Paging Michael Bidwill...

[conraddobler]

I seriously doubt Chip Kelly's gimmick offense will work in the NFL. In fact, one of the reasons it works in colllege is because college teams are limited in their practice time and are not prepared on a weekly basis. When teams have had time to prepare for Oregon, Oregon usually loses. Ohio State held him to 17 points and Auburn to 19 points when they had time to prepare. Even in 2009, when Boise St had time in the season opener, they held him to 8 points. The NFL would figure him out rather quickly.

There are aspects of it that would work but otherwise I agree.

 

[Duckjake]

Wow. This is becoming an ugly personal issue with you. Every post?

He and Phrazbit should have their own thread.

 

[Mulli]

Like I said, what system WOULD John Skelton be good for?

Instead of attacking Krang, what system would Skelton be good for?

 

[Buckybird]

He and Phrazbit should have their own thread.

Yeah but if I'm not mistaken he hates Kolb & said RGIII couldn't make it in the NFL at QB either. Maybe he's like Thesmel & wants to run 45 times a game

 

[Absolute Zero]

The Cards have had pretty decent draft position the last several years.

And yet somehow the O line has been neglected talent wise. And our QB's have been hammered hammered hammered as a result. And we are left with a very ineffective offense, compounded by bashful and uninspired play calling.

I agree, bring in a new coaching team.

 

[kerouac9]

Instead of attacking Krang, what system would Skelton be good for?

I've said it multiple times over the course of the year. I think that Skelton would be more adequate in a run-first, play-action, deep-passing offense. Like the one that they used to run in Pittsburgh when Ken Whisenhunt was taking his marching orders from Bill Cowher, and the one that Mike Mularkey installed with great success in Atlanta as Matt Ryan matured into the quarterback he is now.

We could run that system here with the personnel we had at the opening of training camp. Levi Brown, Daryn Colledge, Lyle Sendlein, Adam Snyder, and Bobbie Massie could have, IMO, opened holes for Beanie Wells between the tackles and just outside the tackles' shoulders in that system. Beanie Wells can be an adequate substitute for Michael Turner. Ryan Williams could have been an interesting change-of-pace back to put some pressure on the outside corner and provide some bigger gains.

After Levi Brown got hurt, that system wasn't really operable anymore. That's why you generally don't hear me complaining about playcalling, how terrible the offensive line is, etc. Skelton is never going to be a Top 15 starter in the NFL. It's worth noting that that through Week 8, Skelton ranks (just) above Kolb in FootballOutsiders advanced quarterback metrics.

The problem with the Cards' offense isn't really the offensive line--at least, they're not the whole problem. The guy under center and the guys in the backfield are also holding the offense back.

 

[Mulli]

I've said it multiple times over the course of the year. I think that Skelton would be more adequate in a run-first, play-action, deep-passing offense. Like the one that they used to run in Pittsburgh when Ken Whisenhunt was taking his marching orders from Bill Cowher, and the one that Mike Mularkey installed with great success in Atlanta as Matt Ryan matured into the quarterback he is now.

We could run that system here with the personnel we had at the opening of training camp. Levi Brown, Daryn Colledge, Lyle Sendlein, Adam Snyder, and Bobbie Massie could have, IMO, opened holes for Beanie Wells between the tackles and just outside the tackles' shoulders in that system. Beanie Wells can be an adequate substitute for Michael Turner. Ryan Williams could have been an interesting change-of-pace back to put some pressure on the outside corner and provide some bigger gains.

After Levi Brown got hurt, that system wasn't really operable anymore. That's why you generally don't hear me complaining about playcalling, how terrible the offensive line is, etc. Skelton is never going to be a Top 15 starter in the NFL. It's worth noting that that through Week 8, Skelton ranks (just) above Kolb in FootballOutsiders advanced quarterback metrics.

The problem with the Cards' offense isn't really the offensive line--at least, they're not the whole problem. The guy under center and the guys in the backfield are also holding the offense back.

Maybe it is just me, but this all supports what Krang posted about Skelton being awful.

 

[kerouac9]

Maybe it is just me, but this all supports what Krang posted about Skelton being awful.

I think that Skelton is playing awful, but I don't think we're seeing him supported by a system and complementary personnel. I don't think that he's an awful quarterback along the lines of Blaine Gabbert. I think that Skelton can have a nice career as a #2--which is what I've thought since he was drafted.

My issue with Krang is that he's been helicoptering in a couple times a week to hammer Skelton without offering solutions and implying that Kolb was the correct answer all along--which is what he said all offseason. IMO Skelton is still better than Kolb as a player, although Kolb is probably more compatible with the system we're running right now.

I don't think it's fair to look at this game and pound on Skelton, who did a fair job operating the offense and was let down by some of his weapons, including Larry Fitzgerald. This loss wasn't on him.

 

[Mulli]

I think that Skelton is playing awful, but I don't think we're seeing him supported by a system and complementary personnel. I don't think that he's an awful quarterback along the lines of Blaine Gabbert. I think that Skelton can have a nice career as a #2--which is what I've thought since he was drafted.

My issue with Krang is that he's been helicoptering in a couple times a week to hammer Skelton without offering solutions and implying that Kolb was the correct answer all along--which is what he said all offseason. IMO Skelton is still better than Kolb as a player, although Kolb is probably more compatible with the system we're running right now.

I don't think it's fair to look at this game and pound on Skelton, who did a fair job operating the offense and was let down by some of his weapons, including Larry Fitzgerald. This loss wasn't on him.

Do you think at any point in Skelton's career he will be able to change plays at the line? Does he does this consistently now? Can't tell.

Why would Krang need to offer solutions? If posters are going to credit Skelton for wins, expect others to blame him in losses (when he can't do much until the soft zones/prevent defenses show up).

NOTE: Have you compared Gabbert's stats to Skelton's this year?

 

[kerouac9]

Do you think at any point in Skelton's career he will be able to change plays at the line? Does he does this consistently now? Can't tell.

Why would Krang need to offer solutions? If posters are going to credit Skelton for wins, expect others to blame him in losses (when he can't do much until the soft zones/prevent defenses show up).

NOTE: Have you compared Gabbert's stats to Skelton's this year?

I don't know if Skelton is empowered to change plays at the line. If he's the kind of guy who trusts what the coaching staff is telling him/what the game plan is ahead of what he's seeing on play to play.

Krang doesn't need to offer solutions, but he's on a very short list of posters who I'm going to read if they have something to offer. If he continues to be a poster who's going to go into thread after thread, lob a bomb w/r/t Skelton, and then disappear without offering anything else of value, he's going to fall off that list. That's unfortunate for me, because I think in the past that he's added really good value to this board.

Gabbert is in a much better situation than Skelton is, and has been truly terrible. Yeah, Gabbert has more TDs and a (slightly) higher completion percentage, but he's averaging almost a full yard and a half less per attempt than Skelton is.

 

[Mulli]

I don't know if Skelton is empowered to change plays at the line. If he's the kind of guy who trusts what the coaching staff is telling him/what the game plan is ahead of what he's seeing on play to play.

Krang doesn't need to offer solutions, but he's on a very short list of posters who I'm going to read if they have something to offer. If he continues to be a poster who's going to go into thread after thread, lob a bomb w/r/t Skelton, and then disappear without offering anything else of value, he's going to fall off that list. That's unfortunate for me, because I think in the past that he's added really good value to this board.

Gabbert is in a much better situation than Skelton is, and has been truly terrible. Yeah, Gabbert has more TDs and a (slightly) higher completion percentage, but he's averaging almost a full yard and a half less per attempt than Skelton is.

Yo Gabba Gabba's QBR is 2X Skelton's. His rating is 78 to 65 for Skelton.

And his DVOA is very close to Skelt's.

And Gabb is in only his second year.

 

[Buckybird]

I think that Skelton is playing awful, but I don't think we're seeing him supported by a system and complementary personnel. I don't think that he's an awful quarterback along the lines of Blaine Gabbert. I think that Skelton can have a nice career as a #2--which is what I've thought since he was drafted.

My issue with Krang is that he's been helicoptering in a couple times a week to hammer Skelton without offering solutions and implying that Kolb was the correct answer all along--which is what he said all offseason. IMO Skelton is still better than Kolb as a player, although Kolb is probably more compatible with the system we're running right now.

I don't think it's fair to look at this game and pound on Skelton, who did a fair job operating the offense and was let down by some of his weapons, including Larry Fitzgerald. This loss wasn't on him.

K9 nobody here needs to explain why or why not they like/dislike Skelton because his play says he's nothing more than a career backup. IMO he didn't play all that well last year when we won 6 of the last 8.

 

[Snakester]

Wow this is a tough crowd. Skelton has showed improvement each game and played well against Greenbay. How about letting the guy at least finish out the year before saying that he sucks. He just might surprise some of you. Like it or not Skelton will continue to do better and the O-line will do better going forward now that Batiste is out and Massie has had some time to get up to speed. We wont beat the Falcons because of our DB's but we should beat St. Louis and the Jets.

 

[Buckybird]

Wow this is a tough crowd. Skelton has showed improvement each game and played well against Greenbay. How about letting the guy at least finish out the year before saying that he sucks. He just might surprise some of you. Like it or not Skelton will continue to do better and the O-line will do better going forward now that Batiste is out and Massie has had some time to get up to speed. We wont beat the Falcons because of our DB's but we should beat St. Louis and the Jets.

Yeah a guy who completes 53% of his passes, 15-21 TD/int & a 66 career passer rating doesn't suck! Skelton blows & he's play say so...just the reality of it.

 

[Russ Smith]

I've said it multiple times over the course of the year. I think that Skelton would be more adequate in a run-first, play-action, deep-passing offense. Like the one that they used to run in Pittsburgh when Ken Whisenhunt was taking his marching orders from Bill Cowher, and the one that Mike Mularkey installed with great success in Atlanta as Matt Ryan matured into the quarterback he is now.

We could run that system here with the personnel we had at the opening of training camp. Levi Brown, Daryn Colledge, Lyle Sendlein, Adam Snyder, and Bobbie Massie could have, IMO, opened holes for Beanie Wells between the tackles and just outside the tackles' shoulders in that system. Beanie Wells can be an adequate substitute for Michael Turner. Ryan Williams could have been an interesting change-of-pace back to put some pressure on the outside corner and provide some bigger gains.

After Levi Brown got hurt, that system wasn't really operable anymore. That's why you generally don't hear me complaining about playcalling, how terrible the offensive line is, etc. Skelton is never going to be a Top 15 starter in the NFL. It's worth noting that that through Week 8, Skelton ranks (just) above Kolb in FootballOutsiders advanced quarterback metrics.

The problem with the Cards' offense isn't really the offensive line--at least, they're not the whole problem. The guy under center and the guys in the backfield are also holding the offense back.

Does FO take into account how much of Skelton's effectiveness is only after we're 10+ points behind? In other words in their advanced metrics do they take into account that Kolb was in basically nothing but close games where Skelton has gotten the benefit of stat padding at the end of a few games that weren't as close? The Rams game was basically the only game Kolb played where we were 2 scores down for any length of time.

 

[kerouac9]

Does FO take into account how much of Skelton's effectiveness is only after we're 10+ points behind? In other words in their advanced metrics do they take into account that Kolb was in basically nothing but close games where Skelton has gotten the benefit of stat padding at the end of a few games that weren't as close? The Rams game was basically the only game Kolb played where we were 2 scores down for any length of time.

Are you talking about this year, or Skelton's entire career? I think that the sample size for Kolb and Skelton this season is too small to change any real judgements about whether they're good or bad. Kolb isn't good; Skelton isn't good. There isn't that much we can do to change that.

 

[Russ Smith]

Are you talking about this year, or Skelton's entire career? I think that the sample size for Kolb and Skelton this season is too small to change any real judgements about whether they're good or bad. Kolb isn't good; Skelton isn't good. There isn't that much we can do to change that.

I meant this year I assumed you were saying their metrics for this year say Skelton is actually better but maybe you meant over career.

 

[kerouac9]

I meant this year I assumed you were saying their metrics for this year say Skelton is actually better but maybe you meant over career.

Oh... No, Fotball Outsider's (I thought you meant the front office's) metrics aren't controlled for situation. That's one reason why Skelton's QBR (21.3) is way, way lower than Kolb's (38.0). But, again, neither of them are good in comparison to the rest of the league. Those QBR rankings are 33rd and 31st, respectively, with only Mark Sanchez between them.

Whether it's Kibbles and Bits or Purina, Arizona Cardinals fans are just eating dog food at the QB position.

I think you're being a little hard on Skelton's fourth-quarter performances, or at least holding them against him. Skelton was 7 for 12 for 78 yards and one first down in the 4th quarter. It's not like he's getting fat on that.

 

[Duckjake]

Does FO take into account how much of Skelton's effectiveness is only after we're 10+ points behind? In other words in their advanced metrics do they take into account that Kolb was in basically nothing but close games where Skelton has gotten the benefit of stat padding at the end of a few games that weren't as close? The Rams game was basically the only game Kolb played where we were 2 scores down for any length of time.

Skelton has always done that. The difference is that last year the CArds came back to win and this year they haven't.

But when you've only scored two TDs in the first quarter in the last 23 games you obviously don't have anyone on the roster who can play well at QB early in a game.

 

[Russ Smith]

Oh... No, Fotball Outsider's (I thought you meant the front office's) metrics aren't controlled for situation. That's one reason why Skelton's QBR (21.3) is way, way lower than Kolb's (38.0). But, again, neither of them are good in comparison to the rest of the league. Those QBR rankings are 33rd and 31st, respectively, with only Mark Sanchez between them.

Whether it's Kibbles and Bits or Purina, Arizona Cardinals fans are just eating dog food at the QB position.

I think you're being a little hard on Skelton's fourth-quarter performances, or at least holding them against him. Skelton was 7 for 12 for 78 yards and one first down in the 4th quarter. It's not like he's getting fat on that.

Oh I get they're both not very good.

I just mean if you remove the throwing against zone defenses late in games factor from the equation I think Kolb's numbers look better than Skeltons' by quite a bit.

the main issue with Skelton right now is the total lack of TD passes, but as you said this offense doesn't suit him, it suits Kolb better, and we're running this offense because of the OL.

If the OL gets better so we can throw a bit more downfield, and Beanie gets back etc, Skelton ought to play better. If he's still playing if/when Kolb gets back.

I get that neither one of them is very good.

 

[Russ Smith]

Skelton has always done that. The difference is that last year the CArds came back to win and this year they haven't.

But when you've only scored two TDs in the first quarter in the last 23 games you obviously don't have anyone on the roster who can play well at QB early in a game.

The main difference is the lack of TD passes. He did put up better stats in the 2nd half last year, but the main thing was he put the ball in the endzone, 8 of his 11 TD passes were 2nd half last year, 6 of them 4th Q. This year he's getting the yardage, but not the TD's.