Meet The Mavs: For Dallas Fan, It's Like Looking in a Mirror at Your Former Self

M3Man

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I'm enjoying reading your board, because you guys sound so much like us Mavs fans. And why not. You guys are us, 3 years ago. You got Stevie being Stevie, and Raja as a combo of himself on D and Finley on offense. We love those guys and hated losing them. You have centers who can shoot from outside, and no decent shockblocking. You have guys who can play defense, but often settle for just taking the ball out of the net and running it back down the opponents throats. You got a team playing the style Don Nelson coached for 15 years, but your coach gives Nash more freedom, so he's better than when he was here, and in better shape. And since you've only knocked us out of the playoffs once, we don't hate your team as much as we were sick of the Spurs, being state champs and all.

This ought to be a great series. Here's some stuff you may not know about our team, and why I think the Mavs win.

Dirk. Has spent all year learning how to beat small forwards who defend him. He scored 29 on Artest, swept Memphis with Battier in round 1. Marion was never as good agaisnt him this year as he was in the playoffs last year. Last year, he'd gone 7 games against McGrady in Houston before he got to Marion. This year, he's been warming up on Bowen. Marion will seem like a vacation. And did you see the play that sent our game 7 to OT? Where Dirk just blows by Bowen? You may be better off putting Marion on Howard, where he might be more effective.

Depth. Avery played 10 players against San Antonio. If Nash gets hot, he can try 3 point guards who are as quick, or either Howard or Marquis Daniels for their length. If Marion is going, both Howard and Adrian Griffin are above average defenders. On offense, its never a problem having 5 scorers on the floor at a time. And Avery isn't afraid to go to his 11th man, DJ Mbenga, a young African center. He's got Amare's body, but he didn't start playing basketball until summer. He's got good enough feet to go outside with TT, and he's a fouling, shotblocking machine. Raw, but scary fun to watch. The only reason he doesn't play more is because he's a free agent and the Mavs want to resign him, so they are hiding him in the playoffs. His only start last year was in April, against PHX. Gee, I wonder why?

Speed kills. Everybody says no one can run with Phoenix, and until last month, that may have been true. But in San Antonio, game 2, Devin Harris had his coming out party. The kid played well in the 1st half of the season, and was supposed to tranistion into starting when he got hurt and missed the last 30 games. He's still raw, but he's faster than Nash, and runs a good fast break. The rest of the team, except the centers, were chosen because they could play Nellieball. We can go with Dirk, Van Horn, Howard, Daniels, Terry, Harris and match Phoenix speed for speed. Our break isn't as smooth as yours, but it sure forced San Antonio to bench all its bigs. We don't want to go there, but we ain't afraid of that style one little bit.

Defense. The main difference between these Mavs and Nash's Mavs is defense. Nobody on this team takes a play off. Johnson has an assistant coach that watches tape of every game and notes every defensive mistake. The next day, every player gets a detailed report of each mistake, and a grade. The team gets a grade as well. They know if the team scores over 70, they win, and if under 50 they lose, and they can see how their score effects the team. Its made them super accountable to each other, and much more methodical about correecting mistakes. At varing times of the year, we've had trouble guarding point guards or small forwards, or Pau Gasol. Not anymore. Avery is very good at correcting problems. The only ones he can't solve are the impossible ones. Like Duncan, and maybe Nash. To beat us in March, the Suns needed Raja to go 5-5, TT 5-7 and Marion 2-2 from the 3 point Line. If your guys can shoot 67% on 3's every game, were in trouble. I doubt they can shoot 67% in practice day after day.

Avery Johnson; This year's coach of the year vs last years. To Me D'Antoni is a smarter, cooler Don Nelson. He took the best of Nellie and Nash and improved on it. AJ also took the best of Nellie. But he won his championship under Popovich, and brings all that defensive mindedness. And the Mavs believe in him. They do what he says and they get better and they know it works. He says "I've led a team to a championship, this is how it's done," and every player has bought into his vision, lock stock and barrell. In the'03 season, when we got to the WC Finals, Avery was left off the playoff roster, but stayed on as an assistant coach. In round one, the Mavs started out beating Portland 3 straight. Then they lost 3. Nelson decided to let Avery make the pre-game speech. That speech is a big reason he's coach today. But his work this year shows he deserved it. This year alone, he's jettisoned Christie, his starting shooting guard, benched Dampier, his 70 Million dollar center, and gotten better. AJ got outcoached by both Van Gundy and D'Antoni last year. This year, he ran rings around Fratello and Popovich. He swept Memphis starting Griffin. In SA, he benched Griff and went a speed line up, starting Harris, who had played 17 minutes in the previous 30 games. Finally, in game 7, saving Diop until 1 minute left in the game, when he had five fouls to give and could go super aggressive on Duncan, who shot 1-7 in overtime. The guy is unreal, and full of surprizes. He just beat one mentor. Let's see how he does against his other mentor's evil twin.

Let's get it on!
 
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M3Man

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jkf296 said:
Great post.

Welcome to the board.

Thanks. I put a lot of work into it. We got into a real immature bout with spursreport.com, and I wanted to get this off on the right foot. Check us out at Dallas-mavs.com The mods are death on trolls, but we enjoy some well informed sparring. Come tell us stuff we don't know.
 

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This sounds like someone who has watched Dallas 70+ times a year, and also someone who has watched Phoenix play 4 times a year.

I think that you are giving your team way too much credit, without knowing the Suns' gameplan.

Your post is insightful in many ways, and yet leaves a lot to be desired.

You rarely speak about matchup problems, unless it concerns Dirk, and yet you basically forget the matchup problems that Phoenix can exploit. (Nash, TT on just about anyone the Mavs throw out on him, Diaw, etc.)

I would love to add more, and I probably will when I get more time to post.
 
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While I respect your opinion, I have to disagree with it. Avery Johnson has turned out to be a good coach and did a good job against Pop but he isn't going against any student of Nellie. Nellie's offense wasn't nearly as sophisticated as D'antoni's, in fact I never thought Dallas was the premier running team in the League, Sacramento was better then them most of the time. On the other Hand D'antoni has proven that he can take steve Nash and any other group of guys that you can name and make them into an unstoppable force.

As far as Dirk going off on marion. Marion has always played dirk tough. He is longer, quicker and more explosive then Bowen who spends all his time playing tough defense until you forget about him and then hits a wide open 3 to break your heart. Marion is not only going to be in Dirk's face defensively but he is going to torch dirk on the offensive end and may get him into foul trouble. I do think that Dallas is a better team then San antonio but sometimes match ups can make a difference in a win or a loss, and the Suns match up with Dallas better then with San Antonio. I think that Phoenix may still lose this series but they have a legit shot at winning it unlike if they had played the Spurs.
 

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I would be surprised if Marion spends a lot of time on Nowitzki. D'Antoni may try it out to see how it goes, but the Suns have to keep Marion out of foul trouble, and if Dirk's going to get 40 on everyone, better to let him and keep someone else from making major contributions. I think Marion will see more time against Howard.

I don't think the Suns can beat the Mavs in a 7-game series without considerable help from Kurt Thomas so the Suns don't have to play so much help defense. We don't even know if he's coming back, and D'Antoni makes it sound like if he does, it will be in very brief appearances. I think that means the Suns will be way too short-handed for this series.
 

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:self:
you sayin you can run with us? :bhiich:
 
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M3Man

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Nash said:
:self:
you sayin you can run with us? :bhiich:

Better than anyone else in the NBA. The biggest tweak Johnson did to the offense was to wait for a better shot, instead of taking the 1st good one like PHX/Nellie does. Shooting percentage goes up, long rebounds and fast break opportunities go down, rebounding improves. Our scoring is down, but our opponents scoring is down more. I'm saying I don't think you will run off and leave us. And we'll probably kill you on the boards.
 

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M3Man said:
Better than anyone else in the NBA. The biggest tweak Johnson did to the offense was to wait for a better shot, instead of taking the 1st good one like PHX/Nellie does. Shooting percentage goes up, long rebounds and fast break opportunities go down, rebounding improves. Our scoring is down, but our opponents scoring is down more. I'm saying I don't think you will run off and leave us. And we'll probably kill you on the boards.

Killing us on the boards is nothing new... that's our perceived weakness and everyone knows it.

I do anticipate much faster pace game which favors us.
 
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M3Man

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Gaddabout said:
I would be surprised if Marion spends a lot of time on Nowitzki. D'Antoni may try it out to see how it goes, but the Suns have to keep Marion out of foul trouble, and if Dirk's going to get 40 on everyone, better to let him and keep someone else from making major contributions. I think Marion will see more time against Howard.

Marion has been the primary defender on Dirk so far, and had some good games. Held him to 26 once this year, then gave up 36.

Dirk never covers Marion. That's usually Howard's job.
 

frdbtr

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M3Man said:
Better than anyone else in the NBA. The biggest tweak Johnson did to the offense was to wait for a better shot, instead of taking the 1st good one like PHX/Nellie does. Shooting percentage goes up, long rebounds and fast break opportunities go down, rebounding improves. Our scoring is down, but our opponents scoring is down more. I'm saying I don't think you will run off and leave us. And we'll probably kill you on the boards.

You keep saying stuff like "PHX/Nellie", I am telling you that if you think that Phoenix's offense and D'antoni's philosophy is anything like Nellie's then you are going to be sorely disapointed watching the Suns in the finals. Dallas is not the best running team in the NBA, they average 10pts per game less then Phoenix did this year.....without its most explosive player (Amare Stoudemire)
 

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frdbtr said:
While I respect your opinion, I have to disagree with it. Avery Johnson has turned out to be a good coach and did a good job against Pop but he isn't going against any student of Nellie. Nellie's offense wasn't nearly as sophisticated as D'antoni's, in fact I never thought Dallas was the premier running team in the League, Sacramento was better then them most of the time. On the other Hand D'antoni has proven that he can take steve Nash and any other group of guys that you can name and make them into an unstoppable force.

As far as Dirk going off on marion. Marion has always played dirk tough. He is longer, quicker and more explosive then Bowen who spends all his time playing tough defense until you forget about him and then hits a wide open 3 to break your heart. Marion is not only going to be in Dirk's face defensively but he is going to torch dirk on the offensive end and may get him into foul trouble. I do think that Dallas is a better team then San antonio but sometimes match ups can make a difference in a win or a loss, and the Suns match up with Dallas better then with San Antonio. I think that Phoenix may still lose this series but they have a legit shot at winning it unlike if they had played the Spurs.

That is fine if you disagree, but how many Suns games have you seen this year? The Suns have created matchup problems for teams all year, the same way that you forced the Spurs to bench their bigs. The Clippers did about as good as you can do, as far as sticking to their gameplan and not getting into a running game with the Suns. I do not think that the Mavs are as disciplined in that regard. I do not believe, (just like you have stated) that the Mavs can beat the Suns in a running game. If they slow down the game, make Nash play defense, and abuse him with physical play, the Mavs have a chance.

No team, not even Dallas can beat the Suns in a running game, especially when the Suns offense was clicking like it was last night.
 
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M3Man

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frdbtr said:
While I respect your opinion, I have to disagree with it. Avery Johnson has turned out to be a good coach and did a good job against Pop but he isn't going against any student of Nellie. Nellie's offense wasn't nearly as sophisticated as D'antoni's, in fact I never thought Dallas was the premier running team in the League, Sacramento was better then them most of the time. On the other Hand D'antoni has proven that he can take steve Nash and any other group of guys that you can name and make them into an unstoppable force.

Dallas not a premier running team? In '03, we won our 1st 16 games, won 60, and beat Sacramento in the playoffs. We lost to SA after Dirk hurt his knee, but actually won a game in SA without him. We had Nash, Dirk, Finley, LaFrenz and Van Exel who could all spot up. We just couldn't slow down Shaq and Duncan.

As for complexity of the offense, I thought the genius of D'Antoni was to free up the genius of Nash, And exploit his ability to make the right decision. Nellie's offense is incredibly detailed and complex. Good players sat because they couldn't figure it out. It took Nash a full 3 years to master it. Obviously, it took him less time to learn Mike's, but he was a much more accomplished point when he returned to PHX than when he was first shipped to Dallas.
 

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M3Man said:
I'm enjoying reading your board, because you guys sound so much like us Mavs fans. And why not. You guys are us, 3 years ago. You got Stevie being Stevie, and Raja as a combo of himself on D and Finley on offense. We love those guys and hated losing them. You have centers who can shoot from outside, and no decent shockblocking. You have guys who can play defense, but often settle for just taking the ball out of the net and running it back down the opponents throats. You got a team playing the style Don Nelson coached for 15 years, but your coach gives Nash more freedom, so he's better than when he was here, and in better shape. And since you've only knocked us out of the playoffs once, we don't hate your team as much as we were sick of the Spurs, being state champs and all.

This ought to be a great series. Here's some stuff you may not know about our team, and why I think the Mavs win.

Dirk. Has spent all year learning how to beat small forwards who defend him. He scored 29 on Artest, swept Memphis with Battier in round 1. Marion was never as good agaisnt him this year as he was in the playoffs last year. Last year, he'd gone 7 games against McGrady in Houston before he got to Marion. This year, he's been warming up on Bowen. Marion will seem like a vacation. And did you see the play that sent our game 7 to OT? Where Dirk just blows by Bowen? You may be better off putting Marion on Howard, where he might be more effective.

Depth. Avery played 10 players against San Antonio. If Nash gets hot, he can try 3 point guards who are as quick, or either Howard or Marquis Daniels for their length. If Marion is going, both Howard and Adrian Griffin are above average defenders. On offense, its never a problem having 5 scorers on the floor at a time. And Avery isn't afraid to go to his 11th man, DJ Mbenga, a young African center. He's got Amare's body, but he didn't start playing basketball until summer. He's got good enough feet to go outside with TT, and he's a fouling, shotblocking machine. Raw, but scary fun to watch. The only reason he doesn't play more is because he's a free agent and the Mavs want to resign him, so they are hiding him in the playoffs. His only start last year was in April, against PHX. Gee, I wonder why?

Speed kills. Everybody says no one can run with Phoenix, and until last month, that may have been true. But in San Antonio, game 2, Devin Harris had his coming out party. The kid played well in the 1st half of the season, and was supposed to tranistion into starting when he got hurt and missed the last 30 games. He's still raw, but he's faster than Nash, and runs a good fast break. The rest of the team, except the centers, were chosen because they could play Nellieball. We can go with Dirk, Van Horn, Howard, Daniels, Terry, Harris and match Phoenix speed for speed. Our break isn't as smooth as yours, but it sure forced San Antonio to bench all its bigs. We don't want to go there, but we ain't afraid of that style one little bit.

Defense. The main difference between these Mavs and Nash's Mavs is defense. Nobody on this team takes a play off. Johnson has an assistant coach that watches tape of every game and notes every defensive mistake. The next day, every player gets a detailed report of each mistake, and a grade. The team gets a grade as well. They know if the team scores over 70, they win, and if under 50 they lose, and they can see how their score effects the team. Its made them super accountable to each other, and much more methodical about correecting mistakes. At varing times of the year, we've had trouble guarding point guards or small forwards, or Pau Gasol. Not anymore. Avery is very good at correcting problems. The only ones he can't solve are the impossible ones. Like Duncan, and maybe Nash. To beat us in March, the Suns needed Raja to go 5-5, TT 5-7 and Marion 2-2 from the 3 point Line. If your guys can shoot 67% on 3's every game, were in trouble. I doubt they can shoot 67% in practice day after day.

Avery Johnson; This year's coach of the year vs last years. To Me D'Antoni is a smarter, cooler Don Nelson. He took the best of Nellie and Nash and improved on it. AJ also took the best of Nellie. But he won his championship under Popovich, and brings all that defensive mindedness. And the Mavs believe in him. They do what he says and they get better and they know it works. He says "I've led a team to a championship, this is how it's done," and every player has bought into his vision, lock stock and barrell. In the'03 season, when we got to the WC Finals, Avery was left off the playoff roster, but stayed on as an assistant coach. In round one, the Mavs started out beating Portland 3 straight. Then they lost 3. Nelson decided to let Avery make the pre-game speech. That speech is a big reason he's coach today. But his work this year shows he deserved it. This year alone, he's jettisoned Christie, his starting shooting guard, benched Dampier, his 70 Million dollar center, and gotten better. AJ got outcoached by both Van Gundy and D'Antoni last year. This year, he ran rings around Fratello and Popovich. He swept Memphis starting Griffin. In SA, he benched Griff and went a speed line up, starting Harris, who had played 17 minutes in the previous 30 games. Finally, in game 7, saving Diop until 1 minute left in the game, when he had five fouls to give and could go super aggressive on Duncan, who shot 1-7 in overtime. The guy is unreal, and full of surprizes. He just beat one mentor. Let's see how he does against his other mentor's evil twin.

Let's get it on!


Welcome M3Man to this board.

Actually, I have watched the mavs quite alot and am impressed with their team this year. I even picked the Mavs to win the title in an office pool. I also predicted the mavs were too fast for the spurs as the reason. Thanks alot for knocking those guys off as they present more matchup problems for the suns.

Here is my comments to your statements:

Dirk has improved alot in his low post game and his defense which is now only mediocre instead of poor. His help D is actually pretty good. His low post game is very underrated, I'm not sure Marion can handle him one-on-one anymore. Dirk is a great player, period. All the Dirk haters can now eat crow.

Depth: yeah with Amare and KT out, the mavs are certainly deeper, though Mbenga cannot guard TT, he's too inexperienced and yes he's a fouling machine, but not necessarily by choice. I dont know if anyone on the roster can guard TT or Diaw. The guards of the mavs are young and often make poor decisions, especially under pressure.

Speed Kills: I like Harris, he's real fast, almost as fast as Barbosa. Jason Terry is also very quick, but, at best, an average defender. Stack is fast, dangerous, but often has tunnel vision, he'll be a force regardless. Daniels plays much better against the suns than the spurs. I expect his PT will go way up. But these suns do not have the speed mismatch that the spurs had. When the spurs went to the bench, it was the geritol syndrome, old and slow. All in all, big edge to the mavs at the guard position, depthwise, but not speed wise. For the suns to win, those young guards must turn the ball over.

Mavs defense: yes its better but statistically the same defensive efficiency, per possession, as last years team. The real difference is the emergence of Josh Howard, a guy who is quickly developing into a premier stopper in this league. Howard was under development, playing limited minutes due to "rookie disease" in Nashs last year in Dallas(he had the disease, even if he wasnt a rookie). The departure of finley also made the mavs better on defense with Griffin and Daniels getting more PT. The arrival of Diop also helped the D against half court teams. The best defense against the spurs was the Mavs offense and Parkers bum ankle. Duncan was unstoppable, but he was almost alone on the spurs.

I see the Mavs winning in 6 or 7 depending on how tired the suns really are and how the Mavs exploit that. But you never know, the suns quicker front line may be able to balance out the depth imbalance at guard. The Mavs had an amazing year, with the injuries to Harris, howard, stack happening at the right time. That may be the biggest reason that the mavs can win it all.
 

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Great post, usually I don’t read a post that long, but it kept me interested. I agree with much of it, but one point I disagree with is your discussion on depth. I don’t see your depth of 10 or 11 players as an advantage, unless of course there are foul problems. These games are filled with numerous breaks of enormous sized commercial breaks. Seven players are all you need at this point. And I don’t know who the hell DJ Mbenga is going to guard on defense…..
 

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You make our job so much easier by using facts that we could use better.

M3Man said:
Dallas not a premier running team? In '03, we won our 1st 16 games, won 60, and beat Sacramento in the playoffs. We lost to SA after Dirk hurt his knee, but actually won a game in SA without him. We had Nash, Dirk, Finley, LaFrenz and Van Exel who could all spot up. We just couldn't slow down Shaq and Duncan.

Exactly, in '03 you probably were. The guys you've listed - Nash : runs our team now
Exel : is in the Spurs and so is Finley.

So what was that point again about still having a premier running game?

M3Man said:
As for complexity of the offense, I thought the genius of D'Antoni was to free up the genius of Nash, And exploit his ability to make the right decision.

Genius of Nash? ok..agreed..

M3Man said:
Nellie's offense is incredibly detailed and complex. It took Nash a full 3 years to master it. Obviously, it took him less time to learn Mike's,

shoot! 3 years to learn it? where did the "Genius of Nash" go then?
Less time to learn Mike's because it was simpler, eh? But he learnt it and used his freedom to kick your ass last year.....what was Nellie's detailed, intricate offense doing then? oh the players didn't understand it, right? ok..
 

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M3Man said:
Dallas not a premier running team? In '03, we won our 1st 16 games, won 60, and beat Sacramento in the playoffs. We lost to SA after Dirk hurt his knee, but actually won a game in SA without him. We had Nash, Dirk, Finley, LaFrenz and Van Exel who could all spot up. We just couldn't slow down Shaq and Duncan.

As for complexity of the offense, I thought the genius of D'Antoni was to free up the genius of Nash, And exploit his ability to make the right decision. Nellie's offense is incredibly detailed and complex. Good players sat because they couldn't figure it out. It took Nash a full 3 years to master it. Obviously, it took him less time to learn Mike's, but he was a much more accomplished point when he returned to PHX than when he was first shipped to Dallas.

I'm gonna agree that the Mavs were and are a running team. The interesting thing that is overlooked is the "Nash impact" as % assisted baskets as a sun. He was not like that as a Mav, mostly because the guys he passed to went one-on-one instead of passing back and forth to force positioning, get better shots. I always liked that mavs team, but they almost didnt score any points in the paint. This is where the suns offense is very different than the old (or new) mavs. Nash creates more than he ever did under Nellie(check assists as a mav, % assisted baskets) and the suns score alot more in the paint. The mavs are really a one-on-one team that runs, with one of the lowest assisted basket stats among playoff teams in the NBA. They are very talented with Dirk, Terry, Stack, Harris all able to go one-on-one against almost anyone.
 
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M3Man

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dreamcastrocks said:
That is fine if you disagree, but how many Suns games have you seen this year? The Suns have created matchup problems for teams all year, the same way that you forced the Spurs to bench their bigs. The Clippers did about as good as you can do, as far as sticking to their gameplan and not getting into a running game with the Suns. I do not think that the Mavs are as disciplined in that regard. I do not believe, (just like you have stated) that the Mavs can beat the Suns in a running game. If they slow down the game, make Nash play defense, and abuse him with physical play, the Mavs have a chance.

No team, not even Dallas can beat the Suns in a running game, especially when the Suns offense was clicking like it was last night.

You are right. I haven't watched many Suns games. But I have watched a few. I love how Raja has blossomed. He was the teeth of our other 60 win team. But I don't worry about matchups so much, because we have versitle players. If you think if the Marion body type, long, lean leapers, we have 2 of those in Howard and Marquis Daniels. You have 2 quick point guards, but they are no quicker than Harris or Terry. Yours do shoot the 3 better, and thats my biggest worry. I do't worry about benching our centers, because then our bigs become 6'10 Van Horn and 7' Dirk, who are taller, if not stronger that anybody you have except K. Thomas. Who I hope plays, so we can get our shotblockers some minutes.

No, I am not saying we can run with the Suns all night. I am saying If we chose to, we'd come closer than anybody else in the NBA. I expect out game plan will be to run some, and when you are not clicking, we'll grab long rebounds and come right back at you and make you get back on defense and run early offense. When you are scrambling around, Howard and Harris and Stackhouse will be slashing to the hoop or Dirk and Terry will be spotting up. If you hit 67% from the three, like in March, we're toast. But we were still working in the 4 key players who'd been hurt all month, and started a rookie at center, so that game isn't very representative.

If you think this team lacks dicipline, you are showing how few Mavericks games you've watched this season. This teams devotion to its coach and his system is frightenly cult-like. He's not afraid to sit anybody who's not doing hus job. including Dirk. And we are deep enough that its not an idle threat.
 

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Wow, I just went and read a few threads on that Mavs board and I'm just amazed at the way those dillusional fans look at this series. Yes, the Mavs most likely will win the series, but with the ease that they are talking? Insane.

Also, why the bitter hatred for Nash? The guy played his heart out for that team and when they wouldn't pony up for him, he moved on, then he destroyed them in the playoffs last year. Don't hate the guy just because you gave him up and now can't stop him.
 

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Card Trader said:
Also, why the bitter hatred for Nash? The guy played his heart out for that team and when they wouldn't pony up for him, he moved on, then he destroyed them in the playoffs last year. Don't hate the guy just because you gave him up and now can't stop him.
seems to be somekind of a behavioral pattern with the Mavs fans, probably inspired by the blowhard Cuban? I don't know. but they did the same to Finley and it makes no sense whatsoever.
 

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The only reason he doesn't play more is because he's a free agent and the Mavs want to resign him, so they are hiding him in the playoffs.

This is the only glaring error in your analysis. This kind of conspiracy theory is a fan favorite whenever there is a young guy who shows flashes but isn't earning consistent playing time. We've seen it on this board, regarding Suns players, plenty of times as well. The only problem is, it is never, ever, ever correct, and that goes double for the playoffs. Coaches play to win now -- especially in the conference finals! -- and they don't worry about how much they'll have to pay Player X if he happens to help them win a game or two.
 

Cheesebeef

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interesting take from M3M - welcome to the board. I happen to think you're pretty on target with most of your comments and the depth, size, speed and homecourt are all factors that should bring confidence, but that's why they play the games. Hell, I thought we were finished against you guys last year when we lost JJ, but we prevailed... I thought we were finished this preseason when Amare went out... and then when Kurt Thomas went out... and then when we went down 3-1 to the Lakers... but there's SOMETHING about this Suns team - I don't know what it is and I won't even try to put my finger on it, I just know I'm loving every second of it.

The one advantage I think wehave is plain and simple - Steve Nash - sure, he'll get toasted on defense, but there's just something (again - I can't put a finger on it) that tells me that there is no way Cuban beats him. That's probably mor eof my heart talking than my mind, but regardless, this should be a HELL of series.

I do find it odd though that the Mavs have seemingly figured that they've won the west - I mean Avery Johnson - "how bout those Mavericks?" as if he was JJ on the Cowboys - Avery - start patting yourself on the back after winning a conference title, or maybe if you crushed the Spurs, arther than almost giving up the second greatest choke job in the history of sports next to the Yankess (sorry, but up 3-1 and then up 20 in the 7th game and you need OT to win? That doens't speak of a whole lot fo composure). But that's fine - let them be over-confident, hell, I expect them to ride a wave of momentum in Game 1 and probably crush us and REALLY think the series is over, but I'm reminded of a 1989 Suns team that went to the conference finals in 1988, got swept by the Lakers, then came back and beat their asses in 5 games when the Lakes had the best record in basketball the next year. Everyone fifured the Blazers were nothing more than a roadblock on the way to the Finals, but they put us down in 6 - I coul see the same thing happening here - who knows? Again - that's why they play the game.

I DO know this - The NBA and David Stern has to be creaming his pants - the Pistons, the best team in the league, going up in a rematch against Shaq and Wade in one Conference Final, and Nash and the free-wheeling Suns running a track meet against his former team and also his best friend Dirk and gun-slinging Mavs - they couldn't ask for anything more. NO ONE LIKES WATCHING SA.
 

Bada0Bing

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M3Man said:
You are right. I haven't watched many Suns games. If you think if the Marion body type, long, lean leapers, we have 2 of those in Howard and Marquis Daniels. You have 2 quick point guards, but they are no quicker than Harris or Terry.

I just lost respect for your knowledge. Now you’re comparing Marion with Howard and Daniels? And who are our two quick point guards? Do you really know the Suns? I don’t think so.
 

Cheesebeef

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Bada0Bing said:
I just lost respect for your knowledge. Now you’re comparing Marion with Howard and Daniels? And who are our two quick point guards? Do you really know the Suns? I don’t think so.


jeez man, give the guy a break. He's said "Marion-body type" not actually comparing Howard and Daniels to Marion and he's right. And I think our two quick PGs are Nash and Barbs, which he's right about there as well. Besdies, he's said he's only watched 4 games and his knowledge of us is better than most trolls we get here and he's not being a douche or anything. Give the guy a break.

I mean most everyone here is talking about how great Marion plays Dirk, but in reality, this is a MUCH better Dirk than we've ever seen and he torched Marion's ass for 30 points a game this year, but you don't seem to be going off on any of us.

I just don't understand why a contrary opinion has to be met with "you're clueless" which is basically what you're saying when you say "you've lost all respect".. come on - this guy started a good thoughtful thread and he gets this kind of guff - if that' the way it's gonna be, we might as well ban him right now.
 
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