How about Matt

[Bobcat]

Warner's "zip" is for 5 6 yds. and he STILL throws behind the DB. His receivers make him. LeinART is different, look at the two passes to Breaston. Breaston didn't have to spread out, they were on the money. AND, I'll bet YOU money, when it does come to "zip", after some playing time ,the kid shows you, he's got it all. Cutler-coach fired, Farve-coach fired, C'mon, wake up and die right! I didn't want this to be a pissin contest. Does the kid have a ways to go, yea. But don't dare try to use my own words against me. I've studied philosophy also. I'm just saying, the kids got more than we've seen. AND, no one can deny, Kurt looks really weak at times. If he isn't on,put the kid in!

My god after 9 years on this forum we finally agree either one of us is getting wiser or we are both on the same page. Could this be true only time will tell.

BOBCAT

 

[vince56]

So Plummer could do one thing better than Warner. Big whoop! Lets get two things straight.
Kurt Warner > Jake Plummer
and
Kurt Warner > Matt Leinart

Our situation is a lot like Green Bay's was last year. Brett Favre left and they missed the playoffs. If Kurt Warner leaves, this team might miss the playoffs next year. JMO Here's hoping he wants to play here for two more years.

you totally missed Donald's joke.

 

[cardsfanmd]

Rogers had a better year than Favre. Their dropoff in defense is the main reason they are not in the playoffs.

 

[IAWarnerFan]

Rogers had a better year than Favre. Their dropoff in defense is the main reason they are not in the playoffs.

No, compare Favre last year to Rodgers this year. Favre had a better season in 2007 than Rodgers did this year.

 

[IAWarnerFan]

Anyways thus far
Aaron Rodgers > Matt Leinart

Aaron Rodgers career QB rating is 91.8 compared to a QB rating of 71.7 for Matt Leinart. No comparison really Leinart's QB rating for this year was 80.2.

 

[BradMannTX]

Leinart was put in the game Sunday with one directive: make sure Steve Breaston gets more than 85 yards receiving to put him over 1000 for the year. I'm sure he was staring him down each passing snap.

 

[azmike74]

Jake Plummer is way better at that than Kurt Warner....

you totally missed Donald's joke.

Ever since Donald referenced the ass grabbing, all these guys talking about Matt's "frozen ropes" have just sparked the crude humor in me. I've really got to get my mind out of the gutter, but damn, it makes me want to photoshop the beer bong photo of Matt something fierce.

 

[Cheesebeef]

So Plummer could do one thing better than Warner. Big whoop! Lets get two things straight.
Kurt Warner > Jake Plummer
and
Kurt Warner > Matt Leinart

Our situation is a lot like Green Bay's was last year. Brett Favre left and they missed the playoffs. If Kurt Warner leaves, this team might miss the playoffs next year. JMO Here's hoping he wants to play here for two more years.

and who's better set up for the future? The Jets or the Packers? And correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Brett lead his team to a 13-3 record and the NFC Title game? I'm pretty sure we just had a 9-7 record and are playoff underdogs at home.

And surprise, surprise, Brett looked completely finished at the end of the season this year... kind of like someone else who plays for the Cardinals. In that way, they do look similar. Old guys continue to get older.

 

[IAWarnerFan]

and who's better set up for the future? The Jets or the Packers? And correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Brett lead his team to a 13-3 record and the NFC Title game? I'm pretty sure we just had a 9-7 record and are playoff underdogs at home.

And surprise, surprise, Brett looked completely finished at the end of the season this year... kind of like someone else who plays for the Cardinals. In that way, they do look similar. Old guys continue to get older.

Who finished with a better record the happless Jets or the team that went 13-3 last year, hmm?

 

[Cheesebeef]

Who finished with a better record the happless Jets or the team that went 13-3 last year, hmm?

if we were talking about one year as opposed to the long-term health of a franchise maybe you'd have a point here... or if the Jets actually even made the playoffs this year, maybe you'd have a point here... or if the Jets didn't just have their HC fired because their over the hill QB completely flamed out as the season went on, you'd have a point here, but they didn't. They mortgaged their future for an aging QB who had a miraculous 1st half of a season last year and then tailed off in the second half and then we saw the same exact thing happen this season on a different team and now the Jets have no coach, have lost draft picks and that QB is threatening to retire... all for what? To be mediocre? No thanks to that. That's EXACTLY the scenario that I'm afraid of.

Now, if you look at the Packers, what do you have? Did they take a step back this year? Sure, but it wasn't because of their QB play as Rodgers had just as many TDs, fewer turnovers and comparable numbers everywhere. I mean, it couldn't be that the Pack were worse this year because their D which was ranked 6th last year was ranked 22nd this year, right? No, that couldn't be. Here's the bottom line for the Pack - their D sucked and was ravaged by injuries but their offense was just as good as last year and it's younger so they solidified their future at the most important position on the field - at QB. I mean, what if the Pack let Favre stay and he did what he (and all QBs his age do) did this season and Rogers then walked? They would have been completely screwed for the future and been mediocre in the present. I have no desire to continue being mediocre.

 

[IAWarnerFan]

if we were talking about one year as opposed to the long-term health of a franchise maybe you'd have a point here... or if the Jets actually even made the playoffs this year, maybe you'd have a point here... or if the Jets didn't just have their HC fired because their over the hill QB completely flamed out as the season went on, you'd have a point here, but they didn't. They mortgaged their future for an aging QB who had a miraculous 1st half of a season last year and then tailed off in the second half and then we saw the same exact thing happen this season on a different team and now the Jets have no coach, have lost draft picks and that QB is threatening to retire... all for what? To be mediocre? No thanks to that. That's EXACTLY the scenario that I'm afraid of.

Now, if you look at the Packers, what do you have? Did they take a step back this year? Sure, but it wasn't because of their QB play as Rodgers had just as many TDs, fewer turnovers and comparable numbers everywhere. I mean, it couldn't be that the Pack were worse this year because their D which was ranked 6th last year was ranked 22nd this year, right? No, that couldn't be. Here's the bottom line for the Pack - their D sucked and was ravaged by injuries but their offense was just as good as last year and it's younger so they solidified their future at the most important position on the field - at QB. I mean, what if the Pack let Favre stay and he did what he (and all QBs his age do) did this season and Rogers then walked? They would have been completely screwed for the future and been mediocre in the present. I have no desire to continue being mediocre.

I'm honestly not going to read that whole thing, but they finished 9-7 and were in a tough division. The Packers were 6-10 in a fairly week NFC North. Therefore the Jets were a boarderline playoff team. I don't know their whole story, but I was sorta shocked that their HC was actually fired. They did have an improved season this year.

 

[moklerman]

Favre looked old because he has a torn biceps tendon in his throwing arm.

And the first hint of a running game and a defense that actually made some stops and Warner put up 4 TD's and a 117 rating.

Anyone who acts like Warner is the one who's been fading isn't being honest about how bad and non-existant the running game and defense and special teams have been.

 

[IAWarnerFan]

Favre looked old because he has a torn biceps tendon in his throwing arm.

And the first hint of a running game and a defense that actually made some stops and Warner put up 4 TD's and a 117 rating.

Anyone who acts like Warner is the one who's been fading isn't being honest about how bad and non-existant the running game and defense and special teams have been.

Exactly!

 

[Cheesebeef]

Favre looked old because he has a torn biceps tendon in his throwing arm.

And the first hint of a running game and a defense that actually made some stops and Warner put up 4 TD's and a 117 rating.

Anyone who acts like Warner is the one who's been fading isn't being honest about how bad and non-existant the running game and defense and special teams have been.

no way! Warner played well against the dregs of the league? I'm sure that had nothing to do with him putting up those numbers (while still having two turnovers again).

The D, the running game AND Warner all looked like crap the majority of the 2nd half of the season. Or do you think it's just a coincidence that the D plays well when the QB plays well. The D and O have a symbiotic relationship with each other.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I'm honestly not going to read that whole thing, but they finished 9-7 and were in a tough division. The Packers were 6-10 in a fairly week NFC North. Therefore the Jets were a boarderline playoff team.

and you make my point perfectly for me. The Jets mortgaged their future for a borderline playoff team, in other words, they mortgaged their future for mediocrity and now their coach is fired and they have no future to speak of. I don't want the Cardinals to be in that same position by doing the same thing.

On the other hand, the Pack got younger and found out that their O could be just as good with Rodgers as it was with Brett and they don't have to worry about the most important position on the field for another 5-10 years. Their offense (ranked #6 in the league) isn't what made them fall this year, it was their D which was injury ravaged and went from #6 to #22 this year which is what did them in.

Maybe you'll read this this time and respond rather than just give a thumbs up to Mokler who was conspicuously absent when Warner (and the rest of the team) looked like absolutely dog-meat against any team with a pulse the 2nd half of the season.

I don't know their whole story, but I was sorta shocked that their HC was actually fired. They did have an improved season this year.

and what's their outlook for next season? try thinking more than one season at a time (or maybe reading what I wrote considering if you want to have a conversation).

 

[IAWarnerFan]

no way! Warner played well against the dregs of the league? I'm sure that had nothing to do with him putting up those numbers (while still having two turnovers again).

The D, the running game AND Warner all looked like crap the majority of the 2nd half of the season. Or do you think it's just a coincidence that the D plays well when the QB plays well. The D and O have a symbiotic relationship with each other.

Face facts! Our O-Line was manhandled by the better D-Lines of the league and that will have an effect on any QBs performance. Kurt Warner is still the great QB he always was and probably will be again next year if he still wants to play.

 

[IAWarnerFan]

and you make my point perfectly for me. The Jets mortgaged their future for a borderline playoff team, in other words, they mortgaged their future for mediocrity and now their coach is fired and they have no future to speak of. I don't want the Cardinals to be in that same position by doing the same thing.

On the other hand, the Pack got younger and found out that their O could be just as good with Rodgers as it was with Brett and they don't have to worry about the most important position on the field for another 5-10 years. Their offense (ranked #6 in the league) isn't what made them fall this year, it was their D which was injury ravaged and went from #6 to #22 this year which is what did them in.

Maybe you'll read this this time and respond rather than just give a thumbs up to Mokler who was conspicuously absent when Warner (and the rest of the team) looked like absolutely dog-meat against any team with a pulse the 2nd half of the season.



and what's their outlook for next season? try thinking more than one season at a time (or maybe reading what I wrote considering if you want to have a conversation).

What makes you so sure that Matt Leinart can do great things if he was the captain of this team? How do you know what the future really holds for the Green Bay Packers? They went 6-10 this year. What makes you so sure the Jets won't go 9-7 or better next year?

 

[moklerman]

no way! Warner played well against the dregs of the league? I'm sure that had nothing to do with him putting up those numbers (while still having two turnovers again).

4 TD's in 3 quarters is pretty good no matter the competition and the point is, he isn't the one who was getting tired or hitting the wall. The o-line and defense completely got exposed and victimized and there was no way for Warner to continue his first 10 games pace with those two units, not to mention the running game, being even LESS effective than they had been up to that point.

I know you'll read that as "Warner is blameless" but from what I saw, the o-line and defense were clearly what led to the offense's ineffectiveness. Not Warner getting tired or being too old.

Warner had just enough time to make the offense work the first 10 games but when that time to throw was greatly reduced, I don't see how he could be expected to keep up the pace he had been on. Not to mention taking James out of the equation. I think most of us thought his 3.2 ypc wasn't good enough but it was obviously pivotal to the success of the offense.

I don't want the Cardinals to be in that same position by doing the same thing.

The Cardinals wouldn't be signing a new QB. They would be re-signing their current QB of almost 2 full years. As far as the Jets, it was time for Pennington to move on anyway and Clemens was never the future. Favre may or may not be back but the Jets are hardly looking at bleak times. They still have a good running game/o-line and pretty good defense. They won't have trouble finding a decent QB if they have to get a new one.

On the other hand, the Pack got younger and found out that their O could be just as good with Rodgers as it was with Brett and they don't have to worry about the most important position on the field for another 5-10 years.

I wonder how many Packers fans take solice in that fact? I'd be willing to be that most of them would have rather had a Favre swan song if they were going to only win 6 games anyway. Whether or not Rodgers could have waited one more year, that offense is good enough that it wouldn't have had to worry about the QB spot whichever way Favre chose to leave. Rodgers if fine but if Favre had stayed and then retired this year then the Pack would be just as good picking up Derek Anderson, etc.

Maybe you'll read this this time and respond rather than just give a thumbs up to Mokler who was conspicuously absent when Warner (and the rest of the team) looked like absolutely dog-meat against any team with a pulse the 2nd half of the season.

Care to ask me where I was? I'm sure you'd rather go with your assumption but you're sadly mistaken if you think I wasn't around just because the TEAM....repeat TEAM was struggling.

 

[D-Dogg]

I'm honestly not going to read that whole thing,

That says a lot, and it isn't good.

 

[D-Dogg]

and you make my point perfectly for me. The Jets mortgaged their future for a borderline playoff team, in other words, they mortgaged their future for mediocrity and now their coach is fired and they have no future to speak of. I don't want the Cardinals to be in that same position by doing the same thing.

On the other hand, the Pack got younger and found out that their O could be just as good with Rodgers as it was with Brett and they don't have to worry about the most important position on the field for another 5-10 years. Their offense (ranked #6 in the league) isn't what made them fall this year, it was their D which was injury ravaged and went from #6 to #22 this year which is what did them in.

Maybe you'll read this this time and respond rather than just give a thumbs up to Mokler who was conspicuously absent when Warner (and the rest of the team) looked like absolutely dog-meat against any team with a pulse the 2nd half of the season.



and what's their outlook for next season? try thinking more than one season at a time (or maybe reading what I wrote considering if you want to have a conversation).

I don't want to speak for cheese here, but I don't want people to think that's what he'd expect starting Leinart next season would bring. I think he for SURE leans that way, or at least that we'd know if we were set at QB for 5-10 years, but he doesn't expect us to be in the least.

He can correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think I am.

 

[IAWarnerFan]

That says a lot, and it isn't good.

My mind goes blury if I have to read long paragraphs like those two. Maybe it's a mental disfunction or something.

 

[moklerman]

or at least that we'd know if we were set at QB for 5-10 years

Other than the Packers, Colts and Eagles are there any teams that have had 5+ years of productivity/solidity from the QB position? If you're waiting for a Favre, Manning or even McNabb to happen for the Cardinals look at the other 28 teams in the league. Most have drafted a QB in recent years at some point or another and I don't see many examples that would warrant replacing 3,500-4,500 yards and 27-30 TD's.

Maybe Leinart steps in and replicates what Warner has done but isn't that a huge risk? Warner has done it time and again throughout his career and for the past two years. Leinart never has and hasn't been able to stay healthy.

Yes, Warner may only last two more years but that would likely be four years worth of really solid production overall and most teams would be happy with that.

 

[Evil Ash]

So Plummer could do one thing better than Warner. Big whoop! Lets get two things straight.
Kurt Warner > Jake Plummer
and
Kurt Warner > Matt Leinart

Our situation is a lot like Green Bay's was last year. Brett Favre left and they missed the playoffs. If Kurt Warner leaves, this team might miss the playoffs next year. JMO Here's hoping he wants to play here for two more years.

The Packers missed the playoffs due to a horrid defense and special teams play. It had nothing to do with the QB. As a result of giving up on an aging Brett Favre they got a 2nd rounder to fix those blunders (and since the Jets missed the playoffs and Brett may retire AGAIN this year, they gave up a valuable pick for nothing).

Thats the thing, you have to look past just the QB position. With the cap space freed from letting an aging QB whose best days are likely behind him, we can spend it on other areas that this team needs such as pass rushers and Olinemen.

Leinart had a good training camp and was in a very close competition with Warner. Coaches said it, media said it, and even numerous posters here said it - if you'd like me to look it up I will. It not this "ZOMG Warner PWNED Leinart" crap that Warner fans want to spew out. I'm not worried about the future of the QB position.

I'm grateful for Warner has brought to our team this year. However, he's shown that he canNOT handle a full season playing at a consistent level and he's not getting any younger. Its simply time to move on. If he wants to comeback as a backup then so be it. If not then I hope he does well in whatever he does outside of football in case he retires or whatever team he signs on with (Minnesota?) except when he plays the Cardinals.

 

[IAWarnerFan]

The Packers missed the playoffs due to a horrid defense and special teams play. It had nothing to do with the QB. As a result of giving up on an aging Brett Favre they got a 2nd rounder to fix those blunders (and since the Jets missed the playoffs and Brett may retire AGAIN this year, they gave up a valuable pick for nothing).

Thats the thing, you have to look past just the QB position. With the cap space freed from letting an aging QB whose best days are likely behind him, we can spend it on other areas that this team needs such as pass rushers and Olinemen.

Leinart had a good training camp and was in a very close competition with Warner. Coaches said it, media said it, and even numerous posters here said it - if you'd like me to look it up I will. It not this "ZOMG Warner PWNED Leinart" crap that Warner fans want to spew out. I'm not worried about the future of the QB position.

I'm grateful for Warner has brought to our team this year. However, he's shown that he canNOT handle a full season playing at a consistent level and he's not getting any younger. Its simply time to move on. If he wants to comeback as a backup then so be it. If not then I hope he does well in whatever he does outside of football in case he retires or whatever team he signs on with (Minnesota?) except when he plays the Cardinals.

The games that Warner has struggled the most in are also the games where the O-Line has struggled and that's no coincidence. It doesn't matter who you have at QB if the O-Line is getting battered by your opponents D-Line. Your QB is going to struggle and may even get injured. We're very fortunate that with some of the hits Warner has been taking that he hasn't been injured.

If he comes back, making him the backup would be an insult and disrespecful. If the Cardinals don't want him I'm certain somone else will. You don't make a Pro Bowl starter a backup.

 

[Evil Ash]

The Cardinals wouldn't be signing a new QB. They would be re-signing their current QB of almost 2 full years.

We need more than a QB. The money for his contract could be spent elsewhere.

As far as the Jets, it was time for Pennington to move on anyway and Clemens was never the future.

Pennington is playing in the playoffs and Favre may or may not be back this year. It didn't help them enough this year and may have screwed up their future.

Favre may or may not be back but the Jets are hardly looking at bleak times. They still have a good running game/o-line and pretty good defense.

Can't argue that

They won't have trouble finding a decent QB if they have to get a new one.

You're kidding right? Have you seen the QB play around the league?

I wonder how many Packers fans take solice in that fact? I'd be willing to be that most of them would have rather had a Favre swan song if they were going to only win 6 games anyway.

Actually quite a few Packer fans were tired of Favre and his act. They got a bonus 2nd rounder for a guy that was simply a distraction. He collapsed down the stretch partially due to his age (seems familiar somehow).

They can improve themselves due to the fact that they MOVED ON. Just like we can improve ourselves by moving on by not spending big money on a QB whose best days have past him and spending that money elsewhere (Oline and OLB).