Lamar Jackson vs Mike Vick: Who is/was a better NFL prospect?

[Solar7]

Wrong. He threw for over 3,000 yards twice in Philly...and over 60% once in Philly. He also carried several bad teams and has a career w/l record of 61-51-1...I'd also disagree about him not being dominant. There were a couple of seasons where he was flat out the best player on any field, whenever he played. Vick's problem was that he could have even be better and more consistent, if he had better habits early on in ATL, before the jail time.

IMO, if Jackson favors comparably with Vick, but has his head screwed on straight, he could be huge with the right development.

Sorry, I meant to focus just on the first 5 years of him as a starter with the Falcons. I try to evaluate guys' careers based on their first team - if a guy doesn't make it to his second contract (or in this case doesn't fulfill it because of character issues), I consider them a bust for their team. Sam Bradford could win a Super Bowl for us, and it wouldn't make him any less of a bad pick for the Rams.

 

[juza76]

Lamar Jackson combine throws:

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LJ interview at the combine:

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Vick breaks down LJ:

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Stephen A. Smith on LJ:

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Couple of bad throws followed by some good throws, probably wasnt much comfortable there
Anyway football is a game which hasnt anything to do with what is displayed at combine

 

[GatorAZ]

The offenses they played in along with the eras are so different that’s you can’t compare their production. You can only base it on physical gifts and Vick was second to none.

 

[GimmedaBall]

Couple of bad throws followed by some good throws, probably wasnt much comfortable there
Anyway football is a game which hasnt anything to do with what is displayed at combine

So, you think he is going to be more comfortable in the pros with 11 D players bearing down on him and the WR?

LJ has the arm strength but his delivery of flicking the ball out really cuts down on the speed of the delivery. Wonder how many of his combine throws where he was more intent on accuracy than zipping the ball in to the WR will end up as INTs? Pro-level DBs will jump on those guided darts.

The advantage of the combine is every player is performing the same drills on the same day which sets a baseline to compare them against one another.

 

[DevonCardsFan]

So you don`t think NFL coaching can fix or improve any of the flaws any of the QBs have? Or just Lamar Jackson? How about about Josh Allen and his inaccuracy and poor decision making? Is that fixable?Or Baker Mayfields lack of big arm or Mason Rudolph being a big guy with a average arm and poor decisions?

What I invite you to do is, instead of using giant generalities. Why don't you read the scouting reports, like me, find a good comparison and state your point. This thread was comparing Jacskson to Vick. Jackson and Pryor have very similar scouting reports.

I am pro Rudolph and Jackson, be happy with either as a pick. Cards going to go WR round 1. But it would be foolish to think Jacksons bust potential isn't huge. You don't just suddenly become a precision passer in the NFL lol. You Couldnt name one.

 

[overseascardfan]

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Michael Vick thinks Jackson was better than him coming out of college.

 

[BW52]

What I invite you to do is, instead of using giant generalities. Why don't you read the scouting reports, like me, find a good comparison and state your point. This thread was comparing Jacskson to Vick. Jackson and Pryor have very similar scouting reports.

I am pro Rudolph and Jackson, be happy with either as a pick. Cards going to go WR round 1. But it would be foolish to think Jacksons bust potential isn't huge. You don't just suddenly become a precision passer in the NFL lol. You Couldnt name one.

Hey Devon-i .I have read the freaking scouting reports and you know what i have seen Jackson for 3 years and i state with coaching i think Jackson can improve his technique and footwork and i think that will improve his accuracy .No i don`t think Jackson will suddenly overnite turn into Bob Griese or Joe Montana but i do think improvement will be shown.He improved as a QB every year in college and he is a smart kid who is a willing worker.FWIW Michael Vick stats that Lamar is a better prospect than he was when he came out of college.I agree that he has bust potential,so do Darnold,Rosen,Mayfield and Allen and every other freaking QB in the draft.Jackson also has a tremendous ceiling.The question is ..which team will the one to pick him and try to make the best use of that potential.Do i think the Cards have enough balls to swing for the fences with Lamar Jackson? No i don`t.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

I think Lamar will be fine. Nearly a 60% completion percentage this past season.

Brett Favre was barely a 52% passer in college. Improved nearly every season in the NFL. Became a career 62% passer. Best year in the league was his 19th season at 68.4%, playing in all 16 games and 2 playoff games.

That stat is a bit overrated once QB's reach a certain level anyway. If it directly translated to success in the NFL, Drew Stanton 64.1% would be better than Aaron Rodgers 63.8%.

 

[daves]

If it directly translated to success in the NFL, Drew Stanton 64.1% would be better than Aaron Rodgers 63.8%.

Drew Stanton has never even APPROACHED 64.1% completion percentage for a season. In his BEST year he completed 58% of his passes. His career average is an appalling 52.4%, and a putrid 51.4% with Arizona.

People continue to under-appreciate just how horrid Drew Stanton is!

Mike Glennon on the other hand actually has a career 60.6% completion percentage, with a pretty good 66.4% in his "horrible" 2017 in Chicago.

For the curious - Blaine Gabbert is a career 55.9% passer (and was true to form with the Cardinals at 55.6%). Ulch.

...dbs

Edit: Thanks to juza76, i now realize that BIM was referencing Stanton's college completion percentage. Makes a lot more sense now! I'm having a tough time associating Stanton with a decent completion percentage at any level!

 

[juza76]

Drew Stanton has never even APPROACHED 64.1% completion percentage for a season. In his BEST year he completed 58% of his passes. His career average is an appalling 52.4%, and a putrid 51.4% with Arizona.

People continue to under-appreciate just how horrid Drew Stanton is!

Mike Glennon on the other hand actually has a career 60.6% completion percentage, with a pretty good 66.4% in his "horrible" 2017 in Chicago.

For the curious - Blaine Gabbert is a career 55.9% passer (and was true to form with the Cardinals at 55.6%). Ulch.

...dbs

I thought he was comparing the college career percentage of completed passes

 

[daves]

I thought he was comparing the college career percentage of completed passes

Ahh... Yeah that makes sense! Thanks for catching that. Apparently after watching far too much of Stanton's ineptitude I was unable to correctly parse "Stanton" and "64.2%" in the same sentence!

...dbs

 

[DevonCardsFan]

Hey Devon-i .I have read the freaking scouting reports and you know what i have seen Jackson for 3 years and i state with coaching i think Jackson can improve his technique and footwork and i think that will improve his accuracy .No i don`t think Jackson will suddenly overnite turn into Bob Griese or Joe Montana but i do think improvement will be shown.He improved as a QB every year in college and he is a smart kid who is a willing worker.FWIW Michael Vick stats that Lamar is a better prospect than he was when he came out of college.I agree that he has bust potential,so do Darnold,Rosen,Mayfield and Allen and every other freaking QB in the draft.Jackson also has a tremendous ceiling.The question is ..which team will the one to pick him and try to make the best use of that potential.Do i think the Cards have enough balls to swing for the fences with Lamar Jackson? No i don`t.

Everyone keeps using Vicks quote as a reason to prove Jackson skillset is amazing and he is the next Vick LOL. The true test to that would be, that there wouldn't be 4 or 5 QBS projected to go ahead of him In the draft if that was the case. None of these QBs are even cant miss prospects, that are projected to go ahead of Jackson. Just because he runs around, doesnt mean he's the next Michael Vick, he can easily be the next Terrelle Pryor. He hasn't shown he can even fit in a prostyle offense, or shown he is quick enough to even digest running a prostyle offense. We saw what happened to Kaep when they tried to make him a passer and took him out of the read option, read option QBs are a thing of the past, most teams don't want to limit themselves into running that limited of an offense. Also in the NFL the passing windows are so small, Jacksons passes were he just heaves the ball in a general direction, will be eaten alive in the NFL. Again I am not completely against taking him, but all this Vick says he is better than him, can only go so far, Vick has also stated hes a great dog owner as well, so take it with a grain of salt. Lol

 

[BW52]

Everyone keeps using Vicks quote as a reason to prove Jackson skillset is amazing and he is the next Vick LOL. The true test to that would be, that there wouldn't be 4 or 5 QBS projected to go ahead of him In the draft if that was the case. None of these QBs are even cant miss prospects, that are projected to go ahead of Jackson. Just because he runs around, doesnt mean he's the next Michael Vick, he can easily be the next Terrelle Pryor. He hasn't shown he can even fit in a prostyle offense, or shown he is quick enough to even digest running a prostyle offense. We saw what happened to Kaep when they tried to make him a passer and took him out of the read option, read option QBs are a thing of the past, most teams don't want to limit themselves into running that limited of an offense. Also in the NFL the passing windows are so small, Jacksons passes were he just heaves the ball in a general direction, will be eaten alive in the NFL. Again I am not completely against taking him, but all this Vick says he is better than him, can only go so far, Vick has also stated hes a great dog owner as well, so take it with a grain of salt. Lol

NFL.com QB rankings
Sam Darnold 7.00
Josh Rosen 6.19
Baker Mayfield 6.03
Josh Allen 6.01
Lamar Jackson 5.95
Mason Rudolph 5.66

That tells me that Darnold is top guy and most so-called "experts: agree
Josh Rosen next guy
Mayfield,Allen,Jackson all within a hair of each other.
Mason Rudolph behind top 5 guys

I think it is very funny that people talk about Jacksons "heaves" saying they will be eaten up by NFL DBs while many thing a guy with a weaker arm,less mobility ,Shorter height will come in and be a star.
Baker Mayfield can easily turn out to be Andre Ware or Ty Dettmer or Manziel
Sam Darnold can turnout to be Matt Leinart (i still think he deserved a better shot than he got)
Rosen-can turnout to be Jay Cutler 2.0
Who knows?

 

[DevonCardsFan]

NFL.com QB rankings
Sam Darnold 7.00
Josh Rosen 6.19
Baker Mayfield 6.03
Josh Allen 6.01
Lamar Jackson 5.95
Mason Rudolph 5.66

That tells me that Darnold is top guy and most so-called "experts: agree
Josh Rosen next guy
Mayfield,Allen,Jackson all within a hair of each other.
Mason Rudolph behind top 5 guys

I think it is very funny that people talk about Jacksons "heaves" saying they will be eaten up by NFL DBs while many thing a guy with a weaker arm,less mobility ,Shorter height will come in and be a star.
Baker Mayfield can easily turn out to be Andre Ware or Ty Dettmer or Manziel
Sam Darnold can turnout to be Matt Leinart (i still think he deserved a better shot than he got)
Rosen-can turnout to be Jay Cutler 2.0
Who knows?

Yeah I agree, I don't want one of those 4, Mayfield will be a bust galore want nothing to do with him, Dont like Allen. Cards ain't getting Darnold or Rosen. I think if Jackson or Rudolph fall to late 1st, early 2nd Cards should swap and get them and move up. But I dont want either @ 15. Rather them go WR, or someone who is ranked 1 or 2 at there position, than get the 5th rated QB with question marks.

 

[BW52]

Yeah I agree, I don't want one of those 4, Mayfield will be a bust galore want nothing to do with him, Dont like Allen. Cards ain't getting Darnold or Rosen. I think if Jackson or Rudolph fall to late 1st, early 2nd Cards should swap and get them and move up. But I dont want either @ 15. Rather them go WR, or someone who is ranked 1 or 2 at there position, than get the 5th rated QB with question marks.

FWIW
saw a couple of GUys on NFL.com today (Bucky Brooks was one) talking about where they think top QBs go.
1.Cleveland -Sam Darnold
3.Jets- Josh Rosen
12.Buffalo-Josh Allen
15.AZ-Baker Mayfield (although they did say Cards really like Josh Allen)
29.Jax-Lamar Jackson

 

[overseascardfan]

Jackson would not be a fit in BAs scheme but if McCoy runs a WC offense focusing on short to intermediate routes then Jackson has a better chance of improving accuracy. If he can develop better footwork and getting his feet set so he can drive on the ball he will improve a lot. By making that adjustment he wouldn’t have to rely on the wrist flick to add zip to his throws which may also improve his accuracy. Again, if ARZ feels Jackson is their man and McCoy can build his scheme around his strengths and make certain adjustments Jackson potentially could end up the best QB in this draft.

 

[Chopper0080]

Jackson would not be a fit in BAs scheme but if McCoy runs a WC offense focusing on short to intermediate routes then Jackson has a better chance of improving accuracy. If he can develop better footwork and getting his feet set so he can drive on the ball he will improve a lot. By making that adjustment he wouldn’t have to rely on the wrist flick to add zip to his throws which may also improve his accuracy. Again, if ARZ feels Jackson is their man and McCoy can build his scheme around his strengths and make certain adjustments Jackson potentially could end up the best QB in this draft.

Are you really trying to say that a quick decision and timing/accuracy offense is GOOD fit for a college QB like Lamar Jackson who struggles with drop timing, footwork, and working through progressions? This isn't a knock on Lamar, but I would argue that McCoy's offense might be the WORST fit for him unless he gimmicks it like he did for Tebow which would then be wasting Jackson's talent.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Are you really trying to say that a quick decision and timing/accuracy offense is GOOD fit for a college QB like Lamar Jackson who struggles with drop timing, footwork, and working through progressions? This isn't a knock on Lamar, but I would argue that McCoy's offense might be the WORST fit for him unless he gimmicks it like he did for Tebow which would then be wasting Jackson's talent.

I think they need to model the offense after the Panthers and Cam Newton and hope that he can learn to not run as often like Cam did later in his career.

 

[oaken1]

I wholeheartedly disagree with that. Vick never led his team to anything relevant past two playoff wins. He broke his fibula on a stupid running play in preseason (the same concern we'll have about Jackson) and wasted an entire year. He only started a full 16 game slate once. He never threw for over 3,000 yards, or over 60% completions.

This doesn't mean I'm anti-Jackson, but outside of Vick's awesome highlight reel, he wasn't a truly dominant player.

that is true. what Vick did at the time was sell lots of jerseys and tickets for a squad that was flailing. He created lots of excitement in ATL.... GM's will draft for that as well as wins.

when Cam came into the league folks hoped they were gonna get the Vick style of play(granted Cam is a better passer) but finally in a guy who could do it for years on end without injuries... but as it turns out...you cant. QB's who run the ball a lot, get hurt. just like pocket QB's who cannot run, get hurt...

as with all running QB's the hope is Jackson can be taught to scramble just enough to get clear for a pass... and he learns when running is the right choice.... but all of his runs should be headed towards the sidelines. If he is gonna go all Tecmo Bowl it needs to be at the right time... NFCC/AFCC Game, SB.... not in week three against the Browns

 

[GatorAZ]

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft...s-to-cardinals-quenton-nelson-drops-to-bears/