Ken Somers Blog: We'll Probably Trade Down

[kerouac9]

Somers said that - reading between the lines of various conversations he's had with Rod Graves on the draft during the past week - leads him to believe that the Cards will definitely trade down. RG apparently feels that, by doing so, we can wind up with additional picks and maybe even an extra 2nd round pick.

How, exactly did you get that out of what Kent Somers actually wrote:

Graves chose his words carefully, but it's clear if the Cardinals are going to make a trade, it will be to move down, not up, on draft weekend.

This is the worst kind of rumormongering. Are you trying to get this story in PFW, or what?

 

[AsUdUdE]

The only team that really makes sense who would want to trade up is if Quinn is still there at 9... If the dolphons are indeed enamared with quinn a trade of the 9, 40, for our 5th, pick makes the most amount of sense.

that is the going rate to move up... I mean Detroit was asking for Tampa 2nd AND 3rd picks just top move up two spots. So if the Dolphins want to move up 4 spots in the top 10, It would cost them atleast one second, maybe even a fourth or fifth two.

If this is the case: I would love to see the Cards draft Levi Brown with the #9 pick and the get a solid corner (Eric Wright, Marcus McCauley) and a stud end like Anthony Spencer or OLB like Jon Beason....

Use our #3rd round pick on Buster Davis and you have yourself a great draft!

 

[BACH]

I think trading down is stupid UNLESS we trade down to 7-8 and get /levi Brown and a 2nd round pick, which is pretty much impossible.

Miami is the most likely trade partner, since they're looking for a franchise QB and have lots of picks.

Several options:

Our 1st and 3rd (1945) for their 1st, 2nd and 4th (1928)

Our 1st (1700) for their 1st, low 2nd and 4th (1728)

 

[Totally_Red]

The only way a trade down makes sense is the following scenario...

1 Oakl - Jamarcus Russell
2 Det - Joe Thomas
3 Clev - Adrian Peterson
4 TB - Calvin Johnson
5 Ariz - ?

In that case they trade down no more than 2-3 slots with someone and draft Brown, Landry or Adams. This assumes they are reasonably certain that Minnesota or their trading partner is taking Brady Quinn. #5 is too high for Brown IMO. The Skins are likely to take Landry or Adams if they stay put.

I really don't see a trade down because I think either Thomas or Peterson will be there.

 

[lobo]

We need a few more difference-makers on our rosters to put us over the top - we've already added enough grinders in free agency.[/quote]

If anything, we will not go lower than 9. Cannot afford to pass on Brown if Thomas is gone. If we can get another 3 or a 4 and 6 and assure ourselves of Brown you can book it.

 

[lobo]

If Thomas or Peterson are on the board at #5 and we trade down this team is run by complete idiots.

They will not pass on either at 5 if they are available. Not only is it the right thing to do, but the questions won't stop until they are run out of town.

 

[Bobcat]

If Thomas or Peterson are on the board at #5 and we trade down this team is run by complete idiots.

I totally agree with you. Maybe the old Cardinal's would pull off this stupid blunder, not this new group. Either pick could make us a playoff team this year. Just look what happened to us with Pace and Johnson. We passed on Suggs and he has made the pro-bowl in the past. four years. Pace and Johnson have yet lived up to what Suggs would have done in this league.


BOBCAT

 

[lobo]

I totally agree with you. Maybe the old Cardinal's would pull off this stupid blunder, not this new group. Either pick could make us a playoff team this year. Just look what happened to us with Pace and Johnson. We passed on Suggs and he has made the pro-bowl in the past. four years. Pace and Johnson have yet lived up to what Suggs would have done in this league.


BOBCAT

Agree on all fronts. I have always weighed on the side of need, but the other day I heard a very compelling interview with Mike Holmgren and he was so much leaning toward BPA he is making me rethink things. He essentially said if a major difference maker is available you have to take him whether you need him or not. He was very adament and if you looked in his eyes he meant it! So on that note..TAKE THOMAS!!

 

[phillycard]

Nooooooo!! For What???!!

 

[JeffGollin]

Nowhere in this does it say we probably or definitely will trade down- ya'll are making some big assumptions from this tiny piece of writing. Of course the Cardinals won't trade up. I think people are reading WAY too much into this blog entry.

You're right.I re-read Kent's blog. It was easy to skim over its nuances (which I unfortunately did). He basically said, "if a trade could be worked out, Graves sees the advantages in doing so." That's a significant "if."

My bad.

 

[Mitch]

It is an if because team's are loathe to trade up into the top $$$$ slots...but that if will depend on two players, IMO, AP and Brady Quinn...if either is still on the board at #5, the phones at Cards' HQs may be ringing.

 

[Skkorpion]

Two things have been clearly settled about this draft already, as evidenced by the posts on this board the last three weeks:

1. Regardless of who we pick, or trade up for, or down for, Rod Graves will be deemed moronic, stupid, incompetent or worse by no less than 1/3 of all Cards fans.

2. If we trade down past #7, we'll find out the true capacity of our server. I think we'll crash at about 300 people on-line at the same time. Given that we are now running often at a level of over 100 visitors each day all day, we may have to upgrade again. If we need to, we will. Just bear with us. I can't justify spending the money until the need is proven.

Back to Rod Graves. This draft is truly all on him now. My opinion is that he will trade down because he really does want more picks this year.

 

[ajcardfan]

Back to Rod Graves. This draft is truly all on him now. My opinion is that he will trade down because he really does want more picks this year.

And, I predict many posts saying, no matter what we do, we have to beleive Whisenhunt wanted it to happen. And, who are we to second-guess Whisenhunt?


(I agree with you Skkorp, it's Graves' responsibility now.)

 

[lobo]

And, I predict many posts saying, no matter what we do, we have to beleive Whisenhunt wanted it to happen. And, who are we to second-guess Whisenhunt?


(I agree with you Skkorp, it's Graves' responsibility now.)

The only possible way they trade down if Thomas is gone and they are sure they will get Brown. It looks like Miami is going to pick up Green eliminating the need for Quinn so they will not be looking to move. Vikings are then in a position to take Quinn if they want him. That leaves Atlanta as the only sensible partner. Texas would jump on Brown. 9 in the lowest we would go and that would not draw an additional 3. Maybe a 4 and 6/7.

As stated many times on the board, they MUST walk away with Thomas or Brown.

 

[WildBB]

So on that note..TAKE THOMAS!!

You need'nt worry about Thomas. They'll make that pick. It the others I worry about.

 

[john h]

Trading down with Joe Thomas on the board would be the exact duplicate of passing on Suggs for two scrubs.

If Thomas is gone, I can't fault them at all.

If they do trade down, I think they should take Patrick Willis.

Trading down with Thomas on the board would be buying fools gold. The further down you go the less likely your first pick will be a keeper. We have never been good at this. It is how smart you draft not how many you draft.

 

[john h]

We need 2 things. An OT and a playmaker on defense. Trading too far down will take us out of both.

Everything I have read coming out of Graves or Whiz's mouth indicates we will stay put and draft #5. That would seem to trump what other people speculate. What sense does it make to put out a rumor you are going to trade down. How does a rumor like that help the Cards? If you were going to do that it would seem to be counter productive to make it public. The people who really know probably had to sign a death oath to keep thier mouth shut.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I totally agree with you. Maybe the old Cardinal's would pull off this stupid blunder, not this new group. Either pick could make us a playoff team this year. Just look what happened to us with Pace and Johnson. We passed on Suggs and he has made the pro-bowl in the past. four years. Pace and Johnson have yet lived up to what Suggs would have done in this league.


BOBCAT

Blah Blah Blah,

Hearing about the Johnson/Pace trade is about as old as the "Bidwills are cheap" line. Trading down is just fine, but it depends on what you do with the picks.

Can you imagine what would've happened if Graves has selected Boldin and Larry Johnson, instead of Johnson/Pace? Graves would be a hero.

 

[Mulli]

Blah Blah Blah,

Hearing about the Johnson/Pace trade is about as old as the "Bidwills are cheap" line. Trading down is just fine, but it depends on what you do with the picks.

Can you imagine what would've happened if Graves has selected Boldin and Larry Johnson, instead of Johnson/Pace? Graves would be a hero.[/quote]

Sorry, based on Graves' track record, I cannot imagine the above actually happening.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Blah Blah Blah,

Hearing about the Johnson/Pace trade is about as old as the "Bidwills are cheap" line. Trading down is just fine, but it depends on what you do with the picks.

Can you imagine what would've happened if Graves has selected Boldin and Larry Johnson, instead of Johnson/Pace? Graves would be a hero.[/quote]

Sorry, based on Graves' track record, I cannot imagine the above actually happening.

At the time, Graves didn't have a track record. Like I said, we would be a hero if he would have selected LJ and Boldin. His track record would be golden.

 

[Mulli]

At the time, Graves didn't have a track record. Like I said, we would be a hero if he would have selected LJ and Boldin. His track record would be golden.

That would have made up for trading a first for Mirer when he was with the Bears.

 

[Zeno]

Blah Blah Blah,

Hearing about the Johnson/Pace trade is about as old as the "Bidwills are cheap" line. Trading down is just fine, but it depends on what you do with the picks.

Can you imagine what would've happened if Graves has selected Boldin and Larry Johnson, instead of Johnson/Pace? Graves would be a hero.

Its not the trade down as much as what was picked there. We can imagine all we want but the reality is Pace and Johnson were the picks, not Larry Johnson and Boldin. That is what Graves will have to make us forget, the reality of what happened and not what we can "imagine", because last I checked we lived in a world of reality and not of fairy tales and imagination.

 

[kerouac9]

Its not the trade down as much as what was picked there. We can imagine all we want but the reality is Pace and Johnson were the picks, not Larry Johnson and Boldin. That is what Graves will have to make us forget, the reality of what happened and not what we can "imagine", because last I checked we lived in a world of reality and not of fairy tales and imagination.

Really, drafting Boldin and Larry Johnson would have made us not hate the trade down the way we currently do, but not the stinky terms that the Cards got strongarmed into by the Saints. It was like we had to pay a surcharge for the privilege of trading down for crappier talent.

And even then, it was obvious that the Cards needed immediate help at DE and WR, but we ended up with projects. Yes, Gerald Hayes has turned into a contributor, but it was three years after we drafted him. That's bad value, any way you cut it.

It's the difference between drafting Joe Thomas and Levi Jones or the kid from Central Michigan. The latter two guys might be better in three years, but if we want to win right now, Joe Thomas is the most NFL-ready prospect and immediate contributor.

It's kind of the inverse of Marcus McNeill and Ferguson. Ferguson could be a Pro Bowl talent for 10-12 years if he develops physically and mentally. McNeill was ready to play right out of Auburn, but his back problems will likely limit his career.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Its not the trade down as much as what was picked there. We can imagine all we want but the reality is Pace and Johnson were the picks, not Larry Johnson and Boldin. That is what Graves will have to make us forget, the reality of what happened and not what we can "imagine", because last I checked we lived in a world of reality and not of fairy tales and imagination.

I get what you are saying. I don't have a problem with the trade down scenerio at all. If you have a problem with trading down, because you aren't sure that Graves can make solid picks, why do we trust him to make a good pick at any time in the draft?

For the record, I want us to draft Thomas with the #5.

 

[Shogun]

John Sullivan out of the league.

Pace (somehow) is still on the team.
SH is actually pretty good.

At least we won that deal, right....?