Last Night's Fiasco

[minercon]

I don't know how many of you watched Channel 45 instead of TNT last night. During that horrible fiasco we call the 2nd quarter you should have heard Eddie and Al. They couldn't believe that Frankie was not trying to counteract the Spurs with Big Jake. Here several of our players were in foul trouble; Duncan and Robinson were having their way with us; we have and were still playing a 1/2 court transition game; and Johnson as someone pointed out was still stubborn.

The man cannot coach and has been surviving on last second miracles during this series. How many times during this year have we said play Little Jake more and he didn't. Finally something clicked and Jake must have had a super dupper game somewhere and he began playing him more. I call this an accidental learning experience and not a coach with ability or genius to recognize talent. Little Jake has more upside than Bo and Williams in many aspects. He has no idea how to develop these players or as it will come down to.....keep them in the future when their contracts are up.

Amare, in Johnson's own words and acknowledgements, stated earlier in the year that if Googs had not gone down he would not be getting the minutes. The man plays and breathes small ball, has no concept of something we can refer to as tall ball, and I hope will be let go at the end of this season. I am tired of his teeth showing through his mouth (but it is better than Skiles attitude) and should be replaced with someone that can and will use the talent that is on this team, but he can't seem to find it.

Again I repeat that you should have heard the real moans and groans on Channel 45. Al very seldom makes personal comments, but he was last night. Remember Big Jake has the ability to receive and dunk the ball and maybe get Duncan and Robinson in foul trouble....especially after the Spurs tallest buildings begin to get winded.

 

[SirStefan32]

I've been saying that FJ sucks eversince he took over for Skiles.

What I don't understand is why, SOMETIMES he playes a legitimate center for 48 minutes, wins that game, and then goes small again. Since playoffs started he's been going with the small ball, but I am refering to the regular season.

Fire Frank Johnson, and hire Mike Dunleavy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[scotsman13]

maybe it is that he doesnt believe that big jake can bring anything to the table. big jake wants the low post that belongs to amare (he has earned it). maybe he believe that big jake cant run ( heck i have seen him from about 10 feet away trying to run the court and i can tell you that i can walk faster then he can run). also he may not believe that big jake can bring anything to the table more then little jake, bo outlaw and scott williams. watching this game i think that he is right. big jake is slow and he jams up the lane with with his size making it harder for marbury, amare, hardaway and marion to take it inside. i guess that if you want to watch this team stand around and do nothing and not even try that you can hope that FJ puts big jake inside.

btw i was at the rocky mountian reeve where i saw ford, casey, amare and big jake all on the floor at the same time and it was scary the pace of the game slowed down to the point that you wouldnt believe it.

 

[Chaplin]

Ironic isn't it?

With Jason Kidd, our half court sets stunk--so we ran as much as we could.

With Stephon Marbury, we have a guy that can definitely create in the half court--so we run as much as we can.

This is like watching Suns basketball with Kidd running the show all over again. I prefer Marbury, of course, and while I think this team is made to run, I also think that they should be coached properly to run half court sets--especially in the playoffs, where they are more prevalent!

With Kidd, coaching the half-court was basically worthless. With Marbury, it can be effective, but isn't used.

That's bad coaching.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

not to mention that big jake and steph have had a pretty good repoire with the pick and roll.

can someone please wake JJ up?

 

[Joe Mama]

Nobody is saying that Big Jake should be taking Amare Stoudemire's shots. We are not asking him to play for his offense. Let's face it. None of the Suns' centers are really going to be playing for their offense unless you count Scott Williams missing from outside. We want Big Jake in the game for his defense and rebounding.

Again, we're only asking for a few minutes here and there when the Spurs are killing the Suns with size. If it doesn't work take him out of the game and go with the beloved small ball.

Joe Mama

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

amen brotha, amen.

 

[cly2tw]

I haven't seen enough Suns games to judge how bad FJ is. The positive side of this is however that the important ingredients for a great team is in place. Imagine what it could be with a real coach!

 

[Joe Mama]

Originally posted by cly2tw
I haven't seen enough Suns games to judge how bad FJ is. The positive side of this is however that the important ingredients for a great team is in place. Imagine what it could be with a real coach!

They are definitely headed in the right direction. However I wouldn't necessarily say that all of the important ingredients for a great team are in place. They could really use some frontcourt scoring off the bench, and the center rotation is still pretty weak.

Joe Mama

 

[cly2tw]

Originally posted by Joe Mama
They could really use some frontcourt scoring off the bench, and the center rotation is still pretty weak.

Joe Mama

I still believe in Big Jake. If with another 'real' coach he gets to play 20-25 min a game, the bench scoring potential of little jake and Scott Williams seems to be adequate.

 

[AZ4Life]

I am having ambivalent feelings right now... Something tells me if we win the Spurs series (as much as I would like to see it happen) - FJ will be around for at least another year. And barring a horrible loss like Game 5, FJ will be around because of the "turnaround" he has created for the ballclub this year....

 

[Charles V]

Something tells me if we win the Spurs series (as much as I would like to see it happen) - FJ will be around for at least another year. And barring a horrible loss like Game 5, FJ will be around because of the "turnaround" he has created for the ballclub this year....

I assume you read the article in the Republic where Marbury was quoted as saying "If Frank goes, I go".

I dont know if that really means anything, but it's interesting nonetheless.

 

[Wally]

Originally posted by Charles V
I assume you read the article in the Republic where Marbury was quoted as saying "If Frank goes, I go".

I dont know if that really means anything, but it's interesting nonetheless.

The best quality that FJ has is that it appears as if most of the players like or respect him. That could be the result of having played for Skiles and when you've hit bottom, there's only one way to go. First of all, I don't believe there is any way FJ is going to be fired, so what needs to be done is to educate him and let the other assistants have a more active role in the decisions. The Colangelo’s need to have a non biased team of personnel do an evaluation of him and make recommendations. The question is, Is the coach coachable? He did listen to Marbury at the first of the season, so at least he's open for suggestions from someone.

I was disappointed in the decision to make FJ the head coach, and he hasn't done anything to change my mind. I would like nothing better than to see someone coach the team who has a solid understanding of the game, but lets face it, he's the coach, and like our young players, he has a lot to learn. Colangelo's have done a good job finding talanted players, but a tough time with selecting coaches.

Quoting many others....Mark my words, read my lips , make no doubt ..... Frank Johnson will be the Suns head coach next year. Prove me wrong and I MIGHT be happy, it could be worse - Isn't Skiles is looking for a job? Watch out what you wish for, you might get it.

As an afterthought, why don't you lucky guys with tickets to tomorrow's game, make some sings to hold up for FJ & the TV cameras to see? Suggestions for signs: "WE WANT JAKE", "DUMB TIME OUT", "PUT ________ BACK IN THE GAME", "TAKE _______ OUT OF THE GAME", TAKE IT TO THE HOOP", MOVE" and I can think of others that would get you ejected by the officials. How about this one "www.arizonasportsfans.com"?

 

[Joe Mama]

Sunday night I wondered if I had been wearing a shirt that read "Joe Mama is in the house" to the game how many people would have come up to me. I also wondered how much it would cost to put a message up on the scoreboard during the game.

I hope none of you are seriously thinking that Frank Johnson might be fired after this season. There isn't a prayer.

Joe Mama

 

[cheng]

The only hope is let FJ read how much the fans hate him so he quits himself.

 

[scotsman13]

man, why is it that so many people think that frank johnson is a bad coach because he doesnt play the players the way you want him to. this is a team that was thought to be the second worst team in the nba before the start of the season. that the suns simply didnt have the tools to do anything more then to go back into the lottery. now we are having one of the best groups of firstround games out there with the #1 seed in the playoffs. many people said that it would take amare years before he could bring something to this team, but here he is ROY and has been a big time player for this team (this from a player who had never been really coached before). this is a team that is playing with heart all the time and if you dont think that a coach has something to do with this you should look back to the last time cotton coached this team or skiles. give FJ some time that mean a couple year to put this team together and give the players some time to grow after all this is one of the youngest teams in the NBA.

 

[reedykat]

I think that most fans see the potential in this young team and realize that with a more flexible and seasoned coach the sky can truly be the limit.

 

[scotsman13]

but without this teaching coach there would be nothing there for them to work with. you look at some of the other coachs out there, and then ask yourself who would get that would be able to do anything more with this team? FJ has worked wonders this year and unless you have an idea of a coach that bring more out of this team then FJ and wouldnt bankrupt the team at the same time i dont see anyone else that we can get that would be better.

 

[Chaplin]

Originally posted by scotsman13
but without this teaching coach there would be nothing there for them to work with. you look at some of the other coachs out there, and then ask yourself who would get that would be able to do anything more with this team? FJ has worked wonders this year and unless you have an idea of a coach that bring more out of this team then FJ and wouldnt bankrupt the team at the same time i dont see anyone else that we can get that would be better.

Which "wonders" are you referring to?

The maturation of Big Jake? Hmm. That's not one.

The amazing consistency of Joe Johnson? Hmm. Nope.

The incredible improvement of substitution patterns?

The great play of Amare Stoudemire? I credit guys like Iavaroni and Grgrich (sp) for that.

What has Frank done outside of devising our offense and our defense (which is great, but is no "wonder")? Where is your proof that it is FJ that has brought more out of this team and not Stephon's improvement? Shawn Marion is a great player, but we still have the same complaints about him that we've had for 2 years.

 

[cheng]

scotsman, sorry but I have to ask have you watched any of games in the playoffs VS SA.

FJ keeps going small ball after getting out-rebounded 31-11, and calls a timeout when team was going on a 17-3 run.

Every game is the same story, get dominated in the paint because of small ball. I don't mind small ball, but not for all 48 mins every game. He should realize small ball never works in playoffs, especially when he has been with the Suns for 12 years in which they have never won a playoff series with small ball. One other problem is that this team doesn't have the shooters who can shoot the lights out for small ball to be effective. Both offense and defense suffer due to small ball.

This is just bad coaching on the floor, I do think he has done a good job in terms of communicating with the players. No doubt they are playing hard.

And I don't believe a NBA head coach should do his learning on the job.

 

[minercon]

First of all, no one here hates Johnson. We may dislike him as coaching material, but he seems to be a pleasant fellow who may have made some hormonal mistakes in his personal life. Now when it came to Skiles....that is a totally different matter.

Johnson has not worked wonders this year. His assistants have worked wonders. The Colangeli have taken away from Johnson over last summer the ability to pick his own assistants. The Colangeli did that for him. That has been duly reported in the paper. Amare's stellar play can be credited to the fact that Googs went down. Bo and Williams were used exclusively over the likes of both Jakes. Youth has been pushed to the back burner. It has only been due to flukes they have played as much as they have. This though has been a consistent part of the Suns philosophy over the years. Unfortunately, I believe several very talented players have been lost in the shuffle due to the lack of playing time. So Johnson has predicted a win for us tonight. He has a 50% chance of being correct. I wonder what he will do if Marbury passes the ball off due to his arm malfunctioning all the time, and we get killed on the boards by the magnificent tall duo?

I agree with whomever said Johnson will be coach next year. He made it to the playoffs....not thanks to his coaching ability, but to the likes of Marbury, Marion and Amare.

 

[SirStefan32]

Originally posted by Joe Mama
and the center rotation is still pretty weak.

Joe Mama

The Suns have a center rotation?

 

[jbeecham]

Sure it's Bo Outlaw, Amare Stoudemire, Shawn Marion and occasionally Jake Voshkul.

 

[NDSunsfan]

so the feeling is that all the good stuff that happened to the suns this season is either fluke, luck or the assistant coaches. the bad stuff is all frank. ok,.......

the talk about hire dunleavy or van gundy. yeah, the rest of the league is really knocking down their doors. they have such a huge history of success. the grass is always greener.

to try and talk about the series so far and blame it on frank. didn't we win 2 of the first five? how many #8 seeds have won at least two games in the first round against a #1? The lucky shots at the end of game 1 and jakes play in game 4 were pure flukes, but something allowed the suns to be in position to win. last i checked the spurs were a pretty tough team. it's not like the suns are sucking it up against the nuggets. the spurs had the best record in the entire nba. they are known for their defense. their coaching staff is adjusting too. apparently the suns isn't.

i probably like frank more than the rest of you guys. is he the second coming of john wooden, not bloody likely, but he's not magic johnson on the sidelines, either.

all this talk about him and the suns are 3-2 against the arguably the best team in the league. what would we be talking about if they had ended up 30-52? probably a coaching change, yippee. that's so good for team continuity.

go suns (and frank)

brad

 

[SirStefan32]

You are saying that Frank Johnson is as good as/ better than Jeff and Mike? You have got to be kidding.

1. He does not know when to call a time out. There have been times when other teams were on a 15+ POINT RUN, AND fRANK WOULD NOT CALL A TIMEOUT.

2. He can not counter other coach's moves. See, Popovich adjusted to the Suns small ball. Now it's time for FJ tocounter Popovich's adjustment.

3. He does not understand the concept of the "substitution pattern," nor that of a "rotation."
Players don't know if they are going to play, and how much they are going to play.

Frank Johnson sucks, it's as simple as that. Easily one of the worst coaches in the league.

"How did he make playoffs then?" You may ask, and the answer is simple:
He has the best staff in the league, and he has one outstanding and three good players on his team.