Probably unpopular here regarding this regime…

[TheCardFan]

Tom Brady didn't really become the "Tom Brady" we all think about, until the 2nd Super Bowl...it took him a few years to become that player. Pioli was building around what he hoped Brady would become...BB took over in 2009 and built around what Tom Brady had become.

Brady won the Super Bowl (and SB MVP) in his first full year as a starter (2nd year in NFL).

That dominance continued for the next 18-19 years as a Patriot.

The "Patriot Way" was drafting the GOAT and riding him and the less than market pay for almost 2 decades.

What has Bill B or Pioli won before or after Tom Brady? Jack squat!

 

[Cheesebeef]

Brady won the Super Bowl (and SB MVP) in his first full year as a starter (2nd year in NFL).

That dominance continued for the next 18-19 years as a Patriot.

The "Patriot Way" was drafting the GOAT and riding him and the less than market pay for almost 2 decades.

What has Bill B or Pioli won before or after Tom Brady? Jack squat!

The comical thing about posters now saying we’re doing this “The Patriot Way” is that I can remember most of them claiming Keim was doing the same thing in off-seasons like last year… or at other various times where it wasn’t even in play in any way shape or form.

Also, “The Patriot Way” comments always ignore there wasn’t ONE Patriot way. They did great in drafts, but ALSO made BIG trades/FA signings, especially through their first decade with massive pick ups like Corey Dillon, Roosevelt Colvin when he was the top FA OLB, trading for Randy Moss, signing Rodney Harrison/Junio Seau, Darrell Revis, etc, etc.

 

[Chopper0080]

Exactly. So why make a decision on the rest of your roster, until you know what you are going to do with your franchise QB? It only makes sense to 'punt' on this offseason until you know what you have in Kyler.

I disagree. You are going to have to support your QB either way. I don't want to rehash this argument again. I disagree that this offseason required an all or nothing approach to FA and roster building. That said, it is long past that now, and nothing is going to change it. This team is going to be bad, and probably unwatchable at times, because of the orgs decisions. That honestly is disappointing because I enjoy watching the Cardinals especially the few years they have been competitive.

The Cardinals are now irrelevant until Kyler comes back and I don't know how much he is going to be able to do to change much. And if he can't, that just likely means another season after this one of bad football.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I disagree. You are going to have to support your QB either way. I don't want to rehash this argument again. I disagree that this offseason required an all or nothing approach to FA and roster building. That said, it is long past that now, and nothing is going to change it. This team is going to be bad, and probably unwatchable at times, because of the orgs decisions. That honestly is disappointing because I enjoy watching the Cardinals especially the few years they have been competitive.

The Cardinals are now irrelevant until Kyler comes back and I don't know how much he is going to be able to do to change much. And if he can't, that just likely means another season after this one of bad football.

The Cards were already irrelevant until Kyler comes back.

 

[TheCardFan]

The Cardinals are now irrelevant until Kyler comes back

The Cards were already irrelevant until Kyler comes back.

The Cardinals are irrelevant even when Kyler comes back.

 

[MadCardDisease]

The comical thing about posters now saying we’re doing this “The Patriot Way” is that I can remember most of them claiming Keim was doing the same thing in off-seasons like last year… or at other various times where it wasn’t even in play in any way shape or form.

Also, “The Patriot Way” comments always ignore there wasn’t ONE Patriot way. They did great in drafts, but ALSO made BIG trades/FA signings, especially through their first decade with massive pick ups like Corey Dillon, Roosevelt Colvin when he was the top FA OLB, trading for Randy Moss, signing Rodney Harrison/Junio Seau, Darrell Revis, etc, etc.

You can chuckle all that you want but I've been pretty spot on about what Monti has been doing.

As for the Patriots making FA signings I mentioned that as my 4th point in my post about Monti:

I think what we are seeing is Monti following in the Belichick model of building a team.

#1: Quick turnover of the roster from the previous regime. By year two of Belichick taking over the Patriots, only 4 starters remained from the previous regime {C Damien Woody (Selected in the 1st round the season before Belichick arrived), MLB Tedy Bruschi, CB Ty Law and DE Willie McGinest}. Belichick wasted no time letting LB Andy Katzenmoyer (the other 1st rounder selected with Woody in 1999) go after just one season with Belichick and only two seasons on the Patriots. Belichick's first year was all about installing a culture and if you weren't all in you were out!

I think we are seeing a lot of this right now with the Cardinals. I expect the 2024 Cardinals starters to have only a handful of starters left from the previous regime (Kyler, Hump, McBride, Baker, Thompson, Collins). It also appears that Monti isn't afraid of letting former 1st round LB Simmons go if he doesn't live up to expectations.

#2: Belichick built the core of his team through the draft and seemingly every year he would hit at least one home run. In Belichick's first year he had 20 rookies on the roster at training camp. It all started by selecting future HOF Tom Brady in the 6th round of his first draft. Belichick followed that up with selecting HOF Richard Seymour in 2001.

Monti is clearly rebuilding the core through the draft. Too early to tell how well he will hit on his draft picks.

#3: Moving on from overpriced players. Belichick was shrewd when it came time for players who were FAs looking for a new big contract. Once your value no longer matched your salary it was time to say goodbye.

Zach Allen, DHop, Chosen Anderson, all were let go because their value no longer fit with the salary that they earned, wanted or got on the open market. Ertz and Conner will soon join them at the end of this season.

#4: Willing to spend when a FA fits. Gilmore comes to mind as does Randy Moss and Devin McCourty. However the one year that comes to mind where Belichick made a big splash was in 2001 which was year two for him in NE. With that FA class Belichick landed the amazing haul of: LB Mike Vrabel, CB Terrell Buckley, G Mike Compton, LB Bryan Cox, LB Roman Phifer, QB Damon Huard, LB Larry Izzo, WR David Patten, FB Marc Edwards, DE Anthony Pleasant, and RB Antowain Smith.

 

[Chopper0080]

The Cardinals are irrelevant even when Kyler comes back.

When you field a roster this bad, that is my fear.

 

[DVontel]

required an all or nothing approach to FA and roster building

In between is purgatory.

 

[Cheesebeef]

You can chuckle all that you want but I've been pretty spot on about what Monti has been doing.

Nah… you haven’t. You’ve been consistently posting contradictory arguments, every one of which somehow has this team making the right decision.

As for the Patriots making FA signings I mentioned that as my 4th point in my post about Monti:

 

[MadCardDisease]

Nah… you haven’t. You’ve been consistently posting contradictory arguments, every one of which somehow has this team making the right decision.

Interesting. This was from my post above. No where did I say Monti made the right decision following this model:

Will Monti have the same success? The odds are against it. However I do see the similarities in his style to what Belichick did early on. No we have to wait and see if all works out for him. As a Cardinals fan I'm hoping that it does.

 

[TheCardFan]

When you field a roster this bad, that is my fear.

It's intentional or Monti is worse than Keim.

 

[Chopper0080]

In between is purgatory.

Again, this is where I disagree. I think they could have added a NFL level DL at a mid range cost and it wouldn't have hurt anything. I think they could have retained either Allen or Murphy and it would not have altered a rebuilding plan. Where I argue Keim put things in purgatory was filling the roster with multiple stopgaps in an attempt to compete for a playoff spot at the expense of young players. Murphy being on the roster displaces Antonio Hamilton, not Ken'trel Clark. Zach Allen would displace Jonathan Ledbetter who isn't a significant part of a rebuild anyway.

I have said, I am totally ok with Monti's approach with the ILB spot. No reason to spend a ton at a non-premium position in a rebuild year. I am fine with Monti not spending 8 mil on a multi year deal for a Suggs level veteran when there are several young players at EDGE they need to evaluate.

Just my feeling on the matter.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

If they are full on tanking/rebuilding, which they obviously are. I’d be on the phone with the Jets trying to get a couple #2s or a conditional #2(becomes a 1 if they make the playoffs) for DJ Humphries.

I like Humphries but they are tearing it down. Do we really need DJ blocking for Josh Dobbs? The Jets are desperate for a LT. Trade him and let Paris start his career path at LT.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

If they are full on tanking/rebuilding, which they obviously are. I’d be on the phone with the Jets trying to get a couple #2s or a conditional #2(becomes a 1 if they make the playoffs) for DJ Humphries.

I like Humphries but they are tearing it down. Do we really need DJ blocking for Josh Dobbs? The Jets are desperate for a LT. Trade him and let Paris start his career path at LT.

I would have sent away Budda instead of DJ.

 

[MadCardDisease]

Again, this is where I disagree. I think they could have added a NFL level DL at a mid range cost and it wouldn't have hurt anything. I think they could have retained either Allen or Murphy and it would not have altered a rebuilding plan. Where I argue Keim put things in purgatory was filling the roster with multiple stopgaps in an attempt to compete for a playoff spot at the expense of young players. Murphy being on the roster displaces Antonio Hamilton, not Ken'trel Clark. Zach Allen would displace Jonathan Ledbetter who isn't a significant part of a rebuild anyway.

If Keim had extended Allen back in Sept of 2022, like many of us wanted back then, Allen would still be on this team. He probably could have been extended for half of what Denver ended up giving him in free agency this year. I believe it was K9 who said that extended Allen would be a smart move by Kiem because Allen would most likely outplay his new extension or something like that. Not extending him was just another failure in a long list of failures of Keim's time here as GM.

 

[kerouac9]

If they are full on tanking/rebuilding, which they obviously are. I’d be on the phone with the Jets trying to get a couple #2s or a conditional #2(becomes a 1 if they make the playoffs) for DJ Humphries.

I like Humphries but they are tearing it down. Do we really need DJ blocking for Josh Dobbs? The Jets are desperate for a LT. Trade him and let Paris start his career path at LT.

Trading Hump would create $24 million in dead money this year.

But you'll likely get your wish next season as both Budda and Humphries will gave no guaranteed salary and negligible prorated bonus on their deals.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I would have sent away Budda instead of DJ.

I’d trade him also. Those guys have zero chance of being on the roster when the Cardinals become competitive again.

 

[Russ Smith]

My issue is that there is a gap between filling a roster with veteran stopgaps (ensuring purgatory) and just adding a bunch of vets on one year deals. That was my issue with Allen and Murphy. Maybe they aren't guys you sign for 5 years, but they can probably help your team over the next 3. I just find it tough to sell a message as a org or a hc when your getting boat raced out of the building every week because you chose to fill your roster with replacement level NFL vets on one year deals.

That was my take on both Murphy and Allen, should have kept them but I guess I see why they didn't. Zach's deal is over 15 per year, Byron's 8.5. Ton of money to pay guys if you don't think you're going to be good in the first 2 years of their deal, and Murphy got a 2 year deal.

But I think those 2 walking were the obvious ok we're tanking revelation for me.

Not that either of them is a superstar but they were solid home grown players I hated to see walk

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Trading Hump would create $24 million in dead money this year.

But you'll likely get your wish next season as both Budda and Humphries will gave no guaranteed salary and negligible prorated bonus on their deals.

I don’t know their cap situation but who cares about dead cap space this year(if they have room), it’s a dead team.

 

[MadCardDisease]

I like Humphries but they are tearing it down. Do we really need DJ blocking for Josh Dobbs? The Jets are desperate for a LT. Trade him and let Paris start his career path at LT.

For the new staff to evaluate Kyler when he is activated they need at least a reasonable OL to block for him.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Monti’s favorite movie:

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[pemory09]

Oh boy, even more good news about us:

NFL Agent Says Client Was Told by Cardinals Player Not to Sign Contract with Arizona — Bleacher Report

With a new ownership regime improving the general perception of the Washington Commanders, a new contender might be claiming the title of the most…

apple.news

We’re number 1, we’re number1!

 

[Stout]

Yes we have. THE DRAFT. You acquire the majority of your core building blocks in the draft and supplement those players using free agency and the trades. Not the other way around.

Great! It sure would've been nice if we had done that.

 

[Stout]

At least one more successful draft, probably two. That can be accelerated if the Cards spend nearly all of their rolled over cap space on new players next offseason.

No, ginormous FA splurges have proven time and again to be a bad idea. Which is why decent FA spends in multiple seasons is a good idea--or would've been. Now that ship has sailed.

 

[Stout]

I am definitely not against rebuilds in general. I am just not a huge fan of how this one has gone so far.

Our top 3 offensive weapons this year will likely be Conner, Ertz and Hollywood, which doesn't help the team much in the present or the future unless they plan on re-signing Hollywood. We still have Gardeck starting over Cam Thomas. Thomas made some mistakes last game, but he has infinitely more upside than Gardeck. If this was a true rebuild, why not let Cam learn on the job? What is the harm?

I also don't believe in blowing off a whole year to evaluate a roster. I really can't think of another team that has done this.

And what about Gannon? Is he really going to keep going along with the tank when the media starts ripping him apart for having an awful team? It would be very tough for a first-time coach.

My big fear is that Monti is taking this "smartest guy in the room" act way too far. After breaking up the dynasty Bulls, Jerry Krause famously said, "Players and coaches don't win championships; organizations win championships." The Bulls haven't been to the Finals since. These days, dealing with stars and their egos is essential, and I am not sure Monti is up for the task.

This. All of this.