, but 1st in DRTG.

Suns made WCF that year, and were 2nd in SRS in the league: (3-0 over DEN and then 4-1 over GS, only to get swept by Lakers who lost to DET).



89-90 the Jazz were better (5th in SRS) and lost in 5 to Phoenix (who were 1st in SRS, and lost to Blazers in 6 in WCF again).

90-91 the Jazz finally got past the 1st rd (beat Suns 3-1) only to lose to POR 4-1 in WCSF. Only 8th in SRS for Jazz that year, kinda weird given their elite health.

91-92 the Jazz make a move to WCF, losing in 6 to POR. 7th and 6th seasons for Stock and Malone, respectively, and the best team SRS (3rd) in their careers.


92-93 a step back, the 10th in SRS Jazz lose 3-2 in Rd 1 to #1 SRS Seattle. Malone and Stockton were both bad in this series.

93-94 7th in SRS Jazz make another WCF, but get DREAM’d in 5.

94-95 2nd in SRS Jazz get DREAM’d in Round One 3-2.

95-96 3rd in SRS Jazz take Sea to 7 in WCF.

then finally over the hump next two years before their stars’ decline.

 

[Dr. Jones]

But, as much as we loved Horny, he was a smooth undersized 2-Guard
who could help his teams maintain good basketball, but not advance to
great basketball.

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[WhyAlwaysMe]

Wonder if there are any “HORNY IS FEELIN IT” calls out there

 

[Cheesebeef]

88-89 was their first good year together. Stockton’s 4th year and Malone’s 3rd.

They went 51-31 and got swept (3-0) by a 43-39 Warriors (Mullin/Richmond). Interestingly, they were only 17th in ORTG, but 1st in DRTG.

Suns made WCF that year, and were 2nd in SRS in the league: (3-0 over DEN and then 4-1 over GS, only to get swept by Lakers who lost to DET).



89-90 the Jazz were better (5th in SRS) and lost in 5 to Phoenix (who were 1st in SRS, and lost to Blazers in 6 in WCF again).

90-91 the Jazz finally got past the 1st rd (beat Suns 3-1) only to lose to POR 4-1 in WCSF. Only 8th in SRS for Jazz that year, kinda weird given their elite health.

91-92 the Jazz make a move to WCF, losing in 6 to POR. 7th and 6th seasons for Stock and Malone, respectively, and the best team SRS (3rd) in their careers.


92-93 a step back, the 10th in SRS Jazz lose 3-2 in Rd 1 to #1 SRS Seattle. Malone and Stockton were both bad in this series.

93-94 7th in SRS Jazz make another WCF, but get DREAM’d in 5.

94-95 2nd in SRS Jazz get DREAM’d in Round One 3-2.

95-96 3rd in SRS Jazz take Sea to 7 in WCF.

then finally over the hump next two years before their stars’ decline.

they basically outlasted the West powers from the late 80’s to late 90’s.

they were always pretenders versus KJ/Chambers Suns, the Drexler Blazers, The Barkley Suns, The Rockets and the Sonics and then only ascended to the top of the West once all those teams were broken up and way past their prime.

that 1990 First round series that we beat them in Game 5 in the Salt Palace was a classic. EJ carried them in the fourth and KJ winning it with the free throw line jumper with 2 seconds left was awesome.

 

[GatorAZ]

88-89 was their first good year together. Stockton’s 4th year and Malone’s 3rd.

They went 51-31 and got swept (3-0) by a 43-39 Warriors (Mullin/Richmond). Interestingly, they were only 17th in ORTG, but 1st in DRTG.

Suns made WCF that year, and were 2nd in SRS in the league: (3-0 over DEN and then 4-1 over GS, only to get swept by Lakers who lost to DET).



89-90 the Jazz were better (5th in SRS) and lost in 5 to Phoenix (who were 1st in SRS, and lost to Blazers in 6 in WCF again).

90-91 the Jazz finally got past the 1st rd (beat Suns 3-1) only to lose to POR 4-1 in WCSF. Only 8th in SRS for Jazz that year, kinda weird given their elite health.

91-92 the Jazz make a move to WCF, losing in 6 to POR. 7th and 6th seasons for Stock and Malone, respectively, and the best team SRS (3rd) in their careers.


92-93 a step back, the 10th in SRS Jazz lose 3-2 in Rd 1 to #1 SRS Seattle. Malone and Stockton were both bad in this series.

93-94 7th in SRS Jazz make another WCF, but get DREAM’d in 5.

94-95 2nd in SRS Jazz get DREAM’d in Round One 3-2.

95-96 3rd in SRS Jazz take Sea to 7 in WCF.

then finally over the hump next two years before their stars’ decline.

they basically outlasted the West powers from the late 80’s to late 90’s.

they were always pretenders versus KJ/Chambers Suns, the Drexler Blazers, The Barkley Suns, The Rockets and the Sonics and then only ascended to the top of the West once all those teams were broken up and way past their prime.

that 1990 First round series that we beat them in Game 5 in the Salt Palace was a classic. EJ carried them in the fourth and KJ winning it with the free throw line jumper with 2 seconds left was awesome.

I’m not going to pretend to know the Jazz roster other than using Basketball Reference but it seemed like they were more than just two guys. Eaton was a DPOY and guys like Jeff Malone, Jeff Hornacek and Thurl Bailey could score. I think the Jazz finally getting through had more to do with the west eroding.

 

[BC867]

You must be registered for see images attach

His coach, Cotton, himself referred to Jeff Hornacek as. "He looks like my paper boy."

'Luv Horny, but paper boys don't win NBA championships.

Same with John Stockton. Strength of image on the court is important.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

His coach, Cotton, himself referred to Jeff Hornacek as. "He looks like my paper boy."

'Luv Horny, but paper boys don't win NBA championships.

Same with John Stockton. Strength of image on the court is important.

Image is silly. The Celtics has the ugliest bunch of dorks a Court has ever seen with bird, Mchale, Ainge, DJ, and Parrish. They tore it up pretty good.

 

[cwamjn]

Image is silly. The Celtics has the ugliest bunch of dorks a Court has ever seen with bird, Mchale, Ainge, DJ, and Parrish. They tore it up pretty good.

Lol. You are forgetting Ainge and Walton coming up the bench.

 

[Hoop Head]

His coach, Cotton, himself referred to Jeff Hornacek as. "He looks like my paper boy."

'Luv Horny, but paper boys don't win NBA championships.

Same with John Stockton. Strength of image on the court is important.

Steph Curry looks like he's 12 and Draymond Green looks like Donkey from the Shrek films. They each have 3 championships.

Dennis Rodman looks like a cartoon character and has 5 championships.

Steve Kerr looks like a paper boys little brother and he has 5 championships as a player and 3 as a coach.

Sam Cassel looks like an alien and has 3 NBA championships.

I could go on but looks don't determine whether a player is capable of contributing to an NBA Championship team.

Looks don't matter, skills do.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Image is silly. The Celtics has the ugliest bunch of dorks a Court has ever seen with bird, Mchale, Ainge, DJ, and Parrish. They tore it up pretty good.

I totally disagree. Sam Cassell by himself on any roster makes it the ugliest bunch.