If the 2006 Draft was held today?

[Billy Flynt]

Yes 2006. If both Leinart and Vince Young are on the board and you are on the clock, knowing what they have both done so far, who would you choose?

The remarkable thing is they have roughly the same passer stats:

ML:
Yards-2171
Comp %-56.2
yd/att-6.60
TDs-10
INT-10
Rating-73.9

VY:
Yards-1704
Comp %-51.7
yd/att-5.96
TDs-10
INT-11
Rating-65.7

To me, it comes down to VY's legs compared to ML's head.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

To me, it comes down to VY's legs compared to ML's head.

I would much rather have a fundamentally sound QB, than one with scrambling ability.

I wouldn't even think twice about it either.

 

[D-Dogg]

I would take Matt's mind over Vince's legs every day of the week, every hour of the day, every minute of the hour and every second of the minute.

Not even a question. No debate.

End of story.

 

[Divide Et Impera]

Oops. I rushed through this. I misread the question as "Who would be taken first?" and I believe Young would be chosen first, so I voted for Young. Personally, I would still choose Leinart, so switch one No vote for a Yes vote....

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Oops. I rushed through this. I misread the question as "Who would be taken first?" and I believe Young would be chosen first, so I voted for Young. Personally, I would still choose Leinart, so switch one No vote for a Yes vote....

It is hard to imagine that VY would have been the more "vogue" pick over Hollywood Leinart, but he was. That said, I would have taken Cutler over Young as well. The Vick's, and (early career) McNabb's of the NFL cannot lead their teams to the promise land.

 

[Pariah]

I'd still take lienart. Young's upside seems limited to me (based on historical ciellings of freakishly good running QBs, ie. Vick), I think Lienart has a chance to be good enough to take someone to the superbowl.

 

[Duckjake]

It is hard to imagine that VY would have been the more "vogue" pick over Hollywood Leinart, but he was. That said, I would have taken Cutler over Young as well. The Vick's, and (early career) McNabb's of the NFL cannot lead their teams to the promise land.

McNabb's 2nd year in the league the Eagles were 11-5, second round of the playoffs. Years 3,4,5 they made it to the NFC Championship game. Year 6 they lose by 3 to New England in the Super Bowl.

That would be plenty of promised land for me.

Can you image how exciting it would be around here if the Cards went 59-21 over the next 5 years!

I would much rather have a fundamentally sound QB, than one with scrambling ability.

Vince doesn't scramble, he runs. Plummer scrambled.

As for which QB to take: either one. But if you look at it you see that each guy really ended up in the right place.

 

[Russ Smith]

It'll sound funny since my caveat on Matt has always been his health, but I'd take Matt because the way Young plays you have to worry if he'll stay healthy. He's a different guy than Vick but when you run that much you take a pounding, VIck is always nicked up, I suspect Young will have that too despite being quite a bit bigger than Vick.

Both great talents I just think VY's style of play is higher risk for injury.

 

[Dback Jon]

Leinart, no doubt.

Of course, if you put this poll up on Titans-online MB, the results would be exact opposite, so both teams scored well.

 

[kerouac9]

I'd still take lienart. Young's upside seems limited to me (based on historical ciellings of freakishly good running QBs, ie. Vick), I think Lienart has a chance to be good enough to take someone to the superbowl.

What about Elway and Steve Young?

 

[Pariah]

What about Elway and Steve Young?

They weren't exactly "freakishly" good runners, were they? And, for the most part, when they found their championship success they were more scramblers than runners.

If you want to bring up Fran Tarkenten, then you might have a point.

 

[Russ Smith]

They weren't exactly "freakishly" good runners, were they? And, for the most part, when they found their championship success they were more scramblers than runners.

If you want to bring up Fran Tarkenten, then you might have a point.

Steve young was a better runner than Vince Young at one point, 5 years over 400 yards rushing, some of the most amazing runs by a QB in NFL history(that one against the Vikings where his helmet came off).

Elway could run before he hurt his knee but he hurt it pretty early in his NFL career.

Steve Young was a much more accurate passer than Vince though, not even close.

 

[Pariah]

5 years over 400 yards rushing, ...
Steve Young was a much more accurate passer than Vince though, not even close.

I'd wager that Vince Young will make 400 yards rushing over 5 years look pedestrian, much the way Vick has. I'm not disputing Steve Young's ability to run, but as you mentioned, his arm was far more of a weapon than his feet.

Maybe VY will get to that point to. I think it's a possibility, but if he does then it's his arm that gets him to the HoF, not his feet.

 

[Russ Smith]

I'd wager that Vince Young will make 400 yards rushing over 5 years look pedestrian, much the way Vick has. I'm not disputing Steve Young's ability to run, but as you mentioned, his arm was far more of a weapon than his feet.

Maybe VY will get to that point to. I think it's a possibility, but if he does then it's his arm that gets him to the HoF, not his feet.

I think you forget the early years where people said young was a RB playing QB. Shanahan was the one that convinced him he'd never be good if he didn't become a good pocket passer.

Young looks headed for 600+ this year but I'm betting his career looks a lot like McNabb in that after about 5 years he'll start to run a lot less to protect himself. that's pretty much the norm outside of Vick who's topped 600 3 times already and had another year of 597.

We'll see, Vince is an amazing athlete, but I do wonder if he can stay healthy running this much.

 

[Pariah]

I think you forget the early years where people said young was a RB playing QB. Shanahan was the one that convinced him he'd never be good if he didn't become a good pocket passer.

And Shannahan was right.

Again, I'm not disputing that he was a talented runner, just that his greatness came form his ability to scramble and throw, not run.

Right now, VY is showing he can win with his feet. I'm not convinced he can become the passer Young was. Maybe he can--he's a phenomenal athlete. But I'd put my money on Leinart ultimately being the better QB because we know he can pass.

 

[Gambit]

I like what VY has done for the Titans, but I still go with Matt. I think his (Young's) bad habits of forcing throws will catch up with him. Also I believe that Ds will adjust to him and he will not be as effective in the future. Matt will have the better career long term.

I was wrong before about VY though, so who knows.

 

[Gambit]

As for which QB to take: either one. But if you look at it you see that each guy really ended up in the right place.

That I agree with wholeheartedly. It will be fun watching both of these guys grow up in the league.

 

[Duckjake]

We'll see, Vince is an amazing athlete, but I do wonder if he can stay healthy running this much.

Two weeks ago Young took a helmet to helmet hit that was penalized for being late. Shook it off and took his team in for the win.

Last week a DB hit him as he crossed into the end zone and just BOUNCED OFF!

Young is so big and doesn't try to make the hard cuts that get guys hurt running so he'll probably last.

But I'd put my money on Leinart ultimately being the better QB because we know he can pass.

We do?

13-32 203 yards 2 INT's Oakland
14-35 157 yards 1 INT Green Bay
20-38 216 yards 2 INT's Dallas
19-29 233 yards Detroit
15-24 186 yards St.Louis
21-34 232 yards 1 INT* Seattle

Looks like Leinart can't pass very well at all if he's not playing the Vikings.



Just kidding.

 

[Russ Smith]

And Shannahan was right.

Again, I'm not disputing that he was a talented runner, just that his greatness came form his ability to scramble and throw, not run.

Right now, VY is showing he can win with his feet. I'm not convinced he can become the passer Young was. Maybe he can--he's a phenomenal athlete. But I'd put my money on Leinart ultimately being the better QB because we know he can pass.

Agreed, as I've argued here many times, at his peak IMHO Young was the best QB I've ever seen, better than Elway, Montana, Manning, Plummer you name it.

 

[Skkorpion]

Vince doesn't scramble, he runs. Plummer scrambled.

As for which QB to take: either one. But if you look at it you see that each guy really ended up in the right place.

I disagree Duck. Houston had the first pick and should have taken VY for many reasons.

Vince is already a very good passer and will improve over time. So he throws sidearm a bit. Big deal. The guy is a real NFL talent. He finds ways to win and can make every throw. His touch is better than most admit.

Cutler improved tremendously too in his second start, putting a scare into San Diego. He's capable of beating us here with his deep strikes and good run game.

Leinart may be the best field general of the bunch.

All three may have what it takes to win super bowls. VY is a Steve Young type. Cutler is a Bret Favre type gunslinger. Leinart is a Tom Brady type.

If the draft were held today, my guess is the three would be the first three picks chosen. They are that good.

 

[SECTION 11]

better than Elway, Montana, Manning, Plummer you name it.

lol!

 

[Russ Smith]

I
All three may have what it takes to win super bowls. VY is a Steve Young type. Cutler is a Bret Favre type gunslinger. Leinart is a Tom Brady type.

If the draft were held today, my guess is the three would be the first three picks chosen. They are that good.

The guy Leinart reminds me of and it's probably the lefty thing since physically he's much bigger, is Kenny Stabler. THere were years with Oakland and then I think the Saints where Stabler was hitting 60-65% when that was unheard of. Everyone said he just dinks and dunks, but like Matt, Stabler threw an incredibly catchable deep ball.

Just think how good he'll be when we get some Wr's used to the ball spining in the other direction?

 

[JasonKGME]

We do?

13-32 203 yards 2 INT's Oakland
14-35 157 yards 1 INT Green Bay
20-38 216 yards 2 INT's Dallas
19-29 233 yards Detroit
15-24 186 yards St.Louis
21-34 232 yards 1 INT* Seattle

Looks like Leinart can't pass very well at all if he's not playing the Vikings.



Just kidding.

This is why I love "stats" so much:

Guess Peyton Manning doesn't pass very well either:

20-30 166 yards 1 INT Tennessee
20-39 254 yards 2 INT Dallas
14-20 183 yards 1 INT Philadelphia
14-31 219 yards Jacksonville
27-39 236 yards Buffalo
25-41 276 yards 1 INT NY Giants


Leinarts totals for the 6 games: 102-192 1227 yards 6 INT
Mannings totals for the 6 games: 120-200 1334 yards 5 INT


And go figure, Manning has a running game, and has been in the league for 9 years and Matt is a rookie with a run game for only 2 games so far this year.

I <heart> Matt!

 

[Pariah]

Agreed, as I've argued here many times, at his peak IMHO Young was the best QB I've ever seen, better than Elway, Montana, Manning, Plummer you name it.

He's in the discussion, and I always include Young in my list of top-5 QBs, but I don't know I could say he was better than Elway or Manning.

 

[Russ Smith]

He's in the discussion, and I always include Young in my list of top-5 QBs, but I don't know I could say he was better than Elway or Manning.

Just at his peak which was about 5-7 years. Manning can not get a big first down with his legs like Young could. And Elway was never as efficient as Young, as accurate. I always felt John was a bit overrated although the argument is most of his career was wasted by Dan Reeves, and you can't argue with how well he played for Shanahan with the best run game around.

Obviously if Matt turns out half as good as any of those 3, I'll be thrilled.