Have conviction.

[Krangodnzr]

I don't subscribe to the "no risk no biscuit" mantra.In my view its better to have half a biscuit than zero biscuit.Rosen/Bosa or Rosen/Williams beats the hell out taking a chance on Murray.I don't think its gutless...I think its smart.

Half a biscuit is a 8-8 season (Rosen)

A Full biscuit is 13-3 and a Super Bowl win (Murray)

 

[BW52]

Half a biscuit is a 8-8 season (Rosen)

A Full biscuit is 13-3 and a Super Bowl win (Murray)

pure speculation.

 

[ajcardfan]

pure speculation.

Ain't it all speculation? All the time? None of us know squat about what will really happen. When we are "right", it is just luck.

 

[Ohcrap75]

If Murray wasn't available, would many be clamoring for Haskins or Lock? Because the QB is always going to be the position with the highest upside.

Also, there is a chance that Murray isn't top 4 or a disaster. What if he is inconsistently good. What if he never learns to read defenses, but still does enough to be average. I feel the arguments are so extreme each way and he most likely won't reach either.

 

[Delmar M Lewis]

Nope. Nick Foles played out of his mind.

You cant try that with 100 average QBs and it works like 9 times. Not to mention that the Eagles team around Nick Foles was very good.

Yiu said the key word TEAM

 

[Solar7]

This is another reason I've flipped.

With the #1 overall pick, teams should look to draft a franchise altering talent.

I just don't see that with any player other than Kyler Murray. If Keim decides to draft Bosa/Williams, but I think that's the safe/gutless move. No risk it, No biscuit. That mantra is what made the Keim/Arians partnership good for a few years.

Like others have stated, the Cardinals have already gone against conventional wisdom. Some people on this board wanted to hire Jim Caldwell. JIM CALDWELL! You want to talk about the picture child of mediocre, ho hum coaches. Instead the Cardinals went outside of the box...from some indications, the moment Kingsbury was fired, the Cardinals were on his trail. I love the hire, because Kingsbury only has to do what he is good at, develop a QB and develop an offense.

Why is Murray the better fit? Because Murray unlocks the full potential of a spread based play book. His ability to make throws on schedule (something Rosen REALLY struggled with last year) is a staple of the Air Raid offense. Christian Kirk was one of the best receivers in football at catching screen passes, another staple of the Air Raid. I'm excited and rejuvenated by the concept of Murray in Cardinal red. If the Cardinals can protect him, this kid is going to be special because he is Michael Vick with accuracy, Michael Vick with a real QB brain.

Yeah, you should use the #1 on a franchise altering talent, optimally, but you shouldn't waste it on a franchise destroying talent.

People talk about Michael Vick like he mattered. Nah, he didn't, he had some highlights, won a game in Green Bay, broke his body up, killed some dogs, and had a great fantasy football postseason game for the Eagles.

The Cardinals couldn't protect Rosen, and Murray isn't going to fare any better.

For the love of God, please just pick a player that isn't going to have the on-field impact of Jonathan Cooper or Hasaan Redick. An actual starting player that will play 16 games of decent football. Stop trying to outsmart everyone in the room every time. It works once or twice, but has never worked in the first round for Keim.

 

[BirdDroppings]

There is a MUCH greater chance that Rosen would get hurt by a pass rusher than Murr.ay. Murray MAKES people miss. That's what he's great at. Rosen has some wiggle, but his pocket presence is average at best. He's a sitting target at times & gets throttled. In addition to our bad o-line, there's a reason why he was sacked almost 50 times last year. You can't just blame that on your o-line every year

Doesn't change the fact that when a huge guy hits a small guy, it does more damage than when he hits a bigger guy. At the very least, Rosen proved his durability last year. Maybe Murray is durable too, but it's hard to say since he was never really tested in college. He certainly didn't play many NFL caliber defenders in the Big 12.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Understood, but the reverse can also be said, if we pass on Murray, he becomes a stud, and Rosen never develops. Getting the 1st pick for the Cardinals is a once in a lifetime event. I'm 61 & this is the first time it has happened since I became a fan in 1963. We swung for the fences & hired a young, offensive minded HC out of the college ranks. Now is no time to start playing it safe. If Murray pans out, he will be great. I would rather swing for the fences & be great, then settle & be an average to good playoff team. Haven't we seen the latter. Wiz got us close, but let's be honest, that was not a great team. BA got us to the NFC Championship game, but we got embarrassed, as we were not quite great enough to be crowned a great champion. Let's go for it! Us older fans want to see a SB ring in our lifetime. We won't get there playing it safe. I would rather risk it all & either be great or suck with Murray. Either way, it'll be an exciting ride.

I'm 49, been a cardinals fan since 1976, first #1 pick I've seen also. Yes, you nailed the flip side of my comment, if Murray blows up for another team & we could've had him....................? The draft is a total crap shoot, sometimes teams just have to take a chance. I soooooooo want them to get this pick right.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Then what? Well, we hope Bidwill has conviction, when he cleans house and starts over from ground zero.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

That would suck worse than just starting over with yet another new QB.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

I'm scared they pass on Murray, Rosen becomes an average QB, and Murray becomes great.

That's the flip side of my comment & trust me, it has crossed my mind.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

So what? There is a bigger chance Rosen fails then Murray, because he already had a crappy rookie year.

Fear of starting back at square one is irrational, that will happen again at some point. All the cards can do is try to get the a QB with the most upside and hope for the best.

I understand how you feel, I'm just scared drafting Murray won't be an improvement but I could be wrong. Rosen shouldn't be judged from last season imo, not completely, our line sucked big time & not many reliable WR's. I'm a cardinals fan & if Murray is the pick..................? Still bleed cardinals red, let's go Murray at that point.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Keep Rosen, draft Bosa, trade him to Oakland for 4th and 27th pick. We have 3 picks in the top 33 and don't have to eat dead money for Rosen. He will be good under our new system. No QB could have succeeded with our "system" last year. We need to fill a lot of holes.

I think keeping Rosen is the safest choice. He made some impossible throws last season, enough to give me hope at least, especially given the QB coaching track records of Tom Clements & KK.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Yiu said the key word TEAM

I dont think you understand this.

You can build a decent team with a great QB and win Super Bowls. Or build a great team with an average QB.

It's easier to fill one position than it is to fill 21.

 

[sdscard4]

It's simple KM can extend drives period. That alone is a game changer

 

[BW52]

I dont think you understand this.

You can build a decent team with a great QB and win Super Bowls. Or build a great team with an average QB.

It's easier to fill one position than it is to fill 21.

And what if you don`t believe Murray is that QB?

 

[PACardsFan]

Doesn't change the fact that when a huge guy hits a small guy, it does more damage than when he hits a bigger guy. At the very least, Rosen proved his durability last year. Maybe Murray is durable too, but it's hard to say since he was never really tested in college. He certainly didn't play many NFL caliber defenders in the Big 12.

You're missing the point. Murray doesn't put himself in a position to get hit flush. He's extremely skilled at avoiding big hits. Rosen may have avoided major injuries, but he limped off the field a few times last year. It's just a matter of time before he's taken off on a cart. He took WAY too many hits. The OL sucked, I get that. But, he held the ball at times, and at times, he just never saw hits coming. That was the knock on Rosen coming into the draft last year. You either have pocket presence or you don't. Rosen's pocket presence is NOT what Murray's is. Murray has been short all his life. He has figured out how to play the QB position given the God given skills he has. With KK the HC/QBC, he'll know exactly how to use KB.

 

[PACardsFan]

I'm 49, been a cardinals fan since 1976, first #1 pick I've seen also. Yes, you nailed the flip side of my comment, if Murray blows up for another team & we could've had him....................? The draft is a total crap shoot, sometimes teams just have to take a chance. I soooooooo want them to get this pick right.

I agree 100%. It used to be that missing on that #1 pick (especially the QB) could set your franchise back a decade. Financially, it's not like that anymore. In today's NFL, you can miss & still reload in short order. The rewards that Murray is a homerun far outweigh the risk that he isn't. As a fan, I've never been more ready to see them take that risk. I'd be shocked if the Cardinals are not taking that approach.

 

[BW52]

You're missing the point. Murray doesn't put himself in a position to get hit flush. He's extremely skilled at avoiding big hits. Rosen may have avoided major injuries, but he limped off the field a few times last year. It's just a matter of time before he's taken off on a cart. He took WAY too many hits. The OL sucked, I get that. But, he held the ball at times, and at times, he just never saw hits coming. That was the knock on Rosen coming into the draft last year. You either have pocket presence or you don't. Rosen's pocket presence is NOT what Murray's is. Murray has been short all his life. He has figured out how to play the QB position given the God given skills he has. With KK the HC/QBC, he'll know exactly how to use KB.

That's what makes me laugh...the thinking that Murray will just scoot away from those NFl guys just like he did at OKIE U.SO glad he has 'figured out" the QB position to dazzle those bums in the NFl who will be trying to crunch him.Being extremely skilled at avoiding hits might work at OKIE U but this is the NFL..bigger,better,stronger,faster guys all looking to get the QB.Remind again....How many times did Russell Wilson get sacked last season.....52 times.FIFTY-TWO sacks.Wilson is considered one of the most agile smart QBs in the NFL.

 

[TJ]

You're missing the point. Murray doesn't put himself in a position to get hit flush. He's extremely skilled at avoiding big hits. Rosen may have avoided major injuries, but he limped off the field a few times last year. It's just a matter of time before he's taken off on a cart. He took WAY too many hits. The OL sucked, I get that. But, he held the ball at times, and at times, he just never saw hits coming. That was the knock on Rosen coming into the draft last year. You either have pocket presence or you don't. Rosen's pocket presence is NOT what Murray's is. Murray has been short all his life. He has figured out how to play the QB position given the God given skills he has. With KK the HC/QBC, he'll know exactly how to use KB.

That all changes when Murray gets hit by someone bigger and faster than him or a pass rusher hits him unabated

 

[Solar7]

That all changes when Murray gets hit by someone bigger and faster than him or a pass rusher hits him unabated

No, you forgot, Kyler Murray will never get hit. He will be the first player in NFL history to never have contact with a defender. Even if a guy came at him from his blindside, Kyler would have felt the air swirling around him, he would be aware. Then he would deliver a perfect touchdown throw of 75 yards to a player who was triple covered, placing the pass in a completely new spot that conventional QBs are unaware of.

 

[slanidrac16]

No, you forgot, Kyler Murray will never get hit. He will be the first player in NFL history to never have contact with a defender. Even if a guy came at him from his blindside, Kyler would have felt the air swirling around him, he would be aware. Then he would deliver a perfect touchdown throw of 75 yards to a player who was triple covered, placing the pass in a completely new spot that conventional QBs are unaware of.

You forgot to mention the never seen before backflip over a blindside hit.

 

[Krangodnzr]

And what if you don`t believe Murray is that QB?

Then you dont draft him.

I think he's better and has more of a chance of being a transcendent talent than Josh Rosen who most agree is in the Eli Manning/Matt Ryan class if he meets his potential.

 

[slanidrac16]

People keep talking about Murray taking hits but we relate that to last years team and offense. It appears kingsbury’s style of offense will get the ball out of Murray’s hands quickly and will probably have him moving at times right off the snap. Wouldn’t that reduce the amount of times he would be in harms way. If we believe his offense would do this for Rosen wouldn’t it even be more so with Murray?

 

[daves]

For what it's worth:

In 2017-8 Baker Mayfield was sacked 26 times in 430 pass attempts (6.04%) at Oklahoma. He also had 97 rushing attempts for 311 yards and 5 TDs, with 3 total fumbles.

In 2018-9 Kyler Murray was sacked 18 times in 395 pass attempts (4.56%) at Oklahoma. He also had 140 rushing attempts for 1001 yards and 12 TDs, with 3 total fumbles.

So despite about the same total number of passing and rushing attempts, Murray was sacked significantly less often, and fumbled no more than Mayfield. And neither one missed any significant time to injury in their college careers, as far as i know. (Mayfield missed parts of two games with concussions.)

...dave

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

I agree 100%. It used to be that missing on that #1 pick (especially the QB) could set your franchise back a decade. Financially, it's not like that anymore. In today's NFL, you can miss & still reload in short order. The rewards that Murray is a homerun far outweigh the risk that he isn't. As a fan, I've never been more ready to see them take that risk. I'd be shocked if the Cardinals are not taking that approach.

I hope you're right bro? It's looking more & more like the cardinals will indeed draft Murray, unless the smokescreen is the best one ever lol?