Quarterback Alternatives

[Pariah]

Our QB situation is likely to be different next year, even if it's something as simple as an open competetion between Blake and McCown.

Here are some possiblities. I'd like to hear your thoughts on them.

A. <B>Draft the Future:</B> Eli or Roethlisberger. This scenario is sort of self-explanitory, except that the organization needs to do more than just draft one of these kids. They need to put together a coaching staff that will help them to succeed.

B. <B>Nab a Vet:</B> There should be some enticing signal callers available in the offseason either through free agency or trade possibilities. Tim Couch, Jeff Garcia, Kurt Warner, Mark Brunell, maybe AJ Feeley or even Aaron Brooks (I read somewhere that the Saints were high on Eli). My take? If it's a relatively young guy like Couch or Feeley, maybe we pull the trigger and focus on any number of other needs in the draft.

C. <B>Go With Watcha Got:</B> Maybe McCown surprises everone at the end of this season and shows he <I>might</I> be a guy who can carry the team for years to come. Maybe he just shows glimpses, but fosters enough faith that with another year of tutelage of Blake and the yet to be named coaching staff.

These are the options as I see them. QB is only one (albiet a very important one) aspect of the game in which we need drastic improvement. Before you flip out over B or C, think how great it would be to have a WR corps of Boldin, Roy Williams or Fitzgerald, and an improved Johnson...or the top edge pass-rusher on defense, or a shut down corner....

 

[AZCB34]

Originally posted by Pariah
Our QB situation is likely to be different next year, even if it's something as simple as an open competetion between Blake and McCown.

Here are some possiblities. I'd like to hear your thoughts on them.

A. <B>Draft the Future:</B> Eli or Roethlisberger. This scenario is sort of self-explanitory, except that the organization needs to do more than just draft one of these kids. They need to put together a coaching staff that will help them to succeed.

B. <B>Nab a Vet:</B> There should be some enticing signal callers available in the offseason either through free agency or trade possibilities. Tim Couch, Jeff Garcia, Kurt Warner, Mark Brunell, maybe AJ Feeley or even Aaron Brooks (I read somewhere that the Saints were high on Eli). My take? If it's a relatively young guy like Couch or Feeley, maybe we pull the trigger and focus on any number of other needs in the draft.

C. <B>Go With Watcha Got:</B> Maybe McCown surprises everone at the end of this season and shows he <I>might</I> be a guy who can carry the team for years to come. Maybe he just shows glimpses, but fosters enough faith that with another year of tutelage of Blake and the yet to be named coaching staff.

These are the options as I see them. QB is only one (albiet a very important one) aspect of the game in which we need drastic improvement. Before you flip out over B or C, think how great it would be to have a WR corps of Boldin, Roy Williams or Fitzgerald, and an improved Johnson...or the top edge pass-rusher on defense, or a shut down corner....

In reverse order:

C Go with watcha got - whether anyone likes it or not, this is probably the single best outcome. I mean, MAYBE the Cards already have Eli on the roster then just haven't had enough vision to realize it. Then you could continue to fill the massive holes that exist on this team.

B Nab a vet - This is lowest on my list because while Blake has played awful, he just isn't this bad. I think Blake can still help this team and with another year of WR development plus maybe drafting or signing another WR, we could see he play like I thought he could.

A Draft the Future - this is the most unknown choice since there are never any guarantees. I posted last night that maybe the Manning family is finally due for a bust as an NFL player. When I typed it, I didn't really wholeheartedly believe it BUT the Cards have yet to have shown they can develop picks...and even with a new staff, there are no gyarantees even they will be able to. While I admit this path makes the greatest sense, can you imagine what happens if either guy is drafted and doesn't pan out?

 

[conraddobler]

I'd as soon pickup Couch as I would draft a QB.

He looked good on MNF to me until he fumbled on the last drive. The Browns have no running game unless they are playing us.

I don't dislike Eli but it isn't the only option and if his defense stinks so will he the defense has to be fixed and we might need a first round draft pick to help out there so we could move down and gain a high pick so that would be an option I would go for.

 

[Pariah]

Yeah, and for the record, if we could land Couch I'd happily draft a different position next year. CB or WR would be my preference.

If we can't get Couch, I want Ben R.

 

[KingLouieLouie]

I would definitely draft a QB (probably not in the 1st round because to my that is a major risk)....I did bring up Michigan State's Jeff Smoker before (true he did have a substance abuse problem, but has sought treatment and has remained completely sober) or John Navarre from University of Michigan (majority of the QBs drafted out of Michigan have put up better stats in the NFL during their time in college because they seem to always emphasize the running game).....

They would be drafted in the 3rd-5th round and would come cheaper..... Every year there will always be that "can't miss, franchise QB" available and why just draft Eli or Ben for the sake of it....If the Cardinals draft either one, they'd probably sign a $35 mil for 4-yrs (plus signing bonus and other incentives)...... If they fail, you'd have to contend with them during that span and not have anyone of worth come in and unseat them.....


Then they must bring in someone who has had a proven track record with younger QBs as either an Offensive Coordinator or
QB coach....

Perhaps it is best to release Blake, but don't know if the Cardinals would be willing to take such a cap hit..... We must realize that the OL didnt completely jell together all year since they were decimated throughout most of the season with injuries and also Garcia's suspension at the start of the season didnt help matters any... Also, with only 2 healthy WR's, did Blake have a 'legit chance of proving his worth? That's' what I question, so the jury is still out on him...... But probably Blake (or any other veteran QB) could serve as a mentor to whichever QB they draft...

Parsons and McCown will remain on the team as 3rd and 4th stringers (probably Parsons on the practice squad)....I will definitely echo what others have suggested, that both must be sent to the World League for some seasoning.....

So, I guess my answer is all three of those categories combined...

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by KingLouieLouie
I would definitely draft a QB (probably not in the 1st round because to my that is a major risk)....I did bring up Michigan State's Jeff Smoker before (true he did have a substance abuse problem, but has sought treatment and has remained completely sober) or John Navarre from University of Michigan (majority of the QBs drafted out of Michigan have put up better stats in the NFL during their time in college because they seem to always emphasize the running game).....

They would be drafted in the 3rd-5th round and would come cheaper..... Every year there will always be that "can't miss, franchise QB" available and why just draft Eli or Ben for the sake of it....If the Cardinals draft either one, they'd probably sign a $35 mil for 4-yrs (plus signing bonus and other incentives)...... If they fail, you'd have to contend with them during that span and not have anyone of worth come in and unseat them.....


Then they must bring in someone who has had a proven track record with younger QBs as either an Offensive Coordinator or
QB coach....

Perhaps it is best to release Blake, but don't know if the Cardinals would be willing to take such a cap hit..... We must realize that the OL didnt completely jell together all year since they were decimated throughout most of the season with injuries and also Garcia's suspension at the start of the season didnt help matters any... Also, with only 2 healthy WR's, did Blake have a 'legit chance of proving his worth? That's' what I question, so the jury is still out on him...... But probably Blake (or any other veteran QB) could serve as a mentor to whichever QB they draft...

Parsons and McCown will remain on the team as 3rd and 4th stringers (probably Parsons on the practice squad)....I will definitely echo what others have suggested, that both must be sent to the World League for some seasoning.....

So, I guess my answer is all three of those categories combined...

*psst* Philip Rivers is better than Navarre and Smoker...

 

[KingLouieLouie]

Originally posted by Krangthebrain
*psst* Philip Rivers is better than Navarre and Smoker...

Rivers will probably slip into the lower part of the 1st round...

I'll pose this question again, how do we know that Manning wont be the next Dan McGwire, Ryan Leaf, Andre Ware...etc? What distiniguishes him or Roethlisberger as the next "sure thing"?

I bet there are several better QBs coming out of college over the next couple of years, so why sacrifice a 4-yr $35 mil contract just for the sake of it over someone who is totally unproven? Wise to go lower rounds and draft a QB that might be just as good or better than Eli or Ben for just the minimal contract..... It's name recognition folks that has soo many obsessed with Eli.....

 

[vince56]

Originally posted by KingLouieLouie
All are gone, all but one.
No contest, nowhere to run.
No more left, only one.
This is it, this is the countdown to extinction.

 

[mdamien13]

Why has Losman's name dropped off the face of the earth? That kid is going to be a stud at the QB spot and could be had in the middle-to-late first round.

 

[ajcardfan]

Originally posted by mdamien13
Why has Losman's name dropped off the face of the earth? That kid is going to be a stud at the QB spot and could be had in the middle-to-late first round.

I agree. Watch, after the All Star games and workouts, he'll shoot back up the boards Manning and Roethlisberger. If Ben R. even comes out. If he doesn't, Losman will be the clear #2.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by KingLouieLouie
Rivers will probably slip into the lower part of the 1st round...

I'll pose this question again, how do we know that Manning wont be the next Dan McGwire, Ryan Leaf, Andre Ware...etc? What distiniguishes him or Roethlisberger as the next "sure thing"?

I bet there are several better QBs coming out of college over the next couple of years, so why sacrifice a 4-yr $35 mil contract just for the sake of it over someone who is totally unproven? Wise to go lower rounds and draft a QB that might be just as good or better than Eli or Ben for just the minimal contract..... It's name recognition folks that has soo many obsessed with Eli.....

See, I'm a big advocate of drafting Manning. If he is gone, I say draft the best available athlete. Ben just doesn't do it for me (pending workouts), he just looks incredibly slow.

I'm not so sure that Rivers will even go in round 1. He is the type of player that probably won't workout very well, but when you pop in a tape of him against FSU or Ohio State, you see why he has good potential at this level.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by mdamien13
Why has Losman's name dropped off the face of the earth? That kid is going to be a stud at the QB spot and could be had in the middle-to-late first round.

I haven't seen Losman play, so I won't try to pimp him.

Could you give me a synopsis of his game? What are his strengths?

 

[mdamien13]

Originally posted by Krangthebrain
I haven't seen Losman play, so I won't try to pimp him.

Could you give me a synopsis of his game? What are his strengths?

You best not be pimpin' my ho's, sucka!

Losman is a great leader on a piss-poor Tulane team. His fundamentals are sound, he shows good vision of the field, and he can anticipate the blitzes well. His arm strength is good but not great, although he has great touch on his short passes. The thing I like the best about him is that he checks off his receivers and shows excellent leadership qualities. I predict he'll be a good quarterback for years in the league.

 

[Duckjake]

Get Couch and sit and wait for Vincent Young to finish his eligibility.

 

[KingLouieLouie]

Originally posted by Krangthebrain
See, I'm a big advocate of drafting Manning. If he is gone, I say draft the best available athlete. Ben just doesn't do it for me (pending workouts), he just looks incredibly slow.

I'm not so sure that Rivers will even go in round 1. He is the type of player that probably won't workout very well, but when you pop in a tape of him against FSU or Ohio State, you see why he has good potential at this level.

I'm just trying to figure out why Manning is the "big deal"? Most "experts" thought that a Ryan Leaf, Akili Smith, or Heath Shuler were the "sure thing" who we all know became major "flops".....I just am concerned the same will easily apply to Manning and everyone would have to contend with that for 4-yrs....

I was thinking of creating a thread that would have some pre-draft analysis any of the aforementioned "flops" (or other ones) and ask everyone which QB in particular was being evaluated.....

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Originally posted by KingLouieLouie


We must realize that the OL didnt completely jell together all year since they were decimated throughout most of the season with injuries combined...

what are you talking about? this is the healthiest this oline has ever been for a full season. other teams experience the same amount of injuries on their olines. we've had bad luck with oline injuries in the past, this year was not one of them.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by KingLouieLouie
I'm just trying to figure out why Manning is the "big deal"? Most "experts" thought that a Ryan Leaf, Akili Smith, or Heath Shuler were the "sure thing" who we all know became major "flops".....I just am concerned the same will easily apply to Manning and everyone would have to contend with that for 4-yrs....

I was thinking of creating a thread that would have some pre-draft analysis any of the aforementioned "flops" (or other ones) and ask everyone which QB in particular was being evaluated.....

I know that in the case of Akili Smith and Ryan Leaf, they weren't considered "sure thing"s. Both had the knock that they didn't start their entire careers. Akili was considered raw, Leaf was a statue with character concerns.

I didn't follow Shuler much but from I remember, he was a "systems" Qb.

Manning is much more of a sure thing. He started his entire career at a school that faces top competion. He has decent mobility, a pretty good arm, a good head on his shoulders, and is a great character guy.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by Ouchie-Z-Clown
what are you talking about? this is the healthiest this oline has ever been for a full season. other teams experience the same amount of injuries on their olines. we've had bad luck with oline injuries in the past, this year was not one of them.

Well we did play without Big for awhile, and he still isn't totally healthy even today (high ankle sprain).

But we are healthier than we've been, but we haven't been able to alleviate the pressure put on the oline since Blake and the receivers can't beat the blitz.

 

[ajcardfan]

Originally posted by Krangthebrain

But we are healthier than we've been, but we haven't been able to alleviate the pressure put on the oline since Blake and the receivers can't beat the blitz.

IMO, we've had more blitzers come in unchecked this season than I can ever remember. The only thing I think comes close to it was the mid 90's when Krieg and then Plummer got sacked 500+ times in one season. This is why we've seen so many balls thrown to the hot routes this year.

 

[Pariah]

Originally posted by Krangthebrain
Ben just doesn't do it for me (pending workouts), he just looks incredibly slow.

Dan Marino slow, or Drew Bledsoe slow?

 

[Pariah]

BTW, I now have a new favorite possible course of action: try to trade our first pick to Cleveland for their first pick (currently #7) and Couch. Then draft the best available WR (Fitzgerald or R. Williams--whomever is still there). Take a CB in the 2nd and hope we can bring in one of the FA CBs available (there are a lot of really good ones).

The only really glaring hole left: DE. That position also needs to be filled in the FA market; it's been proven over time that the Cards cannot count on the draft for an edge pass rusher.

So, we'd look like this on O:

QB: Couch
RB: Shipp
WR: Boildin
WR: Fitzgerald/Williams
WR: Johnson

And our secondary would look like this:

CB: FA (McAllister/Bailey/Winfield etc...)
CB: Starks
CB: Rookie (top of the 2nd rd pick)
S: Jackson
S: Wilson

 

[CaptTurbo]

Originally posted by Pariah
BTW, I now have a new favorite possible course of action: try to trade our first pick to Cleveland for their first pick (currently #7) and Couch. Then draft the best available WR (Fitzgerald or R. Williams--whomever is still there). Take a CB in the 2nd and hope we can bring in one of the FA CBs available (there are a lot of really good ones).

The only really glaring hole left: DE. That position also needs to be filled in the FA market; it's been proven over time that the Cards cannot count on the draft for an edge pass rusher.

So, we'd look like this on O:

QB: Couch
RB: Shipp
WR: Boildin
WR: Fitzgerald/Williams
WR: Johnson

And our secondary would look like this:

CB: FA (McAllister/Bailey/Winfield etc...)
CB: Starks
CB: Rookie (top-10 pick)
S: Jackson
S: Wilson

I really like this. Not a big couch fan, but I like it.

 

[Pariah]

Originally posted by Pariah


CB: Rookie (top-10 pick)

I meant to say "top of the 2nd rd. pick."

 

[earthsci]

Originally posted by Pariah
BTW, I now have a new favorite possible course of action: try to trade our first pick to Cleveland for their first pick (currently #7) and Couch. Then draft the best available WR (Fitzgerald or R. Williams--whomever is still there). Take a CB in the 2nd and hope we can bring in one of the FA CBs available (there are a lot of really good ones).

The only really glaring hole left: DE. That position also needs to be filled in the FA market; it's been proven over time that the Cards cannot count on the draft for an edge pass rusher.

So, we'd look like this on O:

QB: Couch
RB: Shipp
WR: Boildin
WR: Fitzgerald/Williams
WR: Johnson

And our secondary would look like this:

CB: FA (McAllister/Bailey/Winfield etc...)
CB: Starks
CB: Rookie (top of the 2nd rd pick)
S: Jackson
S: Wilson

Hmmmmmmm

 

[Duckjake]

The only really glaring hole left: DE. That position also needs to be filled in the FA market;

And which DE would that be? The one currently occupied by up and coming Dennis Johnson or the position currently held by this year's FIRST round draft pick Calvin Pace?