Nelson: East Valley won when Glendale got stadiums

Jim O

Registered User
Joined
Sep 4, 2002
Posts
5,838
Reaction score
9
Location
Tempe, AZ
East Valley won when Glendale got stadiums
By Gary Nelson, Tribune Columnist
Contact Gary Nelson at [email protected] or phone (480) 898-6541

You must be registered for see images


I read in the paper the other day that the Coyotes’ hockey season is over. This came as news to me because I rank hockey right up there with Botswana’s soccer team as something worth following.

The end of hockey season does, however, bring Los Arcos to mind.
The former home of Scottsdale’s first big shopping mall is nothing more now than a fenced-off, windblown patch of dirt and concrete at Scottsdale and McDowell roads. It’s a big, ugly mess.

But it could be worse. There could be a hockey arena there now.

Scottsdale was headed in that direction after two public votes approved having developer Steve Ellman build a home for the Coyotes on the corner, along with other commercial ventures.

But three years ago, as the City Council tried to make sense of his numbers, Ellman pulled the biggest disappearing act in Scottsdale history. He yanked his plan off the table and headed up to Glendale, whose officials offered him a free ride on a tax-paid gravy train.

Glendale Arena opened in December 2003 to glowing reviews. People liked the architecture and the view of the ice, although the french fries were deemed a bit on the pricey side at four bucks per order.

Home-team victories in the new building were a bit on the pricey side, too.
Given the arena’s $220 million cost, Glendale taxpayers shelled out $44 million for each of the team’s five home wins after the arena opened. But hey, why build a school or hospital when you can win hockey games instead?

Over time, of course, we can take heart in knowing the per-victory cost of the arena will go down. At the blistering pace they set this year, it will take the Coyotes only two more decades to reduce the taxpayer’s cost for home victories to a million bucks apiece.

Next season might not count, though, because there might not be a next season. Labor problems could result in a lockout that might keep Glendale Arena dark until the fall of 2005. Some wonder whether the NHL will survive at all.

And just think, this potential white elephant could have been Scottsdale’s.
It’s enough to make one rethink the now-dead idea of putting a Cardinals stadium in Mesa. For the sake of civic pride, it would have been cool.

But Mesa didn’t suffer the worst fate in the universe when the Cardinals, too, fell for Glendale’s come-hither. If the Cardinals stadium costs $330 million and the team wins four home games a year, it will take 82 seasons to get the per-victory cost down to a million bucks. No football stadium on the planet — not even Green Bay’s vaunted Lambeau Field — has lasted that long.

True, we wouldn’t have those beloved memories of the 2001 World Series if taxpayers hadn’t forked over to build Bank One Ballpark.

But that was a rare thing. For a better picture of what taxpayers usually get for subsidizing jillionaire sports owners, think about what Scottsdale could have had, but fortunately doesn’t.
 

40yearfan

DEFENSE!!!!
Supporting Member
Joined
Feb 2, 2003
Posts
35,013
Reaction score
456
Location
Phoenix, AZ.
Just looking at this guy's picture, you can tell he's a bitter old man with no sense of worth who never has a good day. Because he's so miserable, he tries to drag everyone else down with him.
 

Mrospi

Registered User
Joined
Jan 10, 2003
Posts
1,183
Reaction score
0
Location
Phoenix/west side!!!
I really wish Ellman would put a Tent city over there in Scottsdale....that would be the best outcome for the lot......they seemed to be against anything going in there.

The only thing they might vote for is a nice park there.....

They missed the boat.... the Glendale arena is very nice....can't wait until the restaurants & shopping are built around the area
 

Lex

troublemaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2003
Posts
2,465
Reaction score
0
Location
Scottsdale and one-eleven
Great article ...

This article gives outsiders a unique view of the mind set in Mesa. I would say the reason Gary Nelson is one of the most popular columnists in Mesa, is because he IS the voice of the people. His ignorance is typical of the old gaurd, backward thinking that has made Mesa what it is today, nothing.

The best thing that ever happened to Cardinal fans, was the day Steve Ellman finally gave up on the Los Arcos plan that Scottsdale residents had voted IN FAVOR OF TWICE, but city council members refused to move forward. For THAT day, brought both venues to Glendale. That's about as far away from Mesa as you can get.
 

TruColor

Trombonist in Roger Goodell's Wedding Rcpt.
Supporting Member
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
4,153
Reaction score
3,126
Location
Prescott, AZ
Sour grapes.

Besides the evil-twin-of-Mister-Rodgers picture, the real scary part of this article is how - like so many media-types - he puts a whole incorrect spin on the cost/value of the stadium itself. Yes, it would be extremely cost-ineffective if you based the cost of the facility against a number of Cardinal wins, but please - it's a MULTIPURPOSE stadium. So much more than Lambeau Field I might add. Between Cardinal home games, the annual Fiesta Bowl, an occasional Super Bowl, and countless other events to be held there, I think it will come out ahead of most facilities in the country as far as cost vs. event. I mean, the Cards came out easy; $370 million for a stadium as versitile as this one? Lincoln Financial Field cost $512 million, and it's an open-air venue, with little chance of hosting any other major event, save Eagle home games. Oh, I guess they'll be playing Army/Navy games there too, but come on.

Outside of us Cardinal fans, I sometimes think that people practically make up reasons to bash the Cardinals. Lots of times, it's justified, but not this time.
 

pete

All Star
Joined
May 27, 2003
Posts
820
Reaction score
0
Location
91st & glendale. 2006!
Taking the total cost of the new stadiums and dividing it by the number of wins is a pretty bush league view. Are people in the EV really that bitter about losing out to the best side?
 

AzCards21

Registered User
BANNED BY MODERATORS
Banned from P+R
Joined
Jul 24, 2002
Posts
18,054
Reaction score
61
Location
What?
He states in his first paragraph he doesn't follow hockey. It also sounds like he never has attended a football game.

He stepped way out of his area of expertise to write a completely wrong conclusion to an unresearched article. He's a hack.
 

seesred

Registered User
Joined
Jul 15, 2002
Posts
5,364
Reaction score
28
Location
section 8 row 10
Wins and loses don't cost anything . This guy must have failed in basic math. I thought revenue that produces taxes for that area would equal good or bad investment. Now consider the other dumb people like Hilton and other hotel accomadations, restaurant owners, movie theater builders and other retailers that will invest in this so called per win arena. Then think of the new jobs bith temp and long term. Then think of the taxes and other monies that these people will pay and dump into this stupid Glendale area.

Yes thank God we are now in Glendale not Mesa or Tempe or in fact my City of Phoenix. These smart cities will definitly not miss one single cent of revenue becuase they weren't smart enough to see ehat this development will eventually equal out to be.

The governments are run by short sighted people that will swing fgrom one day to the next baised on the popularity of an issue, not whether it is good or bad. There are exceptions to this rule, however they are in the minority.

GBR
 
Joined
Nov 15, 2002
Posts
13,304
Reaction score
1,182
Location
SE Valley
Yeah, that fenced off pile of rubbish that was once Los Arcos.... that's way better than a venue that draws money into an area :shrug: !
 

joeshmo

Kangol Hat Aficionado
Joined
Feb 23, 2004
Posts
17,247
Reaction score
1
Does anyone know how much money gets pumped into the economy that comes from these events:

Fiesta Bowl(Every year)
NHL All-Star Game(2006)
NFL Superbowl(2008.)

I really want to know these numbers if anyone knows them, so I can send this guy an email.

Becuase I am willing to bet that the money pumped in from those events will more then pay for the 2 stadiums, cactus league facilities, and countless young sports facilities by the end of the 2008 superbowl.
 

seesred

Registered User
Joined
Jul 15, 2002
Posts
5,364
Reaction score
28
Location
section 8 row 10
This is what I just sent him.

Wins and loses don't cost anything . This guy must have failed in basic math. I thought revenue that produces taxes for that area would equal good or bad investment. Now consider the other dumb people like Hilton and other hotel accommodations, restaurant owners, movie theater builders and other retailers that will invest in this so called per win arena. Then think of the new jobs both temp and long term. Then think of the taxes and other monies that these people will pay and dump into this stupid Glendale area.

Yes thank God we are now in Glendale not Mesa or Tempe or in fact my City of Phoenix. These smart cities will definitely not miss one single cent of revenue because they weren't smart enough to see that this development will eventually equal out to be.

The governments are run by short sighted people that will swing from one day to the next based on the popularity of an issue, not whether it is good or bad. There are exceptions to this rule, however they are in the minority.


. I myself will enjoy the games when I can go. Enjoy the new city growing to the west of me, with easy traveling with our new highways, thanks to all our tax payers. I wont waist much time at all on the short blindness of many in the east valley and there need for additional revenue while most new revenue ends up in Glendale. I will also enjoy the new field of dreams at the Hamilton school that is being built by these terrible neighbors. The fields will bring sports to an area in poverty. 2700 children will benefit with this park just west of 19th avenue on Durango. Who are the benefactors? Phoenix Rotary 100, Cardinals, Sports and tourism , The city of Phoenix, The thunderbirds, and APS, The Diamondbacks. Yes sports teams should be rated by wins and loses. To bad many see it like you and always lose.
 

Bobcat

Registered User
Joined
Oct 11, 2002
Posts
1,969
Reaction score
2
Location
Glendale, Arizona
Lex said:
Great article ...

This article gives outsiders a unique view of the mind set in Mesa. I would say the reason Gary Nelson is one of the most popular columnists in Mesa, is because he IS the voice of the people. His ignorance is typical of the old gaurd, backward thinking that has made Mesa what it is today, nothing.

The best thing that ever happened to Cardinal fans, was the day Steve Ellman finally gave up on the Los Arcos plan that Scottsdale residents had voted IN FAVOR OF TWICE, but city council members refused to move forward. For THAT day, brought both venues to Glendale. That's about as far away from Mesa as you can get.

Great article Lex!!! At leastwe don't have him and "Lash Larue" here in Glendale. I wonder if Lash uses her wip on Mr. Nelson???
 

pinnacle

Registered User
Joined
Sep 29, 2002
Posts
2,911
Reaction score
1
Location
arizona
I would have more comment on his extremely flawed "cost per win" formula....this stadium will have useful life of probably +/- 30 years and host a bunch of stuff besides the coyotes....but this guy is not worth the board space...
 

NickelBack

ASFN Lifer
BANNED BY MODERATORS
Joined
Jul 2, 2003
Posts
3,640
Reaction score
1
What about the redevelopment on Northern Ave/59th Ave that was part of the Ellman deal. That is well on it way to being complete.
 

Staff online

Forum statistics

Threads
558,149
Posts
5,452,862
Members
6,336
Latest member
FKUCZK15
Top