Pacquiao/Mayweather fight in Jeopardy..

82CardsGrad

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you're either completely missing my point or ducking it. Comparing them by the weight of their first pro fight makes absolutely no sense. The only "Fair" comparison is to compare them both at the same age, and at 16 they were fighting at the same weight. By 20 Mayweather was at least 10 pounds bigger. Yes he's taller but he's also in a completely different world it makes perfect sense that he was bigger he had a much better life at that point, much better training, much better nutrition etc.

Manny gained weight later on because there were no fights left for him at 130 pounds. I've still found nothing that says he fought above 142 pounds, and he was having trouble making 130 the last several fights so I don't see a big deal gaining 10-12 pounds later in his career. His last fight in the 130 class he fought marquez at 129, 3 months later he fought Diaz at 134.5. If you read the pre fight weighin comments for the Diaz fight it very clearly says unlike his last 3 fights, Manny had no problem making the higher weight. In the last 3 fights they were concerned Manny was weakened by struggling to make the weight. He stayed below 130 because that's where the fights were, once he'd beaten everyone, including the Marquez rematch he moved up to the next weight class that suited him better.



Mayweather went from fighting at 140 to fighting at 150 in about 18 months.
Manny has by you fought above 130 4 times in 18 months and the most I can find is 142 pounds. Why is ok for Mayweather to jump 10 pounds in 18 months but not for Manny to jump 12? You're really saying that last 2 pounds is the difference between doping and not doping? Especially when you consider he really went from 135 to 142 which is only 7 pounds after the Diaz fight.

The highest weight Manny has fought is 142, Mayweather 150, I don't see how anybody can look at that given their comparable ages and say obviously Manny doped and Mayweather didn't.

Of course I've seen 2 16 year olds grow at different rates, that's precisely my point you're assuming Manny cheated because he gained weight later in his career, so did Mayweather, so did Ray Leonard, marvin hagler, Duran, Hearns and on and on. You're taking the growth rate of Mayweather and saying if Manny's doesn't fit it, then he must be doping.

Again if he's doping how come nobody else he fought has made that allegation? And if Mayweather is such an expert on who's doping how come he never called out Mosley for doping when he ACTUALLY WAS doping?

It's just as likely that Mayweather just doesn't want to fight as it is Manny is avoiding tests, especially given what you are refusing to comment on, that Roach says they offered to take a blood test 7 days before the fight.


Russ, again... I am a Manny fan! I am not definitively stating that he is doping! I am curious and a bit suspect. I hope I'm wrong. As for the whole weight debate, somehow we got put on some weird tangent... My point is simply that Floyd is a naturally bigger man, and it matters NOTHING what they weighed when they were 16...
Anyway, hope they find a way to make it happen one day.
 

Russ Smith

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Russ, again... I am a Manny fan! I am not definitively stating that he is doping! I am curious and a bit suspect. I hope I'm wrong. As for the whole weight debate, somehow we got put on some weird tangent... My point is simply that Floyd is a naturally bigger man, and it matters NOTHING what they weighed when they were 16...
Anyway, hope they find a way to make it happen one day.

Well I must have misunderstood you I thought you brought up the weight as an example of what made Manny suspicious?

If you know me at all you know I'm the biggest skeptic about athletes these days there is, I assume everyone is doping until proven innocent in sports like cycling or track and field. IN football too.

I guess my point is I think the mainstream US media is acting out of nationalism here, they're very quick to jump to the conclusion Manny must be doping even though the only "evidence" they have is a guy who is a convicted drug trafficker(Mayweathers dad) accused him of it with no evidence at all.


I actually believe if Manny were the American fighter and Mayweather the "foreigner" the mainstream media would be handling this much different, demanding they prove the allegations or stop etc the way they have with Lance Armstrong.

I really hope they fight, but I also read where Manny's manager said they had made so many concessions to get Mayweather to agree to the fight that after these allegations he doubted they could agree again. Mayweather had demanded a totally different structure on the purse, Manny is the champ but Mayweather wanted a higher percentage than would be standard. Mayweather demanded the fight be billed as Mayweather/Pacquiao not the other way around, they eventually agreed to that in US and reversed in the Philippines. Mayweather made demands on glove weight, made demands on what color trunks both fighters could wear, and the location, who would be on the undercard and on and on. Manny's managers said it was very apparent to us that they were going out of their way to make the fight not happen but Manny really wants this fight so he kept conceding or meeting them halfway.

So then the dad threw out the drug allegation and suddenly that became an impasse. Apparently Freddy Roach convinced Manny to do the 7 day thing but when Mayweater didn't respond and publicly called out Manny over the 14 day thing, Manny told Bob Arum no way I am not making any more concessions to this guy, this fight is done. There was a story quoting Mayweathers manager saying they believed Manny wasn't aware of the 14 day offer and wanted to make sure before they called the fight dead but Arum said that was totally untrue they knew full well Manny was aware of it and had rejected it because of the public comments of Mayweather after his side had not responded to the 7 day offer.

I don't know but the more I read the more convinced I am Mayweather pulled this out to duck the fight.
 

hsandhu

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Freddie Roach just brought up a good point on SportsCenter. He believes that Mayweather is gonna dodge Shane Mosley or Andre Berta and will fight Paul Malignaggi.

On sportscenter or friday night fights?

If on friday night fights you forgot to mention the part where teddy atlas said there is an email floating around from pacquio's side asking mayweather what would happen if he tests positive and would they bury it for the best of boxing?

Seriously, why doesn't manny just ask if they can schedule the drug testing around his cycles.:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anaGcmDIwNQ
 

Russ Smith

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On sportscenter or friday night fights?

If on friday night fights you forgot to mention the part where teddy atlas said there is an email floating around from pacquio's side asking mayweather what would happen if he tests positive and would they bury it for the best of boxing?

Seriously, why doesn't manny just ask if they can schedule the drug testing around his cycles.:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anaGcmDIwNQ

My response would be Mayweather's people should produce those emails in public and expose manny. Right now nobody knows who is ducking who and who is in the wrong. If I'm Mayweather and I know for a fact I have emails that show Manny asking what would the penalty be for a positive test and would you cover it up for the good of boxing, I wouldn't be on tv saying I want his punk ass. I'd be on tv saying here are the emails, now you know why we're asking for the tests.

It's pretty easy to spread a rumor you have an email, if you really have it the way this thing has fallen apart I see no point in not producing them? He's already on record accusing Manny of doping, if he has emails that lend credence to that what possible reason would there be to NOT make them public?

In fact if you really consider this, the whole reason to ask for these tests is concern Manny is doping. If you now have emails that essentially admit he probably is(only reason to send those would be if you're doping), why would you still have any interest in the fight? You asked for the tests because you don't want to fight a cheater, if you have these emails you now KNOW he's cheating, so why insist you still want the fight?
 
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azsportsfan01

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Since Berto pulled out of the fight against Mosley (for very obvious reasons. I believe it goes without saying I hope everything turns out as well as it could for Berto, his family, and the rest of Haiti), Mayweather is now looking to fight Mosley early May. It will be interesting to see how Floyd handles the testing part of this fight. He now goes from a guy his father says used steroids to a guy who has admitted using steroids. He better be requiring the same testing procedures he demanded out of Pacquiao.
 

Russ Smith

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Since Berto pulled out of the fight against Mosley (for very obvious reasons. I believe it goes without saying I hope everything turns out as well as it could for Berto, his family, and the rest of Haiti), Mayweather is now looking to fight Mosley early May. It will be interesting to see how Floyd handles the testing part of this fight. He now goes from a guy his father says used steroids to a guy who has admitted using steroids. He better be requiring the same testing procedures he demanded out of Pacquiao.

He's on record as saying he will demand the blood testing for every fight for the rest of his career now so I'm sure he will.
 

82CardsGrad

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Since Berto pulled out of the fight against Mosley (for very obvious reasons. I believe it goes without saying I hope everything turns out as well as it could for Berto, his family, and the rest of Haiti), Mayweather is now looking to fight Mosley early May. It will be interesting to see how Floyd handles the testing part of this fight. He now goes from a guy his father says used steroids to a guy who has admitted using steroids. He better be requiring the same testing procedures he demanded out of Pacquiao.


Bummer about the Berto situation... However, a Mayweather - Mosely fight could be just as entertaining as the Mayweather - Pacquiao fight would've been! I actually think Mosely has a better shot at beating Floyd than did Manny! I hope they can actually pull this off!!!
 
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