Landry Shamet traded to suns for Javon Carter and 29th pick

[82CardsGrad]

I like Shamet, but couldn't the Suns have gotten at least the equivalent at #29 (with all of the combo guard prospects that were available), only younger, cheaper and with more upside, while keeping Carter's salary to match in a trade for some much needed size up front? Again, I have no problem packaging #29 and Carter for a veteran, but I was hoping for a big man or at least a notable upgrade over what was available at #29.

Meanwhile...

1) Is this a signal that Cam Payne (or worse, Chris Paul) isn't returning?

2) What are the Suns going to do to fill their gaping holes in the front court?

CP3 not returning so we grab Shamet? LOL...

 

[Covert Rain]

even if it's not a win over the Nets, it's a net win for the Suns regardless. Great pickup to give Devin a little rest next season. And he's probably gonna need more of it after playing in the Finals and then going directly to the Olympics.

Definitely a win for the Suns. Plus, I am not convinced Carter plays heavily into the Nets plans. That team is pretty deep with guys that need the ball to be effective. So they trade for a guy that never left the Suns bench?

 

[Mainstreet]

No, it's not that. Look I get it that there is like a 5% chance the #29 pick turns into a good player - but that is better than 0%.

The only way to get cheap good players is draft them. You get someone like a Siakam late in the first round and that has a hell of a lot more value than a Shamet who is likely a 1 year regular season player rental.

I understand the odds are not good, but you can't win if you don't play, and I don't see how other than getting Book and Paul more rest in the regular season this move improves our title chances.

If the Suns do not pay Shamet after this coming season it turns into a salary dump. Carter was guaranteed $3,925,000 for the 2022/23 season.

 

[SirStefan32]

No, it's not that. Look I get it that there is like a 5% chance the #29 pick turns into a good player - but that is better than 0%.

The only way to get cheap good players is draft them. You get someone like a Siakam late in the first round and that has a hell of a lot more value than a Shamet who is likely a 1 year regular season player rental.

I understand the odds are not good, but you can't win if you don't play.

But we are not a lottery team anymore- this team was in the Finals a couple of weeks ago. Roster spots are important, money gets tighter, rotations are harder to crack for new players.

There is no room for a player selected at the end of the first round. Paul, Booker, Bridges, Crowder, Ayton, Cam P, Cam J are the top seven players. Saric is out for the season but takes up a roster spot. Stix takes up a roster spot- that's nine spots taken already, and the Suns still need a backup shooting guard, at least one rotation big and one third-big. Probably another backup point guard, whether it's Moore or someone else.

There just aren't enough roster spots. Bridges and Ayton are about to get extensions, Payne is going to take up the mid-level exception most likely. Backup big will take the other exception. There isn't enough money to pay guaranteed salary for someone to sit on the bench while taking up a roster spot.

I don't understand why you want a guaranteed contract for someone to sit on the bench.

 

[Mainstreet]

that's a pretty cheap 1 year deal for a solid back up SG, if that's what he ends up being.

This is what's the Suns have to offer him to keep his rights as he is a RFA for the 2022/23 season.

 

[Chaplin]

No, it's not that. Look I get it that there is like a 5% chance the #29 pick turns into a good player - but that is better than 0%.

The only way to get cheap good players is draft them. You get someone like a Siakam late in the first round and that has a hell of a lot more value than a Shamet who is likely a 1 year regular season player rental.

I understand the odds are not good, but you can't win if you don't play, and I don't see how other than getting Book and Paul more rest in the regular season this move improves our title chances.

Well there's a 100% chance Shamet plays this year.

 

[Cheesebeef]

But we are not a lottery team anymore- this team was in the Finals a couple of weeks ago. Roster spots are important, money gets tighter, rotations are harder to crack for new players.

There is no room for a player selected at the end of the first round. Paul, Booker, Bridges, Crowder, Ayton, Cam P, Cam J are the top seven players. Saric is out for the season but takes up a roster spot. Stix takes up a roster spot- that's nine spots taken already, and the Suns still need a backup shooting guard, at least one rotation big and one third-big. Probably another backup point guard, whether it's Moore or someone else.

There just aren't enough roster spots. Bridges and Ayton are about to get extensions, Payne is going to take up the mid-level exception most likely. Backup big will take the other exception. There isn't enough money to pay guaranteed salary for someone to sit on the bench while taking up a roster spot.

I don't understand why you want a guaranteed contract for someone to sit on the bench.

Payne doesn't get the MLE, does he? I thought we had Payne's Birds rights, so we can use the MLE on an incoming player and be able to give Payne whatever they decide outside of that. That's how it worked with Dario last off-season when we used the MLE on Jae, right?

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I understand a rookie would likely not see much time in year 1. But if you want to get good players and potential all stars, you pretty much have to draft them - especially when you have 0 cap room for the next 5 years.

I totally get for next year Shamet is probably a good deal. But you can't keep just trading all your draft picks and expect to remain a good team in the long run.

Huh? Jones has only traded away this years draft pick. Stix? Cam Johnson? Weird perspective.

 

[82CardsGrad]

Huh? Jones has only traded away this years draft pick. Stix? Cam Johnson? Weird perspective.

Ayton... Bridges...

 

[SirStefan32]

Payne doesn't get the MLE, does he? I thought we had Payne's Birds rights, so we can use the MLE on an incoming player and be able to give Payne whatever they decide outside of that. That's how it worked with Dario last off-season when we used the MLE on Jae, right?

Sadly, they don't have his "full" bird rights. Because he makes so little money, Suns can only offer him a small amount using his partial Bird rights. MLE is the only way to pay him more than 4M or so I think.

 

[jlove]

Cap implications on the Brooklyn/Phoenix trade To Phoenix

Landry Shamet 2021/22- $3,768,342 * Rookie extension eligible starting on 8/6

Jevon Carter 2021/22- $3,650,000 2022/23- $3,925,000

Pick #29 has a $2M value but does not count toward salary in a trade

Not sure where someone got $5 mil for Shamet. Basically a wash contract wise this year between Shamet and Carter. Saves the Suns $2 mil for pick 29 this year and is a Salary dump of Carter saves Suns nearly $4 mil next year.

Hoping to hear that we get one of Nets 2nd rd picks in this deal that was we can grab a project big like Queta or Bassey.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I'm just stoked we can start talking about moving forward. I'll be honest... I had MUCH MUCH bigger stuff to worry about last week when we lost the Finals and because of that the loss kinda bounced off me with almost zero damage. actually, kinda stunned at how little I care that we lost, especially because I was SOOOOO certain we were going to win.

I'm now excited to see how we level up from here and go after the ring next year.

 

[jlove]

Sadly, they don't have his "full" bird rights. Because he makes so little money, Suns can only offer him a small amount using his partial Bird rights. MLE is the only way to pay him more than 4M or so I think.

We have Payne's partial Bird Rights which allows us to pay up to 105% increase, which would be approximately $10 mil

 

[Cheesebeef]

Sadly, they don't have his "full" bird rights. Because he makes so little money, Suns can only offer him a small amount using his partial Bird rights. MLE is the only way to pay him more than 4M or so I think.

oh poop. then I don't know how we're going to get another legit big game and keep Payne. A guy like Noel is going to cost the full MLE. Would we all collectively throw up if we brought in someone like... Dwight Howard? Is he even available?

 

[1Sun]

CP3 not returning so we grab Shamet? LOL...

I was more thinking the possibility that they lose Chris Paul, bring back Cam Payne (or a different CP3 replacement if Payne signs elsewhere), and therefore need that third guard in the rotation, which is where Shamet comes in.

One thing is for certain: If CP3 and Payne both return, we need a second big a heck of a lot more than we need a fourth guard.

 

[82CardsGrad]

oh poop. then I don't know how we're going to get another legit big game and keep Payne. A guy like Noel is going to cost the full MLE. Would we all collectively throw up if we brought in someone like... Dwight Howard? Is he even available?

Seemed to me in the interview yesterday, that Sarver was sorta preparing himself/us to pay some luxury tax $$... or, was I just hearing what I wanted to hear?

 

[Mainstreet]

Cap implications on the Brooklyn/Phoenix trade To Phoenix

Landry Shamet 2021/22- $3,768,342 * Rookie extension eligible starting on 8/6

Jevon Carter 2021/22- $3,650,000 2022/23- $3,925,000

Pick #29 has a $2M value but does not count toward salary in a trade

Not sure where someone got $5 mil for Shamet. Basically a wash contract wise this year between Shamet and Carter. Saves the Suns $2 mil for pick 29 this year and is a Salary dump of Carter saves Suns nearly $4 mil next year.

Hoping to hear that we get one of Nets 2nd rd picks in this deal that was we can grab a project big like Queta or Bassey.

Shamet is a restricted free agent after the 2021-22 season with a salary slot of $5,562,072 that the Suns must match to retain his rights.

If the Suns don't match offers when he becomes a RFA, he walks.

 

[82CardsGrad]

I was more thinking the possibility that they lose Chris Paul, bring back Cam Payne (or a different CP3 replacement if Payne signs elsewhere), and therefore need that third guard in the rotation, which is where Shamet comes in.

One thing is for certain: If CP3 and Payne both return, we need a second big a heck of a lot more than we need a fourth guard.

And how would this trade prevent Jones from getting a quality big?

 

[SirStefan32]

We have Payne's partial Bird Rights which allows us to pay up to 105% increase, which would be approximately $10 mil

Huh? He made less than $2M (1.97 to be precise.) How does that end up being $10M? 105% increase from $1,97 is $4.03M

 

[Folster]

That's a little dramatic since we're talking about the 2nd to last pick in the first round being traded for a 24-year-old.

Agreed. This isn't D'Antoni and Sarver pick dumping of the mid to late 2000's to get rid of contracts or to save money. This gives us a serviceable young player that can immediately back up Booker.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Seemed to me in the interview yesterday, that Sarver was sorta preparing himself/us to pay some luxury tax $$... or, was I just hearing what I wanted to hear?

from what i heard, I think he's willing to pay some tax. but with cap rules and such, we're still going to be limited from going after really good back up bigs if Cam's eating up some of that MLE.

 

[Dback Jon]

Seemed to me in the interview yesterday, that Sarver was sorta preparing himself/us to pay some luxury tax $$... or, was I just hearing what I wanted to hear?

He'd be stupid not too.

 

[1Sun]

And how would this trade prevent Jones from getting a quality big?

We are running out of salaries to match in a trade for a big without giving up a core player, we no longer have a draft pick to potentially get one there, which means that we have cornered ourselves into needing to sign one rotation big man with the MLE and another one for the minimum. (And yes, we need at least two bigs, given that Ayton is the only big on the roster.)

 

[jlove]

Huh? He made less than $2M (1.97 to be precise.) How does that end up being $10M? 105% increase from $1,97 is $4.03M

Sorry, Read the wrong thing the other day, however, we can sign Payne and not have to use MLE....
Cameron Payne: the Suns have Payne’s Early Bird Rights can re-sign Payne for up to the league average salary (about $10 million in year one, for up to 4 years) and not even use the MLE

 

[82CardsGrad]

We are running out of salaries to match in a trade for a big without giving up a core player, we no longer have a draft pick to potentially get one there, which means that we have cornered ourselves into needing to sign one rotation big man with the MLE and another one for the minimum. (And yes, we need at least two bigs, given that Ayton is the only big on the roster.)

Stix isn't a big?