OT: Donald Sterling

[Covert Rain]

As sad and pathetic as Sterlings beliefs are, he has hired more minorities as coaches and front office staff than any other owner. He's an old backwards thinking fool, but compared to very public comments by some folks in sports with regards to gay men and women, some of the same who were itching for their time in front of the cameras to condemn him, I'd say as a whole, this countries hierarchy of what hate is just insensitive and what labels you a leper is rather backwards and foolish.

This part is 100% inconsequential IMO. It doesn't absolve him in the NBA's eyes in terms of conduct detrimental to the NBA nor does it mean he is any less racist. For all we know his love of money trumps his racism and the player and coaches he brings in has more to do with potential revenue generated by a better product.

 

[KloD]

This part is 100% inconsequential IMO. It doesn't absolve him in the NBA's eyes in terms of conduct detrimental to the NBA nor does it mean he is any less racist. For all we know his love of money trumps his racism and the player and coaches he brings in has more to do with potential revenue generated by a better product.

Ok.
Your comment is 100% inconsequential to my point.

If nothing else, Sterling has provided high income employment to minorities at a greater rate than all the ether owners. For whatever his reasons, he's done it and I said nothing about the players, I said coaches and front office staff. What have the gay bashers done for that community other than to condemn them or complain that they may look at their penis in the locker room? Hate Sterling, I don't care, the man is an old fool. But, be consistent and stop treating bigotry/racism of other groups as if one is better or less offensive than another.

 

[Southpaw]

As sad and pathetic as Sterlings beliefs are, he has hired more minorities as coaches and front office staff than any other owner. He's an old backwards thinking fool, but compared to very public comments by some folks in sports with regards to gay men and women, some of the same who were itching for their time in front of the cameras to condemn him, I'd say as a whole, this countries hierarchy of what hate is just insensitive and what labels you a leper is rather backwards and foolish.

Agreed.

Maybe it is time to make a list of all time worst humans;

In no particular order -

Donald Sterling
Adolph Hitler
Attila the Hun
Ghengis Khan
Caligula
Richard Nixon
Idi Amin
Mao Zedong
Pol Pot
Jeffery Dalmer
Lizzie Borden

I find the frenzy disproportionate to the event.

 

[AzCards21]

Just a thought. Could there have been some confusion concerning the differences between the First Amendment versus the Fifth Amendment of the U.S. Constitution. The Fifth Amendment affords Due Process.

If not, carry on.

I'm sure Cheese would just say as long as the government isn't doing it you don't deserve due process.

It's now mob rule. You can have free speech as long as the mob allows it (and apparently the government doesn't interfere) and due process will not be afforded if the mob decides you don't deserve it. Apparently you can enjoy all of your God given Constitutional rights as long as the mob allows it and the government doesn't interfere.

What you can't do is get on the wrong side of the mob in 140 characters or less...

http://www.polygon.com/2014/5/1/567...ity-manager-josh-olin-twitter-donald-sterling

The vigilante's are back and you best not look to government to stop them. As Cheese said, it aint them doing it so it's all good. So far the 1st, 5th and 10th amendments are if not gone at least severely crippled. Which one do you think will be next Mainstreet?

 

[BC867]

How people continue to turn this into a 1st amendment issue is beyond me. The contracts the owners sign is binding set of rules that Sterling agreed to when he became an NBA owner in a private organization...

In the NBA bylaws it specifically states the NBA "has broad authority under the NBA's constitution and bylaws to suspend and fine an owner for conduct detrimental to the NBA"...

IMO, Game set and match once you sign on and agree to the NBA's terms. You don't like it, don't become an owner and agree to the rules.

I agree! Delving into everything from the Constitution to Hitler is exaggerated rhetoric.

A stupid owner has brought negative publicity to the organization with whom he signed a contract. And now he is paying the price.

He is on a larger stage, but is it any different than if you or I mouthed off in a way that embarrassed the companies we work for? We would hear it, too. "Buh-bye!" Or as the old saying goes, "Don't let the door hit you on the way out."

 

[Brian in Mesa]

In case anyone has not heard, Sterling all of a sudden has cancer.

The news reported he was first diagnosed with prostate cancer at least three years ago. I heard on 910 AM this afternoon that those close to him expected him to have succumbed to it as far back as two years ago. He didn't suddenly get cancer. Like many others he likely chose to battle it privately.

It sort of parallels this racism scandal. He didn't just say these things the other day. According to the news - he was recorded over seven months ago but the tape was just sold to TMZ and released recently.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I'm sure Cheese would just say as long as the government isn't doing it you don't deserve due process.

You're not sure of ANYTHING 21. that much is clear. And NOW you're shifting from a 1st amendment issue to a DUE PROCESS ISSUE? Doy ou need to be schooled on what due process means as well? you do realize due process means that if you're charged with a crime by the state or federal government, you have legal recourse and the right to a trial. Has Sterling been charged with a crime by the federal or state government? Uh...NO. Thus, this isn't a due process issue either.

And even with that being said, if he WANTS to sue, he CAN AND WILL. But that is suing the NBA, a private entity, not the government, thus it's not even a due process issue there either. But he CAN get his day in court if he chooses to go that way.

It's now mob rule. You can have free speech as long as the mob allows it (and apparently the government doesn't interfere)

"and apparently the government doesn't interfere"...lol. um...are you ready to admit yet that this ISN'T a first amendment issue?

and due process will not be afforded if the mob decides you don't deserve it.

again, you deserve due process FROM PROSECUTION BY THE GOVERNMENT. For someone who keeps banging the constitution drum, you really might want to read it sometime.

Apparently you can enjoy all of your God given Constitutional rights as long as the mob allows it and the government doesn't interfere.

it's not the government interfering...the 1st Amendment and Due Process clauses SPECIFICALLY ARE ABOUT PROTECTING CITIZENS FROM GOVERNMENT OPPRESSION. They're job isn't to interfere in this type of matter. How are you just not getting this?

What you can't do is get on the wrong side of the mob in 140 characters or less...

http://www.polygon.com/2014/5/1/567...ity-manager-josh-olin-twitter-donald-sterling

The vigilante's are back and you best not look to government to stop them. As Cheese said, it aint them doing it so it's all good.

It's not all good...it's the law. And you're acting like I'm the only one saying this. EVERY OTHER PERSON IN THIS THREAD KNOWS WHAT THE 1ST AMENDMENT MEANS EXCEPT YOU. It's the CONSTITUTION. Nothing in the constitution says you can say whatever you want in the private sector and can absolutely never face any consequences for what you say there.

So far the 1st, 5th and 10th amendments are if not gone at least severely crippled. Which one do you think will be next Mainstreet?

Tell me where ANYWHERE in the 1st amendment of the constitution it talk about anything else BUT the Goverment's role in not restricting free speech. I've asked you NUMEROUS times to do this and you've failed at every turn. And what the hell does the 5th amendment have to do with this and how the hell has that been severely crippled. Do you even know what that amendment is?

Now if you want an amendment that says "People can say whatever they want, whenever they want and never face any kind of consequences for their actions, no matter what the circumstance", call your Congressmen and start a movement. Until then, take a fifth grade civics class and learn what the Consitutions ACTUALLY says.

 

[Cheesebeef]

21, can you answer me this:

Say you're working somewhere and are talking to someone on the job...or at a party...or anywhere and you unleash a rant slandering every single person who works at the company, including the boss and his wife and your boss HEARS you say that. What happens to that guy? he gets fired, right? Now, do you believe that if he goes to trial, the Government should actually find at trial that his 1st amendment right to freedom of speech was trampelled on and he deserves his job back? is that what you believe the 1st amendment guarantees?
Literally, the ability to say anything anyone wants and have zero repercussions in the private sector?

 

[AzCards21]

You're not sure of ANYTHING 21. that much is clear. And NOW you're shifting from a 1st amendment issue to a DUE PROCESS ISSUE? Doy ou need to be schooled on what due process means as well? you do realize due process means that if you're charged with a crime by the state or federal government, you have legal recourse and the right to a trial. Has Sterling been charged with a crime by the federal or state government? Uh...NO. Thus, this isn't a due process issue either.

I didn't shift I simply moved on to adding the next point as it was brought up. The crime never reached government levels of enforcement, which I tend to wonder if you would support such a thing. The conviction came from public opinion.Public opinion can take many forms the first of all being less customers buying tickets or jerseys. I'm fine with that. Do that, it's public opinion and open to everyone to participate equally. If you are so offended by the guy then don't give him any of your money. It's not up to public opinion to force him to sell an asset. He can sell now and get millions, he can let the franchise drop down to less if he wants but it's his to do with what he wants. He owns it.

Come on Cheese, if the court of public opinion is the primary arbitration device would the Cardinals still be owned by the Bidwills? Do we take the court of public outrage to the point we take something from someone because they are so outraged in order to satiate the mob?

You have your first amendment rights intact, and that's not to support the team. You have every right to do that as they have every right to maintain ownership of what they purchased even if enough people don't support them and they fail as a business.

And even with that being said, if he WANTS to sue, he CAN AND WILL. But that is suing the NBA, a private entity, not the government, thus it's not even a due process issue there either. But he CAN get his day in court if he chooses to go that way.




"and apparently the government doesn't interfere"...lol. um...are you ready to admit yet that this ISN'T a first amendment issue?



again, you deserve due process FROM PROSECUTION BY THE GOVERNMENT. For someone who keeps banging the constitution drum, you really might want to read it sometime.



it's not the government interfering...the 1st Amendment and Due Process clauses SPECIFICALLY ARE ABOUT PROTECTING CITIZENS FROM GOVERNMENT OPPRESSION. They're job isn't to interfere in this type of matter. How are you just not getting this?



It's not all good...it's the law. And you're acting like I'm the only one saying this. EVERY OTHER PERSON IN THIS THREAD KNOWS WHAT THE 1ST AMENDMENT MEANS EXCEPT YOU. It's the CONSTITUTION. Nothing in the constitution says you can say whatever you want in the private sector and can absolutely never face any consequences for what you say there.



Tell me where ANYWHERE in the 1st amendment of the constitution it talk about anything else BUT the Goverment's role in not restricting free speech. I've asked you NUMEROUS times to do this and you've failed at every turn. And what the hell does the 5th amendment have to do with this and how the hell has that been severely crippled. Do you even know what that amendment is?

Now if you want an amendment that says "People can say whatever they want, whenever they want and never face any kind of consequences for their actions, no matter what the circumstance", call your Congressmen and start a movement. Until then, take a fifth grade civics class and learn what the Consitutions ACTUALLY says.

The rest is just bull****.

 

[desertdawg]

This thread sure knows how to suck, it's like racism in it's self being that it just won't die out.

 

[PDXChris]

The news reported he was first diagnosed with prostate cancer at least three years ago. I heard on 910 AM this afternoon that those close to him expected him to have succumbed to it as far back as two years ago. He didn't suddenly get cancer. Like many others he likely chose to battle it privately.

It sort of parallels this racism scandal. He didn't just say these things the other day. According to the news - he was recorded over seven months ago but the tape was just sold to TMZ and released recently.

Then I guess the better way to phrase is it, Sterling's PR team decided to leak the news all of a sudden.

Either way, the timing of it becoming public is impeccable since it appears he is using it to take some heat off, which makes it a low blow.

 

[Mainstreet]

I'm sure Cheese would just say as long as the government isn't doing it you don't deserve due process.

It's now mob rule. You can have free speech as long as the mob allows it (and apparently the government doesn't interfere) and due process will not be afforded if the mob decides you don't deserve it. Apparently you can enjoy all of your God given Constitutional rights as long as the mob allows it and the government doesn't interfere.

What you can't do is get on the wrong side of the mob in 140 characters or less...

http://www.polygon.com/2014/5/1/567...ity-manager-josh-olin-twitter-donald-sterling

The vigilante's are back and you best not look to government to stop them. As Cheese said, it aint them doing it so it's all good. So far the 1st, 5th and 10th amendments are if not gone at least severely crippled. Which one do you think will be next Mainstreet?

The NBA is a business, not the government. The Fifth Amendment applies protection for an individual accused of a crime by the government.

Read it for yourself in the United States Constitution at the link below.

http://constitutionus.com/

 

[AzCards21]

21, can you answer me this:

Say you're working somewhere and are talking to someone on the job...or at a party...or anywhere and you unleash a rant slandering every single person who works at the company, including the boss and his wife and your boss HEARS you say that. What happens to that guy? he gets fired, right? Now, do you believe that if he goes to trial, the Government should actually find at trial that his 1st amendment right to freedom of speech was trampelled on and he deserves his job back? is that what you believe the 1st amendment guarantees?
Literally, the ability to say anything anyone wants and have zero repercussions in the private sector?

You're equating an employee with the owner. If the owner is saying those things and the employees don't like it they are free to leave. If the owner hears that from an employee he has every right to dismiss him or her.

At no point does this equal taking the owners property, buildings, trucks, equipment as payback. You can cease being an employee or cease buying the companies products but it doesn't give you the right to take the companies assets.

Slandering your boss or his wife is probably not a good idea if you want to keep the job.

But the dynamic has now changed. If you have a militant homo on your payroll you can't get rid of him. His first amendment rights come into play then. And he will sue you for it. You can actually lose your job if you support traditional marriage.

Is this what we really want?

 

[AzCards21]

The NBA is a business, not the government. The Fifth Amendment applies protection for an individual accused of a crime by the government.

Read it for yourself in the United States Constitution at the link below.

http://constitutionus.com/

Oh I've read it many times. So as long as the government isn't the prosecutor all is good.

Is the Constitution only applicable to government? Not so much for the people they voted in? I thought the Constitution was actually to keep the government in check in favor of the individual. Isn't protecting everyone's rights the oath they swear to? I'm pretty sure they don't swear to uphold the Constitution for the governments sake.

 

[Phrazbit]

You're equating an employee with the owner. If the owner is saying those things and the employees don't like it they are free to leave. If the owner hears that from an employee he has every right to dismiss him or her.

At no point does this equal taking the owners property, buildings, trucks, equipment as payback. You can cease being an employee or cease buying the companies products but it doesn't give you the right to take the companies assets.

Sterling was an owner of a franchise that is one part of a larger entity, he does not own the NBA, he is a member. The other equal partners have the right to get rid of him. And they are not taking his assets "as payback" either. Forcing him to sell is NOT the same as seizing someone's property. Sterling is still going to walk away with north of a billion dollars from all this.

 

[Cheesebeef]

You're equating an employee with the owner. If the owner is saying those things and the employees don't like it they are free to leave. If the owner hears that from an employee he has every right to dismiss him or her.

Here's the thing...an owner of a franchise ultimately has to answer to the NBA and it's board of governors. You can't just own a team because you want to. It's not your right to own a team. It's a privilege that the ENTIRE LEAGUE OF OWNERS decides if you can buy the team. And once you do own the team, you're STILL under the league rules. The league deemed he broke the rules (which he agreed to follow when he got the team) and thus, they can vote to take it away from him.

At no point does this equal taking the owners property, buildings, trucks, equipment as payback. You can cease being an employee or cease buying the companies products but it doesn't give you the right to take the companies assets.

Slandering your boss or his wife is probably not a good idea if you want to keep the job.

But the dynamic has now changed. If you have a militant homo on your payroll you can't get rid of him.

a militant homo. wow. and I think we just got to the crux of the issue why you're so upset about this.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Then I guess the better way to phrase is it, Sterling's PR team decided to leak the news all of a sudden.

Either way, the timing of it becoming public is impeccable since it appears he is using it to take some heat off, which makes it a low blow.

People have to be incredibly naive not to see that the above is exactly what happened here.

 

[AzCards21]

a militant homo. wow. and I think we just got to the crux of the issue why you're so upset about this.

So do you have a solid reason for cutting my quote off? I'm guessing it doesn't fit your mob mentality. Read to the word that sets you off and then go whole hog and emotional about it ignoring the context of what you are getting upset about.

You're a master of propoganda and agitprop I will give you that.

 

[AzStevenCal]

So do you have a solid reason for cutting my quote off? I'm guessing it doesn't fit your mob mentality. Read to the word that sets you off and then go whole hog and emotional about it ignoring the context of what you are getting upset about.

You're a master of propoganda and agitprop I will give you that.

You don't see the slightest thing wrong with "militant homo"? It's a very revealing comment and it would set most people off. It sounds nice to say that all you're doing is believing in traditional marriage but there's no truth there. My marriage is my marriage and you should have no say in it.

 

[Cheesebeef]

So do you have a solid reason for cutting my quote off

Yup. The militant homo thing was the last straw of the conversation for me. I don't feel the need to read anything further from someone who has absolutely zero understanding of the constitution and uses bigotted language.

 

[SO91]

But the dynamic has now changed. If you have a militant homo on your payroll you can't get rid of him. His first amendment rights come into play then. And he will sue you for it. You can actually lose your job if you support traditional marriage.

Is this what we really want?

Are you seriously saying you'd fire this "militant homo" (despicable language btw) for that reason? And you feel this is a perfectly acceptable reason? Even if he was a model employee?

 

[AzCards21]

You don't see the slightest thing wrong with "militant homo"? It's a very revealing comment and it would set most people off. It sounds nice to say that all you're doing is believing in traditional marriage but there's no truth there. My marriage is my marriage and you should have no say in it.

Yup. The militant homo thing was the last straw of the conversation for me. I don't feel the need to read anything further from someone who has absolutely zero understanding of the constitution and uses bigotted language.

Are you seriously saying you'd fire this "militant homo" (despicable language btw) for that reason? And you feel this is a perfectly acceptable reason? Even if he was a model employee?

And this is the mob I have been talking about.

I couldn't have planned a more perfect example.

 

[Azlen]

And this is the mob I have been talking about.

I couldn't have planned a more perfect example.

You're funny. The levels of parody you exhibit are simply outstanding. Bravo!!

 

[AzStevenCal]

And this is the mob I have been talking about.

I couldn't have planned a more perfect example.

How is it a mob? Right is right and I'm not going to walk away from it just because other's share the same opinion. There might be some herd mentality going on with all the Sterling bashing but "militant homo" is just downright offensive. You're in the minority here because you are wrong not because of a mob mentality.

 

[Errntknght]

For a man of Sterling's age it would almost be more surprising if he didn't have prostate cancer. He may have an aggressive form of it but most men with it live long enough to die from something else. (The most recent figure I've seen for this is 70 -80 % die from some other cause.)