reassessing Booker

[Cheesebeef]

Booker's numbers are propped up by having a big game last year, but he's his record in elimination games -

2021 - 46 Min, 8/22 FG, 0/7 3Pt, 3/3 FT, 3 Reb, 5 Ast, 19 Pts (Suns lose 105-98)
2022 - 37 Min, 3/14 FG, 0/4 3Pt, 5/6 FT, 3 Reb, 2 Ast, 11 Pts (Suns lose 123-90)
2023 - 36 MIn, 4/13 FG, 1/3 3Pt, 3/4 FT, 1 Reb, 8 Ast, 12 Pts (Suns lose 125-107)
2024 - 45 Min, 13/21 FG, 2/5 3Pt, 20/21 FT, 5 Reb, 6 Ast. 49 Pts (Suns lose 122-116)

Averages - 41.0 Min, .400 FG%, .157 3Pt%, .912 FT%, 3.0 Reb, 5.3 Ast, 22.8 Pts

Meanwhile, Booker no showed in the first 3 games of the Wolves series where we went down 0-3.

 

[Bobster]

Meanwhile, Booker no showed in the first 3 games of the Wolves series where we went down 0-3.

First three games 40.3 Min, .431 FG%, .333 3Pt%, .950 FT%, 2.7 Reb, 6.0 Ast, 20.3 Pts

Not terrible, not great.

Of course Anthony Edwards was going crazy against him that series - 31.0 Pts, 8.0 Reb, 6.3 ast

 

[82CardsGrad]

Where Booker totally crapped the bed in Game 6, helping the team choke it’s way from up 2-0 to a backdoor sweep.

He’s also been the co-leader of the two most humiliating Suns home playoff losses to end seasons ever, completely no showing in those vomitous 30 point laughers in back to back years… before co-authoring last year’s pathetic 0-4 sweep, where he only showed up in the entire series for the first 3 quarters of Game 4 and then disappeared as usual in the playoff clutch in the 4th where he got owned by Ant.

Here’s the cold, hard truth. The Finals trip was a fluky, Covid run where we STILL choked away a 2-0 lead AND is the exception to the rule for the rest of Booker’s entire career. Outside of 2021, he’s either been the empty stats leader of a perennial lotto dormat or someone who leads his team to craptacular playoff drubbings in the first or second round.

Harsh… but completely accurate. It sucks because Book is such a good guy. I wish he had more ability to actually be a leader throughout the season and particularly come playoff time.
But he’s simply not “that guy.”

Worse, I am now officially wondering if he will ever win a championship… I mean, I guess anything can happen and if (HUGE IF) he’s on a team that has been absolutely perfectly constructed, I guess he’d have a shot. But short of those stars aligning, I am really questioning if he will ever reach the pinnacle of the mountain…

 

[Bobster]

Harsh… but completely accurate. It sucks because Book is such a good guy. I wish he had more ability to actually be a leader throughout the season and particularly come playoff time.
But he’s simply not “that guy.”

Worse, I am now officially wondering if he will ever win a championship… I mean, I guess anything can happen and if (HUGE IF) he’s on a team that has been absolutely perfectly constructed, I guess he’d have a shot. But short of those stars aligning, I am really questioning if he will ever reach the pinnacle of the mountain…

Paying the super max to a player who can't put the team on his back and carry the load puts you at a real disadvantage. Booker and Beal are paid to be that type of player, and yet, they aren't. Whether Durant is is up to debate.

 

[dscher]

He is what everyone who isn't a Suns fan thinks he is...

An above average player on horrible teams for many years while he got his shine. Just like Beal was for Washington.

 

[Dan H]

Dominique Wilkins 2.0.

 

[Bobster]

Dominique Wilkins 2.0.

Pete Maravich, Adrian Dantley, Alex English, George Gervin, Kiki Vandeweghe, Carmelo Anthony, Walt Bellamy, etc., etc.

There have been a lot of players who never came close to a championship but put up gaudy numbers.

 

[1tinsoldier]

Booker's numbers are propped up by having a big game last year, but he's his record in elimination games -

Averages - 41.0 Min, .400 FG%, .157 3Pt%, .912 FT%, 3.0 Reb, 5.3 Ast, 22.8 Pts

the evidence is clear:
*we went from the best clutch NBA team to the worst after CP3
*Booker is shooting around 10% in the final 2 minutes of close games this season
and
*he shot 16% from 3 in our 4 playoff elimination games

his shot selection is not great to begin with, and it gets worse under pressure

3 games ago, at the 6 minute mark in the first quarter, he had the ball at the top of the key, faked a pass to Durant who was wide open beyond the 3pt line and he drove the ball into defenders for a failed drive

that (and watching him for 10 years) tells me he hasn't got the smarts to make the best play in the moment.
he's a scorer, not a winner

sure, when he's double team (non-crunch time), he can find the open man
if he's not doubled, he can give us 25 points or more
but team success depends on who can step it up both mentally and physically at the end of games
he tries, but he can't
and, for some reason, he's still playing pg in crunch time despite us acquiring a competent one

i'd pay him well, but not the supermax, and not even the max
as is, his Suns career will end like Clay Thompson's Warriors career
with him going somewhere else to get paid what he no longer deserves

 

[Cheesebeef]

Pete Maravich, Adrian Dantley, Alex English, George Gervin, Kiki Vandeweghe, Carmelo Anthony, Walt Bellamy, etc., etc.

There have been a lot of players who never came close to a championship but put up gaudy numbers.

Yeah… that is pretty much the group Booker belongs in. Can throw Dominique into that group as well.

 

[Yuma]

Still, Chuck never won a championship.

He did win a golf challenge. If you ever saw him golf, that's even more amazing! LOL! They were joking on TNT he could finally be called Champ.

 

[Hoop Head]

Season high of 5 straight games scoring 30+ which makes him the second guy to do that this year, SGA being the other.

 

[Yuma]

Season high of 5 straight games scoring 30+ which makes him the second guy to do that this year, SGA being the other.

He now has the chance to be the only guy to get 6 in a row this season.

 

[hcsilla]

First three games 40.3 Min, .431 FG%, .333 3Pt%, .950 FT%, 2.7 Reb, 6.0 Ast, 20.3 Pts

Not terrible, not great.

Is is much closer to terrible than great.

 

[Yuma]

Booker 209 points from tying Walter Davis for franchise scoring leader.

 

[FB94]

IDK, we no longer have any sort of toughness or attitude since Crowder and Paul left. Even Booker had more of an edge back then. Now it’s all good vibes since KD arrived. I just want to see some fire out of anyone. Just disappointed in Booker for not taking the lead, even KD said it was his team.

 

[Yuma]

IDK, we no longer have any sort of toughness or attitude since Crowder and Paul left. Even Booker had more of an edge back then. Now it’s all good vibes since KD arrived. I just want to see some fire out of anyone. Just disappointed in Booker for not taking the lead, even KD said it was his team.

Today Richards threw a guy down he was beefing with in the game. He looked at him and made sure the guy knew he wasn't helping him up. Edge already.

 

[1tinsoldier]

I just want to see some fire out of anyone. Just disappointed in Booker for not taking the lead, even KD said it was his team.

a couple of days ago, Book was asked about the lack of team intensity and his answer was, we have to, "just do it." Leading is just not who he is. On local radio they were also saying Booker has to lead this team, as if he can just turn it on after 10 years in the league.

your teammates have to respect your decision making. Suns players respected KJ, Barkley, Nash, Kidd, and CP3 because of their basketball IQ and mental toughness. Booker substitutes "desire" for those things. He wants to catch up when we're behind, he wants to crush his opponents when they make him mad, and he wants to make the game winners.

but the best he can do, is give you offensive production over the course of a game. And that's fine for a reasonable salary that allows a team to pay others more. As is, his skill set doesn't make him or us a winner. It came closest when he played with one of the NBA's greatest point guards. But it's not working with one of the NBA's best all around players. So why should anyone imagine we could build around him -- again?

 

[Phrazbit]

a couple of days ago, Book was asked about the lack of team intensity and his answer was, we have to, "just do it." Leading is just not who he is. On local radio they were also saying Booker has to lead this team, as if he can just turn it on after 10 years in the league.

your teammates have to respect your decision making. Suns players respected KJ, Barkley, Nash, Kidd, and CP3 because of their basketball IQ and mental toughness. Booker substitutes "desire" for those things. He wants to catch up when we're behind, he wants to crush his opponents when they make him mad, and he wants to make the game winners.

but the best he can do, is give you offensive production over the course of a game. And that's fine for a reasonable salary that allows a team to pay others more. As is, his skill set doesn't make him or us a winner. It came closest when he played with one of the NBA's greatest point guards. But it's not working with one of the NBA's best all around players. So why should anyone imagine we could build around him -- again?

They can say it's "Booker's team" but Durant is the guy all these dudes have looked up to for years and he has always played a dispassionate, detached brand of basketball, it has caused problems everywhere he has played, even in Golden State where he rubbed guys the wrong way.

 

[1tinsoldier]

They can say it's "Booker's team" but Durant is the guy all these dudes have looked up to for years and he has always played a dispassionate, detached brand of basketball, it has caused problems everywhere he has played, even in Golden State where he rubbed guys the wrong way.

true. KD has the cred and respect, is cool under pressure and gets better on offense and defense in crunch time, but he doesn't show passion. And it doesn't help that both KD and Booker take turns playing 1 on 1 in crunch time, instead of sticking with team ball. But last week we did win in the last 2 minutes when they both assisted on 3 baskets from teammates.

it makes a lot of sense for Beal to come off the bench and we now have an agile center to take advantage of the attention KD and Book get. The rookies are adding a little excitement. Things should improve.

 

[Yuma]

true. KD has the cred and respect, is cool under pressure and gets better on offense and defense in crunch time, but he doesn't show passion. And it doesn't help that both KD and Booker take turns playing 1 on 1 in crunch time, instead of sticking with team ball. But last week we did win in the last 2 minutes when they both assisted on 3 baskets from teammates.

it makes a lot of sense for Beal to come off the bench and we now have an agile center to take advantage of the attention KD and Book get. The rookies are adding a little excitement. Things should improve.

An example was that basket late that KD hit Richards down low for a dunk. It helps when you have guys you pass to that make the basket. How many times have we seen Nurkic eff up an opportunity like that?

 

[1tinsoldier]

An example was that basket late that KD hit Richards down low for a dunk. It helps when you have guys you pass to that make the basket. How many times have we seen Nurkic eff up an opportunity like that?

absolutely. Richards should thrive on this team. But i think Nurkic is more useful than Plum. The swelling of criticism and trade talk really got into his head -- as well as Draymond, and that's what got him suspended. Again, leadership from the coach, Durant and/or Booker could have smoothed those things out and we'd still have a decent and willing backup center.

 

[Yuma]

absolutely. Richards should thrive on this team. But i think Nurkic is more useful than Plum. The swelling of criticism and trade talk really got into his head -- as well as Draymond, and that's what got him suspended. Again, leadership from the coach, Durant and/or Booker could have smoothed those things out and we'd still have a decent and willing backup center.

I agree. I think Nurkic against second level centers will be OK.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I agree. I think Nurkic against second level centers will be OK.

This is a potential domino effect. If he can accept his role, he should have a physical advantage over many (not all) backup centers. Then we go from:

Terrible mismatch with starting center
Equal-to-subpar match with backup centers

To

Not as terrible a mismatch (but still mismatch) at starting center
Equal to advantage mismatch at backup center

Those should combine to still be subpar at center, but overall a net improvement for the team.

 

[Yuma]

This is a potential domino effect. If he can accept his role, he should have a physical advantage over many (not all) backup centers. Then we go from:

Terrible mismatch with starting center
Equal-to-subpar match with backup centers

To

Not as terrible a mismatch (but still mismatch) at starting center
Equal to advantage mismatch at backup center

Those should combine to still be subpar at center, but overall a net improvement for the team.

Totally agree. We see saw this on the Dbacks last year when they had two pitchers go down for awhile. Suddenly the number three starter moves to second position. Not bad right? But now the normal fourth guy is pitching more and seeing tougher teams. The fifth guy might come from the bull pen and throw their alignment out of wack. This is just one starter. The Dbacks had two starters out for a long time. Their team ERA went down to 28th team, when the year before they were better. Fortunately for them some of the guys they moved around blossomed against the more difficult assignments. But when we got those starters back, everyone fit into their slots, and our bullpen which was a wreck became average, which was a HUGE jump.

Plus in your scenario, our bench has been an indicator of wins/losses this year. You can see nights no one scores on the bench we get hammered. Nights the bench throws in 40 points we are at least eking out wins. Moving Beal and Nurkic to the bench will bolster our bench scoring, and it also moves some of those bench parts more in alignment.