Saturation Point

[Russ Smith]

Well I've become slightly concerned that a Ball Booker backcourt is defensively awful but as long as we score more than the other side...

Agreed entirely otherwise.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That's where your coaches come into play. Ball is a year removed from a system where they pressed all game and he often played the back line in the press, he's going to have to be coached in the NBA on how to defend, but he improved leaps and bounds at UCLA as a defender so there's no reason to believe that won't continue in the NBA, if he has a good coach.

same with Booker he's improved significantly every year.

 

[Chaplin]

My perception may be off, but I think of Lopez as a very poor defender. With him and Booker, we'd need the rest of the team to be filled with excellent defenders.

Brook Lopez is a terrible defender, and almost certainly will be massively overpaid.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Please tell us about how good Domantas Sabonis is again.

The fact that you still can't do anything else but taking a quote out of context and paraphrasing it to dilute its meaning shows it all about you.

"Positions in basketball were created for the novice to follow the game" Jalen Rose.

You are a novice. Just because Magic Johnson ran the offense does not make him a starter at the PG position. There is a reason why the phrase "point forward" was coined for Magic. The truth is that by basketball positions Magic started as a forward for the vast majority of his career. He rarely ever guarded players labeled as "PGs" and he was not defended by players labeled as "PGs" and for the most part started alongsige two guards one of which was usually labeled a "PG".

So... was James Worthy the PG or SG playing next to Byron and Magic? Or was it AC Green who was the 3rd guard on those teams from 86-90? And was it Kurt Rambis or Larry Sprigs who started next to Byron in 1984? I mean, I remember Kurt on the Suns and he was a MEAN SG! Must have been Kurt, right? What about back in 81... was it Rambis again as the starter or Mitch Kupchak as the "3rd guard"? Or Jamaal Wilkes who was slid from SF to PF?

Yeah... keep talking about things you have consistently been shown to be clueless about.

 

[JCSunsfan]

If Golden State is really a better team without Durant, could he be available in th FA market this summer?

I think this is a great question. I really do not know much about Brook but he has been a consistent 20 point scorer since he came into the league. He appears to be a poor rebounder and I do not think he is any good on defense.

However a big three of Lopez, Booker and Bledsoe (or PG we pick in the draft) could be pretty good especially if we could get him without giving up any of our draft picks or youngsters.

I really think we will need to upgrade the center position going forward and Len is not the answer, IMO. Could Lopez be a 4 or 5 year fix?

I haven't paid much attention to Lopez lately, so here are my questions.

1. Is he in decline? I know he has had a history of injuries, which tend to shorten a career.
2. We need a rim protector and rebounder. Can he fill that role? I tend to think not. We don't need the offense so much.

The idea of getting a FA center is a good one. I am just not sure Lopez is the solution. In fact, Len is probably a better fit.

 

[pokerface]

If Golden State is really a better team without Durant, could he be available in th FA market this summer?

I haven't paid much attention to Lopez lately, so here are my questions.

1. Is he in decline? I know he has had a history of injuries, which tend to shorten a career.
2. We need a rim protector and rebounder. Can he fill that role? I tend to think not. We don't need the offense so much.

The idea of getting a FA center is a good one. I am just not sure Lopez is the solution. In fact, Len is probably a better fit.

Lopez is a good offensive force...That much I do know. I haven't watched Lopez play so I really don't know his overall game.

Far as Len being a good fit for the Suns or being better than Lopez. Ahh...I cant wrap my mind around that one.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Because we knew from the start of the season we would be bad. Because we knew this was supposed to be a very talented freshman one-and-done class. Because we HAVE been so awful. And because we started a legit tank with plenty of games left in the season. I believe we've officially reached our saturation point in terms of debating potential draftees, their fit, their pros and cons, etc.

I mean, this is like scorched earth stuff with regard to fultz, ball, jackson, and Tatum. We are just seeing the same arguments regurgitated over and over again. I'm pretty sure we all know each other's positions in regards to every player. And I have yet to see someone say, "yeah that makes sense. I hadn't considered that. You've changed my mind."

My biggest concern as a result? We have a couple more months of this!

Someone please come up with an interesting alternative discussion!

I said I changed my mind about Ball.

 

[elindholm]

Len > Brook Lopez.

Whew, good thing this board tends to underrate Suns players -- it must mean that Len is really an All-Star!

 

[elindholm]

If Golden State is really a better team without Durant, could he be available in th FA market this summer?

I haven't paid much attention to Lopez lately, so here are my questions.

1. Is he in decline? I know he has had a history of injuries, which tend to shorten a career.
2. We need a rim protector and rebounder. Can he fill that role? I tend to think not. We don't need the offense so much.

The idea of getting a FA center is a good one. I am just not sure Lopez is the solution. In fact, Len is probably a better fit.

I have no interest in BLopez, but I wonder whether MGasol could be pried away when Memphis flames out in the first round again. At some point the Grizzlies have to get tired of being a low playoff seed every single year, and it's not like they have much young talent to develop. They have one of the largest payrolls in the league. Gasol is 32, so he should have a few good years left.

Phoenix gets
Marc Gasol ($22.6M in 2017-18, player option 2020)

Memphis gets
Dragan Bender (4.5, sophomore)
Brandon Knight (13.6, 2020)
PHO first-round pick in 2018 or 19 (lottery protected 2018, top-3 protected 2019, unprotected 2020)

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I have no interest in BLopez, but I wonder whether MGasol could be pried away when Memphis flames out in the first round again. At some point the Grizzlies have to get tired of being a low playoff seed every single year, and it's not like they have much young talent to develop. They have one of the largest payrolls in the league. Gasol is 32, so he should have a few good years left.

Phoenix gets
Marc Gasol ($22.6M in 2017-18, player option 2020)

Memphis gets
Dragan Bender (4.5, sophomore)
Brandon Knight (13.6, 2020)
PHO first-round pick in 2018 or 19 (lottery protected 2018, top-3 protected 2019, unprotected 2020)

No no no. No 32 year olds for young assets or draft picks.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

You probably have to add one of the Miami picks to that deal

 

[Chris_Sanders]

No no no. No 32 year olds for young assets or draft picks.

We have to be thinking with this core that 2 years out is when they make real noise so I agree. That puts Gasol at 34 when we are hitting what is hopefully several years of playoff basketball. I really don't want to be trading for anyone older than 28 right now.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

So I am still hoping we end up with Ball or Fultz. This means moving Bledsoe, but what sort of return could you expect for him?

Teams where you could potentially move Eric Bledsoe (where I believe he is an upgrade or they don't have a young up and coming guard)


Brooklyn Nets
Charlotte Hornets
Chicago Bulls
Dallas Mavericks
Detroit Pistons
Milwaukee Bucks
Minnesota Timberwolves
New Orleans Pelicans
NY Knicks
Orlando Magic
Philadelphia 76ers
Utah Jazz

Maybe

Indiana Pacers

 

[JCSunsfan]

Whew, good thing this board tends to underrate Suns players -- it must mean that Len is really an All-Star!

I think this is more about the lack of respect for Lopez than a love for Len.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I have no interest in BLopez, but I wonder whether MGasol could be pried away when Memphis flames out in the first round again. At some point the Grizzlies have to get tired of being a low playoff seed every single year, and it's not like they have much young talent to develop. They have one of the largest payrolls in the league. Gasol is 32, so he should have a few good years left.

Phoenix gets
Marc Gasol ($22.6M in 2017-18, player option 2020)

Memphis gets
Dragan Bender (4.5, sophomore)
Brandon Knight (13.6, 2020)
PHO first-round pick in 2018 or 19 (lottery protected 2018, top-3 protected 2019, unprotected 2020)

I like the general idea, but I agree that Gasol is a little old for this team. Substitute DeAndre Jordan instead and it might be a little closer with the team timeline.

 

[elindholm]

I like the general idea, but I agree that Gasol is a little old for this team. Substitute DeAndre Jordan instead and it might be a little closer with the team timeline.

I agree that Jordan would be better. But on the other hand, the goal is to have a large window of opportunity, and it's inevitable that the roster will undergo some changes during that period. A player may help the Suns get there and then not be around for the final push.

 

[Mainstreet]

The thing about Brook Lopez, he has another year under contract with the Nets so the Suns would have to trade for him. I don't want to pay assets for an expiring contract.

 

[Dan H]

So I am still hoping we end up with Ball or Fultz. This means moving Bledsoe, but what sort of return could you expect for him?

Teams where you could potentially move Eric Bledsoe (where I believe he is an upgrade or they don't have a young up and coming guard)


Brooklyn Nets
Charlotte Hornets
Chicago Bulls
Dallas Mavericks
Detroit Pistons
Milwaukee Bucks
Minnesota Timberwolves
New Orleans Pelicans
NY Knicks
Orlando Magic
Philadelphia 76ers
Utah Jazz

Maybe

Indiana Pacers

I know he has said he wants to play for LA, but would Paul George be happy here with Ball/Fultz-Booker-Chriss-Chandler manning the other four positions? It would be by far the most talent he's ever had around him.

Bledsoe, Knight, not sure what else. Warren?

 

[Yuma]

Ok. Here is my contribution for an alternative discussion.

How do you define these two terms?

Star.
Superatar.

Not defining, but I do not want the Suns to trade their young developing guys unless it is a Superstar. Basically guys that other teams would never trade, Like Lebron, Curry, etc. I mean if we trade Bledsoe, for a guy who basically has the same stats as Bledsoe, why? The guy we should trade for has those Superstar skills that bring Championships. Trade a bunch of assets for Brook Lopez, no. Why not sign a free agent with similar stats? I'd rather stay the course, see what the next few drafts bring us. I like Chriss, Bender, Ulis, Booker, Warren, Williams, Bledsoe. I mean we had to manipulate resting guys, etc., to have this poopy of a season. Let's see what they can do with the mix we have. Maybe sign a Mason Plumlee if you can.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Okay... so, what if the Pacers look to move Paul George? Say we win the lotto and get the first or second pick... if we took Ball or Fultz and figure the back court is set, anyone think a Bledsoe, Warren and whatever future picks needed would be a good move to get George?

Ball/Fultz (preferably Ball with this group)
Booker
George
Chriss
Chandler

That's a pretty exciting starting lineup and that foursome of youngsters with George as the veteran leader could be pretty damn dynamic.

Thoughts?

 

[AsUpRoDiGy]

Okay... so, what if the Pacers look to move Paul George? Say we win the lotto and get the first or second pick... if we took Ball or Fultz and figure the back court is set, anyone think a Bledsoe, Warren and whatever future picks needed would be a good move to get George?

Ball/Fultz (preferably Ball with this group)
Booker
George
Chriss
Chandler

That's a pretty exciting starting lineup and that foursome of youngsters with George as the veteran leader could be pretty damn dynamic.

Thoughts?

Sign me up! Except Pacers will probably ask for a King's ransom to get George.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Not defining, but I do not want the Suns to trade their young developing guys unless it is a Superstar. Basically guys that other teams would never trade, Like Lebron, Curry, etc. I mean if we trade Bledsoe, for a guy who basically has the same stats as Bledsoe, why? The guy we should trade for has those Superstar skills that bring Championships. Trade a bunch of assets for Brook Lopez, no. Why not sign a free agent with similar stats? I'd rather stay the course, see what the next few drafts bring us. I like Chriss, Bender, Ulis, Booker, Warren, Williams, Bledsoe. I mean we had to manipulate resting guys, etc., to have this ****** of a season. Let's see what they can do with the mix we have. Maybe sign a Mason Plumlee if you can.

So. Would we think star is NBA all-star team caliber?

Superstar a top 5 or 10 type of player--a player that has a chance of cracking the top 50-60 all time--a player that has a chance to be in the MVP conversation (and its not a fluke like IT this year). First team all-NBA type of player.

 

[Yuma]

So. Would we think star is NBA all-star team caliber?

Superstar a top 5 or 10 type of player--a player that has a chance of cracking the top 50-60 all time--a player that has a chance to be in the MVP conversation (and its not a fluke like IT this year). First team all-NBA type of player.

That is what I am thinking. I would only trade assets for a guy like that, and he cannot be at the end of his career coming here like Shaq.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Sign me up! Except Pacers will probably ask for a King's ransom to get George.

George is a free agent in a year. If he wants out of Indiana, he can get out of Indiana

 

[Yuma]

George is a free agent in a year. If he wants out of Indiana, he can get out of Indiana

I know it's probably nothing, but I still see that freak leg injury in my nightmares.

 

[JCSunsfan]

George is a free agent in a year. If he wants out of Indiana, he can get out of Indiana

We could trade for him, but why? He will be a free agent in a year and we can go after him then. We have to convince to stay if we trade for him anyway. If trading for him somehow give us an inside track to keep PG and its not just a marginal advantage, fine. I am not interested in giving away the farm for a one year rental.