Learn from the Browns...

[JosiahLee]

Before I begin this thread, let me start by saying I am fully in the “draft Murray” camp.

With that said, I want everyone to think back to this time last year as we all analyzed the top prospects entering the draft...Many NFL pundits thought Baker Mayfield to be the 3rd or 4th best qb behind Darnold, Rosen, Allen, and even Jackson.

Yet the Browns trusted what their eyes saw on film when watching Mayfield (a proven winner with phenomenal accuracy) and had the guts to take him with the first overall pick.

Now entering the 2019 season the Browns are legitimate contenders to win the AFC North and possibly compete for a Super Bowl (yes I realize this has much to do with John Dorsey’s collective work as GM, however Mayfield remains the largest part of that equation for success).

Let me ask a hypothetical question, let’s pretend Bosa entered the draft last year and the Browns took him #1 overall. Do you think they would be in position to win a title? Even with OBJ & Kareem Hunt & all the other talent they have added recently? Without having to hesitate I would say no.

The goal of every franchise should be to win Super Bowls, not make the playoffs or simply finish with a winning record...In light of that I am 100% all in for Keim swinging for the fences...Why play it safe to simply achieve mediocrity like 8-8 or 9-7.

Like many have stated I admit Murray may be a bigger risk than sticking with Rosen, but how can you not see his potential to be dynamic in this league.

 

[RON_IN_OC]

Before I begin this thread, let me start by saying I am fully in the “draft Murray” camp.

With that said, I want everyone to think back to this time last year as we all analyzed the top prospects entering the draft...Many NFL pundits thought Baker Mayfield to be the 3rd or 4th best qb behind Darnold, Rosen, Allen, and even Jackson.

Yet the Browns trusted what their eyes saw on film when watching Mayfield (a proven winner with phenomenal accuracy) and had the guts to take him with the first overall pick.

Now entering the 2019 season the Browns are legitimate contenders to win the AFC North and possibly compete for a Super Bowl (yes I realize this has much to do with John Dorsey’s collective work as GM, however Mayfield remains the largest part of that equation for success).

Let me ask a hypothetical question, let’s pretend Bosa entered the draft last year and the Browns took him #1 overall. Do you think they would be in position to win a title? Even with OBJ & Kareem Hunt & all the other talent they have added recently? Without having to hesitate I would say no.

The goal of every franchise should be to win Super Bowls, not make the playoffs or simply finish with a winning record...In light of that I am 100% all in for Keim swinging for the fences...Why play it safe to simply achieve mediocrity like 8-8 or 9-7.

Like many have stated I admit Murray may be a bigger risk than sticking with Rosen, but how can you not see his potential to be dynamic in this league.

Who was the 1st round QB the Browns drafted in 2017?

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[JosiahLee]

Who was the 1st round QB the Browns drafted in 2017?

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Are you referring to DeShone Kizer whom they drafted in the 2nd rd?

 

[RON_IN_OC]

Are you referring to DeShone Kizer whom they drafted in the 2nd rd?

Nope...just pointing out they weren't coming off a top 10 QB draft pick.

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[SoCal Cardfan]

The Browns haven't done sheet yet..... Do they look good on paper? Of course.

So did a lot of Daniel Snyders "dream teams".

 

[TheCardFan]

Josiah - If the Jets had hired KK instead of the Cardinals, would you advocate that they take Murray when they have Darnold?

and...would you still take Murray if you were the Jets now (with Gase as HC)?

 

[overseascardfan]

Murray better hope he lands in ARZ somehow because I don't think he will fit in an OAK or NYG offensive system. To me he's limited to a Lincoln Riley type offense and will struggle in any other one. Remember Mayfield didn't start looking like the #1 pick until Jackson and Haley were canned and Kitchens started calling the plays. The problem is we don't know how well Murray will play under center in real game situations. I think it will be more of a challenge that people think. IMO Rosen will be easier to convert to KK's offense from a pro-style because he has most of the attributes you need except for a quicker release.

As I mentioned before, if Kingsbury does not pan out and we get stuck with Murray and he has to learn a pro-style offense that will set ARZ back even longer.

 

[BACH]

Let me ask a hypothetical question, let’s pretend Bosa entered the draft last year and the Browns took him #1 overall. Do you think they would be in position to win a title? Even with OBJ & Kareem Hunt & all the other talent they have added recently? Without having to hesitate I would say no.

The goal of every franchise should be to win Super Bowls, not make the playoffs or simply finish with a winning record...In light of that I am 100% all in for Keim swinging for the fences...Why play it safe to simply achieve mediocrity like 8-8 or 9-7.

Like many have stated I admit Murray may be a bigger risk than sticking with Rosen, but how can you not see his potential to be dynamic in this league.

You cannot compare the situations at all. The Browns under Sashi Brown had passed on ***** and Goff and the owner dictated to draft Manziel over Carr and they HAD no quarterback when they took Mayfield.

This team has to evealuate Rosen against Murray.

Browns: Bosa + nothing at QB vs. actually having a franchise quarterback on the roster
Cardinals: Bosa + Rosen vs. Murray

 

[BW52]

Before I begin this thread, let me start by saying I am fully in the “draft Murray” camp.

With that said, I want everyone to think back to this time last year as we all analyzed the top prospects entering the draft...Many NFL pundits thought Baker Mayfield to be the 3rd or 4th best qb behind Darnold, Rosen, Allen, and even Jackson.

Yet the Browns trusted what their eyes saw on film when watching Mayfield (a proven winner with phenomenal accuracy) and had the guts to take him with the first overall pick.

Now entering the 2019 season the Browns are legitimate contenders to win the AFC North and possibly compete for a Super Bowl (yes I realize this has much to do with John Dorsey’s collective work as GM, however Mayfield remains the largest part of that equation for success).

Let me ask a hypothetical question, let’s pretend Bosa entered the draft last year and the Browns took him #1 overall. Do you think they would be in position to win a title? Even with OBJ & Kareem Hunt & all the other talent they have added recently? Without having to hesitate I would say no.

The goal of every franchise should be to win Super Bowls, not make the playoffs or simply finish with a winning record...In light of that I am 100% all in for Keim swinging for the fences...Why play it safe to simply achieve mediocrity like 8-8 or 9-7.

Like many have stated I admit Murray may be a bigger risk than sticking with Rosen, but how can you not see his potential to be dynamic in this league.

How can you not see that 5`10 QBs are almost never successful in the NFL.How can you not see that expecting Murray to be a successful QB is betting against the odds.Being a good QB in the NFL is hard enough to do anyway.Being a shorter ,smaller QB isn`t making things easier.AS for the awe-inspiring ability to not be hit do you really think that will be the case in the NFl.Sure the kid has talent..but I don`t want my team to risk screwing up the top pick in the draft by taking a longer chance on a risky QB when a RD 1 QB is already on the team and there are safer options available for the top pick.The GUy who is considered top Defensive pick (Bosa) or Qiunnen Williams (who is rated highly). might not be the sexy,flashy ,media hype frenzy pick but IMO either of those two are the safer smarter pick than Murray.

 

[TheCardFan]

This team has to evealuate Rosen against Murray.

Browns: Bosa + nothing at QB vs. actually having a franchise quarterback on the roster
Cardinals: Bosa + Rosen vs. Murray

Agreed but its really a bit more to consider:

Rosen + Bosa or Q

vs

Murray + whatever compensation they get for Rosen

 

[BW52]

Bosa + Rosen or Q.Williams + Rosen before Murray.

 

[Finito]

Before I begin this thread, let me start by saying I am fully in the “draft Murray” camp.

With that said, I want everyone to think back to this time last year as we all analyzed the top prospects entering the draft...Many NFL pundits thought Baker Mayfield to be the 3rd or 4th best qb behind Darnold, Rosen, Allen, and even Jackson.

Yet the Browns trusted what their eyes saw on film when watching Mayfield (a proven winner with phenomenal accuracy) and had the guts to take him with the first overall pick.

Now entering the 2019 season the Browns are legitimate contenders to win the AFC North and possibly compete for a Super Bowl (yes I realize this has much to do with John Dorsey’s collective work as GM, however Mayfield remains the largest part of that equation for success).

Let me ask a hypothetical question, let’s pretend Bosa entered the draft last year and the Browns took him #1 overall. Do you think they would be in position to win a title? Even with OBJ & Kareem Hunt & all the other talent they have added recently? Without having to hesitate I would say no.

The goal of every franchise should be to win Super Bowls, not make the playoffs or simply finish with a winning record...In light of that I am 100% all in for Keim swinging for the fences...Why play it safe to simply achieve mediocrity like 8-8 or 9-7.

Like many have stated I admit Murray may be a bigger risk than sticking with Rosen, but how can you not see his potential to be dynamic in this league.

The browns have had 0 winning seasons since coming back into the NFL like 19 years ago.

 

[GuernseyCard]

Rather than learn from the Browns, I'd rather take my lesson from the Rams. They dropped a fossil and replaced him with a young, dynamic HC and he created an offensive plan suited to a young QB who had a statistically horrible first season.

 

[RON_IN_OC]

The browns have had 0 winning seasons since coming back into the NFL like 19 years ago.

False

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[Delmar M Lewis]

Rather than learn from the Browns, I'd rather take my lesson from the Rams. They dropped a fossil and replaced him with a young, dynamic HC and he created an offensive plan suited to a young QB who had a statistically horrible first season.

My gut feeling is this is exactly what KK was brought here to do not Murray or anything else but we are talking the Cards Here

 

[Delmar M Lewis]

I guess we just have to wait till the OTAs and team visits etc and then the draft to find out

 

[TruColor]

The browns have had 0 winning seasons since coming back into the NFL like 19 years ago.

In 2002 they were 9-7-0, and in 2007 they were 10-6-0.

So - 2.

 

[BurqueCardFan]

Before I begin this thread, let me start by saying I am fully in the “draft Murray” camp.

With that said, I want everyone to think back to this time last year as we all analyzed the top prospects entering the draft...Many NFL pundits thought Baker Mayfield to be the 3rd or 4th best qb behind Darnold, Rosen, Allen, and even Jackson.

Yet the Browns trusted what their eyes saw on film when watching Mayfield (a proven winner with phenomenal accuracy) and had the guts to take him with the first overall pick.

Now entering the 2019 season the Browns are legitimate contenders to win the AFC North and possibly compete for a Super Bowl (yes I realize this has much to do with John Dorsey’s collective work as GM, however Mayfield remains the largest part of that equation for success).

Let me ask a hypothetical question, let’s pretend Bosa entered the draft last year and the Browns took him #1 overall. Do you think they would be in position to win a title? Even with OBJ & Kareem Hunt & all the other talent they have added recently? Without having to hesitate I would say no.

The goal of every franchise should be to win Super Bowls, not make the playoffs or simply finish with a winning record...In light of that I am 100% all in for Keim swinging for the fences...Why play it safe to simply achieve mediocrity like 8-8 or 9-7.

Like many have stated I admit Murray may be a bigger risk than sticking with Rosen, but how can you not see his potential to be dynamic in this league.

Browns still made a mistake. They should have drafted S Barkley #1 and then could have still drafted one of the top 3 QB’s at #4. Mostly likely they still would have had a shot at Baker @ #4. And to answer your question, yes they would be in the same position right now with the additions of Obj and the others. And they would not have needed to pick up Hunt

 

[Finito]

In 2002 they were 9-7-0, and in 2007 they were 10-6-0.

So - 2.

Lol oh well then that’s different

 

[Ronin]

Didn’t DE Myles Garrett go #1 to the Browns a couple of seasons ago?

 

[Crimson Warrior]

Before I begin this thread, let me start by saying I am fully in the “draft Murray” camp.

With that said, I want everyone to think back to this time last year as we all analyzed the top prospects entering the draft...Many NFL pundits thought Baker Mayfield to be the 3rd or 4th best qb behind Darnold, Rosen, Allen, and even Jackson.

Yet the Browns trusted what their eyes saw on film when watching Mayfield (a proven winner with phenomenal accuracy) and had the guts to take him with the first overall pick.

Now entering the 2019 season the Browns are legitimate contenders to win the AFC North and possibly compete for a Super Bowl (yes I realize this has much to do with John Dorsey’s collective work as GM, however Mayfield remains the largest part of that equation for success).

Let me ask a hypothetical question, let’s pretend Bosa entered the draft last year and the Browns took him #1 overall. Do you think they would be in position to win a title? Even with OBJ & Kareem Hunt & all the other talent they have added recently? Without having to hesitate I would say no.

The goal of every franchise should be to win Super Bowls, not make the playoffs or simply finish with a winning record...In light of that I am 100% all in for Keim swinging for the fences...Why play it safe to simply achieve mediocrity like 8-8 or 9-7.

Like many have stated I admit Murray may be a bigger risk than sticking with Rosen, but how can you not see his potential to be dynamic in this league.

The bolded are all excellent. Really like how you used the hypothetical of Bosa being in last years draft, and how you combined that with a other important parallels to last year.

Then driving home the point that, while making the playoffs is nice, losing the last game of a season sucks, and what we really need is a Lombardy Trophy.

Something that has been overlooked a little is that Murray is a gamer. This past season, I watched him lead desperate comebacks against both TX and AL. In the end, his defensive teammates let him down, but my point is that being behind on the scoreboard substantially (21 vs TX and 28 vs AL) only energized him. Made him take his game up another level.

He's on the quiet side, but the competitive fire burns brightly within him. JosiahLee, I think he has the talent to win a Superbowl, but perhaps just as importantly, I think he has the desire to win a Superbowl.

 

[juza76]

Didn’t DE Myles Garrett go #1 to the Browns a couple of seasons ago?

Yes and they went 0-16
But when they got the best qb in that draft they won 8 games
There is not much to add, if u find a better qb u draft him period

 

[GuernseyCard]

Yes and they went 0-16
But when they got the best qb in that draft they won 8 games
There is not much to add, if u find a better qb u draft him period

So after Goff's less than stellar year one, you believe the Rams should have found some way to draft Trubisky, Mahomes or Watson?

 

[Solar7]

Didn’t DE Myles Garrett go #1 to the Browns a couple of seasons ago?

Thank you, holy crap.

"Learn from the Browns?" I'm choking on my water. The team sputtered miserably for years and has a quarterback that looked kinda good for a bunch of games that didn't matter. Their head coaches and GMs lost their jobs in the process.

Baker Mayfield is not yet a savior. Nor is Murray.

 

[juza76]

So after Goff's less than stellar year one, you believe the Rams should have found some way to draft Trubisky, Mahomes or Watson?

u bring on the table the same stuff

Murray height
Goff comparison
Rosen bad cast around
Bad coaching

God helps those who help themselves

Rosen didn't help himself
Teammates didn't help him, coaches didn't help him, but his bad plays didn't help anyone