K1

[Russ Smith]

Waddle would be an absolute homerun pick for us but I don't think he will be there. He should go pretty early. I'm really hoping either him or Pitts are available. If not, there are some good corners that we may need to pick from at that spot.

I've seen some mocks with Waddle lasting into the 20's I assume because he got hurt this year. I expect him to if healthy do really well at the combine. again there's a video of him racing Ruggs where he just barely gets beat, it's a 40 to 50 yard run so he's fast. he's very quick, explosive athlete, I expect him to test really well.

My favorite Waddle play is the punt return TD against LSU from last year, 77 yards. He averaged over 24 yards per punt return one year. They let him return some kickoffs against Auburn he broke a big one, came back for penalty. The next time Auburn kicked to him and he went 98 for a TD. Just electric. I want us to go defense, CB probably, but man if we took Waddle I would be jumping up and down.

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[HairZach]

I want new a #1 corner but I don't know of any corner worth picking over Pitts or Waddle in this draft.

 

[TaylorSwift]

The 3rd and 6 on the last drive sums up Kyler's issues for me.

Throwing a completely pre determined pass to Kirk in tight coverage when 10 yards away you have Keesean wide open behind the defense ready to house it with a simple pass.

That could have been a better route concept by Kliff, it looks like he has both wr running to the near and far endzone pylon from their respective positions in the formation. I felt that route by Kesean should have been far more to the inside to force the safety to have to commit to either one.

By running both wrs in the same general area, the safety can wait till late to bail on either route.

 

[TaylorSwift]

i am not disputing poor mechanics led to a poor throw

but he double clutched -- if he just hits his drop and throws the ball -- he probably throws with better fundamentals, and, Kirk has nearly the whole endzone to work with

in the throw as is: there is lots of room because the ball is underthrown. By throwing late - a well thrown ball probably needs to be within +/- 1 yard of the endline, and it becomes a difficult catch

Its tough, because Kirk doesn't appear to win his 1-1 on till further up the field. Its a difficult throw for even Aaron Rodgers to throw open.

He should have been able to compensate with better mechanics at the last minute though. If he doesn't under throw that ball, its a td.

 

[football karma]

Its tough, because Kirk doesn't appear to win his 1-1 on till further up the field. Its a difficult throw for even Aaron Rodgers to throw open.

He should have been able to compensate with better mechanics at the last minute though. If he doesn't under throw that ball, its a td.

probably a trust thing too

because when its Hopkins -- K1 just throws it

 

[Russ Smith]

That could have been a better route concept by Kliff, it looks like he has both wr running to the near and far endzone pylon from their respective positions in the formation. I felt that route by Kesean should have been far more to the inside to force the safety to have to commit to either one.

By running both wrs in the same general area, the safety can wait till late to bail on either route.

Yeah but if you look the safety isn't even there. When Kirk hits the 30 his DB is right next to him. Keesean is just at the 30 a foot behind Kirk, but the closest DB to him is at the 25 yard line. The other DB is at the 30 but he's all the way on the other side of the hashmarks. If Kyler just throws to Johnson he can keep the ball between the guy in the yellow circle and the guy on the left at the 30. I have to assume he just didn't see him that's wide open in the NFL IMO

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[TaylorSwift]

probably a trust thing too

because when its Hopkins -- K1 just throws it

Exactly, there is really no one else on the cards who have the ability to challenge enough and win on their one on ones for Kyler to make those throws to.

Every team in the play offs has at least 2+ guys outside of the qb they can rely upon to make a play fairly consistently.

Cardinals have Hopkins and who else?

Kirk is a speed guy who lacks elite speed, a wr3 at best

Larry is 37 years old

Kesean is wr3-wr4

And then its an abyss.



Dan Arnold had a chance to make some money for himself last Sunday, he fumbled the bag there.

Cardinals are really lacking in playmakers outside of Hopkins and it shows.

Even their running game is in a large part predicated off of the ability of K1's legs. Thats not a recipe for sustained success in this league.

 

[TaylorSwift]

Yeah but if you look the safety isn't even there. When Kirk hits the 30 his DB is right next to him. Keesean is just at the 30 a foot behind Kirk, but the closest DB to him is at the 25 yard line. The other DB is at the 30 but he's all the way on the other side of the hashmarks. If Kyler just throws to Johnson he can keep the ball between the guy in the yellow circle and the guy on the left at the 30. I have to assume he just didn't see him that's wide open in the NFL IMO

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I dont think he even saw it, two defenders where sitting between KS and K1s eyes. And who knows, height and rushers in pass lanes probably affected him him as well.

But thats the problem, why create that conundrum of a route concept wise for the qb mentally. Make it a easier read of safeties for Kyler.

If that route is more up field, I think it becomes an easier read, but that play puts so many bodies in such a small space of the field.

 

[Russ Smith]

I dont think he even saw it, two defenders where sitting between KS and K1s eyes. And who knows, height and rushers in pass lanes probably affected him him as well.

But thats the problem, why create that conundrum of a route concept wise for the qb mentally. Make it a easier read of safeties for Kyler.

If that route is more up field, I think it becomes an easier read, but that play puts so many bodies in such a small space of the field.

To me if a guy is running essentially wide open at the 30 yard line when you're down 8 points, I have a hard time blaming the route concept. I like Kyler I'm not at all saying he's a bad QB I am just saying on THAT play, it looks to me like missed seeing a wide open play. and remember he and Johnson have had good rapport for 2 years now, he hit him long earlier in the game.

now maybe because in other situations he threw to Keesean and got criticized, he decided I'm going to Kirk, but to me the right play there is throw to the open guy. At the point I took that pic that's wide open.

 

[swagron]

Exactly, there is really no one else on the cards who have the ability to challenge enough and win on their one on ones for Kyler to make those throws to.

Every team in the play offs has at least 2+ guys outside of the qb they can rely upon to make a play fairly consistently.

Cardinals have Hopkins and who else?

Kirk is a speed guy who lacks elite speed, a wr3 at best

Larry is 37 years old

Kesean is wr3-wr4

And then its an abyss.



Dan Arnold had a chance to make some money for himself last Sunday, he fumbled the bag there.

Cardinals are really lacking in playmakers outside of Hopkins and it shows.

Even their running game is in a large part predicated off of the ability of K1's legs. Thats not a recipe for sustained success in this league.

We should call him LeKyler since he needs all that help lol

 

[SoonerLou]

I just dont think throwing goal line fades to Kirk is a wise idea at all. Even if he stepped into that throw.

Since its only 15 yards or so I'd rather Fitz, Arnold or KJ be outside tbh.

Warner is a beast, but maybe throwing a back shoulder fade to Fitz here would have been a better option in the slot.

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Yeah but if you look the safety isn't even there. When Kirk hits the 30 his DB is right next to him. Keesean is just at the 30 a foot behind Kirk, but the closest DB to him is at the 25 yard line. The other DB is at the 30 but he's all the way on the other side of the hashmarks. If Kyler just throws to Johnson he can keep the ball between the guy in the yellow circle and the guy on the left at the 30. I have to assume he just didn't see him that's wide open in the NFL IMO

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With the corner playing inside leverage I think Kyler would have to put less air under on it than the one he threw to Kirk. DB probably picks it or breaks it up. If he throws it on a line then yea its a big play.

 

[Russ Smith]

I just dont think throwing goal line fades to Kirk is a wise idea at all. Even if he stepped into that throw.

Since its only 15 yards or so I'd rather Fitz, Arnold or KJ be outside tbh.

Warner is a beast, but maybe throwing a back shoulder fade to Fitz here would have been a better option in the slot.

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With the corner playing inside leverage I think Kyler would have to put less air under on it than the one he threw to Kirk. DB probably picks it or breaks it up. If he throws it on a line then yea its a big play.

To me the play there is step up and throw it to the corner where if Kirk doesn't get it, nobody can. Maybe get a PI. But by throwing off the back foot he wasn't able to get enough on the throw.

 

[Finito]

Why all the hate? Kyler wants to win. We are damn lucky to have him. He is the best qb we have had since Warner and will get better and he is only 23 yers old.

It’s easy to sit on your couch and question how tough other men are. Guys hate for different reasons.

 

[cardpa]

On this play it's plain and simple, Murray panicked and threw the INT. Either he has no faith in his line or he is afraid of being hit. He made no adjustment in the pocket. He could have slide a bit left and hit Arnold on the drag route and gotten the ball inside the 5 yard line or possibly a TD. Humphries and Pugh were doing a good job of not allowing penetration on the left side and Murray had tons of room there. No pocket awareness at all.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I just dont think throwing goal line fades to Kirk is a wise idea at all. Even if he stepped into that throw.

Since its only 15 yards or so I'd rather Fitz, Arnold or KJ be outside tbh.

Warner is a beast, but maybe throwing a back shoulder fade to Fitz here would have been a better option in the slot.

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With the corner playing inside leverage I think Kyler would have to put less air under on it than the one he threw to Kirk. DB probably picks it or breaks it up. If he throws it on a line then yea its a big play.

Man if that film is indicative of what kyler sees almost every other play it’s got to be disconcerting. There’s not a man open. Not even close.

 

[SoonerLou]

To me the play there is step up and throw it to the corner where if Kirk doesn't get it, nobody can. Maybe get a PI. But by throwing off the back foot he wasn't able to get enough on the throw.

Similar blitzes from the side by DBs spooked him.
So spooked by the blitzes that forced him left is why his mechanics fell apart on that redzone play.

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(Could have stepped up and maybe hit DHop for a 4 yard pass)

End of the game we pick it up but Kyler panics and throws off his back foot.

 

[SoonerLou]

Man if that film is indicative of what kyler sees almost every other play it’s got to be disconcerting. There’s not a man open. Not even close.

And thats with the 49ers backups..

However, again one of two things need to happen. Either Kyler is going to have to throw guys open (like I suggested to maybe Fitz). Or we simply have to adjust the system to include more run action plays.

We're not good enough yet to just line up and call traditional passing plays consistently (at least not a high volume.) against physical teams. Trent Dilfer talked about after the Rams game. I think we gotta get the pocket moving + some misdirection.

 

[SoonerLou]

On this play it's plain and simple, Murray panicked and threw the INT. Either he has no faith in his line or he is afraid of being hit. He made no adjustment in the pocket. He could have slide a bit left and hit Arnold on the drag route and gotten the ball inside the 5 yard line or possibly a TD. Humphries and Pugh were doing a good job of not allowing penetration on the left side and Murray had tons of room there. No pocket awareness at all.

See the post I posted afterwards. That came from the 49ers getting home previous on those blitzes. He had the potential to move to his left and create a play similar to the Eagles game. However, in this particularly game it seemed like every time he rolled left they got him. Just bad time to panic.

 

[daves]

The 3rd and 6 on the last drive sums up Kyler's issues for me.

Throwing a completely pre determined pass to Kirk in tight coverage when 10 yards away you have Keesean wide open behind the defense ready to house it with a simple pass.

That guy does nice breakdowns. Man, you can really see how open Johnson was at 6:00 (though he doesn't comment on it). Ugh.

...dave

EDIT: Oh yeah - as @Russ Smith pointed out a few posts above!

 

[juza76]

How many of the 49ers defensive 2nd string players are free agents? I would sign all of them

They were flying and I didn't see a single missed tackle

Night and day comparing them to the Cardinals defensive unit

Jason Verret one of the best vs Hopkins
Ankhello Weatherspoon , looked very good covering
Tarvarius Moore and Marcell Harris the safeties
Kwaun Williams nickle corner, who made some damages blitzing
Kerry Hyder Jr dt/de was super explosive
DJ Jones DT

Ok they had also i think one of the top 3 linebacker in the nfl if not the best
Fred Warner
but the second string guys has shown they belong to nfl more then our guys

 

[juza76]

If I am a GM I would try to get as many second stringers I can from the following rosters

Rams
49ers
Ravens

* Vance Joseph fired

 

[SoonerLou]

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That guy does nice breakdowns. Man, you can really see how open Johnson was at 6:00 (though he doesn't comment on it). Ugh.

...dave

EDIT: Oh yeah - as @Russ Smith pointed out a few posts above!

I wish I had an endzone copy of that one.

Cause I think the corner is in a zone and was reading where the ball was going.

He's standing between Kirk and KJ as the play develops and reading Kyler. Now maybe there's a play to be made, but I think just chucking it deep wouldnt have worked. He was going to have to drill the football in there imo.

He had time though so maybe he could have done another pump fake.

 

[football karma]

Similar blitzes from the side by DBs spooked him.
So spooked by the blitzes that forced him left is why his mechanics fell apart on that redzone play.

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(Could have stepped up and maybe hit DHop for a 4 yard pass)

End of the game we pick it up but Kyler panics and throws off his back foot.

curious if the top one KD missed a pick up. He sure doesnt seem to have any urgency in running his route

 

[FB94]

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I wish I had an endzone copy of that one.

Cause I think the corner is in a zone and was reading where the ball was going.

He's standing between Kirk and KJ as the play develops and reading Kyler. Now maybe there's a play to be made, but I think just chucking it deep wouldnt have worked. He was going to have to drill the football in there imo.

He had time though so maybe he could have done another pump fake.

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I wish I had an endzone copy of that one.

Cause I think the corner is in a zone and was reading where the ball was going.

He's standing between Kirk and KJ as the play develops and reading Kyler. Now maybe there's a play to be made, but I think just chucking it deep wouldnt have worked. He was going to have to drill the football in there imo.

He had time though so maybe he could have done another pump fake.

Not much speed beyond KJ? If KJ is considered fast we have the slowest group of WR in the league

 

[juza76]

Not much speed beyond KJ? If KJ is considered fast we have the slowest group of WR in the league

They are slower almost everywhere
Defensive line
Inside Linebacker
Cornerbacks

Then Ithey lack tackling skills (defense)
And catching abilities (receivers)

Thats why Murray has often to play at pro bowl level to put this team competing, and the great Hopkins isn't enough
I don't mention the missed field goals
This is a team built very badly