Little more info concerning Payton

Biclops

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http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/s ... id=2003477

Suns stump for Glove; Celtics won't face sanctions
Stein
By Marc Stein, ESPN.com

Suns stars Shawn Marion and Steve Nash have told ESPN.com that they're personally lobbying free agent Gary Payton to sign with Phoenix after he clears waivers Thursday, but league sources indicate that Payton is leaning toward a return to the Boston Celtics.

NBA deputy commissioner Russ Granik, meanwhile, told ESPN.com on Wednesday that the league does not plan to sanction the Celtics if Payton does re-sign with Boston. The Celtics have been accused of prearranging Payton's return by trading him to Atlanta for Antoine Walker and promising to re-sign the veteran guard after the Hawks released him. General manager Danny Ainge has denied those claims.

Granik did say the practice of teams trading a player and then re-signing him after he clears waivers will definitely be "something we take a look at" in the process of ongoing negotiations with the players' union on a new labor deal. Granik also acknowledged that "there is something that doesn't feel quite right" when, for example, Dallas can include Alan Henderson in last Thursday's trade for Keith Van Horn and then reacquire Henderson after Milwaukee releases him. Thus, that deal suddenly became Calvin Booth for Van Horn.

"But in a salary-cap world, sometimes you end up with trades that make sense in accounting terms and don't necessarily make a lot of sense in the sporting world," Granik said.

"If Payton re-signs with Boston, I'm not sure what great harm has been done. It's not anything anyone in the league is that worked up about. It's hard to see where any great principles have been violated."

The only thing that would change that stance is if, say, the Celtics or the Mavericks were found to be paying an under-the-table bonus to Payton or Henderson as part of these trades.

"And I don't think anyone believes that that's taking place," Granik said.

To bring Walker back to Boston, Ainge sent Payton, Tom Gugliotta and Michael Stewart to the Hawks, along with a future first-round pick. The draft choice was Atlanta's motivation to participate, after which the Hawks happily bought out the remainder of Payton's contract and waived him in time to make the former All-Star eligible for the playoffs.

The only sure way to prevent Payton from choosing his next employer is claiming him off waivers. A claiming team, though, must have the salary-cap space to absorb Payton's $5.4 million salary and none of Payton's current suitors do.

Payton, according to sources, has narrowed his choices to the Celtics and Suns. Going to Phoenix would put him in close proximity to his family's main residence in Las Vegas and, more importantly, put the 36-year-old in contention for the championship ring he's still searching for. Adding Payton to the recently acquired Jim Jackson and Walter McCarty would ease the Suns' depth concerns. And with Payton, Phoenix could curtail Nash's minutes leading up to the playoffs as Nash recovers from recent hamstring trouble.

Indications are, however, that Payton wants to play significant minutes and preferably start, both of which are more likely with the Celtics. Uncertainty about those opportunities in Miami, sources said, prompted Payton to eliminate the Heat from consideration. Minnesota, Denver and Sacramento are apparently further down Payton's list because none of those teams is expected to advance deep into the playoffs; the first two are simply jockeying for the No. 8 slot in the West.

Nash and Marion, a former UNLV star who sees Payton occasionally in the summertime, have called Payton urging him to come to the desert.

"Anyone can fit in with this team, the way we play," said Marion, dismissing concerns that it would be hard for the Suns to add a dominant personality like Payton's this late in the season.

Boston faces the same challenge if Payton indeed rejoins them this week. Walker, Paul Pierce, Ricky Davis and Payton would form a headstrong quartet for coach Doc Rivers to manage.

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It seems like it is between the Suns and Celtics now

Hopefully he'll sign with us
 

elindholm

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I'm optimistic about the Suns' chances. Boston won't be able to promise him much more in the way of minutes, and all of the other intangibles should be in Phoenix's favor.
 

Chaplin

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elindholm said:
I'm optimistic about the Suns' chances. Boston won't be able to promise him much more in the way of minutes, and all of the other intangibles should be in Phoenix's favor.

I think the fact that Steve Nash is lobbying for him will speak volumes. I'm not a big fan of Payton as a person, but I think his signing would be a major positive addition on the court. All of a sudden our second unit is Payton, Barbosa, McCarty, JJ2 and Hunter/Voskuhl. Not great, but certainly not horrible either.
 

Cheesebeef

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Getting Payton would AT LEAST allay my fears of getting out of the first round against WHOEVER we play and makes me VERY confident of beating whoever the hell we play in the second round. He's been pretty solid this season and will leave Nash VERY fresh for the playoffs.
 

Cheesebeef

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let's hope the Celts hang on tonight to make Ainge believe even more that they don't need Gary!
 

Qmiles23

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I hope Delonte has a big game tonight. One because I don't like the lakers, and two because I want the Celtics to not get Payton.
 

sly fly

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I'm torn.

What's up with players gravy-training nowadays?

He couldn't get it done in Seattle in his prime.

He got torched in LA.

Sulked his way to Boston. And, now is having a hard time leaving AFTER they traded his ass.

Something smells fishy. Perhaps a little $$ to Payton to agree to the trade? Tampering and collusion all wrapped into one.

Anyways, if the PHX players want GP, I guess that's all that matters.

I survived when Mario Elie signed. At least GP never blew kisses to the Suns bench.
 

Chaplin

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Talk about offense--the 2nd quarter points (remember, this is ONLY from the 2nd quarter--according to ESPN): Boston 50, LA Lakers 49

It was 79-77 at the HALF...

As for their point guards, Marcus Banks has no points, but 8 assists. Delonte West has 5 points and 4 assists.

EDIT: My bad, ESPN's gamecast is all messed up--that score above was after the 3rd quarter...
 

sly fly

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Chaplin said:
Talk about offense--the 2nd quarter points (remember, this is ONLY from the 2nd quarter--according to ESPN): Boston 50, LA Lakers 49

It was 79-77 at the HALF...

As for their point guards, Marcus Banks has no points, but 8 assists. Delonte West has 5 points and 4 assists.

That can't be right. It's 100-96 Boston with a minute left.

Nevermind...
 

mribnik

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Celtics won! Delonte West didn't have such a great game, but they are doing fine without Payton for sure. Payton is aging, you'd think that a chance for a championship and being close to his family would be most important to him. Hopefully it is!
 

George O'Brien

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sly fly said:
I'm torn.

What's up with players gravy-training nowadays?

He couldn't get it done in Seattle in his prime.

He got torched in LA.

Sulked his way to Boston. And, now is having a hard time leaving AFTER they traded his ass.

Something smells fishy. Perhaps a little $$ to Payton to agree to the trade? Tampering and collusion all wrapped into one.

Anyways, if the PHX players want GP, I guess that's all that matters.

I survived when Mario Elie signed. At least GP never blew kisses to the Suns bench.

Payton in his prime was a great player who did not have exceptional talent surrounding him. His visit to Milwaukee wasn't long enough to prove anything, but the Bucks offered him more than the Lakers did.

As for last year with the Lakers, he was certainly not a good fit for Phil Jackson's triangle but he was not horrible. His stats were pretty good 14.1 ppg, 47.1% shooting, with only 5.5 assists per game due to the triangle. This year his points are down but his assists are up and everyone claims he has been effective.
 

elindholm

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Another thing to remember about Payton is that he has been to the Finals twice. The only current Suns with significant playoff experience is Nash, and even he hasn't been very deep. If the Suns are fortunate enough to get somewhere in the playoffs, I think having someone around who has "been there" could be very valuable.
 

thegrahamcrackr

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Jim Jackson has some good playoff experience as well, but I agree with what you are saying.

I am not going to freak out if we don't get Payton, but I think it is a no brainer if we can. He will just make us that much better.
 

Joe Mama

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I've watched a handful of Boston Celtics games over the last couple months. I think Gary Payton would love to push the ball down opponents' throats at every opportunity. With Boston he was pushing the ball a lot whether it was as a result of a rebound, a steal, or a made basket. He would be great for this team.

I'm still not a big fan of his because he has done too much complaining about playing time, offensive schemes, and most of all money even while he was playing for good teams. However I can see that he would be very valuable for the Phoenix Suns on the court. I hope they get him.

Joe Mama
 

WaywardFan

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Do we have any idea when he might/need to decide where he's going?
 

elindholm

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Hoopshype has a link this morning to one of the Boston papers (I can't remember which), saying that, according to Ainge, Payton has made a "verbal agreement" to return to the Celtics. Make of that what you will.
 

coloradosun

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This basicly takes trades back to the days when you did not need to get equivalent compensation. This trade now is just Googs and Yogi for Antoine Walker and a 1st round draft choice, that just does not make any sense.

If there is a rule in the draft where you cannot trade consecutive 1st rounders because it may hurt your franchise, why can't their be a rule that if you trade a player you cannot resign him because it hurts the league. By adding Payton and Walker the Celtics have now improved themselves because Payton did not want to play for the Hawks. They made this move because the Sixers also tried to improve themselves by adding Webber. If I'm Philly I would be pissed.
 

Cheesebeef

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booooooo!!!!! If Payton's just going somewhere so he can start, then he's a loser. (of course had he come here I would have been happier than a pig in slop - classic ex-scenario)
 

SweetD

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cheesebeef said:
booooooo!!!!! If Payton's just going somewhere so he can start, then he's a loser. (of course had he come here I would have been happier than a pig in slop - classic ex-scenario)

I am sure he is trying to be a starter to get another contract next year. I would think if he came to the Suns he would have a better chance of getting more money next year. JMO
 

F-Dog

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I'm happy the Suns didn't get Payton, but I agree that there should be a rule--if a team trades you away, you can't resign with them for the rest of the season.

Long term, the Celtics are probably better off without Payton (more minutes for Banks and Delonte West), just as they'd be better off without Antoine Walker (more minutes for Al Jefferson and Kendrick Perkins). I guess the hope is that Walker and Payton are instilling a winning attitude in the young players...
 

Chaplin

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Rumor has it that Bill Simmons (yes, the Sports Guy from Page 2 at ESPN.com) says that Payton will go to Phoenix. I tried searching for proof that it's even said, but haven't found anything.
 

Cheesebeef

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Chaplin said:
Rumor has it that Bill Simmons (yes, the Sports Guy from Page 2 at ESPN.com) says that Payton will go to Phoenix. I tried searching for proof that it's even said, but haven't found anything.

this whole thing, combined with Cards FA is driving me crazy the last couple days - I just want SOMETHING to happen on either end!

And F-Dog - why wouldn't you want Payton here?
 

Brett10S

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Where and how does such a rumor get started?

Its in neither of The Sports Guy's articles from today.
 
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