No one in NFC West will put up a fight against the Cardinals

[SECTION 11]

Originally posted by HookemCards
Pennington

Forgot about Pennington.

 

[FischerKing]

Originally posted by HookemCards
Like I said I have always like Favre, and 5 years ago every team in the NFL would have him starting, but not now.

I don't think he could start over McNabb in Philly, Vick in Atlanta, Warner when healthy in St. Louis, Pennington in NY, Manning in Ind. or Gannon in Oak.

He was a great QB and a first ballot HoF'r no doubt, but to think he is the quarterback he was 5 years ago just isn't the case, and he isn't the best QB in the NFL anymore.

Pennington is a stud - but if he had been drafted by the Packers he's still be riding the bench.

He'd start over Gannon, McNabb and Manning. Probably not Warner - I don't know. Vick would only get the nod because he's more mobile.

Shawn

 

[EndZone]

Originally posted by FischerKing
Pennington is a stud - but if he had been drafted by the Packers he's still be riding the bench.

He'd start over Gannon, McNabb and Manning. Probably not Warner - I don't know. Vick would only get the nod because he's more mobile.

Shawn

Maybe over Gannon but all the others would send Farve to the bench. After last year I doubt the Bills would bench Bledsoe in favor of Farve. I think Minn would sit Farve in favor of Culpepper. Maybe ever Brooks in N.O.

Besides we are not talking about if certain players were drafted to a different team...we are talking about current starters starting on other teams.

 

[SBXXXVIChamps]

Originally posted by FischerKing
All your receiving corp - except one - for starters. Your TE's, and RB's - that includes Emmitt. He's old and I can't see him lasting the entire season - the only reason he is here is to sell tickets.

How about that for starters? Should I continue with the defense?

Shawn

I agree with you, in part, that most of the current starters on this team would, in all probability, just be first line backups on many other teams, not MOST, but I disagree with you on your assessment of Emmitt Smith.

I think he will be a pg PLUS for this team, both on and off the field....the problem is, if he does go down, I have little faith in Marcell Shipp in being a three down back, and beyond him...there is no one.

There are several on the offensive line, well maybe a few, that could start for a lot of other teams.

Defensively though, especially in the secondary, and on the line, there is a definie lack of "starter" talent.

 

[SBXXXVIChamps]

Originally posted by Brian in Mesa
Then why did he fail the coach's camp workout course...again?

For attention????? He always passes on the second go around.

He will be fine this season, and I am sure he would fit in very well with the Cardinals, if they had a chance to get him, which they wont.

People are not giving this group of running backs their due...they are going to surprise a lot of people this season.

And the corps of receivers...while not super stars, the most talented, and deepest, as a group, in the NFL.

Just about every one of them, Brown, Branch, Johnson, Patten and even Givens, would be number 1 or 2 on the Cardinals.

 

[SBXXXVIChamps]

Originally posted by FischerKing
Pennington is a stud - but if he had been drafted by the Packers he's still be riding the bench.

He'd start over Gannon, McNabb and Manning. Probably not Warner - I don't know. Vick would only get the nod because he's more mobile.

Shawn

Pennington's gonna have a rough season. Who the hell is he going to throw the ball to?

 

[HookemCardsOld]

Why would he start over Gannon?

Lets look at the stats of the two last year. I certainly don't think that is only way to determine a player's ability, but it sure is a very important tool.

Gannon: Comp% 67.6
Favre: Comp% 61.9

Gannon: 4689 yds
Favre: 3658 yds

Gannon: Yards/attempt 7.6
Favre: Yards/attempt 6.6

Gannon: 10 int. in 618 attempts
Favre: 16 int. in 551 attempts


Why would he start over Manning?

Manning: 66.3 comp%
Favre: 61.9 comp%

Manning: 4200 yds
Favre: 3658 yds

Manning: 7.1 y/a
Favre: 6.6 y/a

Manning: 19 int in 591 Attempts
Favre: 16 int in 551 Attempts


As for McNabb, he may start over him, thier numbers are similar, but since Mcnabb missed alot of games is hard to determine how he would have stacked up against Favre. But Mcnabb has mobility and elusiveness on his side, that make it pretty hard to flat out say that Favre would start.

 

[FischerKing]

Originally posted by HookemCards
Why would he start over Gannon?

Lets look at the stats of the two last year. I certainly don't think that is only way to determine a player's ability, but it sure is a very important tool.

Gannon: Comp% 67.6
Favre: Comp% 61.9

Gannon: 4689 yds
Favre: 3658 yds

Gannon: Yards/attempt 7.6
Favre: Yards/attempt 6.6

Gannon: 10 int. in 618 attempts
Favre: 16 int. in 551 attempts


Why would he start over Manning?

Manning: 66.3 comp%
Favre: 61.9 comp%

Manning: 4200 yds
Favre: 3658 yds

Manning: 7.1 y/a
Favre: 6.6 y/a

Manning: 19 int in 591 Attempts
Favre: 16 int in 551 Attempts


As for McNabb, he may start over him, thier numbers are similar, but since Mcnabb missed alot of games is hard to determine how he would have stacked up against Favre. But Mcnabb has mobility and elusiveness on his side, that make it pretty hard to flat out say that Favre would start.

I suppose if all you were looking at was pure stats - then you have a case. But Favre is a proven, much more so than those you've listed. He's better in the 2 minute, he has a stronger arm and better vision. Sure he throws more picks because he takes more risks - but when the game is on the line I wany my QB taking risks and not playing safe.

Shawn

 

[FischerKing]

Oh yeah - and there is a reason why he has been very close the being a 4 time MVP and it's not because he's a hack.

Shawn

 

[EndZone]

Originally posted by FischerKing
Oh yeah - and there is a reason why he has been very close the being a 4 time MVP and it's not because he's a hack.

Shawn

Yes but that is in the past. We are talking about here and today...no way he even comes close to MVP this year.

 

[FischerKing]

Originally posted by EndZone
Yes but that is in the past. We are talking about here and today...no way he even comes close to MVP this year.

He was in a dead heat for the award last season vs. Gannon. You are out of your mind if you don't think he has at least another shot each season he plays. That's just ludicrous.

Shawn

 

[EndZone]

Originally posted by FischerKing
He was in a dead heat for the award last season vs. Gannon. You are out of your mind if you don't think he has at least another shot each season he plays. That's just ludicrous.

Shawn

I wouldn't say dead heat....Like I said there is no way he comes close this year with all the youngsters coming up...LT, RW, MV, ...

 

[FischerKing]

Originally posted by EndZone
I wouldn't say dead heat....Like I said there is no way he comes close this year with all the youngsters coming up...LT, RW, MV, ...

Well, we're just going to have to disagree then, because anytime he plays a full season I feel that he's a threat to win it. He's still got a lot of game left in him and with a good front line and a solid receiving corp and solid RB's, he could continue at a high level for about another 3 seasons.

Shawn

 

[EndZone]

Originally posted by FischerKing
He's still got a lot of game left in him and with a good front line and a solid receiving corp and solid RB's, he could continue at a high level for about another 3 seasons.

Shawn

No doubt about it! The question is would other teams bench their young superstars or young mobile QB's for Brett and I say No.

 

[FischerKing]

Originally posted by EndZone
No doubt about it! The question is would other teams bench their young superstars or young mobile QB's for Brett and I say No.

And I say that they would start Brett because he's got the experience and he's a proven commodity. He's got the wins, the records and the rings to back up his performance on the field. He's got the intangibles in that he's a great leader on the field and he breeds confidence in his team mates. He makes any team and any individual on his team (offensive) better just by being on the field and playing with them.

He may not be the best QB in the history of the league - but he's pretty high on the list, and in terms of QB's currently playing - I'd take him over any of them to start and lead my team - no questions asked.

Shawn

 

[EndZone]

Originally posted by FischerKing
And I say that they would start Brett because he's got the experience and he's a proven commodity. He's got the wins, the records and the rings to back up his performance on the field. He's got the intangibles in that he's a great leader on the field and he breeds confidence in his team mates. He makes any team and any individual on his team (offensive) better just by being on the field and playing with them.

He may not be the best QB in the history of the league - but he's pretty high on the list, and in terms of QB's currently playing - I'd take him over any of them to start and lead my team - no questions asked.

Shawn

And everyone of those QB's mentioned are proved, have the experience, gots the wins,

 

[HookemCardsOld]

Who the hell called him a "hack". I said he was a first ballot Hall of Famer. But if your contention is he is as good as he was 5 years ago then thats crapola, if that were the case he wouldn't be contemplating retirement.

 

[HookemCardsOld]

Sure he throws more picks because he takes more risks - but when the game is on the line I wany my QB taking risks and not playing safe.

You must love watching Plummer play. Just give him a stronger arm and Plummer = Favre.

 

[FischerKing]

Originally posted by HookemCards
You must love watching Plummer play. Just give him a stronger arm and Plummer = Favre.

Not really - Plummer couldn't read a defense to save his life.

Shawn

 

[FischerKing]

Originally posted by HookemCards
Who the hell called him a "hack". I said he was a first ballot Hall of Famer. But if your contention is he is as good as he was 5 years ago then thats crapola, if that were the case he wouldn't be contemplating retirement.

He has lost a little in the past 5 years like speed and mobility, but he hasn't lost the velocity, accuracy and touch of being to get it to his receivers. Brett was never a great scrambler anyway - even though he may have thought he was.

Shawn

 

[Houdini]

Originally posted by Krangthebrain
That's BS, Shawn.

If you are talking realistically, FJ could start for most teams in the league. I'm not saying he would start over Franks, but for most teams he would.

I actually think Jones has been a better TE than Franks. Franks is overrated. He has a future hall of fame QB throwing to him, and his stats are deceiving. He gets a lot of TD passes, but they are usually 1 yard misdirection plays where Favre rolls one way and Franks runs the other way. Most teams would pound it in with the RB, but the Pack usually tosses it to Franks on misdirection plays. Franks doesn't have the speed to split the seam either, and he doesn't run well after the catch. Franks is a better blocker than Freddie though.

 

[FischerKing]

Packers have had a solid TE since Mark "American Chewie" Chmura was in town, and before that was Ed West. Packers used to rely on the TE alot to catch them passes in the middle and it was fairly effective.

And you're right Houdini - Bubba is a better blocker, I just wish he wasn't so slow running and had a better set of hands.

Shawn

 

[Houdini]

Originally posted by FischerKing
He has lost a little in the past 5 years like speed and mobility, but he hasn't lost the velocity, accuracy and touch of being to get it to his receivers. Brett was never a great scrambler anyway - even though he may have thought he was.

Shawn

I read an article about Favre that surprised me recently. In it, he said he wished he could go back in time and QB the game he lost the Super Bowl to Denver. He said the Favre today could have beaten Denver then, because he is a better QB today than he was back then. The Packers had a better team then, but he said he is a better QB now than he was then because he can read and react so much better now than he did back then. That surprised me because he definately doesn't run as much as he did then, but his canon is as good as ever.

 

[FischerKing]

Originally posted by Houdini
I read an article about Favre that surprised me recently. In it, he said he wished he could go back in time and QB the game he lost the Super Bowl to Denver. He said the Favre today could have beaten Denver then, because he is a better QB today than he was back then. The Packers had a better team then, but he said he is a better QB now than he was then because he can read and react so much better now than he did back then. That surprised me because he definately doesn't run as much as he did then, but his canon is as good as ever.

I think by "reacting" he's probably talking about reacting to defenses - how to attack them, spotting the secondary receivers, etc.

Even though the Packers lost that game to Denver, I still think it's the best Super Bowl I've ever watched - it was such a fun game, all the way down to the end.

Shawn

 

[Houdini]

Originally posted by FischerKing
I think by "reacting" he's probably talking about reacting to defenses - how to attack them, spotting the secondary receivers, etc.

Even though the Packers lost that game to Denver, I still think it's the best Super Bowl I've ever watched - it was such a fun game, all the way down to the end.

Shawn

I agree. Ticks me off though when I see the highlights of that game and I see Freeman fumble a kickoff in the 4th quarter and then on the final drive of the game Freeman dropped a pass on 1st or 2nd down I think it was right down the middle on a bullet from Favre that would have given the Pack a 1st down around the 15 or 20 I think.

Gotta give Denver credit for blitzing Favre on the 4th down call though that went incomplete to Chumura. Most teams do that prevent defense crap and end up losing. Denver threw the kitchen sink at Favre.

I think the Packers came into the game over confident. They were something like 14 point favorites, and the first drive of the game they go like 80 yards for a TD and made it look easy. After that it was a struggle and a great game to watch by both teams. Elway actually didn't play that great, but Terrel Davis had such a big game that surprised me.