Is it already time to consider Nkemdiche a bust?

[kerouac9]

This is by no way a belief that I have an statistical backing for, but there is a belief that special teams play can be attributed to your overall LB depth and talent. I never put a ton of weight to it, but our lack of depth a quality at LB has gone hand in hand with our decline in special teams play.

I think that RBs, TEs, and LBs are the bulk of your special teams. I actually blame Amos Jones less than most because if you look at our IR, there are a ton of these ILBs and TEs who should be playing special teams and contributing, but they're out for the year.

 

[cardncubfan]

The last two drafts were pretty poor. Got lucky with David Johnson and that's about it. The quickest way to nose dive as an organization is to miss in the draft. Need to stop reaching.

Yep

The 2015 draft has 5 starters on the team right now. DJ Hump, DJ, Golden, JJ Nelson, & Gunter. How many other teams that had winning records the previous year has 5 starters from last years draft?

 

[StreetTruckinTitan]

No. You gotta have to play first dont you? And preferably a full season or two.

 

[Stout]

Well, yes, he is what the pre draft worries said he was. I believe, like Humphries last year, the Cardinals thought they could coach him up. But, not every player wants to change, and Keim is seeing the result of so many projects taken in the draft. This is where Keim and Arians have to be on the same page. This all being said, when Nkemdiche has been on the field, he has not been anything special.

Still waiting for that coaching to kick in with Humpty Dumpty.

 

[kerouac9]

The 2015 draft has 5 starters on the team right now. DJ Hump, DJ, Golden, JJ Nelson, & Gunter. How many other teams that had winning records the previous year has 5 starters from last years draft?

Nelson and Gunter aren't starters on 31 other NFL teams, and I'm not sure Humphries starts for half the teams in the league or more.

 

[Brian]

Nelson and Gunter aren't starters on 31 other NFL teams, and I'm not sure Humphries starts for half the teams in the league or more.

Was just getting ready to say this exact thing.

 

[Stout]

Nelson and Gunter aren't starters on 31 other NFL teams, and I'm not sure Humphries starts for half the teams in the league or more.

+1

 

[Buckybird]

The 2015 draft has 5 starters on the team right now. DJ Hump, DJ, Golden, JJ Nelson, & Gunter. How many other teams that had winning records the previous year has 5 starters from last years draft?

Being a starter & making an impact are 2 different things aren't they? Only 2 of those listed has really contributed to winning. Don't make those 4 others players out to be more than they have been thus far & that's average Joes.

Hey I thought DJ was gonna be a helluva player & he's played pretty poor in pass pro. He looks more like Levi Clown each game. Golden has been a very good find, JJ has has 1 good game all year now has the dropsies & IMO Gunter isn't playing much or all that well when he does. #31 is a stud though.

You just can't keep reaching & missing on #1s like we have 2 years in a row. Those guys gotta be major contributors.

 

[kerouac9]

Being a starter & making an impact are 2 different things aren't they? Only 2 of those listed has really contributed to winning. Don't make those 4 others players out to be more than they have been thus far & that's average Joes.

Hey I thought DJ was gonna be a helluva player & he's played pretty poor in pass pro. He looks more like Levi Clown each game. Golden has been a very good find, JJ has has 1 good game all year now has the dropsies & IMO Gunter isn't playing much or all that well when he does. #31 is a stud though.

You just can't keep reaching & missing on #1s like we have 2 years in a row. Those guys gotta be major contributors.

And 3 out of the last 4 years. Yikes!

 

[Buckybird]

And 3 out of the last 4 years. Yikes!

Yep & that's not even counting busting on 2nd rounders in Mintor & Nickelglass. Ugh

Those 1st & 2nd rounders are what generally leads to winning or losing.

 

[oaken1]

Golden is a star... not quite a superstar,..but a star..and I think he will be better next year even.... dude is all motor and willingness to improve... would be nice to get a few more like that in the draft sometime.

 

[cardncubfan]

Nelson and Gunter aren't starters on 31 other NFL teams, and I'm not sure Humphries starts for half the teams in the league or more.

You state this as a fact but it's fiction because you have no way of knowing.

 

[Russ Smith]

Nelson and Gunter aren't starters on 31 other NFL teams, and I'm not sure Humphries starts for half the teams in the league or more.

Agreed on that, that they are starting is not a good job drafting but an indictment of us right now. Nelson to be fair is starting because John Brown is not right, Jaron Brown is hurt and Floyd is just not getting it done. But on a good NFL team JJ Nelson is no better than a 5th WR.

 

[kerouac9]

You state this as a fact but it's fiction because you have no way of knowing.

Sure I do. I can compare the way these players are performing against what I've seen from the other 31 teams in the league, and find them wanting. It's definitely true for J.J. Nelson, who immediately fell apart when elevated to the starting job. It's probably a little exaggerated for Gunter—he might start for San Francisco, maybe Cleveland. I'd be surprised if he can start for 25 teams in the league—particularly because he's not starting for us. Rucker and Campbell are our starters; Jason Peters when healthy is our nose tackle.

 

[Ohcrap75]

Yep & that's not even counting busting on 2nd rounders in Mintor & Nickelglass. Ugh

Those 1st & 2nd rounders are what generally leads to winning or losing.

I know Minter hasn't been the playmaker we had all hoped, but I think calling him a bust is pretty harsh. He was a second round pick not an early first.

 

[Buckybird]

You state this as a fact but it's fiction because you have no way of knowing.

And yet you probably still think Niklas is still gonna be a star & was a justified draft pick. Lol

 

[Bodha]

I know Minter hasn't been the playmaker we had all hoped, but I think calling him a bust is pretty harsh. He was a second round pick not an early first.

2nd round picks are discount 1st round picks. Absolutely they are expected to be cornerstones of your team.

They dont have to be superstars, but they need to be part of the core. Minter isnt a core guy and therefore a bust.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

2nd round picks are discount 1st round picks. Absolutely they are expected to be cornerstones of your team.

They dont have to be superstars, but they need to be part of the core. Minter isnt a core guy and therefore a bust.

That's just not true. It's been awhile but I researched it a couple years ago and more than 50% of 2nd round picks(can't remember the exact %) never impact an NFL roster whatsoever.

If you get one that's a cornerstone of your team, it's a luxury. I agree there can be a lot of good players found in round 2 but expecting them to be a core player is a reach at best. Ideally, you are correct. Realistically, you're wrong. Minter, in no way, is a bust.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

http://www.azcentral.com/story/spor...a-cardinals-latest-loss-drains-hope/94176658/

Apparently RN still thinks he's "all that".

Screw this kid, some players just don't ever get it & Keim better start drafting better or this team is gonna be a laughingstock in a few seasons.

This is the best article I've read in the valley about one of our teams in need of criticism in a long time.

I'm no Bickley fan but he nailed this.

 

[Bodha]

That's just not true. It's been awhile but I researched it a couple years ago and more than 50% of 2nd round picks(can't remember the exact %) never impact an NFL roster whatsoever.

If you get one that's a cornerstone of your team, it's a luxury. I agree there can be a lot of good players found in round 2 but expecting them to be a core player is a reach at best. Ideally, you are correct. Realistically, you're wrong. Minter, in no way, is a bust.

50% is a good number. That would support my position that 2nd rounders should be core guys. At 50%, you find a new core guy every 2 years. Thats perfect.


But looking at the Cardinals specifically.

2016 - none (Chandler doesnt count, he wasnt a pick)
2015 -Markus Golden - hit
2014 - Troy niklas - bust
2013 - Kevin Minter - bust
2012 - none (Kolb - barf)
2011 - Ryan Williams - injury bust
2010 - Daryl Washington - character bust
2009 - Cody Brown - super bust
2008 - Calais Campbell - hit
2007 - Alan Branch - bust
2006 - Deuce Lutui - bust
2005 - JJ Arrington - bust


In our last 10 2nd round picks, we have 2 cornerstones. Thats a rate of 20%

Id love to be at 50%

 

[Chopper0080]

Minter has under performed relative to his draft position. However you want to classify that, it isn't good.

 

[82CardsGrad]

BA sounds off on Diche: http://blog.azcardinals.com/2016/11/23/arians-blunt-on-nkemdiche-evaluation/

“Talent, not an issue,” Arians said. “Maturity is. It’s just maturing.”

 

[Darkside]

BA sounds off on Diche: http://blog.azcardinals.com/2016/11/23/arians-blunt-on-nkemdiche-evaluation/

“Talent, not an issue,” Arians said. “Maturity is. It’s just maturing.”

I would have disagreed maybe, until I read the ridiculous situation with him trying to put on a tie. Apparently if the team wins they can dress casual, per BA, after games. This dude doesn't have a clue, after we lost, and was begging vets for a shirt and tie after Sundays loss.

It's a dumb rule maybe, but it's better than getting hazed and these mother ******* should know if we won or lost and dress appropriately.

It's a stupid thing in my opinion, but also shows a lack of respect and just basic dumbassery on nk's part.

 

[gmabel830]

BA sounds off on Diche: http://blog.azcardinals.com/2016/11/23/arians-blunt-on-nkemdiche-evaluation/

“Talent, not an issue,” Arians said. “Maturity is. It’s just maturing.”

Thigh deep? When asked to compare Nkemdiche to Humphries last year, BA said "DJ worked harder."

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

[juza76]

50% is a good number. That would support my position that 2nd rounders should be core guys. At 50%, you find a new core guy every 2 years. Thats perfect.


But looking at the Cardinals specifically.

2016 - none (Chandler doesnt count, he wasnt a pick)
2015 -Markus Golden - hit
2014 - Troy niklas - bust
2013 - Kevin Minter - bust
2012 - none (Kolb - barf)
2011 - Ryan Williams - injury bust
2010 - Daryl Washington - character bust
2009 - Cody Brown - super bust
2008 - Calais Campbell - hit
2007 - Alan Branch - bust
2006 - Deuce Lutui - bust
2005 - JJ Arrington - bust


In our last 10 2nd round picks, we have 2 cornerstones. Thats a rate of 20%

Id love to be at 50%

Washington had amazing seasons with us, he was the best player
Dont remember a more spectacular LB