Jeudy or Lamb for Cards??

[Solar7]

if it has to be a WR Lamp by far, before the Combine I was already more inclined to go lamp after watching tape and now with the combine numbers, there is no way that I could argue for Jeudy.

But I would like to have Simmons more than a WR, but I could understand if we draft Lamp.

Lamp looks like a type of a WR that can grab the game and put it on it's shoulder, like Larry or Edelmann, and if Simmons isn't there (I'm not sold on any OT/OG or Brown) than go draft Lamp.

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[Jetstream Green]

if it has to be a WR Lamp by far, before the Combine I was already more inclined to go lamp after watching tape and now with the combine numbers, there is no way that I could argue for Jeudy.

But I would like to have Simmons more than a WR, but I could understand if we draft Lamp.

Lamp looks like a type of a WR that can grab the game and put it on it's shoulder, like Larry or Edelmann, and if Simmons isn't there (I'm not sold on any OT/OG or Brown) than go draft Lamp.

Jeudy's combine wasn't too shabby either

 

[binkar]

I don’t think Ruggs can be discounted in the conversation. Keim and KK have both mentioned the need for speed at outside receiver. Ruggs saw most of his snaps outside last year while Jeudy saw more in the slot. I’m not saying it’s the right pick, I just wouldn’t be shocked by it.

 

[Dr. Jones]

What is wow about Jeudy is how he cuts. He shifts his hips so effortlessly. If you have paid attention to the draft over the past few decades, we literally havent seen someone as smooth as he is.

There have been several articles on this....top NFL WRs watch tape of Jeudy...his routes are that good.

Man..... what a tough one here.

I moved Lamb above Jeudy on our list after the combine but still waffle when I think about it.

The things I love about Lamb (Rapport with K1, Ferocity, Catch Aggression, etc) cannot be measured and usually get GM's fired when they take a player with those "immeasurables" over the guy with Transcendent traits (Jeudy's hip movement, bend, and change of direction).

With that being said...... You can see Lamb's "want to" on film all over the place and his production was in the 98th percentile for a college WR. That has to account for something.

In the end, there is a 47% bust rate in the draft among WR's and an continue to think that of Jeudy, Lamb, Ruggs, Jefferson, Higgins, Reagor, & Mims atleast 4 will fail. The two I am most sure of are Jeudy and Lamb and it's a long way before I get to Ruggs now.

Okudah - Young - Wont be there
Simmons - still "totally in"
Jeudy - Lamb - Either
OT - Wirfs, Wills, Thomas

"Totally Out" on: Becton & Brown

That's my list until we figure out our FA successes & failures.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Man..... what a tough one here.

I moved Lamb above Jeudy on our list after the combine but still waffle when I think about it.

The things I love about Lamb (Rapport with K1, Ferocity, Catch Aggression, etc) cannot be measured and usually get GM's fired when they take a player with those "immeasurables" over the guy with Transcendent traits (Jeudy's hip movement, bend, and change of direction).

With that being said...... You can see Lamb's "want to" on film all over the place and his production was in the 98th percentile for a college WR. That has to account for something.

In the end, there is a 47% bust rate in the draft among WR's and an continue to think that of Jeudy, Lamb, Ruggs, Jefferson, Higgins, Reagor, & Mims atleast 4 will fail. The two I am most sure of are Jeudy and Lamb and it's a long way before I get to Ruggs now.

Okudah - Young - Wont be there
Simmons - still "totally in"
Jeudy - Lamb - Either
OT - Wirfs, Wills, Thomas

"Totally Out" on: Becton & Brown

That's my list until we figure out our FA successes & failures.

Heh I know weve gone back and forth on this, but Becton is a 100th percentile athlete for his size. He has some technique issues to clean up, but his ceiling is easily the highest and with a top notch o line coach on the staff, I take the guy with the highest ceiling.

That's why I say this is one of the coolest drafts to follow as a Cardinals fan. A really good player will be at 8th.

I'm souring a bit on Brown because of his lack of elite traits and I think the Cardinals can find effective DL in FA.

I think Lamb over Jeudy because of the situation. He will know a lot of the offense, he has played with our franchise QB, he attacks the ball with an alpha mentality, and by all accounts has a tremendous work ethic.

 

[az jam]

I don’t think Ruggs can be discounted in the conversation. Keim and KK have both mentioned the need for speed at outside receiver. Ruggs saw most of his snaps outside last year while Jeudy saw more in the slot. I’m not saying it’s the right pick, I just wouldn’t be shocked by it.

You make a good point, he could end up the best of the three. He will go high in the draft for sure.

 

[az jam]

Appreciate the feedback from everyone. Consensus seems to be Lamb if they go WR at #8. IMO they won't go OT but would have a tough decision to make if CB Okudah, Dt Derrick Brown or LB Isaiah Simmons are available at #8. I also think whatever they do in free agency will impact what they do at #8.

 

[Dr. Jones]

Heh I know weve gone back and forth on this, but Becton is a 100th percentile athlete for his size. He has some technique issues to clean up, but his ceiling is easily the highest and with a top notch o line coach on the staff, I take the guy with the highest ceiling.

That's why I say this is one of the coolest drafts to follow as a Cardinals fan. A really good player will be at 8th.

I'm souring a bit on Brown because of his lack of elite traits and I think the Cardinals can find effective DL in FA.

I think Lamb over Jeudy because of the situation. He will know a lot of the offense, he has played with our franchise QB, he attacks the ball with an alpha mentality, and by all accounts has a tremendous work ethic.

We have...... My issues with Becton have been well documented. Limited passing sets. Limited top end competition. Limited offense. The dude is more Tony Mandarich than Tyron Smith IMO. 100th percentile means nothing without a solid body of work. His ceiling may be sky high but his floor is basement level wash out.

 

[GuernseyCard]

We have...... My issues with Becton have been well documented. Limited passing sets. Limited top end competition. Limited offense. The dude is more Tony Mandarich than Tyron Smith IMO. 100th percentile means nothing without a solid body of work. His ceiling may be sky high but his floor is basement level wash out.

Tony Mandarich after failing as a tackle had a number of good years at guard before injuries took him out.

 

[TheCardFan]

We have...... My issues with Becton have been well documented. Limited passing sets. Limited top end competition. Limited offense. The dude is more Tony Mandarich than Tyron Smith IMO. 100th percentile means nothing without a solid body of work. His ceiling may be sky high but his floor is basement level wash out.

Tony Mandarich after failing as a tackle had a number of good years at guard before injuries took him out.

Not to mention he was juiced out of his mind...not a fair comparison with Becton.

 

[Dr. Jones]

Tony Mandarich after failing as a tackle had a number of good years at guard before injuries took him out.

Not to mention he was juiced out of his mind...not a fair comparison with Becton.

I'm looking at the insane size, speed comparison. Not the juiced out junkie stuff.

Even Mandarich made all an american team. And was the Big 10 O-Lineman of the year twice.

Becton's tailor made to be the O-Line washout of the top 4. I keep saying that this is a passing league and the Louisville offense just doesn't pass very much. Trusting a guy with limited technique, limited reps, and limited tape seems really sketchy for a top 10 pick. Especially with 3 other top college lineman coming out.

 

[PlanoCard]

If we have to choose between the two, it would be Lamb. It pains me to say it as a Baylor fan, but I got to watch him reek havoc on the Big 12 for way too long and he is a freak that is going to be a star in the NFL. There are so many great WRs in this draft, but I put him at the top. Mark my words that my Baylor Bear, Denzel Mims, is also going to do big things in the NFL.

 

[BullheadCardFan]

Mark my words that my Baylor Bear, Denzel Mims, is also going to do big things in the NFL.

Been hearing good things about Mims.

Will he be there at our second pick?

 

[Krangodnzr]

I'm looking at the insane size, speed comparison. Not the juiced out junkie stuff.

Even Mandarich made all an american team. And was the Big 10 O-Lineman of the year twice.

Becton's tailor made to be the O-Line washout of the top 4. I keep saying that this is a passing league and the Louisville offense just doesn't pass very much. Trusting a guy with limited technique, limited reps, and limited tape seems really sketchy for a top 10 pick. Especially with 3 other top college lineman coming out.

He went up against two top 100 edge rushers against Notre Dame and dominated them. Went against Clemson as well. Went against FSU.

If you were talking about Ezra Cleveland, I'd agree, he hasn't gone against top competition.

Julian Okwara has an outside shot at being a 1st rounder....Becton dominated him.

Limited technique? Dude it sounds like you are talking about a JC lineman here. He played in the freaking ACC, not the Big Sky Conference. There is a reason that a number of highly respected scouts are listing him as the top lineman on their or board or second best lineman.

He has freakish ability and though he needs to clean up some of his technique, he crushed people. 17% body fat. He tested better than Andrew Thomas in nearly every category.

Last year you very smartly disregarded the lack of rep argument against Murray. Lack of reps dont matter if you crush it on the reps you do have.

And you champion Isaiah Simmons for ILB and he had......70 snaps at ILB?!?!

 

[Krangodnzr]

If we have to choose between the two, it would be Lamb. It pains me to say it as a Baylor fan, but I got to watch him reek havoc on the Big 12 for way too long and he is a freak that is going to be a star in the NFL. There are so many great WRs in this draft, but I put him at the top. Mark my words that my Baylor Bear, Denzel Mims, is also going to do big things in the NFL.

What we dont know is what goes on between the ears. That's the stuff Keim and Co. are going to hear.

 

[Zeno]

I think both will be productive and wouldn't have a problem with either one. I just don't know that either one will be BPA at #8--lot's of top 10 talent in this draft at other positions.

 

[Dr. Jones]

He went up against two top 100 edge rushers against Notre Dame and dominated them. Went against Clemson as well. Went against FSU.

If you were talking about Ezra Cleveland, I'd agree, he hasn't gone against top competition.

Julian Okwara has an outside shot at being a 1st rounder....Becton dominated him.

Limited technique? Dude it sounds like you are talking about a JC lineman here. He played in the freaking ACC, not the Big Sky Conference. There is a reason that a number of highly respected scouts are listing him as the top lineman on their or board or second best lineman.

He has freakish ability and though he needs to clean up some of his technique, he crushed people. 17% body fat. He tested better than Andrew Thomas in nearly every category.

Last year you very smartly disregarded the lack of rep argument against Murray. Lack of reps dont matter if you crush it on the reps you do have.

And you champion Isaiah Simmons for ILB and he had......70 snaps at ILB?!?!

I'll try and take these one at a time:

Notre Dame: I think the ND tape is not his reality. In fact, I wouldn't use the word "dominated" in regards to it. ND had 4 sacks, allowed only 3 points in the last three quarters, and the Cardinals still didn't throw the ball more than they ran it.

This offense was a running offense. Not wishbone Navy style, but Very RUN HEAVY. Even when they cant score.... they still run 60% of the time.

Clemson: Another destruction. Clemson won 45 to 10 and the only Cards TD came in junk time against the third string. Louisville allowed 6 sacks (Simmons had 2). And wait for it..... they ran it 43 times to Passing only 22. IN A BLOWOUT they preferred to run it. And still allowed 6 sacks.

Florida State: Same story..... Lost by 11. Still ran it 47 times to only 27 passes. Another 6 sacks allowed by a team who only passed it 27 times.


Like a Navy offense, its almost impossible for a D end to pin his ears back and rush relentlessly when 1. the team your playing runs it 60 to 70% of the time, and 2. You are up so big that the other team benches you in favor of 2nd and third stringers.

Teams are so surprised when they do pass (Like playing Navy) that they couldn't have figured it was coming, need to stop setting and edge, and now must rush.

Freakish Ability: So did Nkemdiche. And that is exactly where you take a risk on a player with his physical attributes. The end of round 1.

If he gets his hands on you, and in the right place.... He can be great. I just think he's nowhere near ready yet.

Smartly disregarded reps argument for Kyler: Kyler had hundreds upon hundreds of pass attempts at Oklahoma. Becton has 73 measurable pass protection sets in 2019 with 8 pressures allowed (11%). And his 2018 tape was super sloppy. In the ACC...... as supposedly dominant as he was..... that's pretty Ugly.
PFF Noted:

The reason we’re still relatively low on Becton despite his absurd physical traits at 6-7, 369 pounds is that we haven’t seen them translate consistently to the football field yet. Louisville’s offense this past season was extremely run and play action heavy. Among PFF’s top five tackles, Becton’s 73 true pass sets were 40 fewer than anyone else. On the flip side, his 8 pressures allowed though on those true pass sets were the most. Having had to flip sides based on the strength of the formation as a freshman and sophomore didn’t help Becton’s development, but that’s still more projection than we’d like at the top of the draft.

Isaiah Simmons: Like Kyler..... his position is so truly un-matchable, I don't know how it can be debated. 98th percentile physically, and production that matches and exceeds his physical attributes. He was the best player on the field in every game he played this season. And that includes the LSU game IMO. Only Stingley & Burrow come close IMO

 

[Dr. Jones]

He went up against two top 100 edge rushers against Notre Dame and dominated them. Went against Clemson as well. Went against FSU.

And saying "Two top 100 edge rushers" isn't saying much......

There are 115 colleges playing D1 football and that leaves 230 starting edge rushers.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Jeudy is better than Lamb and that’s not a Knick on Lamb.
To pick a guy based on friendship is pretty ridiculous. Take the better player.

the only argument to take a WR in this draft, after last years drafting of 3, is to get that true #1. Even though it’s a deep WR class, the #1 receiver the Cards need is going to have to be between Jeudy or Lamb.
Everyone else may be good but the Cards likely have WRs 2-5 already on their roster and that’s what you’d be taking if you miss out on the top guys.

 

[Phrazbit]

Jeudy, IMO, is clearly the better player. Talent trumps familiarity.

 

[Krangodnzr]

And saying "Two top 100 edge rushers" isn't saying much......

There are 115 colleges playing D1 football and that leaves 230 starting edge rushers.

Top 100 players

 

[JeffGollin]

Lamb - due to the chemistry issue.

But what I really want is a 6-4 240 lb jump ball star with velcro hands.

 

[Ohcrap75]

Been hearing good things about Mims.

Will he be there at our second pick?

I think he will go late one, but he would make an amazing 2nd round pick. Elite physical traits combined with great work ethic. No diva, just a football player. Loves to block and is great at it!

 

[SoonerLou]

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

 

[clif]

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

I’m not even kidding. I would take this guy as a backup any day.