Robin Lopez will never be good

lou_skywalker

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Bill Cartwright said before that rookie big men "need some time" well,
YOU BETTER HURRY UP ROBIN, GET GOOD BEFORE U RETIRE......
 

CardsFan88

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He'll be alright.

He won't be Shaq, but who thought he would be?

He'll be a starting center in today's (well tomorrow's) NBA. Sad, but true.

That's not saying he's great, it's saying the NBA center position isn't manned by as much quality as it used to be.

He is 21, and a lot of his errors are rookie mistakes.

A 15 and 10 guy when all is said and done.

Imo if you're not a superstar from day 1 (Lebron, Shaq, etc), then generally it takes you three years or so to develop into what you will be as a player for the most part. Ofc that player will gain veteran savvy in subsequent years, but overall you need to wait until year 3.

Again given the fact he just turned 21, to me means he has a lot of room to grow 'headwise' about the NBA. When he gets that, I suspect he'll be a 15 and 10, maybe a 12 and 8. Not great, but it is what we should expect from where we picked him.

I really don't see how he doesn't improve next year in a big way.

All the hate on lopez lol, I guess frustrations need to be placed somewhere, and to each their own.
 

elindholm

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It's virtually inconceivable that Lopez could ever be a 15 and 10 guy. I'd be surprised if he amasses those totals in a single game more than half a dozen times in his career.
 

CardsFan88

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Definitely a chance that's true. But imo he has a good shot of being around a 15 and 10 guy, again maybe a 12 and 8 guy. Either of those imo, are worthy of his selection.

He makes a lot of rookie mistakes. I feel most are seeing his rookie mistakes as a limitation of his talent, whereas I see them as rookie mistakes correctable in subsequent years through coaching, practice, and experience.

His shot selection should improve to the point where he's not throwing up a wild air ball from some funky move. It is frustrating to see that, but I won't use that as basis that he sucks and I won't set things in stone by saying, he'll never learn to make better decisions with his shot selection.

We've also not had a lot of rookies on our teams the past few years, so I believe even if it's just a small bit, we are pitting Lopez unfairly up against the 'lens' of what we normally see from our veteran team. Any rookie to our eyes when viewed within our veteran team will probably be much more apparent (to look like a rookie, and bigger gap) than if say we saw him and compared him to a team with a bunch of young players. So when analyzing him, I feel he'll get lower marks from us just because of that.

Try to remember back at all the horrible shots that Amare had his first year or two here.

Lopez will do better when he understands his role better. When he understands his limitations, and instinctively realizes and knows the talent of players around him. When he realizes things like, pass the ball instead of throwing up a wild air ball, etc.

Plus it seems everyone hates how he bends his knees making him a 6 foot 3 player or so. Well it's conceivable he switches his approach as he matures.

I'm not saying he'll be special, I just feel we are judging him a bit harshly at this point. Maybe his basketball acumen will never be up to par, and the judgments of him are spot on. But for a 21 year old 0 month player, just finishing his rookie season, after always playing 2nd fiddle to his brother, and as a center (generally not the most athletic players in basketball) he is making the mistakes most players his age would.

I do see some improvement. He's thinking quicker. He's making whatever decision he makes much faster imo then he was at the beginning of the season. Like when he gets a rebound or receives a pass down low.

The talent some of us saw last summer is still there. He's still quick for a center, and a good fit going forward for our up-tempo system. All those things won't make him a good NBA player, but it gives him a shot. Again at 21, like most 21 year olds, he's still basically a child mentally. He hasn't been to the puppet show and seen the strings yet. When he has, like most decent NBA players, he'll start to use his strengths in conjunction to what is going on in the NBA game and use them to try to dictate the outcome of it. He's on the right team for his strengths imo, but that too doesn't mean he'll end up being good. But to cast him off now, is like believing the market is back.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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It's virtually inconceivable that Lopez could ever be a 15 and 10 guy. I'd be surprised if he amasses those totals in a single game more than half a dozen times in his career.

agreed. and i reiterate 100% of what i said in my "i hate robin lopez" thread.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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Definitely a chance that's true. But imo he has a good shot of being around a 15 and 10 guy, again maybe a 12 and 8 guy. Either of those imo, are worthy of his selection.

He makes a lot of rookie mistakes. I feel most are seeing his rookie mistakes as a limitation of his talent, whereas I see them as rookie mistakes correctable in subsequent years through coaching, practice, and experience.

His shot selection should improve to the point where he's not throwing up a wild air ball from some funky move. It is frustrating to see that, but I won't use that as basis that he sucks and I won't set things in stone by saying, he'll never learn to make better decisions with his shot selection.

We've also not had a lot of rookies on our teams the past few years, so I believe even if it's just a small bit, we are pitting Lopez unfairly up against the 'lens' of what we normally see from our veteran team. Any rookie to our eyes when viewed within our veteran team will probably be much more apparent (to look like a rookie, and bigger gap) than if say we saw him and compared him to a team with a bunch of young players. So when analyzing him, I feel he'll get lower marks from us just because of that.

Try to remember back at all the horrible shots that Amare had his first year or two here.

Lopez will do better when he understands his role better. When he understands his limitations, and instinctively realizes and knows the talent of players around him. When he realizes things like, pass the ball instead of throwing up a wild air ball, etc.

Plus it seems everyone hates how he bends his knees making him a 6 foot 3 player or so. Well it's conceivable he switches his approach as he matures.

I'm not saying he'll be special, I just feel we are judging him a bit harshly at this point. Maybe his basketball acumen will never be up to par, and the judgments of him are spot on. But for a 21 year old 0 month player, just finishing his rookie season, after always playing 2nd fiddle to his brother, and as a center (generally not the most athletic players in basketball) he is making the mistakes most players his age would.

I do see some improvement. He's thinking quicker. He's making whatever decision he makes much faster imo then he was at the beginning of the season. Like when he gets a rebound or receives a pass down low.

The talent some of us saw last summer is still there. He's still quick for a center, and a good fit going forward for our up-tempo system. All those things won't make him a good NBA player, but it gives him a shot. Again at 21, like most 21 year olds, he's still basically a child mentally. He hasn't been to the puppet show and seen the strings yet. When he has, like most decent NBA players, he'll start to use his strengths in conjunction to what is going on in the NBA game and use them to try to dictate the outcome of it. He's on the right team for his strengths imo, but that too doesn't mean he'll end up being good. But to cast him off now, is like believing the market is back.

i'm sorry, you're just absolutely bending over backward trying to make excuses for him.

many of us watched a great deal of his play through college. it's not just rookie mistakes, he stunk then against much inferior and smaller competition and it's carried over.

many of us watch more than just the suns. i've seen more than my share of rookies play in the L throughout my 30 years of being an NBA and college basketball fan. he's not making rookie mistakes, he just doesn't have "it." there's a reason that shaq is calling him out. there's a reason he can't get minutes on a team that desperately needed a big.

15 and 10 is a joke. i'll be shocked if he ever averages 10 and 6 for a season. he was a lousy rebounder in college against smaller guys . . . and now he's gonna average double digits??? lol.

sorry bud. i love your optimism, but i don't think it's based in reality.
 

ASUCHRIS

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i'm sorry, you're just absolutely bending over backward trying to make excuses for him.

many of us watched a great deal of his play through college. it's not just rookie mistakes, he stunk then against much inferior and smaller competition and it's carried over.

many of us watch more than just the suns. i've seen more than my share of rookies play in the L throughout my 30 years of being an NBA and college basketball fan. he's not making rookie mistakes, he just doesn't have "it." there's a reason that shaq is calling him out. there's a reason he can't get minutes on a team that desperately needed a big.

15 and 10 is a joke. i'll be shocked if he ever averages 10 and 6 for a season. he was a lousy rebounder in college against smaller guys . . . and now he's gonna average double digits??? lol.

sorry bud. i love your optimism, but i don't think it's based in reality.

Co-sign. if you watch Pac 10 bball, you knew before he was drafted that he was a bum. I was praying for Speights, who tore up the Suns earlier this year.
 

elindholm

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If you consider the Suns' last "project" center, Tsakalidis, there's really no comparison. Tsakalidis was slow and didn't have much in the way of basketball instincts, but he carried himself like a big man. He often looked lost, but he didn't look afraid to be on the floor. And even during his rookie season, if he got comfortable against soft competition during garbage time, he would occasionally put up a big game. (For that matter, I remember him playing one Shaquille O'Neal to a statistical draw in one game early in his career, with something like 20 points and 10 rebounds.) For Lopez, a "big game" is a couple of blocks and maybe a putback dunk.

As for Lopez being mainly a defensive player, come on, any seven-footer with decent hops is going to block a shot once in a while, especially if he's willing to take himself out of position and risk a foul or layup in order to do it. He's a terrible rebounder because he's a timid weakling -- constantly wearing a "stop the ride, I want to get off" expression -- and offensively he's just about hopeless.
 

Mainstreet

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It's virtually inconceivable that Lopez could ever be a 15 and 10 guy. I'd be surprised if he amasses those totals in a single game more than half a dozen times in his career.

Sadly my comparison to Gadzuric still stands.
 

CardsFan88

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i'm sorry, you're just absolutely bending over backward trying to make excuses for him.

many of us watched a great deal of his play through college. it's not just rookie mistakes, he stunk then against much inferior and smaller competition and it's carried over.

many of us watch more than just the suns. i've seen more than my share of rookies play in the L throughout my 30 years of being an NBA and college basketball fan. he's not making rookie mistakes, he just doesn't have "it." there's a reason that shaq is calling him out. there's a reason he can't get minutes on a team that desperately needed a big.

15 and 10 is a joke. i'll be shocked if he ever averages 10 and 6 for a season. he was a lousy rebounder in college against smaller guys . . . and now he's gonna average double digits??? lol.

sorry bud. i love your optimism, but i don't think it's based in reality.

it's cool, I'm not trying to make excuses for him, just saying I feel the judgments of people might be partially swayed by his inexperience among experienced players and weighting it more than it should be. Everyone seems to be taking the over critical approach with RL.

I sense he has defer-itis and questions what he does, maybe because of his brother..maybe his brother is just an easy way for a personality type to 'take it easy', but it seems like he plays too humble and while his brother is an easy explanation, it may be more than that. Who knows lol. Or I should say this is how I saw he was.

I think that is what shaq is calling him out on. It's not physical, it's mental. At 21 he still can mature.

What becomes of him, I don't know. Tonight I felt was a good night for him. He made quick decisions, and was thinking ahead. Good game by him.

Maybe he never comes out of his shell, I'm just saying let's give him a shot. :)
 
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Sunburn

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Lopez showed me somethin last night against the Kings. Was havin a block party. Still needs to work on his hands tho. I saw a couple passes hit him square in the mitts and he just fumbled it out of bounds.
 

cly2tw

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Sadly my comparison to Gadzuric still stands.

Many here liked Gaduric. But I believe Robin is a smarter player and will learn how to be effective better than the former.

Lopez showed me somethin last night against the Kings. Was havin a block party. Still needs to work on his hands tho. I saw a couple passes hit him square in the mitts and he just fumbled it out of bounds.

His timing of block is quite good. Shaq was fumbling bullet passes by Nash the game before too. His twin doesn't seem to be too bad at that, so there is still hope for Robin to get it.
 

leclerc

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I hope he gets better in the summer. Go to bigman camp and lift weights from now till August. Work on the fundamentals and a few post moves. He's young and I think he's a chance to be decent. I don't know if he's good enough to be our starter any time soon though, but I'm not writing him off in his first year. And get your hair cut man! ;)
 

binkar

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Robin looked pretty good against the Kings. He was timing shots well, not trying to do too much on offense (which for some weird reason I can't understand he does too often), and providing a physical presence in the paint. There are times when Robin looks like he could be an adequate player in this league and very above average shot blocker. At other times Robin makes mistakes that make you wonder if he has ever played basketball before or if he is even learning from his mistakes. He continually leaves his feet to attempt to block a shot when not in a good position to so (or he doesn't need to jump) and is called for the foul EVERY time. Often defensively when he shows himself up top defending the pick and roll he spends way to long up there attempting to guard the ball and lets the "roller" slip behind him for easy buckets when he can't catch up.
Offensively he needs to finish stronger and attempt to dunk the ball more often instead of being so tip happy. He also tends to bring the ball down too low where the defender can swipe at it instead of keeping it safe, high, and secure before attempting a shot/put back.
That said, those things are all correctable. The thing that troubles me is that those are all basic basketball fundamentals that are taught early on and he should be doing them by now. The one struggle I have with Robin is if he truly loves to play basketball. Sometimes I think he would rather be sitting in the corner of a comic book shop, reading his comics, and eating a PB&J then playing basketball.
 

Mainstreet

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Many here liked Gaduric. But I believe Robin is a smarter player and will learn how to be effective better than the former.

I was one of those who liked Gadzuric early on. However, he never seemed to blossom like I thought. Let's hope Lopez is one of those players that gets better every season.
 

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