Ossenfort's crap drafting continued. The Athletic All Rookie Team

[Chopper0080]

I honestly don't think Monti believed thought Garrett Williams or Kei'Trel Clark were that good after year 1. Otherwise it makes even less sense to have taken 2 CBs in round 3. Where does Elijah Jones even play now?

He's not playing unless multiple CBs get injured.

 

[kerouac9]

He's not playing unless multiple CBs get injured.

No one's gonna like this but statistically it's very likely that Elijah Jones is an utter bust and never really sees the field.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Ooops. I thought it meant you weren't getting anything from the lady so you watched sports instead.

It's literally anything that you put into more than you get out of it.

Which is pretty much everyone who is an Arizona Sports Fan

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

ehhh the strength of a draft isn't truly told till 3 years in. I still hold by that. The later round gets that have flourished early is just hindsight thinking. Easy to have that luxury.

lol. I love this thinking. GM’s aren’t supposed to be good at talent evaluation. It’s just hindsight. lol.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I want all your thumbs down you simps.

I heart raging sanders.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

This is a really stupid post.

You are comparing Monti's draft to every other team's drafts combined.

Pick one team and do a comparison if you want to do it fairly - and do it for both seasons Monti has drafted.

I am not going to say he is the best GM in the league at drafting by any means, but to say he sucks at it is ridiculous since we got contributions from nearly every pick from the 6th round up.

Marvin is at worst the 3rd best WR behind Thomas and Nabers, and nobody had him ranked pre draft as any worse than the 2nd best going into it. He was not thrown the ball nearly as often as anyone expected. Even so he had a better rookie season than his dad or Fitz two hall of famers.

Adams started out badly but by year end was playing like an average guard. Seeing as how he was drafted as somewhat of a project and improved greatly over the season calling him a mistake of a pick is way to early of a conclusion.

We badly needed a corner - Melton was somewhat of a need pick and everyone on this board was begging for a corner early in the draft. I think he played fairly decent, about what I would expect from a 2nd rounder.

Reiman was drafted as a blocking TE - and he did a good job at that. He never even got opportunities to catch the ball because we already have the best TE in the league. He did what he was asked and he did it pretty well.

Rabbit played really well when given the chance - but only really got time in 3 games or so. To compare him to rookies who got a ton of time is insane.

There has never been a draft ever where a GM got the best possible pick when they were picking on every pick, to act like that is even remotely possible is ridiculous.

Hmm Chris wasn’t arguing that his picks should have been the best at all positions. But for none of ELEVEN selections to crack the top two STRINGS at ANY of thr positions kinda stinks.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I get it.
However, 4 wins in year one.
Year two 8 wins and within a whisker of winning this division if we score 20 pts against the Seahawks and the Rams.

If in year 3 we win the division, or make the playoffs or win a playoff game he will be praised for doing a great job.

If he doesn’t, he will be a bum. I’m happy with the direction we are headed.

I’ll go on record: we do that in year 3 and remain a sustainable playoff team I’ll be happy with monti. You can quote me on it.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I don't care who ranked them.

I don't care if a couple teams had dramatically better drafts than the Cards.

The claim is that Monti's draft is crap - and that is a stupid unsubstantiated claim. You don't get significant contributions from 80% of your draft if it's crap.

Well you do when you had no talent . . . because you gutted the team the season before.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Evan Brown, Jonah Williams, Blake Gillikin, SMB, Mack Wilson, Froholdt, Kyzir White, have all been solid or good starters.

Even guys like Collier, Colon and Tonga have been good value and solid contributors.

Jones and Nichols didn't get enough play to be considered.

That's not terrible.

Agree. So far monti’s strengths seem to be identifying solid guys. Have yet to see him identify top shelf talent.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Brown, Williams, Gillikin, Wilson, Froholdt, SMB and White have all been "good" starters.

How many teams do you think each would start for? I would say I would have to be more than half to call them “good.” Otherwise they’re average or worse, no?

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

No one on the team thought Clark was good after six weeks. He got buried and hasn’t resurfaced in any meaningful way.

I don’t know why but the Cards have put a limiter on Williams and seem to only play him from the slot.

Murphy-Bunting is probably on the roster next season but has an easy out in 2026. I don’t expect to see much of him in 2025 tbh.

Garrett Williams usage is the most baffling fact from 2024 for me.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

I heart raging sanders.

I am not kidding I get an absurd amount of hate for daring to criticize Monti.

Hence the simp thing. We just tied the worst 3 years in franchise history and the dude is teflon. I can only think it's because here Murray gets like 80% of the blame when it's probably more 40-50%

 

[Shane]

I am not kidding I get an absurd amount of hate for daring to criticize Monti.

Hence the simp thing. We just tied the worst 3 years in franchise history and the dude is teflon. I can only think it's because here Murray gets like 80% of the blame when it's probably more 40-50%

Well Monti only gets credit for 2

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Well Monti only gets credit for 2

I agree and I am very happy we won 8.

Also it might be smoke and mirrors.

 

[Dayman]

Monti took a decent amount of older dudes in this last draft. Elijah Jones and Xavier Thomas just turned 25. Adams and Christian Jones will be 25 by the start of next season. Reiman and Rabbit will be 24. I mean, Elijah Jones and Thomas are 6 months younger than Zaven Collins and only a month younger than McBride.

It's not like these guys can't still develop, but their odds have to be lower than if they were a bunch of young developmental projects.

 

[TheCardFan]

Well you do when you had no talent . . . because you gutted the team the season before.

He gutted a 4-13 team with a culture problem.

 

[Stout]

I’ll go on record: we do that in year 3 and remain a sustainable playoff team I’ll be happy with monti. You can quote me on it.

There's the rub. Backing into the playoffs in 2025 only to be destroyed will be nothing to crow about. Incremental progress, but it won't signify unless we follow it up with continual and progressive playoff appearances.

 

[Stout]

He gutted a 4-13 team with a culture problem.

Right, meaning the problem wasn't all down to a lack of talent. He then proceeded to jettison most of that talent.

 

[TheCardFan]

Right, meaning the problem wasn't all down to a lack of talent. He then proceeded to jettison most of that talent.

So Keim was good at this job then, since we jettisoned "most of the talent"?

JJ Watt Retired
Zach Allen and Byron Murphy were mid. Allen was Elite this year (6 years into the league) and Murphy played well this year on one of the most talented defenses in the NFL.
Deandre Hopkins couldn't stay on the field, hurt his team, and has only 1 decent season over the past 4 seasons.
AJ Green?
Rodney Hudson?

Who are "most of the talent" that you are referring to?

 

[Stout]

So Keim was good at this job then, since we jettisoned "most of the talent"?

JJ Watt Retired
Zach Allen and Byron Murphy were mid. Allen was Elite this year (6 years into the league) and Murphy played well this year on one of the most talented defenses in the NFL.
Deandre Hopkins couldn't stay on the field, hurt his team, and has only 1 decent season over the past 4 seasons.
AJ Green?
Rodney Hudson?

Who are "most of the talent" that you are referring to?

Most of the talent that remained on the roster, clearly. We got rid of WR 1 (Hop), Allen, and Murphy. Try to downplay it all you want, that hurt the team. A lot. Being unable to replace them has been big, too. Hopefully Charmin Marvin can eventually be the guy to replace Hop. Maybe Williams will be more than a non-starting CB, but he's at least starting to show out. You clearly think the team had no talent left when Monti took over, but the board unanimously talks about how Monti tore the team down to the studs in year one. You can't do that if the roster is already stripped down to the studs, as you have intimated. You are, quite simply, wrong. You are, quite clearly, looking at this through Monti-colored glasses. Agree with what he did or not, Monti absolutely stripped the remaining talent from the team in year one.

 

[TheCardFan]

Hopefully Charmin Marvin can eventually be the guy to replace Hop

He is already better than the Hop version we had in 2022 and after. Plus - much cheaper and huge upside.

but the board unanimously talks about how Monti tore the team down to the studs in year on

We unanimously talked about tanking (turned over a lot of players and didn't add high priced FA's) but looking for you to give me some names of this 2022 talented roster.

You are, quite clearly, looking at this through Monti-colored glasse

I am looking at things with balance/looking at both sides. Your view is always grim reaper.

The board also talked about being stuck in purgatory like we have been since 2016 (save 1 year) vs tearing it down and building it back up the right way for the long term.
I agree with the latter and believe we overperformed with the talent we have for the first time in a long time.
Keep building the roster, keep coaching them up, and add in some impact players. That is not rose colored glasses - that is called a strategy/vision.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I am not kidding I get an absurd amount of hate for daring to criticize Monti.

Hence the simp thing. We just tied the worst 3 years in franchise history and the dude is teflon. I can only think it's because here Murray gets like 80% of the blame when it's probably more 40-50%

I'm not a Monti fan at all but I can see the team is much better. Maybe that's a Gannon/Rallis thing but to say the team has no talent and a bad year is wrong. I had them winning about 3-4 games this year.

But I don't get all the complaining about being in 1st after 10 weeks, playing meaningful games late in December against a very tough schedule, all with a super young roster is pretty good to me.
Either these players are better than given credit for or Gannon is a cross between Belichick and Don Shula and the best coach ever to get these results with such dregs on the roster.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

So Keim was good at this job then, since we jettisoned "most of the talent"?

JJ Watt Retired
Zach Allen and Byron Murphy were mid. Allen was Elite this year (6 years into the league) and Murphy played well this year on one of the most talented defenses in the NFL.
Deandre Hopkins couldn't stay on the field, hurt his team, and has only 1 decent season over the past 4 seasons.
AJ Green?
Rodney Hudson?

Who are "most of the talent" that you are referring to?

Byron Murphy is in the pro bowl and Zach Allen is second team All Pro

They would both be top 5 players on the current team

 

[Chris_Sanders]

I'm not a Monti fan at all but I can see the team is much better. Maybe that's a Gannon/Rallis thing but to say the team has no talent and a bad year is wrong. I had them winning about 3-4 games this year.

But I don't get all the complaining about being in 1st after 10 weeks, playing meaningful games late in December against a very tough schedule, all with a super young roster is pretty good to me.
Either these players are better than given credit for or Gannon is a cross between Belichick and Don Shula and the best coach ever to get these results with such dregs on the roster.

Who are the 5 best players on the team and who drafted / signed them as FAs?

 

[Dan H]

As I recall we had a ton of dead money issues due to Keim’s cap mismanagement as well. Monty has cleaned that up.