Meeting between owners and players fails to materialize

[NickelBack]

A collective bargaining session between a large group of NBA owners and players, originally scheduled for Tuesday, has ``failed to materialize,'' a league spokesman said.

The development could be an ominous sign in labor talks, coming less than a week after commissioner David Stern publicly downgraded his outlook for reaching a new agreement from ``optimistic'' to ``hopeful.''

A spokesman for the players' union said the league informed the players over the weekend that Tuesday's previously scheduled session wouldn't take place.

``They told us we won't be able to meet. They said they'd get back to us as to what the next step would be,'' union spokesman Dan Wasserman said.

Union attorneys met with league officials last Thursday and orally outlined a new proposal to replace the seven-year agreement that is due to expire June 30.

In downgrading his forecast for a speedy and amicable resolution, Stern indicated this would be a critical week in negotiations.

The sides have been meeting in small groups regularly since mid-February, although considerable differences remain on several key issues.

Owners would like to reduce the maximum length of long-term contracts, reduce the size of annual percentage salary increases in long-term contracts and raise the minimum age for playing in the NBA.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=ap-nbalabor&prov=ap&type=lgns

 

[WizardOfAz]

Did they not learn a thing from the NHL this past season?

 

[Joe Mama]

Did they not learn a thing from the NHL this past season?

I would wait until at least August to say stuff like this. As far as I'm concerned it's just posturing by both sides.

Joe Mama

 

[NickelBack]

ESPN was running with this on tonight's Sports Centers.

 

[WizardOfAz]

I would wait until at least August to say stuff like this. As far as I'm concerned it's just posturing by both sides.

They will lock the players out after June 30th, I am pretty sure of that. After reading the news reports today, I think this whole new focus on drug testing presents an additional hurdle that I don't think can be avoided.

 

[justAndy]

...

No season next year because the players don't want to give up the hippie lettuce...

 

[WizardOfAz]

No season next year because the players don't want to give up the hippie lettuce...

Maybe.

Stern adopted a rather 'tough talk' posture for someone who is trying to get a new CBA done.

 

[lancelet's cousin]

The two parties were just on Capitol Hill today talking to a Congressional Commitee. Then it hit me why now is not a good time for CBA discussions. The right move if you ask me, in light of their respective schedules. I see no reason to panic.

 

[WizardOfAz]

The two parties were just on ESPN talking to a Congressional Commitee. Then it hit me why now is not a good time for CBA discussions. The right move if you ask me, in light of their respective schedules. I see no reason to panic.

That's what I thought too when I saw it.

Way too much posturing going to be good for bargining sessions.

 

[asudevil83]

things dont look good folks. i smell a lockout brewing.

 

[NickelBack]

i smell a lockout brewing.

I am afraid you are right.

 

[Joe Mama]

I guarantee there is going to be a lockout. I seriously doubt any season will be lost though.

Joe Mama

 

[haverford]

It seems extremely irrational for either side to make smoking pot a deal-breaker. If the season is cancelled, the reasons will go much deeper.

 

[jibikao]

NBA is going to be like NHL?

I am too lazy to read what's going on but what are they arguing now? What do the players want? MORE MONEY??

 

[WizardOfAz]

NBA says players have backtracked; no new talks scheduled

Claiming that the player's union has backtracked on terms that had already been resolved, the NBA announced Wednesday that no further negotiations are scheduled as the current collective bargaining agreement draws closer to its June 30 expiration date.

"Since we are at a loss as to how we can possibly reach a new deal that is in any way consistent with the principal terms that we have been discussing for many months, there are no further meetings scheduled at this time," deputy commissioner Russ Granik said.

If no new agreement is reached, a lockout could begin as early as July 1 — three days after the draft.

The union did not immediately respond, but on ESPN SportsCenter, union chief Billy Hunter said he resented the NBA's inference that the union had buckled to pressure from player agents.

The sides had been publicly optimistic over the prospects for reaching a new deal until last Friday, when commissioner David Stern downgraded his outlook to "hopeful." That came just hours after two union attorneys gave a verbal outline of the union's new offer and, according to the league, changed its position on several key issues.

"They've taken major steps backward on all the key elements," Granik said in a telephone interview. "We still have more than six weeks until July 1, so I don't want to predict what will or won't happen, but based on way things have gone here it's hard to see where an agreement will be reached any time soon."

A lockout beginning July 1 would force the cancelation of summer leagues and offseason conditioning programs at team facilities. Training camps are scheduled to open in early October.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/basketball/nba/2005-05-18-labor_x.htm?csp=34

 

[haverford]

NBA is going to be like NHL?

I am too lazy to read what's going on but what are they arguing now? What do the players want? MORE MONEY??

Waaahhhaaaha. That's freaking funny! Er, yeah.




Ask the owners what they want.

 

[WizardOfAz]

Ask the owners what they want.

According to the story, they'd like the PA to stick to the promises they've made.

 

[haverford]

According to the story, they'd like the PA to stick to the promises they've made.

That's a somewhat loaded way to put it; Russ Granik would like them to "keep their promises." My question asked for the same cynicism regarding the owners as jibikao displayed toward the players. What do you think the owners (poor put upon victims that they are) really want?

 

[Joe Mama]

I honestly don't understand why the owners actually want 3-4 year maximum contracts. I would think that 4-5 year maximum contracts would be about perfect. I'm tired of these players. I just don't understand what entitles them to such a large chunk of the overall NBA income. There something wrong when the average NBA player yearly salary is more than many organizations are making at this point.

Somewhere in the ESPN article the other day I read that the players were complaining about the escrow tax because they already pay taxes on their money making their salaries much less than it looks. Guess what? Most Americans pay a large part of their salaries to taxes as well. That's the way it works. The simple fact is that the NBA average salary is about $5 million. Even after you figure taxes into the equation that's enough money after 2-3 years to live like a king for the rest of your life.

Again, my prediction is that there will be a lockout. I will guarantee that one. I also don't think there will be any actual games missed. It may stretch late into the summer and/or even threaten the season, but they will get it figured out before the season actually starts.

Joe Mama

 

[WizardOfAz]

One big sticking point will be Stern's new call for a life-time ban for a third failed drug test.

 

[justAndy]

One big sticking point will be Stern's new call for a life-time ban for a third failed drug test.

bet that one doesn't make it.
bet AI never smoked any herb

 

[haverford]

I honestly don't understand why the owners actually want 3-4 year maximum contracts. I would think that 4-5 year maximum contracts would be about perfect. I'm tired of these players. I just don't understand what entitles them to such a large chunk of the overall NBA income. There something wrong when the average NBA player yearly salary is more than many organizations are making at this point.

Somewhere in the ESPN article the other day I read that the players were complaining about the escrow tax because they already pay taxes on their money making their salaries much less than it looks. Guess what? Most Americans pay a large part of their salaries to taxes as well. That's the way it works. The simple fact is that the NBA average salary is about $5 million. Even after you figure taxes into the equation that's enough money after 2-3 years to live like a king for the rest of your life.

Again, my prediction is that there will be a lockout. I will guarantee that one. I also don't think there will be any actual games missed. It may stretch late into the summer and/or even threaten the season, but they will get it figured out before the season actually starts.

Joe Mama

Overall, I agree with you, Joe; you are one of the most astute and respected authorities on this board and a must read for me. But keep in mind that the vast majority of the players in the NBA are not pulling in break the bank type contracts--for every KG there are probably three or four Paul Shirley's. Moreover, these parties are involved in negotiations about a business in which you have, at best, a marginal financial interest; you can't begin to fathom what good faith and equity are about if you insist on seeing the process solely through your own lens. In other words, of course the scale of the numbers seems exotic and outrageous; but that doesn't invalidate the rules of fairness in process of bargaining.

And, again, I will be shocked if they cancel the season over pot smoking.

 

[elindholm]

But keep in mind that the vast majority of the players in the NBA are not pulling in break the bank type contracts--for every KG there are probably three or four Paul Shirley's.

That might be true, but the average NBA salary is something like $4 million per year, so as a group they're doing pretty well.

 

[haverford]

You know the one about Bill Gates walking into a bar: the average net worth of the patrons soars about a billion??? The principle seems applicable here.

 

[Joe Mama]

Overall, I agree with you, Joe; you are one of the most astute and respected authorities on this board and a must read for me. But keep in mind that the vast majority of the players in the NBA are not pulling in break the bank type contracts--for every KG there are probably three or four Paul Shirley's. Moreover, these parties are involved in negotiations about a business in which you have, at best, a marginal financial interest; you can't begin to fathom what good faith and equity are about if you insist on seeing the process solely through your own lens. In other words, of course the scale of the numbers seems exotic and outrageous; but that doesn't invalidate the rules of fairness in process of bargaining.

And, again, I will be shocked if they cancel the season over pot smoking.

thank you. I see your point about the minimum salary players. However there are some huge problems with that argument. First of all I would say that those players are lucky to be making $400,000 a year for what they do. Most of the time they really aren't contributing much, and if they do it means they are going to get one of the big paydays in the near future.

Secondly, according to recent articles raising the minimum salary pretty significantly is something that both sides have already agreed to do.

I understand where the players are coming from. I can even understand the agents take on the issue, and why they did what they did. To me it's just frustrating that it has come to this point. I really think these ridiculous salaries are at the top of the reasons that people in general are getting turned off by professional sports.

Joe Mama