OT: NBA Finals: Cavs v. Warriors

[slinslin]

Lebron is still the best player in the league by a wide margin.

 

[slinslin]

Warriors win this series playing something beyond small ball. Tallest guy who has seen serious PT the last few games was Barnes at 6'8", and he is a twig. Frequently they've had Iggy, a SG, playing power forward.

Draymond Green has the standing reach of a PF.

Iguodala is a SF. Klay Thompson has SF size.. You could say that the Warriors played 1 PG 3 SFs and a PF.

But yeah small ball can win as long as you have the versatility to matchup with big teams too.
It is not like Bogut was not factor against Memphis for example.

It helps though that Iguodala, Green, Barnes are defenders and pretty strong. Harrison Barnes is not a twig in my opinion, not as massive as Iguodala but still strong and athletic.

 

[Russ Smith]

The Warriors are fouling Mozgov so quickly when he gets a rebound under the basket that he doesn't even have time to travel.

The NBA is so hilarious at times on the travel calls.

Warriors are up 10, Green is holding the ball 25 feet from basket, not really being guarded. I don't know if he lost his balance or what but he took an extra step for no reason and they called walking. Now it's 100% a walk, by rule he walked, it's also NEVER called, he wasn't doing anything but eating clock, but they called it.

About 9 minutes later the Warriors are up 7 LeBron passes to Jr Smith who's about 12 feet from the basket when he catches the pass. He then takes 4 steps to get to the 3 point line, then dribbles(that's a walk), then takes 3 more steps to reverse pivot and then one more to regain balance before swishing a 3 that cuts the lead to 4. 33 seconds left, they foul Curry on the inbounds the ref cals the ball out of bounds to the Warriors,. They foul Curry again he makes both FT's ballgame. It was hilarious, the entire Warrior team stopped because the walk was so obvious they just assumed they'd call it, and it wasn't called and suddenly it's a 4 point game.

And the announcers didn't even comment on it because if you watch the NBA you just come to expect that stuff.

Oh well they won so I'm happy. It's a weird feeling I'm not sure they can repeat, they were incredibly lucky health wise, they stayed healthy, everyone they played had injuries. They will have to deal with contracts and egos etc. But so happy they hung tough down 2-1 and got it done.

 

[Absolute Zero]

Congrats to the Warriors, what a great run. Pretty cool that we have a new team as champs for a change, too bad for the Suns they will be around for a while though.

 

[Ronin]

Congrats to the Golden State Warriors!

 

[Brian in Mesa]

Well, he did promise to bring Cleveland a Championship...

You must be registered for see images

 

[Dback Jon]

It seems Laker fans I know are the most butt-hurt about LeBron.

 

[Cheesebeef]

It seems Laker fans I know are the most butt-hurt about LeBron.

without a doubt.

 

[Russ Smith]

Well, he did promise to bring Cleveland a Championship...

You must be registered for see images

I would be pretty surprised if they don't win one in the next 2 years. If you just assume they get healthy and don't crap the bed on moves they will be very good.

They have 3 all stars in LeBron, Kyrie and Love. Love probably stays one year and then moves on for Thompson. So next year it's Mozgov with Verajao as the backup, Thompson and Love, LeBron, Kyrie and some other pieces. I assume that Jones and Perkins retire, not sure about Miller but maybe they get some caproom to get more help or they trade someone not sure who but LeBron is so good they should be able to put the pieces around him to win in the next year or two.

 

[Cheesebeef]

rumors are swirling that Wade may opt out of his contract and give the ultimate FU to Riley and sign a cheap-o deal with the Cavs. That would be interesting. He'd give them another ball-handler, but I think his lack of outside shooting would hamper LeBron's spacing, not to mention he can't really stay healthy.

but what if he decided that he could play the Ginobli role? Wade as that team's 6th man, with Love and Kyrie back healthy could be scary.

 

[sunsfan88]

I wonder how Sarver feels knowing the Warriors were able to rebuild faster and win a championship before the Suns did.

The difference is the Warriors owner Joe Lacob and coach cared about defense and brought in guys like Draymond Green, Andre Igoudala and Andrew Bogut at the cost of offensive players like Monta Ellis, benching of all star David Lee etc. I can't see Sarver and none his coaches sacrificing a lot of offense for defense.

GSW had the best defense since 2004 Pistons.

 

[sunsfan88]

This has to be so freaking strange for Mark Jackson

https://twitter.com/DylanMacNamara/status/611241385841307648?s=09

 

[slinslin]

It seems Laker fans I know are the most butt-hurt about LeBron.

They are insecure because he is far better than Kobe and probably better than Magic too.

 

[Chaplin]

I wonder how Sarver feels knowing the Warriors were able to rebuild faster and win a championship before the Suns did.

Rebuild faster? The Warriors had been irrelevant for a long time, so your comment makes no sense other than to make the Subs look bad for no reason.

They never came close to the power we were in the mid-2000s.

 

[sunsfan88]

Rebuild faster? The Warriors had been irrelevant for a long time, so your comment makes no sense other than to make the Subs look bad for no reason.

They never came close to the power we were in the mid-2000s.

I used poor choice of words. I meant they have done more in such short time with their owner Joe Loacob than Sarver has in more than twice the time. Rebuild was the wrong word for me to use there.

 

[Phrazbit]

On 92.3 today they had some stat guy on and he said the Cavs shot 18% when LeBron was not in the game... for the series.

Thats insane. This Warrior team will probably go down as one of the top 10 greatest title winners ever, and LeBron gave them a run for their money with a supporting cast that, without him, would be among the worst teams in the entire league.

I'm not old enough to have seen Wilt or Russell, and I only saw Bird and Magic when I was young, but this LeBron character is easily the 2nd best player I have ever seen. Other than Jordan, the greatest by a wide margin, the only other dude I can really recall being such a force was Shaq during his peak 2 or 3 seasons. That stretch where teams were picking up extra bigs just to deal with all the fouls Shaq was going to absorb.


Quick note. Not trying to say Shaq is the 3rd best I've seen, I'd take Duncan's career over his easily, but during those peak couple seasons Shaq was virtually unstoppable on the interior.

 

[Russ Smith]

On 92.3 today they had some stat guy on and he said the Cavs shot 18% when LeBron was not in the game... for the series.

Thats insane. This Warrior team will probably go down as one of the top 10 greatest title winners ever, and LeBron gave them a run for their money with a supporting cast that, without him, would be among the worst teams in the entire league.

I'm not old enough to have seen Wilt or Russell, and I only saw Bird and Magic when I was young, but this LeBron character is easily the 2nd best player I have ever seen. Other than Jordan, the greatest by a wide margin, the only other dude I can really recall being such a force was Shaq during his peak 2 or 3 seasons. That stretch where teams were picking up extra bigs just to deal with all the fouls Shaq was going to absorb.


Quick note. Not trying to say Shaq is the 3rd best I've seen, I'd take Duncan's career over his easily, but during those peak couple seasons Shaq was virtually unstoppable on the interior.

That's what makes basketball interesting to me is that you get situations like career vs peak. The best C I ever saw(too young to have seen Wilt or Russell) was Bill Walton. But his peak was so short because of all the injuries most people don't think of him. Even Kareem has said repeatedly Bill was the best big he ever played against. Great offensive player, passer, shooter etc, and a great defender and rebounder. For his peak he was off the charts.

Shaq for a few years there in peak shape and healthy was unstoppable.

Hakeem was like that too.

It is pretty amazing what LeBron did in this series.

 

[Chaplin]

I used poor choice of words. I meant they have done more in such short time with their owner Joe Loacob than Sarver has in more than twice the time. Rebuild was the wrong word for me to use there.

Gotcha. Makes more sense now.

 

[carrrnuttt]

Gotcha. Makes more sense now.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...s-craft-new-model-in-winning-nba-championship

Death to the Superteam! Warriors Craft New Model in Winning NBA Championship

"Bob Myers, right there!" Lacob exclaimed, pointing to the Warriors general manager. "The architect! The architect!"

In the next few minutes, Lacob, the majority owner, would praise the Warriors players, coaches, the front office and the folks who sell tickets. "So many people that don't even get credit," he said.

A few minutes later, Myers would add scouts, video guys and the equipment manager to the list.

Down the hallway, Iguodala took the postgame podium—a sixth man just crowned as the Finals MVP—and pointed to the seventh, eighth, ninth and 10th men: Shaun Livingston, Leandro Barbosa, David Lee, Festus Ezeli.

(...)

The Warriors seized the title, their first in 40 years, without ever stripping the roster down to the studs, without cravenly plotting for the No. 1 pick, without ever pilfering another team's disgruntled All-Star.

This was a champion built, as Myers put it, "organically"—through a series of shrewd moves, and mostly through the draft.

Four of the Warriors starters were their own draft picks, none taken in the top five: Curry (seventh in 2009), Thompson (11th in 2011), Barnes (seventh in 2012) and Green (35th in 2012). Ezeli, the backup center, was drafted 30th by the Warriors in 2012.

The only No. 1 pick on the roster is center Andrew Bogut, who was acquired in a 2012 trade—a controversial trade at that—for fan-favorite Monta Ellis. The priciest player is Lee, who was acquired (by a previous administration) in a sign-and-trade with the Knicks in 2010, when the Warriors were simply endeavoring to be relevant. He made $15,012,000 in 2014-15 and will make $15,493,680 next season before becoming a free agent.

Drafting Curry, now the reigning MVP, could be seen in hindsight as the pivotal moment, but the Warriors' rise is so much more interesting and complex. They are not here without any of the aforementioned moves, and certainly not without Iguodala, who just became one of the most unlikely MVPs in Finals history after averaging 16.3 points, 5.8 rebounds and 4.0 assists in the series.

 

[Phrazbit]

That's what makes basketball interesting to me is that you get situations like career vs peak. The best C I ever saw(too young to have seen Wilt or Russell) was Bill Walton. But his peak was so short because of all the injuries most people don't think of him. Even Kareem has said repeatedly Bill was the best big he ever played against. Great offensive player, passer, shooter etc, and a great defender and rebounder. For his peak he was off the charts.

Shaq for a few years there in peak shape and healthy was unstoppable.

Hakeem was like that too.

It is pretty amazing what LeBron did in this series.

Yeah, my mom would talk about Walton. How good he would have been if the guy had not been a hippie (her words, not mine).

Based on their careers and purely of the guys I was old enough to really absorb what I was watching I'd rank em...

Jordan
LeBron
Duncan...

Then it gets tough. The guy I have a hard time placing is Garnett, his career is hard to judge because of all those putrid Wolves teams. But I think I'd put Hakeem, Shaq and Kobe over him, in that order.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Yeah, my mom would talk about Walton. How good he would have been if the guy had not been a hippie (her words, not mine).

Based on their careers and purely of the guys I was old enough to really absorb what I was watching I'd rank em...

Jordan
LeBron
Duncan...

Then it gets tough. The guy I have a hard time placing is Garnett, his career is hard to judge because of all those putrid Wolves teams. But I think I'd put Hakeem, Shaq and Kobe over him, in that order.

That's pretty much my list as well, but I'd put Barkley and Nowtizki over Garnett.

 

[TJ]

Yeah, my mom would talk about Walton. How good he would have been if the guy had not been a hippie (her words, not mine).

Based on their careers and purely of the guys I was old enough to really absorb what I was watching I'd rank em...

Jordan
LeBron
Duncan...

Then it gets tough. The guy I have a hard time placing is Garnett, his career is hard to judge because of all those putrid Wolves teams. But I think I'd put Hakeem, Shaq and Kobe over him, in that order.

I'd throw Iverson somewhere in that mix. He goes unappreciated based on the teams he played for and some of his antics, but for his size, dude was a straight up baller.

 

[Russ Smith]

Yeah, my mom would talk about Walton. How good he would have been if the guy had not been a hippie (her words, not mine).

Based on their careers and purely of the guys I was old enough to really absorb what I was watching I'd rank em...

Jordan
LeBron
Duncan...

Then it gets tough. The guy I have a hard time placing is Garnett, his career is hard to judge because of all those putrid Wolves teams. But I think I'd put Hakeem, Shaq and Kobe over him, in that order.

It wasn't so much that Walton was a hippie that was the problem, it was the foot injuries. He was certainly a hippie but he was still a remarkable player when healthy, just couldn't stay healthy. EVen the year they beat the Sixers, he wasn't really healthy.

I would agree with your 3 as well.

On Garnett, wonderful player but I always had an issue with his refusal to play inside more. He was a terrific player but if he'd been willing to post up more and play more post defense when needed it would have helped his team. Great player though, when people talk about all the Warrior mistakes they talk about Fuller over Kobe and not taking McGrady but nobody ever points out they took Joe Smith over Garnett.

 

[Phrazbit]

I'd throw Iverson somewhere in that mix. He goes unappreciated based on the teams he played for and some of his antics, but for his size, dude was a straight up baller.

Ehhh... I'd disagree. He was good in that specific era (snails pace, ISO ball). I think no matter what team you put him with he'd play the same. He had a huge heart and was a serious competitor, but I am a big believer in the idea that if you're a purely offensive player then you'd better be efficient, and he was not.

There are a lot of guys I'd put ahead of him. Pretty sure he'd be outside my top 25.

 

[Phrazbit]

It wasn't so much that Walton was a hippie that was the problem, it was the foot injuries. He was certainly a hippie but he was still a remarkable player when healthy, just couldn't stay healthy. EVen the year they beat the Sixers, he wasn't really healthy.

I would agree with your 3 as well.

On Garnett, wonderful player but I always had an issue with his refusal to play inside more. He was a terrific player but if he'd been willing to post up more and play more post defense when needed it would have helped his team. Great player though, when people talk about all the Warrior mistakes they talk about Fuller over Kobe and not taking McGrady but nobody ever points out they took Joe Smith over Garnett.

The foot injuries were a part of his hippie lifestyle (still her words, not mine). His vegetarian diet kept him from healing.