as it climbed elevation reports are that it was going even faster than 180mph
Kobe Bryant Dead: Helicopter Crash
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as it climbed elevation reports are that it was going even faster than 180mph
Terrible tragedy. Condolences to all affected. 
elindholm
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Wow, that sucks. It's like you know the danger is there lurking, but once it's upon you, you can't figure out how to react.
Raindog
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I'm pretty sure that would have been the case regardless.
I've posted in this thread a couple of times. What's your issue with me?
adding to this, that is fast even for a helicopter. now figure in the known weather conditions and you wonder why they were going that fast in those conditions.
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Could it be like an airplane and trying to gain elevation by going faster?
I haven't read the latest. It's so depressing.
BC867
Long time Phoenician!
Realistically, after the Sheriff and Police helicopters had been grounded because of the heavy fog
(100% humidity), both the pilot (even though new to Kobe) and Kobe (as the helicopter owner)
should have turned around. June Gloom fog is dangerous.
It is ironic that the same stubborn over-the-top driving force that led Kobe to greatness on the
basketball court led to his demise. And that of other innocent people.
Ironic and sad!
Phrazbit
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Planes can glide when they have a problem, in most planes you can glide 10+ feet forward for every 1 foot you descend.
Helicopters however, if something goes wrong they drop like a stone... terminal velocity might account for some of the speed readings.
They also have a maneuver that pilots can pull in an emergency where they deliberately nose dive and then flair at the last second, but I expect that would be nearly impossible to pull off successfully at low altitude, in hills and fog.
Helicopters however, if something goes wrong they drop like a stone... terminal velocity might account for some of the speed readings.
They also have a maneuver that pilots can pull in an emergency where they deliberately nose dive and then flair at the last second, but I expect that would be nearly impossible to pull off successfully at low altitude, in hills and fog.
carrrnuttt
Didactic
Quite incorrect.
Collective pitch is a mechanical connection that allows a heli pilot to angle rotors so that it stays spinning and generating some lift, allowing the helicopter to "glide" down in the event of a catastrophic engine failure (autorotation). I emphasized "mechanical connection," because unless someone climbed out of the heli and broke that cable/rod connection, this will always be an option during a helicopter engine failure.
https://www.popularmechanics.com/flight/a20559/how-helicopters-land-safely-engine-cuts-out/
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I doubt that helicopter was that light, and the remaining fuel in their accounts for additional weight too, it was carrying 9 passengers comfortably.
Phrazbit
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One, this only accounts for engine failure, if the problem is with either rotor then there is nothing you can do.
Secondly, I described the maneuver in the video in my post but you cut it out. And, as I mentioned, it is hard to imagine someone successfully diving and flaring while flying at high speed, in hills and thick fog.
JCSunsfan
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I wonder if it was that same loss of the horizon problem that happens to airplane pilots in the fog or at night. That’s what official now believe happened to John F Kennedy Jr. Their equilibrium gets thrown off and then they do not trust their instruments.
elindholm
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I knew that this story reminded me of something -- yep, similar case, at least if the speculation in that article is correct. The pilot interviewed even said as much (without mentioning the Kennedy crash).
carrrnuttt
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Rotors are designed to provide enough lift to the heli they're on. So whatever the weight may be, an autorotor maneuver can be successful since we know that the rotor has enough surface area to do so.
True, but I highly doubt that that is what happened in this case.
A mechanical failure is more likely, but even that is a distant possibility.
Also, rotor failure during flight is rare. The IHST doesn't even have an entry for in its pie chart for systems failure types of classes: http://www.ihst.org/portals/54/symposium/2016/Presentation IHST-CIS_2016.pdf (slide #8). Pitch control failure might affect this, but that's also only 3.4 percent of all occurrences. By far, engine failure is the biggest cause of systems failure crashes. And even then systems failures are less than a quarter as far as causes of heli crashes. Outright pilot errors and violations account for almost 3/4 of the overall crashes pie.
Ah, I though you were describing it for fixed wing planes, since a glide down and pull up to use the wings as an air brake is also a maneuver planes can do.
DemsMyBoys
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For as long as I can remember the standard opening for a So Cal weather report has been, “Night and early morning low clouds and fog along the coast from Point Conception to the Mexican border.”
As soon as I saw photos of the crash site I thought the fog must have been a major contributor to the crash.
As soon as I saw photos of the crash site I thought the fog must have been a major contributor to the crash.
carrrnuttt
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Phrazbit
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Man... if Kobe's pilot simply lost his instrument bearings, lost what was up and down, and that is what led to the crash... that is sad stuff, especially considering he already was aware of the terrible conditions and should have been playing extra close attention to his instruments.
I have a private pilot's license... or at least I used to, I haven't done a review in years so it isn't valid currently. I got the thing when my dad (a retired airline and air force pilot) had his own plane, he took me up and taught me how to fly. I also got to sneak in time on simulators at the airline he flew for.
I was NOT instrument qualified and I've never flown a helicopter, but I gotta think Kobe's pilot was instrument qualified and the way helicopters move, I would think the shift in gravity would be very apparent as you're getting close to rolling the thing over. I just cannot fathom how an experienced pilot would make such an amateur mistake. He requested a clearance to climb out of the fog, obviously because he couldn't see jack... so how would he not have been watching his instruments?
I gotta think something broke on the helicopter and the fog, combined with their high speed and relatively low altitude, made it almost impossible to recover. At least I hope so, the pilot losing track of which way was up... that is just an awful and easily avoided mistake to lead to the death of 9 people.
I absolutely agree with what the dude in the linked video said though, I cannot believe they were flying in those conditions. One time when I was a teenager, I was with my dad and we landed his plane during a storm, with cloud cover waaaaaaay higher than what it looks like they were dealing with. My dad flew F-5's, he has tens of thousands of hours of flight time in commercial airliners, but I was scared shitlless.
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Phrazbit
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Man... this got me in the feels.
NTSB: Helicopter was 20-30 feet from clearing mountain
https://www.abc15.com/news/national...mountain?utm=email&category=Homepage Showcase
The NTSB continued its investigation on Tuesday into why a helicopter carrying Kobe Bryant and eight others crashed on Sunday into a hillside in Southern California, killing all nine on board.
According to NTSB investigator Jennifer Homendy, the helicopter came 20 to 30 feet from avoiding the mountain.
But investigators are interested in why the helicopter descended rapidly. Homendy said that the helicopter descended at a rate of 2,000 feet per minute. The helicopter went from an altitude of 2,300 feet above sea level, and crashed at 1,085 feet above sea level.
"This was a high-energy-impact crash and the helicopter was in a descending left bank," she said.
https://www.abc15.com/news/national...mountain?utm=email&category=Homepage Showcase
The NTSB continued its investigation on Tuesday into why a helicopter carrying Kobe Bryant and eight others crashed on Sunday into a hillside in Southern California, killing all nine on board.
According to NTSB investigator Jennifer Homendy, the helicopter came 20 to 30 feet from avoiding the mountain.
But investigators are interested in why the helicopter descended rapidly. Homendy said that the helicopter descended at a rate of 2,000 feet per minute. The helicopter went from an altitude of 2,300 feet above sea level, and crashed at 1,085 feet above sea level.
"This was a high-energy-impact crash and the helicopter was in a descending left bank," she said.
BC867
Long time Phoenician!
The expert commercial helicopter pilot confirmed the strong possibility that I considered.
That the pilot might have said they need to land (or turn back), but Kobe (as his employer)
might have said, "I don't turn back. Continue on."
If so, the strong personality that drove Kobe (as Michael) to greatness became his own worst enemy.
elindholm
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Dude, for God's sake. I mean really.
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