I told you so. O

[bk3000]

Many of you got mad when I told you all about nine months ago that Budenholzer would make no difference, that the problem was with the Suns personnel and not the coaching. I said you have three mid-range jump shooters as your main cogs, and that two of those guys, your superstars, sulk and chide their teammates when they don't get enough shots. The whole team chemistry is awful, both on the court and off. Good players such as Crowder, Ayton and Nurkic have been run off by the terrible attitudes and selfishness of the "stars." I am not saying Crowder, Ayton and Nurkic are great players, but they can help play roles with a good and team-oriented roster. This team is going nowhere with the players it has its core.

 

[ProdigalSun]

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[SirStefan32]

I know this board is a bit different than your average fan site, and you seem relatively new, so let me just say this:
We know, man. Most (probably 90%) of us here have been around for a long time, and we have all been wrong dozens of time. We have said we've been wrong dozens of time. Hell, I've been around so long that I wanted the Suns to draft Nikoloz Tskitishvilli over Amare Stoudemire. Telling me I was wrong about Frank being the problem instead of the players isn't telling me anything new or anything I haven't said already. I am betting that 90% of the board relates and can say something similar.

Congrats on being right!

 

[Cheesebeef]

Congratulations!

 

[1tinsoldier]

Many of you got mad when I told you all about nine months ago that Budenholzer would make no difference, that the problem was with the Suns personnel and not the coaching. I said you have three mid-range jump shooters as your main cogs, and that two of those guys, your superstars, sulk and chide their teammates when they don't get enough shots. The whole team chemistry is awful, both on the court and off. Good players such as Crowder, Ayton and Nurkic have been run off by the terrible attitudes and selfishness of the "stars." I am not saying Crowder, Ayton and Nurkic are great players, but they can help play roles with a good and team-oriented roster. This team is going nowhere with the players it has its core.

BK, i copied your post to the Booker Non-Appreciation thread because this can be an inhospitable place for critical thinkers

 

[Hoop Head]

Are you interested in joining in a community of Suns fans to talk about the Suns or did you just want to gloat about being right when there was little pushback on that claim you made initially? That's a serious question. No one here claims they're always correct and most admit when they're wrong but I think we all root for the Suns to win over our bleak predictions coming true. I thought Ayton would be better than Embiid before his rookie contract and become a modern day Shaq to Booker's Kobe while leading the Suns to championships. Before that I was convinced Josh Jackson would be a Pippen like franchise player and would definitely have a better career than Tatum. That's just a couple of things I've been ridiculously wrong about.

However I believe witnessing the Suns succeed feels a lot better than saying "I told you so". Maybe others feel different, I'd imagine most here agree though. We all make predictions about how things will play out, that's part of being a dedicated sports fan. You aren't wrong to do so. I'm not sure what you gain from gloating about being right though considering you've posted here 4 times before today and received very little pushback, most agreed to varying degrees since you didn't stick around to expand or elaborate whether you felt he was free from blame entirely or not. He wasn't the primary problem and I don't think anyone believes he was, especially now. The others who shared similar beliefs then, or disagreed, didn't vanish for almost a year though before returning and trying to take a victory lap like you are doing.

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[bk3000]

I don't go on this site a lot because I am busy. I came back this time because what I predicted, and what I was castigated for, came true. I don't think it is gloating. I just think Suns fans need to take a critical look at their team rather than getting on the same bandwagon with the same band over and over. The Suns need to totally revamp their roster, even if it means getting rid of their longtime "superstar," who is the source of a lot of the team dysfunction.

 

[1982baskets]

I guess it was just easy to blame the head coach at the time. Even though the same head coach like Bud had won a title and put forth an elite defense.

Nevermind if you look back to a year ago, the role players like Nurk/Grayson are all playing much better. If you then consider how few games Beal played with Durant/Booker, it is even more impressive we won 49 games and had a good enough defense to stay competitive.

It was a real shame what we did to Vogel. He did a much better job with a flawed poorly set up team that had an injury prone big 3. No point guard.

We've given Bud more, changed the roster a bit for bigs he needs, Beal has been willing to come off the bench, so many changes for Bud. Should show the owner that it's not the coaches fault. If it were some rookie coach, ok. This was a coach who like Bud had won a ring at one spot and built another contender at a stop in Indiana.

I never bought in that coaching was the problem. Each coach will bring you some positives and negatives. No coach is perfect. Clearly even though the organization believed in Bud, we're seeing it's the same thing with him. He has improved some of the sets on offense but overall the team is playing worse. They're worse defensively and they're having much of the same road blocks.

 

[CardNots]

I don't go on this site a lot because I am busy. I came back this time because what I predicted, and what I was castigated for, came true. I don't think it is gloating. I just think Suns fans need to take a critical look at their team rather than getting on the same bandwagon with the same band over and over. The Suns need to totally revamp their roster, even if it means getting rid of their longtime "superstar," who is the source of a lot of the team dysfunction.

You are busy?

 

[Ronin]

I’m going to keep my eye on this thread. I got a feeling that nothing good is going to come out of this thread. Oof

 

[BirdGangThing]

tyus beal book kd nurk

morris greyson oneale bol bol plum

i thought these rotations would see a lot more time together but i was wrong dot com - nurk got budnished - bol bol got left on the shelf shelf - this changed everything and everybody's responsibilities - responsibilities everybody still hasn't figured out according to book last night (who turned it over more than a black jack dealer)

book's mentioning physicality and i agree with him - just wished he would've figured this out 3 seasons ago

 

[Chaplin]

I’m going to keep my eye on this thread. I got a feeling that nothing good is going to come out of this thread. Oof

Isn't that describing pretty much all threads nowadays?

 

[1tinsoldier]

I don't go on this site a lot because I am busy. I came back this time because what I predicted, and what I was castigated for, came true. I don't think it is gloating. I just think Suns fans need to take a critical look at their team rather than getting on the same bandwagon with the same band over and over. The Suns need to totally revamp their roster, even if it means getting rid of their longtime "superstar," who is the source of a lot of the team dysfunction.

even if you were gloating, i say, power to you! i'm not so insecure that i can't handle you being right and me being wrong.

bragging rights is at the root of why people play sports and why they watch sports

and if you can't enjoy being right on a sports talk forum, why waste the time?

isn't that EXACTLY what sports gambling is?
no one is betting on sports because it's a good source of income
they're betting to be rewarded for strategizing better than the opponents betting against them
IT'S THE SPORT IN THE SPORT
and is entertaining -- as long as it's respectful

what isn't entertaining is pouncing on a newbie for out-of-the-box thinking even if it includes an "i told you so" once in a while

 

[elindholm]

I know this board is a bit different than your average fan site, and you seem relatively new, so let me just say this:
We know, man. Most (probably 90%) of us here have been around for a long time, and we have all been wrong dozens of time. We have said we've been wrong dozens of time. Hell, I've been around so long that I wanted the Suns to draft Nikoloz Tskitishvilli over Amare Stoudemire. Telling me I was wrong about Frank being the problem instead of the players isn't telling me anything new or anything I haven't said already. I am betting that 90% of the board relates and can say something similar.

Congrats on being right!

I understand that attitude. But there are some on this board (not you) who repeatedly insist that they are right, up until the moment when it becomes obvious that they aren't. They might say "I was wrong last time," but never follow it up with "So I will be less abrasive and dismissive next time."

I would love it if I ever saw someone post, "Over the years, I've come to recognize that I'm not always as smart as I think I am, so I will become less hostile in shouting down alternate viewpoints, because I've learned that I might later be proven wrong." But that never happens.

Everything bad has stemmed from the Durant trade, and yet there is still a contingent on this board who keeps saying that it's not as bad as it looks, because "Ishbia will spend enough to stay competitive" or some other rationalization. Guess what: The Suns are about to give up their first lottery pick, years earlier than anyone foresaw, and the bill for the Durant trade is only just starting to come due.

So I say, gloat all you want. The only silver lining to any of this is that some of us saw it coming.

 

[Hoop Head]

I don't go on this site a lot because I am busy. I came back this time because what I predicted, and what I was castigated for, came true. I don't think it is gloating. I just think Suns fans need to take a critical look at their team rather than getting on the same bandwagon with the same band over and over. The Suns need to totally revamp their roster, even if it means getting rid of their longtime "superstar," who is the source of a lot of the team dysfunction.

I'm sorry you weren't welcomed or respected more initially. Life on Planet Orange hasn't been pleasant for a while now, as I'm sure you understand.

I think you'd see a lot us, definitely the majority, share the view that the issues with the Suns go far beyond the coach. I'm also sorry you felt unfairly challenged for pointing something out before it was a commonly held belief. If you would have stuck around though and engaged I believe you would have seen some shared your view back then or respected it more the more you elaborated. From what I saw scrolling through your previous comments, you were asked a number of questions regarding your stance but didn't stick around to answer them. That's why I asked if you are looking to become part of this community or drive by gloat.

As you can see by most user join dates here, most of us have been here a long time and are used to challenging positions we each state but I can see how that's off putting to a new user to get caught up in.

Take your victory lap, you called it, and I'm not disputing that. I hope you stick around to engage further because you'll see that there are a number who share your views or at least are willing to discuss them with you civilly. Maybe your next lap will be sweeter if you get to know who else is here.

 

[bk3000]

Thanks. I will be back... when I can