NO way on Vince Young

[JeffGollin]

I'm not completely sold on Young's ability to translate to the pros but the guy has as much upside as any player ever to enter the NFL Draft and that kind of talent can't be taken lightly no matter what system he ran in college.
Bingo!

 

[TRW]

If he's there at #10...

the Cards would be foolish NOT to grab him.

They have Warner signed for the next 3. Kurt can run the show for a couple of seasons and then turn it over to the kid. Plus, I believe that Young will be good enough going in to be #2 if Kurt gets hurt from the get go.

But, I don't think he will be there at #10 anyway, so I don't think there will be any controversy.

 

[Shane]

Guys, let's not be morons here, as it seems the media world is. This media blitz is ********. How many top-10 QB prospects EVER throw at the combine? Answer that, then reflect on your misguided attempts to rip the kid. Especially lay off his mental toughness over this issue. I'm not saying he IS mentally tought but to label him thus because he's not throwing at the combine? Egads, that's why there are PRO DAYS for the major prospects!

His reasons show a lack of mental toughness. You cant deny that. Unfamiliar surroundings and unfamiliar WRs. Is bogus as can be and raises many redflags as far as im concerned. Cowherd nailed on his AM radio show. If there is any kid that needed to do this it was him. There are still question marks around the kid. Prior to the rodebowl he was a 2nd round pick at best.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

His reasons show a lack of mental toughness. You cant deny that. Unfamiliar surroundings and unfamiliar WRs. Is bogus as can be and raises many redflags as far as im concerned. Cowherd nailed on his AM radio show. If there is any kid that needed to do this it was him. There are still question marks around the kid. Prior to the rodebowl he was a 2nd round pick at best.

I don't know how one person can get so many things wrong in one paragraph. First, saying a guy who has surpassed expectations at the premiere position in one of the biggest football programs in the country and has played unbeleivably well in some of the biggest college football games in recent history is mentally weak for not throwing at the combine (just like nearly every sure-fire first round QB in recent history) is just plain asinine.

Why should VY have to prove his throwing abilities at the combine? Is Leinart going to have to prove his arm strength at the combine? Is Lendale White going to have to prove his speed at the combine? Sure there are question marks around him but like nearly every elite prospect they will be answered at his school's Pro Day and not the combine.

And he was not a 2nd round draft pick before the Rose Bowl. Vince Young has been earmarked for the Top 10 in the NFL Draft since he was a sophomore in high school.

 

[Shane]

I don't know how one person can get so many things wrong in one paragraph. First, saying a guy who has surpassed expectations at the premiere position in one of the biggest football programs in the country and has played unbeleivably well in some of the biggest college football games in recent history is mentally weak for not throwing at the combine (just like nearly every sure-fire first round QB in recent history) is just plain asinine.

Why should VY have to prove his throwing abilities at the combine? Is Leinart going to have to prove his arm strength at the combine? Is Lendale White going to have to prove his speed at the combine? Sure there are question marks around him but like nearly every elite prospect they will be answered at his school's Pro Day and not the combine.

And he was not a 2nd round draft pick before the Rose Bowl. Vince Young has been earmarked for the Top 10 in the NFL Draft since he was a sophomore in high school.

Just like other experts(not saying Im one I just agree) who have been denouncing him for this. Vince Young played prinarily out of the shotgun in college. Most of his passes were dump off and of the short variety. His passing motion is awkward on top of it. He has a lot to prove such as him armstrength etc.... It would be nice like they said on ESPN if he did it where he didnt feel "comfy" like with his WR's at Texas Campus on his pro day. DO it with WR's you dont know with scouts all over the place watching you in a foriegn stadium etc...

Other QBs such as leinart have been in more big games and made many more big throws and have far less to prove. He has thrown and completed long pass after long pass in big games etc....

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Just like other experts(not saying Im one I just agree) who have been denouncing him for this. Vince Young played prinarily out of the shotgun in college. Most of his passes were dump off and of the short variety. His passing motion is awkward on top of it. He has a lot to prove such as him armstrength etc.... It would be nice like they said on ESPN if he did it where he didnt feel "comfy" like with his WR's at Texas Campus on his pro day. DO it with WR's you dont know with scouts all over the place watching you in a foriegn stadium etc

Alex Smith was in a similar position due to the system he ran in college and so on and there was no national outcry for him to participate in the combine nor did have any affect on his draft status. Again, why should Young put himself in that position when nobody else in recent history has made such sacrifices for ESPN reporters?

Other QBs such as leinart have been in more big games and made many more big throws and have far less to prove. He has thrown and completed long pass after long pass in big games etc....

Do you watch college football? Vince Young had the best passer rating in the NCAA this last year. He made a fool out of USC and looked just as good against Ohio State as supposed 2007 #1 overall pick Brady Quinn. He's been there in big games and has proven more than enough to qualify himself out of working out with small-school Day 1 hopefuls.

 

[kerouac9]

Vince Young went into The Horseshoe in Columbus and won in a prime time game surrounded by fans in crimson and silver. Do you really think he's going to be rattled playing in a 90% empty RCA Dome? Really?

 

[Stout]

Vince Young went into The Horseshoe in Columbus and won in a prime time game surrounded by fans in crimson and silver. Do you really think he's going to be rattled playing in a 90% empty RCA Dome? Really?

Haven't agreed with you on the other thread, but have to agree here.

 

[LVCARDFREAK]

Shane I have to disagree with you here. Especially your remark on armstrength. Kid has a cannon not sure where that came from and I have never heard that criticism of him before.

We want to say he isnt accurate but he completed 65% of his passes. We want to say he cant read defenses yet his td-int ration was almost 3-1, we say he has an awkward throwing motion and I say thats of very little or no concern considering who has had success n the NFL with awkward throwing motions.

Not only would I take him @ #10 I would not disagree if Graves and Green decided to move up and grab him at #3, #4 etc if he is still there.

Like K9 said he not only went into the horseshoe in front of 100,000+ OSU fans but he single handidly made the winning throw in the 4th quarter when they were behind.

This kid gives methe buzz that many had when Vick came out. He is the real deal. Watch his games, dont listen to 'experts"

 

[HookemCards]

Most of his passes were dump off and of the short variety. His passing motion is awkward on top of it. He has a lot to prove such as him armstrength etc....
Other QBs such as leinart have been in more big games and made many more big throws and have far less to prove. He has thrown and completed long pass after long pass in big games etc....

So why was he second in the nation in Y/A at 9.3 yds per pass. Only Broehm from Louisville was higher. Leinert with the great players such as Bush, Jarrett, and Smith, and according to you a stronger arm only have 8.9 yds per pass. The only reason Leinert's played in more big games is because he's been a starter longer. I'd be willing to bet that this season, Young played much better defenses than Leinart: big games at OU, OSU, ATM (I know they aren't that good, but they get amped when they play UT, especially at Kyle field), USC (essentially at home), he also had a huge comback against Ok. State, the guys simply a winner, he has the drive to win like Jordan.

 

[Tashunca]

I just listened to the guy from Ourlads on 1060 KDUS. Bill Lewis stated that five picks were locks in the first round (Bush, Leinart, Mario Williams, Young and Ferguson).

The guy from Ourlads said he would pretty much agree with that except for Young. He said that Young is a great athlete but doesn't project well as a QB in the NFL. He questions if Young can read defenses and whether or not he is an accurate enough passer for the NFL.

Based on his observations of Young, his accuracy left much to be desired and his WRs and TEs were constantly having to make great catches because of the poor accuracy. This will lead to Interceptions in the NFL.

He also felt that Young couldn't read defenses. This belief was backed up when he asks DBs from other major schools about Young. The response from them was that Young constantly threw the ball at the wrong part of the defense.

IMO selecting Young in the first round would be a wasted pick. Assuming he is able to make the transition to the NFL he won't contribute for at least 3-4 years. The player we select in the first round needs to be able to contribute the day he signs with the team.

The player we select in the first round needs to be able to contribute the day he signs with the team??? Did we with Warner have one of the TOP passing offensives in the league???

 

[Redsz]

Joe picked up something very intreasting in the Kurt Warner press confrence from Rod Graves.

http://www.arizonasportsfans.com/vb/showpost.php?p=924142&postcount=3

9. I think he let something slip about Vince Young. He was tlaking about hopefully having a lot more pressers during the fA period, having a good draft looking at players such as "Vince Young", then he studdered and tried to backstep from it by saying or a player of his abilities. Then he was asked about Vince after that question from a reporter I think, becuase he answered with the usual we are still in the process of evaluating players and nothing has been decided. Again it is just specualtion on part but it sounded as if he let somethin gslip then tried to backstep from it. It is at about the 33:30 mark of the rpesser if you want to listen for yourself.

Check out point number 9 and his comments about VY.

Sorry to steal your thunder, joe.

 

[Tashunca]

I was and still am a BIG supporter of the Cards signing Young. But we live in the real world. Lets get REAL! The TITANS and the RAIDERS and the JETS and the LIONS are not ALL going to pass on this "standing room only", fiery competitive "freak" (Leinart's word) to elude their grasp. He will NOT be available. He will NOT be available. There are two strategies for Denny Green: Trade UP and try to snatch him, or trade DOWN and secure an additional pick in the second round and grab Omar Jacobs (another side slinger) with one of those picks and let HIM be Warners protege!

 

[Jetstream Green]

Who is Vince Young...

Vince Young is a winner. Big comebacks in big games. Hell yes, I wish only the Cardinals would be so fortunate to be able to draft him. Anyone who says he is not mentally tough or a leader has not been watching college football the last couple of years...THE COMBINE IS A JOKE, the proof is in the tapes of his play on the field.

 

[WisconsinCard]

I'm just relaying what the professional scout was saying.

The guy from Ourlads also mentioned that Young played in a shotgun formation with a spread offense where most of his throws were short and inbetween the hash marks(Easy Throws). He had concerns about Young playing under center in the NFL and being able to make reads as he drop back to pass.

:
If he believes all that then why does ourlads mock have him going at # 3?

 

[Stout]

Joe picked up something very intreasting in the Kurt Warner press confrence from Rod Graves.

http://www.arizonasportsfans.com/vb/showpost.php?p=924142&postcount=3



Check out point number 9 and his comments about VY.

Sorry to steal your thunder, joe.

Yeah, but was anybody able to hear the actual question? I wasn't. It might have been something about Young.

 

[JeffGollin]

From the Warner-Green-Graves Presser

Not an exact quote, but close:

When asked what he'd do if Vince Young dropped to #10, Rod Graves replied:

"I'd meet him at the airport."

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Not an exact quote, but close:

When asked what he'd do if Vince Young dropped to #10, Rod Graves replied:

"I'd meet him at the airport."

sounds good to me!

 

[CronosCard]

"..And in this corner.."

WHO IN THE HELL IS THE GUY FROM OURLADS??? I'M pretty sure he's not a Hall of Famer Like Dan Fouts, who watched Young grow over the past two years and was very impressed, just gushing over vince young, and how his abilities project to the next level..I say we use subterfuge, and poison every teams opinion about him so we can get him at #10..That's smart ballplaying

 

[MadCardDisease]

:
If he believes all that then why does ourlads mock have him going at # 3?

Because he said some team will most likely make the mistake of taking him way too early in the draft.

Their Mock draft is predicting what they think teams will do. Not what they think teams should do.

 

[kerouac9]

Because he said some team will most likely make the mistake of taking him way too early in the draft.

Their Mock draft is predicting what they think teams will do. Not what they think teams should do.

Yeah. The Huddle Report has Young going in the Top 5, as well, but they have him rated as a third-round prospect based on talent, time-to-contribution, etc. It'd be interesting to see what they thought about Vick back in the day.

For the record, and I'm sure I'll be saying this multiple times between now and the draft, I'm against the Cards trading up to get Vince Young. Considering what the cost would be (probably a second round pick this year as well as 2007's #1), the risk of the pick, the development time required, and the total number of question marks surrounding him (arm strength, accuracy, ability to digest a pro-style offense, ability to diagnose pro-style defenses, delivery issues, ability to take snaps from under center--taken one at a time, these aren't huge deals, but taken altogether, it's a HUGE problem). But his ceiling is so high that if he were to fall to the Cardinals at #10 I'd do backflips to take him. I'm not sure if there's been a quarterback with a higher ceiling available in the draft since Michael Vick.

 

[seesred]

I'm against us trading up period. We need players not just a player. There will be plenty to pick from when it comes our time.

GBR
40

 

[JeffGollin]

WHO IN THE HELL IS THE GUY FROM OURLADS???
hey, Hey, HEY!

During my early days as a draft junky, I spent many an hour with the Hetzlers, Werndl and other Ourlads guys gassing about the draft. I'd run into them at the draft. I'd occasionally break bread with them over lunch. And I participated in one of the Ourlads' Fans' Drafts (They made me pick of the Jets, and I caught a lot of heat for choosing a little known DE from Langston U named Pierce Holt).

One year when I was Promotion Guy at a NJ daily called The Trentonian, I ran a mock draft tie-in contest with Ourlads.

The Hetzlers know their football and do their homework. They were attending Senior Bowl practices (mainly as a labor of love) many years before there was a Great Blue North or Gil Brandt was reporting for nfl.com. They're also great guys.

For years, they've run their mock draft differently from anyone else - preferring to (a) key into a mainframe computer (aptly named "Ourlads") with tons of electronic data used to rate various aspects of a player's game and then (b) let the computer spew out a mock draft based on what the Ourlads people felt were a team's needs.

The biggest thing that made them different was that their computer didn't make picks according to what they thought a team and its scouts might do, but rather what they felt a team should do.

Obviously, being human, they're going to have opinions that vary from what each of us think. But they do know what they are doing.

Anyway, if anyone's interested, that's "who the hell" Ourlads is.

 

[conraddobler]

With Warner signed, what the heck.

As long as we can still fix our O line then let's go for it.

We may hit the Jackpot, heck if any ANY team is due for an all world QB we are IT!

I have my reservations but he can throw the rock, please Lord if we somehow land him, then let someone not ruin him and let him be much better than I ever dreamed possible.

I hope he proves me laughably wrong and I'd be happy if he did.

 

[CardLogic]

I am curious where Michael Vick would project if he were being considered for the current draft. The reason I raise this point is because when Vick was coming into the NFL he was the unquestioned #1 pick.

It seems to me that Vince Young is a better prospect than Vick was. Youngs attributes are similar to Vick except Young is taller, bigger, stronger, and a better passer than Vick. Vick is faster, yet Young is no slouch in the speed catagory.

So considering Vick was so esteemed by everyone, why is there such disagreement about Young's potential? Is it because Vick himself has not met expectations with Atlanta? Do people think that Vick should have driven the Falcons to the Super Bowl by now???

Should that be the rationale I think it's bogus. Hell, Peyton Manning or Tom Brady couldn't have gotten the Falcons into the Super Bowl during the same time frame. While agreeing that more was expected of Vick than has been delivered he is still a great player and he has made Atlanta a much better team than they would be without him. Even though Atlanta has a good #2 QB (his name escapes me at the moment) who many QB weak teams are envious of and would like to aquire, Atlanta performs significantly better with Vick taking the snaps than not.

As Rod Graves stated, if Young is sitting on the board when the Cardinals pick at #10, "Go pick him up at the airport!"