Shipp is not a better receiver than Emmitt, lay off the booze, buddy.Shane H said:
Have many of you would rather have TUGBOAT
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clif
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yeah but what about Josh? .. oh wait wrong thread.. 
my rb rankings
1) draft a rb
2) shipp
3) bennett
4) henry
5) anyone else in the free world
6) emmitt
my rb rankings
1) draft a rb
2) shipp
3) bennett
4) henry
5) anyone else in the free world
6) emmitt
chickenhead
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In the grand scheme of things, I wouldn't take anything away from Emmitt this year, but last year he did very little. I would rather have Shipp, because I think a healthy Shipp would have put up similar production (well, maybe without the TD pass), is cheaper, and has a longer career.
We need to acquire another running back anyway, because depending on when Smith retires, we'll need a backup for Shipp, or a starter for Shipp to back up (if he sticks around).
We need to acquire another running back anyway, because depending on when Smith retires, we'll need a backup for Shipp, or a starter for Shipp to back up (if he sticks around).
Shipp is the most overrated player on this team. He is a strong runner, with a very poor idea of how to stop running. He takes a lot of wicked hits because of his running style, and he uses his spin move over and over again, taking licks off balance. Hence, he's always dinged up. He's improved on pass protection, and is a decent, but not strong, receiver out of the backfield.
Shipp is a great backup, but we need a real starting RB with speed for next season. Maybe Shipp gets 3 games at the start of the year, but our rookie should be the man after that. I'd love to have a Mewelde Moore-type on this team; fast, versatile and a good runner/pass reciever.
Problem is, this isn't a big RB draft class on the horizon...
Shipp is a great backup, but we need a real starting RB with speed for next season. Maybe Shipp gets 3 games at the start of the year, but our rookie should be the man after that. I'd love to have a Mewelde Moore-type on this team; fast, versatile and a good runner/pass reciever.
Problem is, this isn't a big RB draft class on the horizon...
clif
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D-Dogg said:
.... only led the team in rushing for the last 3 years or so.
clif said:
Isn't that hard.....don't confuse results with success. Just because we have a low bar, reaching it doesn't mean you are a great player. He's good, but if he ran better and stayed healthy and on the field, and not nicked up, he'd be a much better player. He is not the answer....not even close.
clif
ASFN Addict
D-Dogg said:
who said he was the answer? he is better than what we got now... but I sure didnt say he was the saviour. I still would draft a rb, and keep shipp.
my point when I posted earlier was to dispute your "most overrated" comment.
Henry is under contract for the 2005 season and is due to make 1.25 mil
Bennett is under contract for the 2005 season and is due to make 946K
Per the NFL Players Association.
Now there could be voidable years for both of them but they have contract figures for 2005
Bennett is under contract for the 2005 season and is due to make 946K
Per the NFL Players Association.
Now there could be voidable years for both of them but they have contract figures for 2005
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D-Dogg said:
When did Moore become fast? That's why he was drafted so low he's short and not very fast. Good player, but in that offense they seem to be able to run anybody. Notice with Moss out his YPC fell significantly as teams decided they could afford to play a safety up.
If he's not asking for the moon I still think getting a Lamont Jordan is an ideal pickup, he runs with power, is faster than either Shipp or Smith, he can catch the ball, and he's not been pounded so far in his NFL career because of Curtis Martin taking all the carries.
The problem is I get the impression Jordan wants big money without proving he's worth it, which is sort of why I was hoping we'd trade for him before the deadline so we could find out if he WAS worth big money or not.
I think there is a difference between being fast and being speedy. Moore makes quick moves, especially in the open field.
Kind of how Boldin has game speed, I see that in Moore. His quickness is deceptive, more than point-to-point stopwatch fast. Moore actually reminds me a bit of Marshall Faulk...a rung or so below, but his style is in that mold.
Kind of how Boldin has game speed, I see that in Moore. His quickness is deceptive, more than point-to-point stopwatch fast. Moore actually reminds me a bit of Marshall Faulk...a rung or so below, but his style is in that mold.
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D-Dogg said:
Agreed, if you'd said quick, I wouldn't have said anything he's definitely quick. he's also very decisive.
Quan is different, he has an innate ability to change direction at full speed, and to "wiggle" back and forth like he's going to do something even if he doesn't. I bet Quan was an amazing man to man defender in basketball the way he moves. John Wooden once said the best on ball defender he ever saw was Kenny Easley in rec games at UCLA. Quan has that kind of feet.
Man I missed that guy, too bad his return came on such a lousy game.
kerouac9
Klowned by Keim
Shipp v. Emmitt? Who cares? I mean, really. It's like asking who you'd rather have between Karl Williams and Larry Foster, isn't it?
Lamont Jordan really impressed me last night. I think he'd cost less than James or Henry, and he'll be an UFA this spring. He doesn't have the big wheels that Green really likes in his RBs, though. Lamont Jordan kind of reminded me of a poor-man's TJ Duckett. But I'd pay him Top 15 money to play here and start.
He's mature, knows the NFL game and it's speed coming in, and hasn't taken much of a beating over his first four seasons. Could very well be in the same category as Priest Holmes: a very good player stuck behind another good player on the same team.
That being said, I don't think that this team is one runningback away from making the playoffs, so I disagree that we should give up multiple picks to trade for one. Look what happened with Portis: You just can't predict what a RB is going to do in a different system.
Regardless, this team isn't going to win 10-plus games with either Shipp or Smith as the starter. Sign Jordan or draft someone in the second round.
Lamont Jordan really impressed me last night. I think he'd cost less than James or Henry, and he'll be an UFA this spring. He doesn't have the big wheels that Green really likes in his RBs, though. Lamont Jordan kind of reminded me of a poor-man's TJ Duckett. But I'd pay him Top 15 money to play here and start.
He's mature, knows the NFL game and it's speed coming in, and hasn't taken much of a beating over his first four seasons. Could very well be in the same category as Priest Holmes: a very good player stuck behind another good player on the same team.
That being said, I don't think that this team is one runningback away from making the playoffs, so I disagree that we should give up multiple picks to trade for one. Look what happened with Portis: You just can't predict what a RB is going to do in a different system.
Regardless, this team isn't going to win 10-plus games with either Shipp or Smith as the starter. Sign Jordan or draft someone in the second round.
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kerouac9 said:
They had to trade him because of the contract, but while Droughns is doing a nice job there's no question he's not the back Portis was, more durable probably, but nowhere near the threat to take it all the way. IF they had Portis Denver might be unbeaten. Droughns is nearly a YPC less than Portis was the last 2 years in Denver, Griffin nearly 2 yards.
Jordan is pretty fast, not Portis fast or Bennett fast, but he's faster than Curtis Martin, in fact I think Martin was NEVER any faster than Jordan.
Dave Te Thomas before the draft in 2001 predicted the Vikings would take Jordan because he apparently heard Green really liked him. He also said the negative on Jordan, and the reason he ultimately wound up going out of the first round, was he was a notoriously lazy player in college, didn't work hard, didn't take care of himself in the offseason, and didn't "apply himself".
Don't know if that has changed or not all you hear is he wants more playing time. Great talent but if that part is still true, we won't go after him.
I've always liked Jordan but I tell you the same thing Thomas said about Jordan he said about Barlow and that's all you hear on Kevan now in the bay area, he got his contract and he's just so content now that he doesn't care. That would be my fear on Jordan, give him the money and he'll never be the same again, but I don't know enough about him to know if that's true.
he's an absolute beast of a talent though.
chickenhead
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I watch the Jets nearly every week. I'd take a look at Jordan, but if he wants starter money I wouldn't give it him.
kerouac9
Klowned by Keim
chickenhead said:
You wouldn't give him starter money to be a starter? Wow, sounds like a nice deal.
I'd pay him whatever Kevan Barlow is making. He should probably get Top 10 or 15 RB money.
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kerouac9 said:
5 years 20 million, 1.5 bonus with a 6 million option according to the day he was signed.
Not sure Jordan will get that much Barlow DID gain 1000 yards last year as a part time starter to earn his contract.
kerouac9
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Russ Smith said:
That's true. All that being said, I'd offer 5 years, $18 million, and a $1.2 million SB with a team option, or something. Barlow hasn't delivered on his contract yet, but I think that Jordan could easily be as good.
brandon
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D-Dogg said:
I have to disagree. I defend Shipp not because I saw his stats but because when I was listening/watching a game, he pleasantly surprised me- he seemed to come out of nowhere. I just keep thinking that because of Smith's age, Shipp should be there. Shipp hasn't been given a real chance yet. A real chance meaning starting him at RB- he deserves it. I know he's on IR, but if he was healthy, I still would feel uneasy seeing Emmitt out there more. Every time Shipp got the ball...it would be a strong gain it seemed. However, with Emmitt, it's more like a 1yrd run, 2yrd run, 1 yrd run, than a big one. Shipp just has more consistency. Shipp may not have speed, but speed is certainly NOT the determining factor, although a big one, in how good a RB is- Emmitt's having a hell of a season and is he fast now?
BTW, what seem to be the best RB's coming in for next year's draft- I only pay attention to UVA football when it comes to college
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