Rumor? The Cardinals and CB Patrick Peterson are parting ways

[dreamcastrocks]

I’m not looking to jettison CJ, but it’s fair to ask the question of a guy coming off injury, after a poor quarter of a season, who is on the wrong side of the preferred age equation.

I think it is a fair question, especially with Keim's history of giving big contracts to injured players... (Tyrann/DJ)

I for one do not think Jones is washed up.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Because I’m in the mood for stirring the pot - Here’s my fire take for you all to chew on:

Those of you who are giving praise for other pass rushers getting sacks in Jones’s absence are also indirectly giving praise to Vance Joseph for putting them in position to do so. I mean, who had on their 2020 Cardinals Bingo Card Reddick having 12 sacks and Gardeck having the highest sack rate on the team?

But the Cardinals routinely lead the league in designed blitzes.

Remember that Cover 0 blitz against the Niners in 2019 that the Niners scored a TD on and Jones dropped in coverage? Horrible.

 

[Solar7]

How are we in win now mode without a winning season in 5 years? At the very best this roster is in "scrape into the playoffs and get beat in the wildcard" mode and looking at our schedule even that might be tough.

We as fans may not be, but Keim and Kliff definitely are in win now mode, or lose their jobs. There's no way Keim is going to trade away CJ for assets that are only going to help the next guy, unless he gets immediate return in the form of a superstar CB or something.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

For those wanting to jettison Chandler, how’d that work out with Calais Campbell? He’s only been a pro bowler every year since he left the Cards.
What did the Cards do with that cap space you so severely crave?
Cap space is really irrelevant. It can be manipulated so many ways, it not an issue.

It’s only be comes an issue when guys under perform and trams are wanting to get rid of a player. Are cap hits keeping teams from pursuing Wentz, Watson or Stafford?

 

[TJ]

For those wanting to jettison Chandler, how’d that work out with Calais Campbell?

Yep.

 

[Cheesebeef]

For those wanting to jettison Chandler, how’d that work out with Calais Campbell? He’s only been a pro bowler every year since he left the Cards.
What did the Cards do with that cap space you so severely crave?
Cap space is really irrelevant. It can be manipulated so many ways, it not an issue.

It’s only be comes an issue when guys under perform and trams are wanting to get rid of a player. Are cap hits keeping teams from pursuing Wentz, Watson or Stafford?

yeah, I'm curious to to see a list of the best pass rushers/defensive linemnen in the league the last couple decades and see when their play usually starts to decline. I feel like he probably has a couple good years left in him.

 

[Hoodhero]

yeah, I'm curious to to see a list of the best pass rushers/defensive linemnen in the league the last couple decades and see when their play usually starts to decline. I feel like he probably has a couple good years left in him.

Chan is a technican & uses his length to advantage more than any athletic ability. That definitely works in his favor for career longevity imho

 

[Russ Smith]

By what standard, judging by sacks alone? Pretty much the only argument you can make for Chandler Jones being the best pass rusher in football, and a weak one.

Here's some insight into 2019 #'s that goes beyond simple sack totals - https://www.nfl.com/news/myles-garrett-nick-bosa-among-nfl-s-top-10-best-disruptors-of-2019

Link doesn't work for me

I get the coming off injury so it's 2 seasons ago, fully see that point. But if you're trying to argue he wasn't the best pass rusher in 2019 I have a hard time with it. He had 19 sacks and 26 QB hits, often while being doubled. Barrett had 19.5. Jones forced EIGHT fumbles that year, Barrett 6, Jones recovered 3 fumbles, Barrett 0. CJ was 2nd in sacks, first in forced fumbles, 2nd in recovered fumbles. He did have less QB hits than several guys but he did more with the hits he had, more sacks, more forced fumbles.

Remember 2019 we won 5 games and were often playing from behind, it's not like he just got to go rush teh QB on every down because we're ahead all the time, he did that while we were often behind and teams ran the ball.

I have no idea how good he'll be this year it's a tough injury to judge, I do think it's unfair to suggest he wasn't at least as good as any other pass rusher in the NFL his last full year, he was.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Link doesn't work for me

I get the coming off injury so it's 2 seasons ago, fully see that point. But if you're trying to argue he wasn't the best pass rusher in 2019 I have a hard time with it. He had 19 sacks and 26 QB hits, often while being doubled. Barrett had 19.5. Jones forced EIGHT fumbles that year, Barrett 6, Jones recovered 3 fumbles, Barrett 0. CJ was 2nd in sacks, first in forced fumbles, 2nd in recovered fumbles. He did have less QB hits than several guys but he did more with the hits he had, more sacks, more forced fumbles.

Remember 2019 we won 5 games and were often playing from behind, it's not like he just got to go rush teh QB on every down because we're ahead all the time, he did that while we were often behind and teams ran the ball.

I have no idea how good he'll be this year it's a tough injury to judge, I do think it's unfair to suggest he wasn't at least as good as any other pass rusher in the NFL his last full year, he was.

Stupid NFL.com links...the name of the link is Garrett, Nick Bosa among NFL's top 10 Disruptors. (spoiler, Jones isn't on the list) Jones was excellent in 2019 and didn't do much in 4 games in 2020.

Chandler Jones is not in the top 10 problems facing the team, but I'd also be hesitant to pay him top dollar long term at this point.

 

[BritCard]

I think it is a fair question, especially with Keim's history of giving big contracts to injured players... (Tyrann/DJ)

I for one do not think Jones is washed up.

I don't think he's washed up, which is why I want to trade him before he is.

The art is trading a guy when he still has something to offer another team but not so much your going to miss him too much.

To me, this feels like that time because we just proved we didn't miss him too much. Add in he's 31 and has one year left on his deal.

 

[Russ Smith]

Stupid NFL.com links...the name of the link is Garrett, Nick Bosa among NFL's top 10 Disruptors. (spoiler, Jones isn't on the list) Jones was excellent in 2019 and didn't do much in 4 games in 2020.

Chandler Jones is not in the top 10 problems facing the team, but I'd also be hesitant to pay him top dollar long term at this point.

If the list is for 2019, and the guy who led the NFL in forced fumbles and was 2nd in sacks, is not on it, I question the list. That was my point. Their description of a disruption is a hurry, sack or pressures, with only one counting per play. So they start off not even counting forced or recovered fumbles which is probably the most disruptive thing a pass rusher can do without scoring a TD on the play

Jones had 8 forced fumbles in 19, Garrett has 10, in his 4 year career, 51 games.

Garrett is great, so is Bosa and some of the others on that list, but when you look at Jones and realize he's basically been our only real pass rusher the last few yearsit's pretty impressive. 2 years ago next best was 5.5 on the team, 18 it was 4.5, 17 4.5 again, you have to go back all the way to 2016 to find a year anybody else had even 6, that year Golden led the team with 12.5

I'm fine with being careful about his contract or trying to restructure, and if someone comes up with a too good to refuse trade sure, I'm just saying I'm not going to write him off because of last year unless we have reason to believe the injury is going to negate him as a pass rusher.

If we lose Fitz and PP in the same year you're basically removing all the veterans who've actually played at a high level on a good team. PP and Fitz here, Jones in NE and here. I don't want to overpay him I agree.

Let's see how the rehab goes first IMO

 

[Chopper0080]

For those wanting to jettison Chandler, how’d that work out with Calais Campbell? He’s only been a pro bowler every year since he left the Cards.
What did the Cards do with that cap space you so severely crave?
Cap space is really irrelevant. It can be manipulated so many ways, it not an issue.

It’s only be comes an issue when guys under perform and trams are wanting to get rid of a player. Are cap hits keeping teams from pursuing Wentz, Watson or Stafford?

Yeah...a lot of this.

And for those who think it would take 3 years and 75 mil to extend a 31 year old non-QB player coming off an injury...you are being silly.

I feel like Brit is going full "DJ Humphries sucks" on this take. The only dude ever who thought that getting rid of pass rushers when your Pro Bowl QB is on his rookie deal is a good idea. Let's get rid of talent when we can afford to pay for it the most.

 

[phillycard]

Could be in the minority, but I'm going to miss PP. I know it's time to part ways, but he gave us a great deal of excitement his time with us. Allowed us a sense of pride when he made Pro Bowls and was mentioned as one of the top shut down corners in the NFL. We haven't had a ton of players worthy of jersey purchases and wishes from other fans to trade for him over the years. We gave the man trash men for most of his career on the other side and he, to my knowledge never complained about the "help". Exciting and a charismatic player who gave us reason to be excited about him being on the field. I gave him guff when needed but he was one of my 3 favorite Cards on the roster outside of Larry for much of his time in AZ. I have a black 21 and I will cherish it and wish him well if he leaves.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I don't think he's washed up, which is why I want to trade him before he is.

The art is trading a guy when he still has something to offer another team but not so much your going to miss him too much.

To me, this feels like that time because we just proved we didn't miss him too much. Add in he's 31 and has one year left on his deal.

We don't have the luxury of trading our best players away. What are we going to trade him for, draft picks that Keim can't get right?

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Could be in the minority, but I'm going to miss PP. I know it's time to part ways, but he gave us a great deal of excitement his time with us. Allowed us a sense of pride when he made Pro Bowls and was mentioned as one of the top shut down corners in the NFL. We haven't had a ton of players worthy of jersey purchases and wishes from other fans to trade for him over the years. We gave the man trash men for most of his career on the other side and he, to my knowledge never complained about the "help". Exciting and a charismatic player who gave us reason to be excited about him being on the field. I gave him guff when needed but he was one of my 3 favorite Cards on the roster outside of Larry for much of his time in AZ. I have a black 21 and I will cherish it and wish him well if he leaves.

I will miss him too.

There was an interesting debate on local Denver radio when talking about Von Miller potentially leaving after this year. The radio hosts argued that Von was the best pick in the draft (had the best career) They seemed to completely dismiss players like JJ Watt, Julio Jones, and Pat P, even Cam was an afterthought. I'm not sure if the 2011 draft was re-done that Von would be drafted 1st and would have the best career. Can you imagine if somehow Von Miller, Luke Kuechly, and Thomas Davis were all on the same team at the same time?

 

[Chopper0080]

I will miss him too.

There was an interesting debate on local Denver radio when talking about Von Miller potentially leaving after this year. The radio hosts argued that Von was the best pick in the draft (had the best career) They seemed to completely dismiss players like JJ Watt, Julio Jones, and Pat P, even Cam was an afterthought. I'm not sure if the 2011 draft was re-done that Von would be drafted 1st and would have the best career. Can you imagine if somehow Von Miller, Luke Kuechly, and Thomas Davis were all on the same team at the same time?

Von has the legal issue as well. That said, I will be shocked if Von doesn't take a pay cut as he likes the Broncos franchise. His charity is out of Denver and the fans love him as well.

 

[ReasonableMan]

I agree we have holes but Tampa just won a SB a year after going 7-9. They have better Wr's than we do other than D Hop but the main thing they did was a combination of drafting well, and making the right signings. We have Kyler so we don't need a veteran like Brady signing but we do need the other ones. 2 years ago they were 29th in points allowed, this year 8th. They allowed almost 100 less points a game, in large part by getting rid of Winston who turned it over so much, they went from a league worst 41 turnovers to 17 this year!

We don't have that really obvious way to get better they did, change QB's to stop the turnovers, but the point is a team can go from where we are, to a SB, in one year if they make the right moves.

Tom Brady. Big overlooked factor

 

[daves]

The Athletic put out a list of top 50 free agents. Here are their rankings of available CBs:

22. William Jackson III, CB, Bengals (28)
23. Shaquill Griffin, CB, Seahawks (26)
43. Richard Sherman, CB, 49ers (33)

45. Patrick Peterson, CB, Cardinals (31)
He’s another tough player to slot. Peterson was suspended for six games in 2019 for violating the NFL’s performance-enhancing drugs policy. He played 99 percent of the Cardinals’ defensive snaps in 2020 but looked like a declining player. Peterson has put together a Hall of Fame-caliber resume and, at his best, is an elite man corner. But his best days are behind him, and interested teams will have to determine how much to invest in Peterson at this stage of his career.

Players you might yell at me about for not including:
Bashaud Breeland, CB, Chiefs (29)
Jason Verrett, CB, 49ers (30)
Mike Hilton, DB, Steelers (27)
Cameron Sutton, DB, Steelers (26)
Ronald Darby, CB, Washington (27)
Brian Poole, CB, Jets (28)
Mackensie Alexander, CB, Bengals (27)
K’Waun Williams, CB, 49ers (30)
Troy Hill, CB, Rams (30)
Chidobe Awuzie, CB, Cowboys (26)
Xavier Rhodes, CB, Colts (31)
Rasul Douglas, CB, Panthers (27)
Quinton Dunbar, CB, Seahawks (29)
Kevin King, CB, Packers (26)
Terrance Mitchell, CB, Browns (29)

(Off topic, but also on the list

28. Haason Reddick, Edge/LB, Cardinals (27)
He had a big second half of the season and finished with 12.5 sacks, which was tied for fourth league-wide. Reddick’s role in Arizona has changed about 400 times in four seasons, but he has shown pass-rushing chops. He’s a hybrid-type player who could be really fun with the right defensive coordinator.

Players you might yell at me about for not including:
Kenyan Drake, RB, Cardinals (27)
Kelvin Beachum, OT, Cardinals (32)

...dave

 

[TK421]

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[BritCard]

Yeah...a lot of this.

And for those who think it would take 3 years and 75 mil to extend a 31 year old non-QB player coming off an injury...you are being silly.

I feel like Brit is going full "DJ Humphries sucks" on this take. The only dude ever who thought that getting rid of pass rushers when your Pro Bowl QB is on his rookie deal is a good idea. Let's get rid of talent when we can afford to pay for it the most.

No. I want a better team and frankly this take is ridiculous. Teams trade good players all the time with the intention of making their TEAM better overall.

The Jets traded Jamal Adams last season. The best player on their team. Niners traded Buckner, one of their best defensive players, maybe the best.

The year before you have Jalen Ramsey, Minkah Fitzpatrick, Tunsil, Clowney, the Seahawks traded Frank Clark, KC traded Dee Ford.

Go back another year and the Raiders traded Khalil Mack, Giants traded JPP.

Chances are that NO might trade Cam Jordan this year.

Let's not act like this is some unusual far fetched idea. Keim and Bidwill have been treating this team as if it's just a few players away from challenging every year for the past 5 years and it needs to stop. Every year we have had a crap tonne of dead cap holding us back from the money they threw at over the hill cast offs they had to discard. We did the same last year. Kennard was a bust, Philips was a bust, Campbell had a good start but a poor finish and were paying him $4m this year not to be on the team.

We need to get younger and start planning to challenge in Kyler's 4th and 5th years. Not next year.

All you are doing is making the same arguments many people made 2 years ago regarding P2 and it would have been the right thing to trade P2 then the same way it's the right thing to trade CJ now.

I don't want to trade him. If we were healthier on cap space, had other tradeable pieces or were remotely close to being an actual SB contender I wouldn't be making the suggestion. But we aren't, and I don't want to get trapped in the same endless cycle the next 3 years and waste Kyler's rookie deal.

If we could get a 2nd for CJ and also trade back in the 1st and pick up another 2nd it would give us 4 picks inside the top 60 to start building a team to win in 2022 and 2023.

Say we trade CJ to Miami for #36. He know the system, they have a young defense that needs some veteran talent and a better edge rush.

Imagine coming out of the draft with Ojulari, Rondale Moore, Tyson Campbell and Landon Dickerson for example (based on current rankings). Or pick your poison. And having $15m more cash to spend in FA.

 

[Krangodnzr]

No. I want a better team and frankly this take is ridiculous. Teams trade good players all the time with the intention of making their TEAM better overall.

The Jets traded Jamal Adams last season. The best player on their team. Niners traded Buckner, one of their best defensive players, maybe the best.

The year before you have Jalen Ramsey, Minkah Fitzpatrick, Tunsil, Clowney, the Seahawks traded Frank Clark, KC traded Dee Ford.

Go back another year and the Raiders traded Khalil Mack, Giants traded JPP.

Chances are that NO might trade Cam Jordan this year.

Let's not act like this is some unusual far fetched idea. Keim and Bidwill have been treating this team as if it's just a few players away from challenging every year for the past 5 years and it needs to stop. Every year we have had a crap tonne of dead cap holding us back from the money they threw at over the hill cast offs they had to discard. We did the same last year. Kennard was a bust, Philips was a bust, Campbell had a good start but a poor finish and were paying him $4m this year not to be on the team.

We need to get younger and start planning to challenge in Kyler's 4th and 5th years. Not next year.

All you are doing is making the same arguments many people made 2 years ago regarding P2 and it would have been the right thing to trade P2 then the same way it's the right thing to trade CJ now.

I don't want to trade him. If we were healthier on cap space, had other tradeable pieces or were remotely close to being an actual SB contender I wouldn't be making the suggestion. But we aren't, and I don't want to get trapped in the same endless cycle the next 3 years and waste Kyler's rookie deal.

If we could get a 2nd for CJ and also trade back in the 1st and pick up another 2nd it would give us 4 picks inside the top 60 to start building a team to win in 2022 and 2023.

Say we trade CJ to Miami for #36. He know the system, they have a young defense that needs some veteran talent and a better edge rush.

Imagine coming out of the draft with Ojulari, Rondale Moore, Tyson Campbell and Landon Dickerson for example (based on current rankings). Or pick your poison. And having $15m more cash to spend in FA.

So one thing to consider with trading CJ is that he is on the last year of his deal and he is past 30.

I doubt the Cardinals get a substantial haul for him.

But the part that is slightly appealing is that the team didn't really have him last season anyway! We've seen this current defense sans Jones and they were a top 5 sacks defense last season.

If you told me the only way the Cardinals can keep Reddick is to trade/release Jones, I'd be all for it.

There are a few teams that have substantial space and need pass rushers. Those teams will pay Reddick.

 

[BritCard]

So one thing to consider with trading CJ is that he is on the last year of his deal and he is past 30.

I doubt the Cardinals get a substantial haul for him.

But the part that is slightly appealing is that the team didn't really have him last season anyway! We've seen this current defense sans Jones and they were a top 5 sacks defense last season.

If you told me the only way the Cardinals can keep Reddick is to trade/release Jones, I'd be all for it.

There are a few teams that have substantial space and need pass rushers. Those teams will pay Reddick.

I think it's possible to get a 2nd. Jones has led the league in sacks the last 5 years. Age is the biggest factor, I don't think contract is. We have seen Ramsey, Adams, Clowney and Clark have big trades with only a year left on their deals.

But I think the 2nd round factors age in. If he was younger he'd be a 1st.

Miami is my favorite destination. Not bad for sacks finishing 10th but no guy there you would say is a top pass rusher. More a team effort. CJ knows the system from the Pats. He knows Flores and Boyer from the Pats and the Fins have two 1st's and two 2nd's.

Of course, this is fantasy football stuff but I can see the fit there.

 

[AsUpRoDiGy]

According to PP; "There's no real update and, like you said, it is a dirty rumor," Peterson said. "I woke up to it this morning as well. Me and the team haven't talked anything about contracts and we haven't [spoken about] parting ways. That's just what it is -- a dirty rumor. I don't know where [the reporter] got his insight from, but it was a dirty rumor and you're hearing it here."

 

[Krangodnzr]

According to PP; "There's no real update and, like you said, it is a dirty rumor," Peterson said. "I woke up to it this morning as well. Me and the team haven't talked anything about contracts and we haven't [spoken about] parting ways. That's just what it is -- a dirty rumor. I don't know where [the reporter] got his insight from, but it was a dirty rumor and you're hearing it here."

So the nugget I gleam from his statement is that the team HASN'T talked contract with him.

Patrick...that's not a good sign!

 

[GuernseyCard]

So the nugget I gleam from his statement is that the team HASN'T talked contract with him.

Patrick...that's not a good sign!

Well, unless they've discussed contracts with other pending free agents it's not a sign of anything really.

I'd suggest they're still in the evaluation of roster mode and going through cap/accounting scenarios.