Jayson Tatum

[Carolinacacti]

I hate Duke but I wouldn't cry if suns end up with Tatum.

 

[Russ Smith]

Tatum was definitely mentioned as a possible superstar. Tatum was most frequently mentioned as the #1 pick of this class before Fultz solidified himself as the likely choice.

Most of the Duke busts were busts because they were drafted as perceived winners instead f big time talents (Shelden Williams one of the most obvious busts possible).

Kansas had a TON OF BUSTS. Maybe more than Duke so the same argument goes against Jackson. A lot of their busts were playing the same position too like Xavier Henry.

No they weren't they were perceived busts because they were highly rated in HS and by the time they left Duke they had either dropped in the ratings or were drafted and then didn't pan out.

Nobody said Rivers was going to be great because he won games in college, in fact that was one of the knocks on him that Duke team seemed better without him. They had 32 wins the year before he got there, 27 the year he was there, and 30 the year after he left. He was supposed to be a PG but he was a shoot first PG and his year in college made it obvious that he wasn't nearly as good as people thought.

 

[slinslin]

Rivers at least had talent and still sticks in the league and has good games occasionally.

Shelden Williams was drafted top 5, everyone with a brain knew he sucks. He was an undersized sturdy Power Forward with very offensive little talent.

I'd be shocked if a player like that would be a top 40 pick with the scouting as it is today.

The guys from Duke that are considered big busts are hardly a shock to me.


Brand, Hill, Irving, Hood and others are or were good though. And I'd wager that Jay Williams would have been good without the bike accident.

 

[Russ Smith]

Rivers at least had talent and still sticks in the league and has good games occasionally.

Shelden Williams was drafted top 5, everyone with a brain knew he sucks. He was an undersized sturdy Power Forward with very offensive little talent.

I'd be shocked if a player like that would be a top 40 pick with the scouting as it is today.

The guys from Duke that are considered big busts are hardly a shock to me.


Brand, Hill, Irving, Hood and others are or were good though. And I'd wager that Jay Williams would have been good without the bike accident.

But he wasnt' drafted high because people thought he was great, he was drafted high because the draft was so terrible.

Aldridge was the best player in the draft but most of them were just tossups. Brandon Roy was good but he already had teh knee injury that cut his career short. Rudy Gay probably should have gone higher but really that was just a terrible draft. Rondo slid because he was considered uncoachable. Honestly looking at the names that was a really bad draft. I don't think Williams goes near that high now just because there are too many obviously better guys.

 

[Chaplin]

Flame war? I'm not arguing. I'm playing devils advocate. I'm not enamored with Tatum but I wouldn't avoid him just due to attending Duke.

Yeah because that's the only reason I said I'd avoid him. At best, it is a red flag IMO.

Duke produces terrific role players, 90% of which aren't worth a top 5 pick in a good draft.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Yeah because that's the only reason I said I'd avoid him. At best, it is a red flag IMO.

Duke produces terrific role players, 90% of which aren't worth a top 5 pick in a good draft.

But my point is that can likely be said of almost every school. It's just that duke likely has more players drafted than anyone but Kentucky within the last 20-30 years.

 

[Covert Rain]

I actually like Tatum. The problem I have is that he is a big reach IMO where the Suns are likely to pick.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I actually like Tatum. The problem I have is that he is a big reach IMO where the Suns are likely to pick.

A big reach at 4 or 5 if we drop? I don't think so. More like exactly where he's projected to go.

 

[Covert Rain]

A big reach at 4 or 5 if we drop? I don't think so. More like exactly where he's projected to go.

I don't think we drop to 4 or 5. Top 3? Yes he is a reach. Typically after top 3 picks that is the first drop off in the draft.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I think few (other than slin) have Tatum in top three. And I believe we have a 40-something percent chance of dropping out of top 3, so you can think what you want, but thems the odds.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

I don't think we drop to 4 or 5. Top 3? Yes he is a reach. Typically after top 3 picks that is the first drop off in the draft.

I don't think many are promoting him as our pick if we get a top 3 selection, but we only have a 56% chance of a top 3 pick. Just a little better than a coin flip, which...well, you know the history.

 

[Mainstreet]

There is always the trade down scenario if the Suns draft 1st or 2nd. I really enjoy bargains.

Speaking of bargains, Markkanen might turn out to be just this as he rises in the draft. He should be available if the Suns trade done slightly as well as Fox and Isaac. I'm still liking Jackson and Fox a lot.

 

[Covert Rain]

I don't think many are promoting him as our pick if we get a top 3 selection, but we only have a 56% chance of a top 3 pick. Just a little better than a coin flip, which...well, you know the history.

Yes but that number is a bit of a vacuum. For instance other teams in the draft have a higher chance than we do for the 4th and 5th pick for example. The Celtics (via Brooklyn) have a better chance that we do at the 4th pick. The Lakers, Philadelphia and Orlando have a higher chance than we do to get the 5th pick and so on.

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[Covert Rain]

By the way, I didn't realize that after each "pick" all the balls even for the team that won a pick already are still in play. Meaning that let's say the Celtics ball comes up pick 1 and pick 2. They actually will throw them all back in the mixer until they get a clean lottery combination (meaning a different team for each pick).

So, it's probably a good thing they don't show that to the public. Could you imagine the Suns getting the #1 pick 3 times in a row but because some teams ball came up twice, that is tossed out. Then the one time you get a clean combination we get the #3.

People's heads would explode. I wonder in the past how many times they have had to redo the pulling of the numbers because some team kept getting multiple balls pop up?

 

[slinslin]

By the way, I didn't realize that after each "pick" all the balls even for the team that won a pick already are still in play. Meaning that let's say the Celtics ball comes up pick 1 and pick 2. They actually will throw them all back in the mixer until they get a clean lottery combination (meaning a different team for each pick).

So, it's probably a good thing they don't show that to the public. Could you imagine the Suns getting the #1 pick 3 times in a row but because some teams ball came up twice, that is tossed out. Then the one time you get a clean combination we get the #3.

People's heads would explode. I wonder in the past how many times they have had to redo the pulling of the numbers because some team kept getting multiple balls pop up?

That is not how it works..

Teams are not assigned ping pong balls, teams are assigned sets of numerical combinations.

They draw numbered ping pong balls and whichever team owns the combination gets the pick. They can't remove ping pong balls of someone who already is out of the drawing.

 

[Covert Rain]

That is not how it works..

Teams are not assigned ping pong balls, teams are assigned sets of numerical combinations.

They draw numbered ping pong balls and whichever team owns the combination gets the pick. They can't remove ping pong balls of someone who already is out of the drawing.

Thank you for clarifying. What you posted above was how I thought it worked but someone posted the above which I thought was a really frustrating way to run a lottery. I assumed they knew what they were talking about. I had always thought teams were assigned combinations. Maybe he was talking about the old system? How did it work before they put in the combination system?

 

[Mainstreet]

By the way, I didn't realize that after each "pick" all the balls even for the team that won a pick already are still in play. Meaning that let's say the Celtics ball comes up pick 1 and pick 2. They actually will throw them all back in the mixer until they get a clean lottery combination (meaning a different team for each pick).

So, it's probably a good thing they don't show that to the public. Could you imagine the Suns getting the #1 pick 3 times in a row but because some teams ball came up twice, that is tossed out. Then the one time you get a clean combination we get the #3.

People's heads would explode. I wonder in the past how many times they have had to redo the pulling of the numbers because some team kept getting multiple balls pop up?

I know what you mean. As I recall, on the coin flip for Kareem, JC momentarily saw the coin flip come up heads (their choice) before the Commissioner turned it over which resulted in tails. So close but so far away.

 

[Covert Rain]

I know what you mean. If I recall correctly, on the coin flip for Kareem, JC momentarily saw the coin flip come up heads (their choice) before the Commissioner turned it over which resulted in tails. So close but so far away.

Slin clarified they do in fact use a combination assignment process. I never really dove into how they pull the order but I watch the results and dive into all the analysis and video on each player in the draft.

By the way, I don't think Suns fans will ever get over that coin flip until we win a title.

 

[Yuma]

I know what you mean. As I recall, on the coin flip for Kareem, JC momentarily saw the coin flip come up heads (their choice) before the Commissioner turned it over which resulted in tails. So close but so far away.

I once saw a coin flip hit the sand, we were outside, and land evenly on edge and stick in the sand. We all started laughing. Of course we flipped the coin again.

Anyway, that would be hilarious on TV!

 

[Mainstreet]

Slin clarified they do in fact use a combination assignment process. I never really dove into how they pull the order but I watch the results and dive into all the analysis and video on each player in the draft.

By the way, I don't think Suns fans will ever get over that coin flip until we win a title.

I was commenting more on the emotional part of it whether it be a coin flip or ping pong balls. Losing is never pleasant.

 

[Yuma]

Slin clarified they do in fact use a combination assignment process. I never really dove into how they pull the order but I watch the results and dive into all the analysis and video on each player in the draft.

By the way, I don't think Suns fans will ever get over that coin flip until we win a title.

I don't remember the particulars, but I think we got screwed on David Robinson, too.

May 17, 1987: After finishing the 1986-87 season with a 28-54 record, the fourth-worst mark in the NBA, the Spurs needed some luck in the 1987 NBA Draft Lottery … Bob Bass was on hand for the Spurs at the Equitable Center Auditorium in New York (along with Bass was Spurs fan Roberto Pachecano who had won a team sponsored ‘lucky charm’ contest and brought along a bolo tie clasp with an inlaid red chameleon and an old iron spur) … after the Phoenix Suns logo was revealed for the second spot it was clear that the Spurs had won the lottery.

 

[Covert Rain]

I don't remember the particulars, but I think we got screwed on David Robinson, too.

All the Suns bad breaks blur together for me now. LOL.

 

[Yuma]

All the Suns bad breaks blur together for me now. LOL.

May 17, 1987: After finishing the 1986-87 season with a 28-54 record, the fourth-worst mark in the NBA, the Spurs needed some luck in the 1987 NBA Draft Lottery … Bob Bass was on hand for the Spurs at the Equitable Center Auditorium in New York (along with Bass was Spurs fan Roberto Pachecano who had won a team sponsored ‘lucky charm’ contest and brought along a bolo tie clasp with an inlaid red chameleon and an old iron spur) … after the Phoenix Suns logo was revealed for the second spot it was clear that the Spurs had won the lottery.

 

[Mainstreet]

I once saw a coin flip hit the sand, we were outside, and land evenly on edge and stick in the sand. We all started laughing. Of course we flipped the coin again.

Anyway, that would be hilarious on TV!

Maybe they should hide ping pong balls on the beach and let the GMs have at it.

 

[Yuma]

The Suns have never drafted first in nearly 50 years of existence! We are overdue!

I am thinking they should just GIVE it to us by default this year.