OT: The wonderful world of coincidence!

[Ed B]

Originally posted by PortlandCardFan
And for the record, "OT" means "off topic" meaning "not about football" so don't read it in the future if you only want to discuss football.

My bad....

But OT also stands for Offensive Tackle

Learn somethin new everyday....

I only posted this in "Cardinals" because if i dumped it in the non-sports board no one would see it and i (incorrectly, apparently) thought everyone might like to know something like this seeing as how we all work, vote, and pay taxes here. I think it's kinda nice to know what's going on aside off camera, beyond all the rhetoric and bombing footage.

 

[Bellingham Mike]

The old saying holds true follow the money.

 

[RedRob]

Originally posted by Ed B
The media isn't liberal! QUOTE]

I guess that's subject to personal interpretation.

 

[KingofCards]

I am sure that Cheney had nothing to do with this company getting this job. It is completely coincidental.



Unbelievable. I support the War on Iraq, but am not naive enough to forget this administration has made millions off of oil. And is using it power for their own personal gains, not unlike most politicians. That is why anyone that blindly believes anything they say and makes statements that we should all be as blind and as naive as them, is a complete and utter, moron.

If you were born in Iraq you be one of these vigilantes blindly following Saddam. American's are supposed to question their Government.

 

[Ed B]

And let me correct one more ignorant inaccuracy from earlier in this thread.....<b>this contract was not bid on</b>. It was <b>awarded</b> by the administration out of a small pool of current Defense vendors. There was no bidding process. So to even say it was the lowest-price company is inaccurate.

The government simply <b>gave</b> this contract to the Vice-President's former employer. How crooked is that?

 

[RedRob]

The government simply <b>gave</b> this contract to the Vice-President's former employer. How crooked is that? [/B]

Ed, not to say you shouldn't be outraged, but your referring to politicians and then asking "How crooked is that?" Uhhh, what exactly did you expect?

 

[Ed B]

Originally posted by RedRob
Ed, not to say you shouldn't be outraged, but your referring to politicians and then asking "How crooked is that?" Uhhh, what exactly did you expect?

I haven't yet gotten to the point where I don't care. Maybe I'll be jaded in 5 more years.

 

[jmr667]

Originally posted by RedRob
Ed, not to say you shouldn't be outraged, but your referring to politicians and then asking "How crooked is that?" Uhhh, what exactly did you expect?

(Ok. Since there is not much Cards stuff going on today may as well play here.)

You are correct. Saying the politicians are making decisions that provide them perks is hardly news. Saying voters will be outraged when they find out politicians are not ideal examples of altruism is also not news.

Altruism is a lot to ask for from any human. That's why Mother Theresea is famous.
I personally am happy to hear that American companies are getting the contracts to rebuild Iraq. It happens to be that I work for an American company. I have always worked for American companies. And I must say I would like to keep collecting paychecks from them. So I'm in favor of giving American companies more contracts so they can give me more money to do the work for them. So what if some politicians also make some money at the same time?
Unfortunately, this mind set means it would be hypocritical of me to vilify Dick Chaney for not being more altruistic than myself. I guess that probably makes me a conservative in the eyes of the liberals, huh? Oh well, that's life I guess.

 

[KingofCards]

That comparision would only be true if you had the power to award your company a multi-billion dollar contract, using political power. We all want American Companies to do well and be awarded contracts in fair competition. For Cheney's ex-Company to get the contract is a slap in the face to all of us. Its like they are saying:

"Hey we are going to take your tax money and wage a war. Then use your tax money to rebuild the mess, lining our pockets in the mean time, by awarding ourselves the contract. And we aren't going to be sneaky about it, we are going to rub your noses in it."

 

[Brian]

FYI (for what it's worth)

Ed, Krang, etc.

As you all know I'm in the Army. My job is to provide Prime Power in wartime (we're talking megawatts, not kilowatts that most industrial generators provide)

I am in probably the smallest, most unique unit in the Army. My higher command beyond battalion level is the Corps of Engineers. Any time we reach a point of "mission complete" i.e. Bosnia, Kosovo, Afghanistan, etc. Brown and Root has ALWAYS taken over, dating way back before 1996. In any campaign, you have to have an endstate. In other words, we can't be left on location forever. So once we have set up our generators and done the distribution (either base camps, EPW camps, hospitals etc.) we have to have a way to pull out.

Enter Brown and Root. We have been so strung out of late in Uzbekistan, Kajikistan, Afghanistan (Kandahar and Bagram), Kuwait, and now Iraq, I and my buddies are very glad to hear the words Brown and Root. Yes, these guys make 5 times what I do and do half the work, but they are civilians and sometimes the only way to convince civilians to go in an area where there are ongoing firefights and mortar attacks is with alot of money.

I never knew that the VP was a major stockholder with them but then again, I don't care. My son has been growing up without me around. So hurry up Brown and Root guys, pack your s**t and I'll see you over there. I gotta go restore power in Basra and my kid misses me already.

P.S. I won't be posting any replies to this, I'm busy packing. Just thought I'd check and see if we'd signed anyone before I headed out. Catch you all on the flip-side.

 

[justAndy]

redrob -

How can any huge corporate entity be truly liberal? Maybe culturally, you know - prochoice, "multicultural", etc. But they can never be economically liberal - that would be counter to their own interests.
I recognize the natural evolution of society under the effects of money. Money has it's OWN agenda, it is a force neither good or evil. I analyze civilization, but only point out it's hypocracies. I have no beef with the great majority that have bought in - it's the best we've been able to come up with so far, and for most people in the USA, it works well enough. I'm not suffering...

 

[CardNots]

I'm a Cardinal fan here in the US. I suffer from it daily...

 

[Cardinal Bob]

Originally posted by Ed B
The government simply <b>gave</b> this contract to the Vice-President's former employer. How crooked is that?

It's no different that anything else George W. Bush and Dick Cheney have done since the day GWB announced he was running for President. One half-truth (or less) followed by another.

 

[Dback Jon]

I was going to post a thread on this, but decided not too - glad you did, Ed.

Haliburton MAY be the best company to do this particular job, but the circumstances smell fishy. The Bush Admin is a throwback to the old smoky backroom - the good 'ol boys slapping each other on the back, and helping each other out. This is why Bush and CHeney will not release their "Energy" department meetings - because we would see how much in bed with the Texas Energy Mafia they are. (like Enron, Dynergy, Halliburton, Exxon, etc).

And now back to our regularly scheduled

Operation
Iraqi
Liberation

 

[Ed B]

Originally posted by Dback Jon
I was going to post a thread on this, but decided not too - glad you did, Ed.

Haliburton MAY be the best company to do this particular job, but the circumstances smell fishy. The Bush Admin is a throwback to the old smoky backroom - the good 'ol boys slapping each other on the back, and helping each other out. This is why Bush and CHeney will not release their "Energy" department meetings - because we would see how much in bed with the Texas Energy Mafia they are. (like Enron, Dynergy, Halliburton, Exxon, etc).

And now back to our regularly scheduled

Operation
Iraqi
Liberation

Actually, if anyone who's attacking me knew how to read, they'd know that Halliburton was one of the politically connected companies given the firefighting contract in 1991 and turned out to be totally incompetent for the job, and after the wells burned for a few weeks (costing billions and doing endless environmental damage) the US finally brought in a company from Canada called Safety Boss to actually put out the fires since Halliburton and the other military contractors couldn't do it.

But what do I know, I'm sure this is all a big coincidence.

 

[Skkorpion]

Harleyrider, from now on, every time the lights go out in zones of conflict, I'll remember you.

Stay safe and hurry home.

 

[Young Gun]

unfortunately, a lot of people( not on this board) are so bandwagonish. (you probably know who I'm talking about, there's droves of them on the other AzCentral board.)

I for one, stand behind the Cardinals each & every Sunday

 

[Russ Smith]

Check out the last 2 weeks of trading on WEL, company is Coots and Boots they do repairs to oil wells including ones set on fire. They have ties to Haliburton. The stock went from like .59 to over 2.00 in 2 days, then fell down to about .75, and was at 1.50 again yesterday. Very risky but if you'd hit it right you could have made a fortune, I was too scared by the time I discovered it, the stock had already exploded.

 

[Ed B]

Originally posted by Russ Smith
Check out the last 2 weeks of trading on WEL, company is Coots and Boots they do repairs to oil wells including ones set on fire. They have ties to Haliburton. The stock went from like .59 to over 2.00 in 2 days, then fell down to about .75, and was at 1.50 again yesterday. Very risky but if you'd hit it right you could have made a fortune, I was too scared by the time I discovered it, the stock had already exploded.

Yes, Boots & Coots was the company that was supposed to do the majority of the work in 1991 but ended up being unable to for a variety of reasons (competence, manpower, etc).

Several of their firefighters were badly injured and even killed in the process. It's a very dangerous job and I hope their services won't be necessary.

 

[Russ Smith]

Originally posted by Ed B
Yes, Boots & Coots was the company that was supposed to do the majority of the work in 1991 but ended up being unable to for a variety of reasons (competence, manpower, etc).

Several of their firefighters were badly injured and even killed in the process. It's a very dangerous job and I hope their services won't be necessary.

Yep, and 2 weeks prior to the start of the war Boots and Coots was preparing to file for bankruptcy. They're at 1.19 right now although it's still not clear how much if any work they'll get from this war.

Any bets Cheney and friends held a lot of stock in WEL and sold it all in the last few days?

 

[Ed B]

Originally posted by Russ Smith
Yep, and 2 weeks prior to the start of the war Boots and Coots was preparing to file for bankruptcy. They're at 1.19 right now although it's still not clear how much if any work they'll get from this war.

Any bets Cheney and friends held a lot of stock in WEL and sold it all in the last few days?

Dick Cheney "divested" himself of all his investments, or so the media reported. The reality is that he still owns the stocks but they are in trust and cannot be traded. So he can't have sold anything.

But the Halliburton stock increase is something he'll be able to reap the benefits of once he is out of office.

 

[jmt]

Excellent thread Ed! And lest we forget Richard Pearle.

 

[WizardOfAz]

Hopefully You Got Your Halliburton Before The Conflict Started!

Halliburton Contract Goes Beyond Fires

By LARRY MARGASAK, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON - An emergency contract the Bush administration gave to Halliburton Co. to extinguish Iraqi oil fires also gave the firm a more lucrative role in getting the country's oil system up and running, documents showed Tuesday.

A congressional critic of the Houston company, formerly run by Vice President Dick Cheney, said the administration was hiding the expanded role.

A spokeswoman for Halliburton said the company's initial announcement of the contract on March 24 disclosed the larger role for its KBR subsidiary.

The U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, in a letter to Rep. Henry Waxman last Friday, disclosed that the no-bid contract included not only extinguishing fires but "operation of facilities and distribution of products."

Waxman, D-Calif., senior Democrat on the House Government Reform Committee, wrote Lt. Gen. Robert Flowers of the Corps on Tuesday, saying the contract "is considerably broader in scope than previously known."

The lawmaker also said the Corps' proposal to replace the Halliburton contract with another long-term deal was at odds with administration statements that Iraq's oil belongs to the Iraqi people.

KBR was given the right to extinguish the oil fires under an existing, contingency contract. Cheney's office has said repeatedly the vice president had no role in the contract award.

Carol Sanders, a spokeswoman for the Corps of Engineers, said officials were reviewing the letter but had no immediate response.

Halliburton spokeswoman Wendy Hall pointed to the company's announcement of the contract in March, which she said revealed the extent of the work.

The release said: "KBR's initial task involves hazard and operational assessment, extinguishing oil well fires, capping oil well blowouts, as well as responding to any oil spills. Following this task, KBR will perform emergency repair, as directed, to provide for the continuity of operations of the Iraqi oil infrastructure."

Hall said KBR is assisting Iraq's oil ministry to get the oil system operating.

Waxman countered, "Only now, over five weeks after the contract was first disclosed, are members of Congress and the public learning that Halliburton may be asked to pump and distribute Iraqi oil under the contract."

Waxman also has repeated the Corps' statement that the contract could be worth up to $7 billion for up to two years, but the Corps said that figure was a cap based on a worst-case scenario of oil well fires. In fact, few wells were burning during the war with Iraq and the Corps said that by early April, the company had been paid $50.3 million.

 

[Rattler Rod]

While we are at it, how is George Bushington gong to explain to the american People, that Weapons of Mass Destruction don't exist, that the so-called democratic government of Iraq turn out to be an Islamic Fundamentalist Government and that Saudi Arabia, Syria, Iran and the rest of the Arab world just want us the hell out of there.

How does he explain to the American people that more than 100 American Boys , and thousands of Iraqis, died, just so George Bushington could fullfill his vendetta against Saddam Hussein, who now, he can't even find?????

Just wondering.

I guess it really won't matter though, cause by then, he will have bombed a few more countries, just to get re-elected, and continue to cow tow to the wealthy.

Impeachment might be next on the agenda.

 

[KingofCards]

Nem, suddenly gives up his alias.