Marion was tired of Suns

[D-Dogg]

LMAO! At people like Donald take this guy seriously. [/FONT]

"He's a real journalist now! He has a media pass!"

Like I said: Amatuer hour.

Did he sleep with your family members or something? Good lord.

I like his takes and really couldn't care less how poorly or well he writes. AP Stylebook isn't really that important to me; what I find important are interesting viewpoints backed up by information coming straight from the horse's mouth. He talked to Marion, and you didn't. That puts him a step up in the information department, IMO.

 

[devilalum]

I think the Suns saw the writing on the wall. They knew last summer that we didn't have the juice to get to the finals. That's why they tried so hard to trade for KG. I don't think they had one player they wanted to trade or get rid of they just wanted to make a move that might get them to the next level.

The players always say, "I know its a business." but when push comes to shove there aren't very many who can rise above their own ego and really appreciate or except what that truly means.

 

[BC867]

I think the Suns have been looking for that big guy for the last few seasons and where there is smoke there is fire. Anybody who bought into that "we always listen to offers for players and take the call but that doesn't mean we are shopping him" crap is very gullible.

It's no coincidence that Marion was always the name brought up in trades.

Having met Shawn Marion a number of times, I don't believe he has the sophistication to see the big picture.

D'Antoni's decision to play Amare and Marion out of position had to give sooner or later.

Amare going back to Power Forward and eliminating Marion is much more beneficial than eliminating Amare and keeping Marion at Power Forward.

Perhaps Marion was the victim of obsessive coaching. And perhaps he didn't know how and when to voice it. But that's life. And now he has a fresh start.

 

[dodie53]

let's just appreciate on what he did for Phoenix

 

[Ollie]

1) I think he means "less than amicable"

Main Entry:ami·a·ble

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Pronunciation: \ˈā-mē-ə-bəl\
Function:adjective
Etymology:Middle English, from Anglo-French, from Late Latin amicabilis friendly, from Latin amicus friend; akin to Latin amare to love
Date:14th century

1 archaic : pleasing, admirable

2 a: generally agreeable <an amiable comedy> b: being friendly, sociable, and congenial
— ami·a·bil·i·ty

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\ˌā-mē-ə-ˈbi-lə-tē\ noun
— ami·a·ble·ness

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\ˈā-mē-ə-bəl-nəs\ noun
— ami·a·bly

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\-blē\ adverb

synonyms amiable, good-natured, obliging, complaisant mean having the desire or disposition to please. amiable implies having qualities that make one liked and easy to deal with <an amiable teacher not easily annoyed>. good-natured implies cheerfulness or helpfulness and sometimes a willingness to be imposed upon <a good-natured girl who was always willing to pitch in>. obliging stresses a friendly readiness to be helpful <our obliging innkeeper found us a bigger room>. complaisant often implies passivity or a yielding to others because of weakness <was too complaisant to protest a decision he thought unfair>.

At least the dude may have taught you a new word.

 

[BeeBeard]

At least the dude may have taught you a new word.

Oh, no....are we actually busting out with the dictionary here??

My guess is that he has heard the rather cliche "less than amicable" expression before, but couldn't remember the exact word. "Amicable" is a better fit and is found in common usage. So after fumbling with his Microsoft Word built-in thesaurus (shift F7....shift F7...shift F7...) for 30 minutes or so, he finally settled on "amiable" (oh god, that sounds about right, doesn't it??) instead.

I assure you that "Emplay" is a terrible writer notwithstanding any dictionary cut-and-pasting you may have up your sleeve. There is practically one mistake in grammar or punctuation in every single sentence. I kid you not. And his style of writing is very childish and sophomoric. He tries too hard to mix in simple sentences and clumsy metaphors for dramatic effect. (re: "Marion wanted a divorce." *cue dramatic music* dum dum DUUUUMMM!) I could critique it further, but you get the drift.

 

[da_suns_fan]

Oh, no....are we actually busting out with the dictionary here??

My guess is that he has heard the rather cliche "less than amicable" expression before, but couldn't remember the exact word. "Amicable" is a better fit and is found in common usage. So after fumbling with his Microsoft Word built-in thesaurus (shift F7....shift F7...shift F7...) for 30 minutes or so, he finally settled on "amiable" (oh god, that sounds about right, doesn't it??) instead.

I assure you that "Emplay" is a terrible writer notwithstanding any dictionary cut-and-pasting you may have up your sleeve. There is practically one mistake in grammar or punctuation in every single sentence. I kid you not. And his style of writing is very childish and sophomoric. He tries too hard to mix in simple sentences and clumsy metaphors for dramatic effect. (re: "Marion wanted a divorce." *cue dramatic music* dum dum DUUUUMMM!) I could critique it further, but you get the drift.

Exactly. When speaking of a bad business or relationship break up, the phrase is "less than amicable". I HIGHlY DOUBT "Emplay" knew this but was just trying to be different.

Any real journalist would have a proof-reading and fact-checking process that would quickly pick that up.

Great post, btw, BeeBeard.

 

[msdundee]

He tries too hard to mix in simple sentences and clumsy metaphors for dramatic effect. (re: "Marion wanted a divorce." *cue dramatic music* dum dum DUUUUMMM!)

An obvious reference to this: (Marion) ""It's like a bad marriage. It's time to get up. I love my fans, I love the city, I love my teammates. I just think it's time for me to leave."

 

[choicearizona]

Shawn Marion

http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=7639

Marion Tired of Suns
By: Eric Pincus

Poor Communication: It's still a puzzle why Shawn Marion wanted to leave the Phoenix Suns so badly. He was the team's highest paid player. He would get a ton of touches. The Suns were continually in the playoff hunt.

Still Marion asked for a trade and seemed flat out delighted to be shipped off to the struggling Miami HEAT.

Seeing him in Los Angeles (where the Suns fought so many battles against the Lakers) was odd but he seemed lighter and happier than he looked when he was in Phoenix.

Marion's trade demand was brewing for years. About three years ago a source close to the team indicated that Marion was on this path - it was just a matter of time.

"When it gets to a point where you keep hearing your name in trades and all this stuff - you get tired of it. Either you're going to step up for yourself or not. I just got tired of the situation," said Marion.

While Marion didn't address it specifically, the thought was he just wasn't able to adjust to the accolades thrust upon Steve Nash and Amare Stoudemire while he did what he perceived to be all the dirty work.

It's sort of a chicken/egg situation. Had Marion not been so unsettled by the make-up of the team - they probably wouldn't have considered moving him. The more they shopped him around - the unhappier he became.

Key to Marion's frustration was a lack of communication.

"Sometimes you don't get the answers you want to hear," said Marion. "Sometimes you don't get no answers at all."

The only solution for him was divorce.

"I just had to protect myself. This time I thought it was time - and it was time. I just got tired of hearing my name in trade rumors - so I rolled with [the trade to the HEAT]."

Clearly Marion harbors resentment, but he wishes them well from afar (even if it comes across like platitudes).

"I was [in Phoenix] for eight and half years, man. I did a lot for that team and the city," said Marion. "We had some great times there. It's time for me to move on right now. I wish them a lot of luck. It is what it is."

Some players would probably prefer to be a top dog on a losing team (see Joe Johnson) than the third or fourth guy on a winning team.

Still, the Suns made a horrible move trading Marion for Shaq. I don't mind them trading Marion, but in two years when Shaq is retired Marion will be paying huge dividends for the next 7 years. A bad trade, horrible trade - period.

What the Suns should have done was recognize their opportunity passed last year. There are simply too many good western teams now. Look at the up and coming teams like the Hornets, Trailblazers and Seattle, let alone stalwarts like Dallas, San Antonio and the Lakers.

Phoenix should have traded Shawn to a bad team (like Miami) but for a great young player, a first round draft pick and a bunch of throw in's to make the dollars work. This trade should have been to re-tool. The Suns are dreaming if they believe an old Shaq can lead them to a title.

The Suns will regret a missed opportunity for years to come. You don't get a guy like Marion to come around too often as trade bait.

arizona auto insurance

 

[elindholm]

but in two years when Shaq is retired Marion will be paying huge dividends for the next 7 years.

No he won't. Marion is in decline. His career will outlast O'Neal's, obviously, but he has already peaked.

Phoenix should have traded Shawn to a bad team (like Miami) but for a great young player, a first round draft pick and a bunch of throw in's to make the dollars work.

Unless the throw-ins had bad contracts, there's no way another team would have agreed to this trade. Marion's trade value was quite low, because he makes too much money and may run away this summer. The Suns combined Marion's value-neutral contract with Banks's negative one to take on O'Neal's negative one. They probably got the short end of the stick, but not by much, and the poor chemistry issues pretty much forced their hand.

The reason some people are mis-assessing this trade is because (a) they overrate Marion's value and (b) they think that the Suns were expecting the "real" O'Neal. But the Suns had come to recognize Marion's limitations, and they were prepared to accept damaged goods in return. Trust me, no one within the organization is disappointed with O'Neal so far. They knew what they were getting.

The Suns will regret a missed opportunity for years to come. You don't get a guy like Marion to come around too often as trade bait.

You're right there, but the missed opportunity was two summers ago, when Marion's value was at its highest. By last month it was already way, way too late.

 

[Agloco]

No he won't. Marion is in decline. His career will outlast O'Neal's, obviously, but he has already peaked.



Unless the throw-ins had bad contracts, there's no way another team would have agreed to this trade. Marion's trade value was quite low, because he makes too much money and may run away this summer. The Suns combined Marion's value-neutral contract with Banks's negative one to take on O'Neal's negative one. They probably got the short end of the stick, but not by much, and the poor chemistry issues pretty much forced their hand.

The reason some people are mis-assessing this trade is because (a) they overrate Marion's value and (b) they think that the Suns were expecting the "real" O'Neal. But the Suns had come to recognize Marion's limitations, and they were prepared to accept damaged goods in return. Trust me, no one within the organization is disappointed with O'Neal so far. They knew what they were getting.



You're right there, but the missed opportunity was two summers ago, when Marion's value was at its highest. By last month it was already way, way too late.

You can't be serious.......
To say they are not disappointed would be to say that they are impressed, or at least on the fence. You're hard pressed to say that the chuckwagon is rolling in the right direction currently. At the risk of sounding cliche, Shaq is what he is. There isn't some miracle second wind in those sails. One too many Whopper combos has submarined that line of thought.

As for Marion declining, he's as good a second banana as you're going to find in this league right now. He's got at least 4-5 years left at this level. I'm thinking no one is aquiring him to be "the man". Every GM understands that he wears Robin's suit, not Batman's. Either way you slice it, he's getting paid this offseason. Perhaps it's a bit less, but at this level of pay I'm thinking he's not worried about making the rent.

 

[elindholm]

To say they are not disappointed would be to say that they are impressed, or at least on the fence.

Um, yeah.

You're hard pressed to say that the chuckwagon is rolling in the right direction currently.

The team is not playing well, by any measure, but O'Neal himself looks okay.

There isn't some miracle second wind in those sails. One too many Whopper combos has submarined that line of thought.

That's no secret to the Suns now, nor was it before the trade.

As for Marion declining, he's as good a second banana as you're going to find in this league right now.

I vehemently disagree with that, but we'll see how the next 4-5 years go before making the final call.

Perhaps it's a bit less, but at this level of pay I'm thinking he's not worried about making the rent.

Not relevant.

 

[CaptainInsano]

Marion is definately not one of the best 2nd banana's in the league right now.

Manu is 2nd banana (or possibly even 3rd after Tony Parkers performance in last years playoffs!) to Tim Duncan and Manu can dominate a game.

Shawn Marion does not dominate playoff games, he can put up solid if sometimes slightly below regular season numbers, but marion has never ever single handedly torn a team apart in the playoffs like Manu or Parker can.

Did you see Caron Butler last year on the wizards? Nasty.

Tyson Chandler and his BEASTLY rebounding yet he is obviously 2nd fiddle to CP on the hornets. I (and many other suns fans) would have taken that type of rebounding in a straight up trade for marion ANY DAY of the week.

etc. etc.

*edit: I think though you could definately make a case for marion being best 3rd banana with his stat stuffing.

 

[MiamiHeat]

uh.....changed due to recent circumstances

 

[ozzfloyd]

Marion tired of the Suns? I think it's apparent that the Suns were tired of Marion.

 

[green machine]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCiSxbRf0pc

And you try to say you're not a troll?

This post provides nothing to this thread.

 

[MiamiHeat]

well, the post wouldn't have been so bad, but after this loss to the 76ers. im going to remove it lol. suns fans are upset

 

[arwillan]

Marion is definately not one of the best 2nd banana's in the league right now.

Manu is 2nd banana (or possibly even 3rd after Tony Parkers performance in last years playoffs!) to Tim Duncan and Manu can dominate a game.

Shawn Marion does not dominate playoff games, he can put up solid if sometimes slightly below regular season numbers, but marion has never ever single handedly torn a team apart in the playoffs like Manu or Parker can.

Did you see Caron Butler last year on the wizards? Nasty.

Tyson Chandler and his BEASTLY rebounding yet he is obviously 2nd fiddle to CP on the hornets. I (and many other suns fans) would have taken that type of rebounding in a straight up trade for marion ANY DAY of the week.

etc. etc.

*edit: I think though you could definately make a case for marion being best 3rd banana with his stat stuffing.

aside from caron butler, antawn jamison was tearing the cavs apart in the post season as well. at the end of the playoffs, he was the leader in ppg with a little bit over 30. granted they only played one series, but that is still impressive. you know, that wizards team could/should be a lot better than they are.

 

[Hat]

He's already complaining about the Heat. Shocking!

http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/51194/20080301/marion_questions_teammates_desire/

SEATTLE — Forward Shawn Marion has been with the Heat only a little more than three weeks, but he already has expressed concern on more than one occasion about the determination of his teammates.
The latest comments came Thursday night after a 106-88 loss to the Lakers in a game televised from Los Angeles by TNT.

"We've got a national TV game. You're telling me you can't get pumped up and come out with fire? That's frustrating. We've got dig deeper," said Marion, who was obtained from Phoenix on Feb. 6 in the Shaquille O'Neal trade. Lakers reserve guard Jordan Farmar made 9 of 14 shots from the field and led all scorers with 24 points."Their bench comes in and gives them energy, our bench needs to come in and give us energy," said Marion, who was in Seattle with his teammates to face the SuperSonics on Friday night. "It's got to be an even swap. We can't have it one-sided."


Miami fell behind 22-6 in the first quarter and never recovered. It was the Heat's sixth loss in the seven games since Marion donned a Heat jersey.
"It's hard, man," he said. "I'm used to being a leader on the floor, but it's got to be everybody. When everybody starts to feel pain, to feel that pain, and get (upset) on the floor ... then this will end. Until that happens, it's never going to end."


But his teammates didn't seem overly bothered by the loss. As Marion spoke in the post-game locker room, they unwittingly illustrated his point by casually joking in the background. Marion also voiced frustration with the club's attitude after a 112-100 loss at Houston on Feb. 21 and after a 101-96 overtime defeat two days later against Philadelphia.


"That was a tough, tough, tough loss for him," coach Pat Riley said of the Sixers game, in which the Heat took a 96-91 lead in overtime but let Philadelphia finish on a 10-0 run.
"I think that was the first time he really felt it," Riley said of the malaise afflicting the Heat.


Marion's former team is playing for an NBA title this season while his new team is playing out the string."Sometimes you get caught in a situation that you've got to deal with, so he's trying to deal with it as best he can right now," Riley said.

 

[arwillan]

can't say i blame shawn for questioning the heart of anyone that's a part of the heat right now.

 

[MiamiHeat]

heart? 9-39 when HEAT acquired Marion. season = over. why would anyone question the heart of a team that was left in the shaq mess, is beyond me.

HEAT are about future = lottery pick + wade + expiring contracts of JWILL/Davis, with or without marion.

marion is just trying to sell himself for his contract coming up

 

[arwillan]

heart? 9-39 when HEAT acquired Marion. season = over. why would anyone question the heart of a team that was left in the shaq mess, is beyond me.

that makes no sense at all, both gramatically and literally.

Why would anyone question the heart of a team that's 9-39? that kind of answers itself. if you are 9-39, it's because of a lack of effort. that means no heart. the fact that they have continued to suck means that they really have no heart. how could you even ask such a stupid question? do us a favor, ban yourself.

 

[MiamiHeat]

they are 9-39 because a certain 20 mil a year center refused to play and demanded a buyout, threatening to stay injured etc......

so this leaves a 20million dollar hole in the HEAT roster, a Dwyane Wade who came off 2 surgeries - 1 for his shoulder and 1 for his knee and is recovering, no Alonzo mourning, etc..... and a team that was built to tailor Shaq.

what team leaves 20 million dollars of free space ? nobody. you use it to sign someone. HEAT didn't have ANYBODY in that hole, cause shaq was sitting. at the same time, SHAQ was in the locker room telling teammates he was praying to be traded. he was openly mocking pat riley. team chemistry was off and team was hurting and missing a shaq. so you go 9-39. season = over. lottery pick in future is our best bet.

so it's not about effort or lack of desire. it's about a ugly situation that has left the season ruined even before the Marion trade.

that's how you treat that team.

 

[BeeBeard]

they are 9-39 because a certain 20 mil a year center refused to play and demanded a buyout, threatening to stay injured etc......

so this leaves a 20million dollar hole in the HEAT roster, a Dwyane Wade who came off 2 surgeries - 1 for his shoulder and 1 for his knee and is recovering, no Alonzo mourning, etc..... and a team that was built to tailor Shaq.

what team leaves 20 million dollars of free space ? nobody. you use it to sign someone. HEAT didn't have ANYBODY in that hole, cause shaq was sitting. at the same time, SHAQ was in the locker room telling teammates he was praying to be traded. he was openly mocking pat riley. team chemistry was off and team was hurting and missing a shaq. so you go 9-39. season = over. lottery pick in future is our best bet.

so it's not about effort or lack of desire. it's about a ugly situation that has left the season ruined even before the Marion trade.

that's how you treat that team.

This is one of the silliest things I've ever seen a Heat fan claim. And here I thought you guys were through trying to blame Shaq for your misery, and were starting to man up and evaluate your team for what it is. I guess not.

The other points I can sort of agree with you on. But why aren't you mentioning how terrible the ownership of your team is? For instance, you were bad last year because your idiotic owner refused to ante up to keep Kapono (one of the best 3-pt shooters in the game) and James Posey (one of the best defensive stoppers in the game). If you can't pay to play, you can't compete in the league. So in the name of being cheap, you guys lost most of your perimeter offense and defense.

Plus, when is Dwayne Wade going to change his "get back up" commercials to where he gets knocked down and then just kind of stays there on the ground, writhing in pain while somebody on the other team violently kicks him? Because I've never seen someone get so battered in the course of two seasons, and if Riley were an intelligent man (we're being hypothetical here because he's obviously not) he would just rest Dwayne Wade for the rest of the season.

I'd say that the worst is over for your guys, but it just isn't true. The Heat have developed a culture of losing in Miami that is so profound, so deeply rooted, that the best free agents will avoid the team at all costs. Some might still play for you if the money is nice enough, but the fact that the Heat will have to overpay to draw good talent to their woeful team essentially neutralizes whatever advantage in salary cap space the team might eventually have when bad contracts like Williams' finally come off the books. Is it any wonder why Marion won't play for the Heat?

I realize trying to place blame for all this at the feet of the man who won you a championship is easier than objectively evaluating everything that's wrong with the Heat. But you should try just being honest about the situation in Miami. You might be happier in the long run.

 

[MiamiHeat]

shaq did NOT WIN the heat a championship.

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^ Wade, Finals MVP, won the championship. I don't think you watched the FINALS MAVS vs HEAT at all.

management of the HEAT is among the best in the NBA. the HEAT just had no wiggle room because of shaq's salary.

the HEAT clearly said they were willing to go over the cap for a player that was worth it.

Kapono signing a deal with Toronto paying him 6 million a year is NOT worth it. kapono is not worth that much.

posey is a huge loss that the HEAT miss very much. i'm one of the fans that knew from day 1 we needed to keep him. the problem was, he wanted more money than we had to offer him.

basically it came down to this : the HEAT were sweeped 4-0 with shaq, posey, and kapono

so why would Pat Riley, with only like 6 mil to work with, use it all on 1 of those guys we just got swept with? Kapono IS NOT WORTH 6mil a year. period. and if we used it all on Posey, we are the same team that got swept 4-0 WITH posey. so riley said no and tried to go after Mo Williams, asking him to sign with Miami for LESS MONEY because we don't have cap space. obviously, mo said no and went back to Milwaukee. we were left with Smush Parker....

that's how you end up like this. then on top of all of this, shaq DEMANDS a buyout by threatening to remain injured because he wants to go to DALLAS. so locker room chemistry and team is now even worse off. wade missed the start of season because of injury surgery and is trying to recover.....

that's how. riley has proved to be one of the best GM's -ever- if you look at his track record. his coaching speaks for itself, one of best all time top 3. and micky arison is a nice guy, one of top 2 richest NBA owners around who isn't afraid to go over tax but it has to be worth it.

i know the situation. shaq is to blame, why does that bother you?